Saying "No" to Backfills/B Lists

Knottie1444189200

Hi all,

We are a week away from our RSVP deadline and my FMIL wants to add more guests that weren't included as part of our guest list, and they therefore didn't get Save the Dates or invitations.  

To give some context - the wedding is being paid for 1/3 by my family, 1/3 by FI's family, 1/2 by FI and I. We did as best as we could to keep the guest list 1/3 my family's invites, 1/3 my FI's family's invites, and 1/3 our mutual friends our own age (including the wedding party). When we were planning our budget, we made the guest list. FMIL wanted to invite a whole bunch of her cousins, their adult children, and other distant family who my FI and I have never met (well, scratch that - we saw them at my FBIL's wedding a few years ago, but never saw them before or since then). All of the people she wanted to invite went to my FBIL's wedding, but they also had more help from FSIL's mom so they had a bigger budget. My FI told her that we couldn't afford to invite ALL of them, so she could tell us who she wanted to fill in for 10 spaces. She gave us the names, that was that. (These 10 spaces are in addition to FI's many direct aunts, uncles, and adult cousins.)

We have gotten some declines (not many though), enough for us to tell her that we now have room to invite my FI's aunt's children. We wanted to invite them in the first place, but FMIL said we could take them off for budget and space purposes. They are in high school and we see them at every holiday. When she got the invite, FI's aunt politely asked to clarify if they were invited, and FMIL told her that if we did have declines, we would let her know. Well, now we're at that point, so today my FI asked his mom to inform the aunt that her kids can come. FMIL countered that she has some additional cousins of her own she'd like to invite since, from him saying that, she knows we have declines. Problem is: (a) these people were not on the invite list and did not receive invitations; (b) we don't know them at all!

I want to put my foot down and say no. The cousins of my FI, I believe, should be there and should have priority, and as we get more declines, I do not want to "backfill" the spaces. Even if my FMIL says that these extra guests would be happy just to get the invite and really want to come, they will absolutely know they were B-listed - the RSVP date is printed on the response card, and it's next week! I find B-listing so embarrassing and tacky no matter what my FMIL says. Also, even if we did budget for "X" amount of people, my FI and I would rather just save the money by not backfilling - nothing wrong with coming in under budget, and money is very tight for us right now. Finally, if these people were so important, she would have included them in the first round of invites; they live in the same state as all of us, so nothing is stopping them from coming to holidays, having dinners with my FMIL and us, etc., but they only come around when a wedding is happening.

I've asked my FI to reiterate that he only would like to invite the HS cousins I mentioned before, and that we will not send out any additional invites. I think it's better he talks to her about it because she is his mom. I would like him to stay away from money talk because she will try to work around by saying how they're only backfilling spaces. I also plan on not sharing with her who on our invite list has accepted and who has declined until right before we give the final numbers to the venue - she'll probably find this information out through the grapevine, but it just won't be coming from us. Is this the best way to handle this situation?        

charlotte989875

Knottie1444189200 said:

Hi all,

We are a week away from our RSVP deadline and my FMIL wants to add more guests that weren't included as part of our guest list, and they therefore didn't get Save the Dates or invitations.  

To give some context - the wedding is being paid for 1/3 by my family, 1/3 by FI's family, 1/2 by FI and I. We did as best as we could to keep the guest list 1/3 my family's invites, 1/3 my FI's family's invites, and 1/3 our mutual friends our own age (including the wedding party). When we were planning our budget, we made the guest list. FMIL wanted to invite a whole bunch of her cousins, their adult children, and other distant family who my FI and I have never met (well, scratch that - we saw them at my FBIL's wedding a few years ago, but never saw them before or since then). All of the people she wanted to invite went to my FBIL's wedding, but they also had more help from FSIL's mom so they had a bigger budget. My FI told her that we couldn't afford to invite ALL of them, so she could tell us who she wanted to fill in for 10 spaces. She gave us the names, that was that. (These 10 spaces are in addition to FI's many direct aunts, uncles, and adult cousins.)

We have gotten some declines (not many though), enough for us to tell her that we now have room to invite my FI's aunt's children. We wanted to invite them in the first place, but FMIL said we could take them off for budget and space purposes. They are in high school and we see them at every holiday. When she got the invite, FI's aunt politely asked to clarify if they were invited, and FMIL told her that if we did have declines, we would let her know. Well, now we're at that point, so today my FI asked his mom to inform the aunt that her kids can come. FMIL countered that she has some additional cousins of her own she'd like to invite since, from him saying that, she knows we have declines. Problem is: (a) these people were not on the invite list and did not receive invitations; (b) we don't know them at all!

I want to put my foot down and say no. The cousins of my FI, I believe, should be there and should have priority, and as we get more declines, I do not want to "backfill" the spaces. Even if my FMIL says that these extra guests would be happy just to get the invite and really want to come, they will absolutely know they were B-listed - the RSVP date is printed on the response card, and it's next week! I find B-listing so embarrassing and tacky no matter what my FMIL says. Also, even if we did budget for "X" amount of people, my FI and I would rather just save the money by not backfilling - nothing wrong with coming in under budget, and money is very tight for us right now. Finally, if these people were so important, she would have included them in the first round of invites; they live in the same state as all of us, so nothing is stopping them from coming to holidays, having dinners with my FMIL and us, etc., but they only come around when a wedding is happening.

I've asked my FI to reiterate that he only would like to invite the HS cousins I mentioned before, and that we will not send out any additional invites. I think it's better he talks to her about it because she is his mom. I would like him to stay away from money talk because she will try to work around by saying how they're only backfilling spaces. I also plan on not sharing with her who on our invite list has accepted and who has declined until right before we give the final numbers to the venue - she'll probably find this information out through the grapevine, but it just won't be coming from us. Is this the best way to handle this situation?        

Yes. Do not B-list or Backfill. Stick to the people that you invited. It's rude to do otherwise. Don't share with your FMIL who is, or is not coming. If she brings it up again, have your FI reiterate that you are not sending anymore invitations. 

OliveOilsMom

You and your FI need to stand tall against FMIL.  Your FI should tell her that you are able to invite the HS cousins and no more.  The amount of declines does not matter because you never intended to invite these more distant relatives.  And just because some people declined doesn't mean she can fill in her 1/3 of the guest list with more people.  

It might even be best to have your FI call and speak with his aunt to inform her about the HS cousins instead of FMIL.  That also helps to avoid any further inquires from FMIL about sending out more invites.

Jen4948

OliveOilsMom said:

You and your FI need to stand tall against FMIL.  Your FI should tell her that you are able to invite the HS cousins and no more.  The amount of declines does not matter because you never intended to invite these more distant relatives.  And just because some people declined doesn't mean she can fill in her 1/3 of the guest list with more people.  

It might even be best to have your FI call and speak with his aunt to inform her about the HS cousins instead of FMIL.  That also helps to avoid any further inquires from FMIL about sending out more invites.

I agree. I think it's safest not to include FMIL in any conversations about the guest list. I'd go around her and have your FI directly communicate with his aunt about inviting the HS cousins.

LondonLisa

"Sorry, the guest list has been finalised so we will be unable to accommodate them. Have you tried this bean dip, it's delicious?" And repeat. Don't give excuses, don't give reasons. Just say that and change the subject. Repeat as necessary.

SP29

Agree with the above.

FMIL should not know who is or who is not attending. I agree to have FI talk to his aunt- keep yourselves as the host. Don't give FMIL the power to invite more.

Re-iterate, "the guest list is closed".

sparklepants41

Knottie1444189200 said:

Hi all,

We are a week away from our RSVP deadline and my FMIL wants to add more guests that weren't included as part of our guest list, and they therefore didn't get Save the Dates or invitations.  

To give some context - the wedding is being paid for 1/3 by my family, 1/3 by FI's family, 1/2 by FI and I. We did as best as we could to keep the guest list 1/3 my family's invites, 1/3 my FI's family's invites, and 1/3 our mutual friends our own age (including the wedding party). When we were planning our budget, we made the guest list. FMIL wanted to invite a whole bunch of her cousins, their adult children, and other distant family who my FI and I have never met (well, scratch that - we saw them at my FBIL's wedding a few years ago, but never saw them before or since then). All of the people she wanted to invite went to my FBIL's wedding, but they also had more help from FSIL's mom so they had a bigger budget. My FI told her that we couldn't afford to invite ALL of them, so she could tell us who she wanted to fill in for 10 spaces. She gave us the names, that was that. (These 10 spaces are in addition to FI's many direct aunts, uncles, and adult cousins.)

We have gotten some declines (not many though), enough for us to tell her that we now have room to invite my FI's aunt's children. We wanted to invite them in the first place, but FMIL said we could take them off for budget and space purposes. They are in high school and we see them at every holiday. When she got the invite, FI's aunt politely asked to clarify if they were invited, and FMIL told her that if we did have declines, we would let her know. Well, now we're at that point, so today my FI asked his mom to inform the aunt that her kids can come. FMIL countered that she has some additional cousins of her own she'd like to invite since, from him saying that, she knows we have declines. Problem is: (a) these people were not on the invite list and did not receive invitations; (b) we don't know them at all!

I want to put my foot down and say no. The cousins of my FI, I believe, should be there and should have priority, and as we get more declines, I do not want to "backfill" the spaces. Even if my FMIL says that these extra guests would be happy just to get the invite and really want to come, they will absolutely know they were B-listed - the RSVP date is printed on the response card, and it's next week! I find B-listing so embarrassing and tacky no matter what my FMIL says. Also, even if we did budget for "X" amount of people, my FI and I would rather just save the money by not backfilling - nothing wrong with coming in under budget, and money is very tight for us right now. Finally, if these people were so important, she would have included them in the first round of invites; they live in the same state as all of us, so nothing is stopping them from coming to holidays, having dinners with my FMIL and us, etc., but they only come around when a wedding is happening.

I've asked my FI to reiterate that he only would like to invite the HS cousins I mentioned before, and that we will not send out any additional invites. I think it's better he talks to her about it because she is his mom. I would like him to stay away from money talk because she will try to work around by saying how they're only backfilling spaces. I also plan on not sharing with her who on our invite list has accepted and who has declined until right before we give the final numbers to the venue - she'll probably find this information out through the grapevine, but it just won't be coming from us. Is this the best way to handle this situation?        

I completely agree with PPs - your FI should stand firm on the stance of not having B-listed guests and tell your FMIL that the guest list is final and therefore closed.

Also - I'm sure this is a typo, but the bolded is making my math-loving brain implode. 

PrettyGirlLost

Just to warn you, depending on your contract, you may not actually end up saving money with declines. . .you may have to upgrade or add apps or food in order to fulfill the minimum stipulated in your contract.

We were contracted for X total, Y amount per person for 200pl, so when our RSVPs came in for 150ppl, we had to add apps to get to X total.

short+sassy

sparklepants41 said:

Knottie1444189200 said:

Hi all,

We are a week away from our RSVP deadline and my FMIL wants to add more guests that weren't included as part of our guest list, and they therefore didn't get Save the Dates or invitations.  

To give some context - the wedding is being paid for 1/3 by my family, 1/3 by FI's family, 1/2 by FI and I. We did as best as we could to keep the guest list 1/3 my family's invites, 1/3 my FI's family's invites, and 1/3 our mutual friends our own age (including the wedding party). When we were planning our budget, we made the guest list. FMIL wanted to invite a whole bunch of her cousins, their adult children, and other distant family who my FI and I have never met (well, scratch that - we saw them at my FBIL's wedding a few years ago, but never saw them before or since then). All of the people she wanted to invite went to my FBIL's wedding, but they also had more help from FSIL's mom so they had a bigger budget. My FI told her that we couldn't afford to invite ALL of them, so she could tell us who she wanted to fill in for 10 spaces. She gave us the names, that was that. (These 10 spaces are in addition to FI's many direct aunts, uncles, and adult cousins.)

We have gotten some declines (not many though), enough for us to tell her that we now have room to invite my FI's aunt's children. We wanted to invite them in the first place, but FMIL said we could take them off for budget and space purposes. They are in high school and we see them at every holiday. When she got the invite, FI's aunt politely asked to clarify if they were invited, and FMIL told her that if we did have declines, we would let her know. Well, now we're at that point, so today my FI asked his mom to inform the aunt that her kids can come. FMIL countered that she has some additional cousins of her own she'd like to invite since, from him saying that, she knows we have declines. Problem is: (a) these people were not on the invite list and did not receive invitations; (b) we don't know them at all!

I want to put my foot down and say no. The cousins of my FI, I believe, should be there and should have priority, and as we get more declines, I do not want to "backfill" the spaces. Even if my FMIL says that these extra guests would be happy just to get the invite and really want to come, they will absolutely know they were B-listed - the RSVP date is printed on the response card, and it's next week! I find B-listing so embarrassing and tacky no matter what my FMIL says. Also, even if we did budget for "X" amount of people, my FI and I would rather just save the money by not backfilling - nothing wrong with coming in under budget, and money is very tight for us right now. Finally, if these people were so important, she would have included them in the first round of invites; they live in the same state as all of us, so nothing is stopping them from coming to holidays, having dinners with my FMIL and us, etc., but they only come around when a wedding is happening.

I've asked my FI to reiterate that he only would like to invite the HS cousins I mentioned before, and that we will not send out any additional invites. I think it's better he talks to her about it because she is his mom. I would like him to stay away from money talk because she will try to work around by saying how they're only backfilling spaces. I also plan on not sharing with her who on our invite list has accepted and who has declined until right before we give the final numbers to the venue - she'll probably find this information out through the grapevine, but it just won't be coming from us. Is this the best way to handle this situation?        

I completely agree with PPs - your FI should stand firm on the stance of not having B-listed guests and tell your FMIL that the guest list is final and therefore closed.

Also - I'm sure this is a typo, but the bolded is making my math-loving brain implode. 

Al Gore on South Park, "Man-Bear-Pig!!!  Half man, half bear, half pig."

I think the OP is saying her and her FI are together splitting the final third.  But I enjoyed my Al Gore "Man-Bear-Pig" moment when I read the post.

Agree with the other PPs.  Blood talks to blood.  Your FI should be the one saying "no" to FMIL.  He may not even want to go down the rabbit hole of giving a further explanation, but what she wants to do is actually quite rude.  She risks her relatives being offended if they are invited "last minute".

simplylaurel

We had this happen. We firmly told my FMIL "no' after she suggested backfilling the first time, and stopped telling her when we got no RSVP's from then on. So she just started contacting their guests directly and secretly backfilling herself, without saying anything to us. FFIL spilled the beans to my husband the night before the wedding that "so-and-so is coming with Aunt Shirley, since Uncle Al couldn't come."

Rather than suffer a total mental breakdown the nigh before the wedding, I just let it go and figured that Aunt Shirley and her guest would be the ones with red faces when they saw the seating chart and realized that mystery guest wasn't supposed to be there.

MesmrEwe

The challenge here is that you/FI said "We'll call you if we get any declines and there'll be room" for said cousins specifically, so you've already opened that can of worms up.  IMO, given that, you do not need to involve FMIL, your FI can call them up and say "we have room for Cousin Wednesday and Pugsly if you'd like to bring them along, but I need to know today!".

As the PP mentioned, check your contracts!!!

Knottie1444189200

Thank you so much everyone for the advice! I'm glad that there is consensus that backfilling/B-listing is rude - I was scared for a moment I was being a rude or a bitch by refusing the requests, but I realize it is ruder to invite people last minute, making them feel like an afterthought. 

Our venue says that 125 is the minimum - if we end up with less than 125 guests, we have to pay for at least 125. Our RSVP deadline was yesterday and we're still missing responses from 35 people. We'll wait until Wednesday (since people might have mailed their RSVPs yesterday) to start following up with the stragglers. 107 have RSVPed yes, only 11 have said no so far. We budgeted for approximately 150, so even if we come in under and have to pay for 125, that'll be saving money in my mind. 

Oh, and after all this - FI's cousins (in HS) won't be coming after all according to their mom (FI's aunt). Being high schoolers, they probably are doing something with their friends that weekend. The aunt told my FMIL after my FBIL's wedding that her kids shouldn't have come since they didn't have fun - a kinda rude comment in my opinion, which led to my FMIL to strike them from the guest list, but I think the aunt was (awkwardly) making a point how they were in their gawky middle school/early HS years and felt too self-conscious to dance and be social. Oh well, I made it clear they are welcome to attend and it is their prerogative if they want to come or not.

Fortunately FMIL hasn't mentioned again these extra guests she wanted to invite, even after FI's aunt said her kids won't come after all. Fingers crossed that was the last of it...

@simplylaurel - that's so crazy! Sorry you had to deal with that. I am crossing my fingers that my FMIL won't be doing anything like that. I don't think she would, but weddings and guests lists bring out craziness for some reason. I also overall don't understand how there are so many people out there who would feel comfortable attending a wedding based on a verbal invite! And how there are so many people who strongly hint or flat out ask to be invited to a wedding when they don't even know the bride and groom (as is the situation with a few people towards my FMIL)! Do they just want a night out on the town and a chance to have some wedding food? Do they think a wedding is the best time to meet the bride and groom for the first time? People are strange, lol...