"Brexit"

CraftyG

glasgowtolondon said:

I don't think the vote to leave was ever based on facts though. It seemed to me it was more about a feeling of disenfranchisement and fear of "other". Even a little research debunked Farage's comments about the £350mil, it was never about economic facts.

Completely agree! The whole leave campaign was basically just scaremongering and manipulation, I've seen that because the vote was so close it should go to a second referendum but I really doubt that will happen!

CraftyG

@glasgowtolondon @ScottishSarah I've just seen on BBC that an hour ago they made a statement that 'an option of s second Scottish independence referendum must be on the table and it is on the table' 

kimmiinthemitten

FI just called Boris Johnson the British Donald Trump. 

glasgowtolondon

CraftyG said:

@glasgowtolondon @ScottishSarah I've just seen on BBC that an hour ago they made a statement that 'an option of s second Scottish independence referendum must be on the table and it is on the table' 

I don't blame them. I was angry about the vote to leave the EU, but I am truly heartbroken to think that the likelihood is that I will not live in the same country as my family within the next few years. They wanted to be part of the UK, in Europe. Now on balance they feel it would be better for them to be apart from the UK and hopefully with EU membership. I imagine there is an awful lot of people feeling very differently to a year ago.

charlotte989875

Since Cameron resigned does that mean it's up to a new government to determine when to notify the EU and begin the Article 50 process of withdrawal? I thought I had read there were disagreements about when and how to initiate the process. 

I really thought the vote would to be to remain; I'm sorry to all of you who were hoping for that as well. 

kimmiinthemitten

glasgowtolondon said:

CraftyG said:

@glasgowtolondon @ScottishSarah I've just seen on BBC that an hour ago they made a statement that 'an option of s second Scottish independence referendum must be on the table and it is on the table' 

I don't blame them. I was angry about the vote to leave the EU, but I am truly heartbroken to think that the likelihood is that I will not live in the same country as my family within the next few years. They wanted to be part of the UK, in Europe. Now on balance they feel it would be better for them to be apart from the UK and hopefully with EU membership. I imagine there is an awful lot of people feeling very differently to a year ago.

Will Brexit also effect international but inner European tourism and travel as well?

glasgowtolondon

We vote for the party and not the man, as it were, so the tories will still be in power just with a different leader as of October (unless an impromptu general election is called. I think thats unlikely, but who knows in this climate). He will continue to govern until then, but it remains to be seen who will actually do the negotiations etc. Likely not Cameron.

glasgowtolondon

kimmiinthemitten said:

glasgowtolondon said:

CraftyG said:

@glasgowtolondon @ScottishSarah I've just seen on BBC that an hour ago they made a statement that 'an option of s second Scottish independence referendum must be on the table and it is on the table' 

I don't blame them. I was angry about the vote to leave the EU, but I am truly heartbroken to think that the likelihood is that I will not live in the same country as my family within the next few years. They wanted to be part of the UK, in Europe. Now on balance they feel it would be better for them to be apart from the UK and hopefully with EU membership. I imagine there is an awful lot of people feeling very differently to a year ago.

Will Brexit also effect international but inner European tourism and travel as well?

Hard to say at this point in time. Right now we don't have to go through the same customs within the EU block that 'outsiders' do, so that may or may not change depending on what we negotiate with the EU. I don't think it would necessarily affect international travel though, and I don't think people will stop travelling withing the eu. I guess if the economy hits a recession it will obviously mean less people will be going to spain (or further) for their summer hols so there will likely be an impact on tourism to some extent. Who knows.

charlotte989875

glasgowtolondon said:

We vote for the party and not the man, as it were, so the tories will still be in power just with a different leader as of October (unless an impromptu general election is called. I think thats unlikely, but who knows in this climate). He will continue to govern until then, but it remains to be seen who will actually do the negotiations etc. Likely not Cameron.

That I knew; I am curious if there will be a delay of initiating the process. I could definitely be wrong, I had thought Cameron's policy had been to initiate quickly whereas the Leave camp wanted to delay until 2020 or so. I didn't know if these positions were just part of the campaign strategy or if the interim government would follow through on his statements. 

kvruns

I feel like I don't really know much about this topic. Need to find some good synopsis articles to catch up

MCmeow

Wow that really sucks. Sorry it didn't go as planned you guys. 2016 is such a crappy political year...

kimmiinthemitten

kvruns said:

I feel like I don't really know much about this topic. Need to find some good synopsis articles to catch up

I thought this was a good piece:  http://www.economist.com/blogs/economist-explains/2015/04/economist-explains-29

ETA this one also:  http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-32810887

glasgowtolondon

scribe95 said:

I have been learning about this topic since I saw this thread a bit ago. Very interesting. Especially the parallel of anger/Trump to U.S. 

Also I just saw a reporter asked Trump if Boris Johnson should be the next PM and Trump said, "Who is Boris? I don't know him."

There was a little tiff in the press a while ago where trump said something to the effect of "there are whole parts of the uk where white people can't even go for fear of radical muslims" and boris said that british people darent go to the city of new york for fear of bumping into Donald Trump. I'm guessing there is some kind of spat there. Or maybe he just doesn't know him.

glasgowtolondon

charlotte989875 said:

glasgowtolondon said:

We vote for the party and not the man, as it were, so the tories will still be in power just with a different leader as of October (unless an impromptu general election is called. I think thats unlikely, but who knows in this climate). He will continue to govern until then, but it remains to be seen who will actually do the negotiations etc. Likely not Cameron.

That I knew; I am curious if there will be a delay of initiating the process. I could definitely be wrong, I had thought Cameron's policy had been to initiate quickly whereas the Leave camp wanted to delay until 2020 or so. I didn't know if these positions were just part of the campaign strategy or if the interim government would follow through on his statements. 

Leave camp are pushing for as long as possible but it seems the rest of the EU are calling the 2yr period. It would be in the UK's interest to delay sonwe can take as long as we need to negotiate what we want, and in the EU's interest to have a relatively short period of time to hold our feet to the fire. I'd imagine none of us want our status to just revert to the standard 'rest of the world' terms.

WinstonsGirl

ScottishSarah said:

I never ever ever thought I'd say this, but I think we should have another referendum in Scotland.

Just curious, does anyone ever talk about spitting up the USA?

We get the splitting talk more seriously, every once in a while from Quebec.  They did a referendum a little while back that was just as close as this vote, but it was voted to stay.  One of their provincial political party is a separatist party, but they haven't been as popular lately.  

But a lot of Quebec wants the benefits of separation (more autonomy, etc.) along with the perks of staying in Canada (not taking their share of the national debt).  It don't really work that way people.  

Some people were speculating that if Scotland does eventually decide to leave the UK, that might start up the chatter here agin with Quebec

TrixieJess

WinstonsGirl said:

ScottishSarah said:

I never ever ever thought I'd say this, but I think we should have another referendum in Scotland.

Just curious, does anyone ever talk about spitting up the USA?

We get the splitting talk more seriously, every once in a while from Quebec.  They did a referendum a little while back that was just as close as this vote, but it was voted to stay.  One of their provincial political party is a separatist party, but they haven't been as popular lately.  

But a lot of Quebec wants the benefits of separation (more autonomy, etc.) along with the perks of staying in Canada (not taking their share of the national debt).  It don't really work that way people.  

Some people were speculating that if Scotland does eventually decide to leave the UK, that might start up the chatter here agin with Quebec

And it almost happened too. I'm not sure that this generation would let it happen now. If you talk to people who were in their teens and early 20s when the first referendum happened, they did not want to split from the rest of Canada and would not be amenable to it happening. Plus, there is no one in Quebec politics like Parizeau.

As for Brexit, this is going to have worldwide implications. There are a ton of Canadian expats over there now who are concerned about how this will affect their Visas. Our rules as a Commonwealth country are different, but all that can change with this. 

PrettyGirlLost

kvruns said:

I feel like I don't really know much about this topic. Need to find some good synopsis articles to catch up

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-32810887

madamerwin

I have been following this pretty closely, and I am really surprised that the vote went the way it did... Every Brit I know (including my boss and a number of cousins and friends across the pond) was convinced that the Remain vote would win, even if by a small margin. I feel like the Leave vote is based solely on xenophobia, and if this can happen in the UK, maybe Trump does have a chance to win here. Which terrifies me.

kimmiinthemitten

scribe95 said:

I have heard there is a somewhat racist component of the whole debate. Can someone explain that? 

The argument is that the EU is forcing the UK to take in the dangerous Islamic refugees and that the refugees and immigrants are a drain on the UK economy.

STARMOON44

scribe95 said:

I have heard there is a somewhat racist component of the whole debate. Can someone explain that? 

One of the key arguments in favor of leave has been fear of immigration. More than a somewhat racist component, it's been central to the argument and pretty explicit. 

glasgowtolondon

kimmiinthemitten said:

scribe95 said:

I have heard there is a somewhat racist component of the whole debate. Can someone explain that? 

The argument is that the EU is forcing the UK to take in the dangerous Islamic refugees and that the refugees and immigrants are a drain on the UK economy.

Yeah. It's funny how I never hear anyone bemoaning the hundreds of thousands of Irish people, or aussies, kiwis, or south africans. It's almost as though you only put a strain on services if english is not your native tongue, are not white, or are not christian. Thats what I see and hear. 

They also put out this disgusting poster featuring herds of Syrian refugees fleeing conflict, but used to illustrate the "no more immigrants" rhetoric. Please also just be aware that the people pictured here are not photographed whilst queueing up to get into the UK or anything. Just walking for miles to get away from a war zone.



Eta spelling. I'm just too bloody angry today to check my spelling.

STARMOON44

Yup. I hear it in the US too. So many people are anti-'immigrant' but none of them see to mind me being here. Maybe because I'm white? Just maybe. It's the same reason Trump's campaign is racist. 

kimmiinthemitten

glasgowtolondon said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

scribe95 said:

I have heard there is a somewhat racist component of the whole debate. Can someone explain that? 

The argument is that the EU is forcing the UK to take in the dangerous Islamic refugees and that the refugees and immigrants are a drain on the UK economy.

Yeah. It's funny how I never hear anyone bemoaning the hundreds of thousands of Irish people, or aussies, kiwis, or south africans. It's almost as though you only put a strain on services if english is not your native tongue, are not white, or are not christian. Thats what I see and hear. 

They also put out this disgusting poster featuring heards of Syrian refugees fleeing conflict, but used to illustrate the "no more immigrants" rhetoric. Please also just be aware that the people pictured here are not photographed whilst queueing up to get into the UK or anything. Just walking for miles to get away from a war zone.

What's the stodgy old white dude in a suit doing pointing at this?  Is he a Leave Proponent trying to make a point?

glasgowtolondon

Ah, thats Nigel Farage. The 'everyman' ex city trader who leads UKIP (UK INDEPENDANCE PARTY) and who spends all day long trying to convince us he is the common man by drinking pints, wearing a hat, and smoking. Oh yeah, and he is also a masssive fucking racist. Thats his poster you see him standing before. He can also be heard defending whatever recent racial slur members of his party have been caught using. Such as 'chinky'. A thai woman was branded a 'ting tong'. He himself said he would be worried if romanians moved in next door to him. One of their party in reference a famous man in the UK called Lenny Henry, said that he should emigrate to a black country. I mean, theres no maybe for me. They have shown themselves time and again to be hugely racist.

glasgowtolondon

STARMOON44 said:

Yup. I hear it in the US too. So many people are anti-'immigrant' but none of them see to mind me being here. Maybe because I'm white? Just maybe. It's the same reason Trump's campaign is racist. 

Yeah. It's bollocks, mate. Such hypocrisy.

TrixieJess

glasgowtolondon said:

Ah, thats Nigel Farage. The 'everyman' ex city trader who leads UKIP (UK INDEPENDANCE PARTY) and who spends all day long trying to convince us he is the common man by drinking pints, wearing a hat, and smoking. Oh yeah, and he is also a masssive fucking racist. Thats his poster you see him standing before. He can also be heard defending whatever recent racial slur members of his party have been caught using. Such as 'chinky'. A thai woman was branded a 'ting tong'. He himself said he would be worried if romanians moved in next door to him. One of their party in reference a famous man in the UK called Lenny Henry, said that he should emigrate to a black country. I mean, theres no maybe for me. They have shown themselves time and again to be hugely racist.

This is my favourite Brexit image so far:

kimmiinthemitten

glasgowtolondon said:

Ah, thats Nigel Farage. The 'everyman' ex city trader who leads UKIP (UK INDEPENDANCE PARTY) and who spends all day long trying to convince us he is the common man by drinking pints, wearing a hat, and smoking. Oh yeah, and he is also a masssive fucking racist. Thats his poster you see him standing before. He can also be heard defending whatever recent racial slur members of his party have been caught using. Such as 'chinky'. A thai woman was branded a 'ting tong'. He himself said he would be worried if romanians moved in next door to him. One of their party in reference a famous man in the UK called Lenny Henry, said that he should emigrate to a black country. I mean, theres no maybe for me. They have shown themselves time and again to be hugely racist.

I'm sorry for the confusion. I was asking about the man in the photo, I'm already familiar with Donald Trump. </endsarcasm>

glasgowtolondon

I see what you did there 

labro

At least this can be considered a slightly humorous take on Brexit....

https://www.buzzfeed.com/robinedds/brexit-tweets-guaranteed-to-make-brits-laugh-cry-or-both?bffbmain&utm_term=.pe0KPEZW0#.paa3ZaOvA

I'm not sure whether to laugh, cry, or scream.

MCmeow

Some good news, there's a petition calling for a second vote because of the small margin: https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/131215  It's now going to be debated since it has over 100k signatures