I hope my kids never ever feel they 'owe' me like this

mrsconn23

Dear Prudence,
When I first went to college, I set up a joint bank account with my parents because they were helping me financially. They’ve also paid for pretty much everything else in my entire life growing up, including some pretty big medical bills from an illness I had. Fast forward 10 years and now I am making good money, but my parents keep taking funds from my bank account. When my mom does it, she tells me about it and says she’ll try to pay me back, but my dad just takes the money. Dad doesn’t know Mom dips into my account, and Mom has no idea Dad is doing it too. I feel guilty about closing the account and starting a new one they can’t access because they’ve always been so generous to me. And I’m always happy to give them what they need, but I’m particularly annoyed with Dad for just taking money. It’s a pride thing with him. I could also deal with it if the sums were really minor, but we’re at close to $4,000 now, which is a lot of money. (But not even a fraction of what they’ve given me over the years. See why I’m so conflicted?) What can I do to a) protect my money?, b) still be helpful to my parents, and c) allow Dad to save face?

—Incredible Shrinking Bank Account

DrillSergeantCat

I'd want to know how old LW was when the illness hit. If you were still a dependent, then it was their responsibility to pay those. The only thing you can do to protect your money, is to close the account or stop putting your paycheck in there. Explain to dad that you appreciate everything they did for you, but that you can't afford for him to keep taking money from your account and that if they're truly in a bind you're more than happy to help.

charlotte989875

Yah, no. LW needs to have a real conversation, with both of her parents ASAP. 

I do wonder what the terms of the initial "financial help" during college was. Did they expect her to pay them back, and they see this as repayment? 

Close the account, and have a real talk about what the expectations of "help" is. Or deal with the fact that your parents are stealing from you. 

bleve0821

With my bank, I was told (when we tried to add DH to it) that all the account holders had to be present to make any changes to it, since it was a joint account.  So she may not be able to close the account on her own.  In which case, I would open a new account yesterday and start depositing the majority of my funds in there.  And I would have had a conversation with my parents a long time ago.

I both see and don't see why LW feels indebted to his/her parents.  There are days I feel like I owe my parents for providing for me the way they have (especially when I see the cost of college tuition, which they paid for in full, no strings attached), but I'm not eager to cut them a check every month... I could use those funds to support MY kids the way my parents supported ME.

If this financial aid came with no strings attached... well, there are other ways to show your gratitude than enabling the sticky fingers in the honey pot.

NOLABridesmaid

Why is she not talking with her parents about this? I would leave $50 in the account and open another bank account for all of my personal transactions. Problem solved.

ShesSoCold

So, I agree with PPs. But it sounds like LW doesn't mind helping here and there and wants to give to her parents without her dad having to ask.

This would never be me, but if I were, I'd open a new account to use primarily and put a little in the old account every month or so.

MissKittyDanger

I wouldn't necessarily close the account, but I would remove all other access until a conversation was had.

Did they expect to be paid back? Maybe have a conversation with them separately, since they don't seem to know what other is doing - you don't wanna cause unneeded friction.

If they feel that LW owes them, maybe set out a monthly payment and/or total amount owed?
My parents paid for things when I was first living on my own because they knew things were hard. We made it work and once I was making better money, I discussed with them about a payment plan and how much I owed. I knew they didn't keep track, but I wanted to ensure they knew I respected them enough to make an effort. They liked the fact I talked to them about it also.

thefanciestbeckler

This is really childish to me. Put your big girl pants on and have a conversation with your parents.

My parents helped me during college, but I in no way feel indebted to them for that. They had stipulations like "as long as you're working X amount of hours and are able to pay for A and B, we will help you with the rest". I did my part and they were happy to help me. There were no terms of repayment.

As an adult, I am happy to help my mom out financially if she asks and we are able to. I know she'd do the same for DH and I. Those instances are few and far between though, and because we have healthy boundaries she would never freely take money from us even if she was on our account. Time for LW to woman up.

Ro041

The problem I see with leaving the account open and leaving $50 in there is that she will still have to have a convo with parents a la "Hey, just so you know, I am moving my money to a different account, so don't overdraw the joint account.  If you need something, let me know and I will transfer money over there."  Since she has to have the convo anyway, she might as well just buck up and do it.

short+sassy

AtomicBlonde said:

With my bank, I was told (when we tried to add DH to it) that all the account holders had to be present to make any changes to it, since it was a joint account.  So she may not be able to close the account on her own.  In which case, I would open a new account yesterday and start depositing the majority of my funds in there.  And I would have had a conversation with my parents a long time ago.

I both see and don't see why LW feels indebted to his/her parents.  There are days I feel like I owe my parents for providing for me the way they have (especially when I see the cost of college tuition, which they paid for in full, no strings attached), but I'm not eager to cut them a check every month... I could use those funds to support MY kids the way my parents supported ME.

If this financial aid came with no strings attached... well, there are other ways to show your gratitude than enabling the sticky fingers in the honey pot.

I worked my way through college at B of A.  While I can't speak for all banks, Anyone who was a signer on the account could close it.  However, you couldn't TAKE someone off an account, even if that person was present.  In those situations, the only option was to close it.

I'd probably be more cowardly than I would like to admit.  I would either tell my parents I had decided on a different bank because (insert other reason) and wanted to give them a heads up.  Or, if I didn't mind them grabbing some money on occasion if they needed it, I'd leave a few hundred bucks in there and refill periodically.

But the better and "big girl" panties way would be to, not just talk to them about the money disappearing, but a real conversation like, "Hey, is everything okay with you guys financially?  I've noticed x,y,z."  With potentially a discussion included about their retirement plans.

MissKittyDanger

short+sassy said:

AtomicBlonde said:

With my bank, I was told (when we tried to add DH to it) that all the account holders had to be present to make any changes to it, since it was a joint account.  So she may not be able to close the account on her own.  In which case, I would open a new account yesterday and start depositing the majority of my funds in there.  And I would have had a conversation with my parents a long time ago.

I both see and don't see why LW feels indebted to his/her parents.  There are days I feel like I owe my parents for providing for me the way they have (especially when I see the cost of college tuition, which they paid for in full, no strings attached), but I'm not eager to cut them a check every month... I could use those funds to support MY kids the way my parents supported ME.

If this financial aid came with no strings attached... well, there are other ways to show your gratitude than enabling the sticky fingers in the honey pot.

I worked my way through college at B of A.  While I can't speak for all banks, Anyone who was a signer on the account could close it.  However, you couldn't TAKE someone off an account, even if that person was present.  In those situations, the only option was to close it.

I'd probably be more cowardly than I would like to admit.  I would either tell my parents I had decided on a different bank because (insert other reason) and wanted to give them a heads up.  Or, if I didn't mind them grabbing some money on occasion if they needed it, I'd leave a few hundred bucks in there and refill periodically.

But the better and "big girl" panties way would be to, not just talk to them about the money disappearing, but a real conversation like, "Hey, is everything okay with you guys financially?  I've noticed x,y,z."  With potentially a discussion included about their retirement plans.

I like that wording because there is no blame happening.

lyndausvi

As a joint owners of the account,  they are legally entitled to any money in the account.   Even if they didn't contribute any funds.  They are not legally required to tell the LW they are taking money out.  Morally is, of course, a different story.  Legally it's theirs.  And get this, if a parent(s) die, then a portion of the money in that account is considered part of their estate.

I get the LW thinks of the account has "his", he does contribute all the money. Honestly, that is his problem for not understanding what it means to be a joint account owner.    If you don't want someone else to have access to the funds, then you don't have joint account owners.    Just like if you don't want to be responsible for someone's debt, do not become a co-signer on a loan.  Becoming a joint account holder of assets or debts come with consequences. 

Bottom line is if the LW doesn't want his parents to take out any money he has to put his money into a different account.  Otherwise they will always have the legal right to access any money in there.   Time for LW to put their big girl pants on a have an actually conversation with her parents.

Now,  if the LW really wants to help, then he can. On their terms.  For some 20+ years on payday my dad deposited funds into my grandmother's account to help her out.   As my dad got more successful, the more money he contributed.   All of dad's retirement, kid's educations, etc were always fully funded first.  BTW - grandma was dad's MIL.  Together my parents figured out what they contribute and it was just a budget line.  Grandma never asked for money.   My parent's didn't have a joint account with her either.

kimmiinthemitten

Am I the only person judging LW for being a grown ass person who still has a joint account with their parents at age 28 plus?  They should have been an adult and opened their own account 8 some years ago. 

And now in unshocking news they can't have a conversation with them about closing it?  This is getting just an eye roll from me. 

thefanciestbeckler

kimmiinthemitten said:

Am I the only person judging LW for being a grown ass person who still has a joint account with their parents at age 28 plus?  They should have been an adult and opened their own account 8 some years ago. 

And now in unshocking news they can't have a conversation with them about closing it?  This is getting just an eye roll from me. 

Nope you're not. I'm totally judging.

ILoveBeachMusic

thefanciestbeckler said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

Am I the only person judging LW for being a grown ass person who still has a joint account with their parents at age 28 plus?  They should have been an adult and opened their own account 8 some years ago. 

And now in unshocking news they can't have a conversation with them about closing it?  This is getting just an eye roll from me. 

Nope you're not. I'm totally judging.

I'm still on DS1's account just because we haven't gone in and changed it - we both have to be present (we haven't lived in the same city for 5 years- even more if you count college). I was on his account through college so if we needed to add money I could. We hope to change this at Christmas. I never look at the balance and NEVER take money out.

Please don't judge.

ei34

Maybe LW hasn't had a conversation with the parents yet because he/she is from a family that doesn't talk about money?  My parents always know what the other is up to- the fact that this mother and father don't know the other is dipping says a lot to me.  That said, I agree that a conversation does need to be had...I wouldn't just leave the parents high and dry without a conversation, just throwing out why LW hasn't spoken to them yet?

I was on a full scholarship for undergrad, but my parents supported me since I lived at home, and they let me use one of the family cars as long as I kept the scholarship, worked a certain number of hours a week, not come in piss drunk and wake them up at 4am, etc.  I moved out ten years ago, and there's never been talk about paying them back, but they also don't need money from me.

bleve0821

ILoveBeachMusic said:

thefanciestbeckler said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

Am I the only person judging LW for being a grown ass person who still has a joint account with their parents at age 28 plus?  They should have been an adult and opened their own account 8 some years ago. 

And now in unshocking news they can't have a conversation with them about closing it?  This is getting just an eye roll from me. 

Nope you're not. I'm totally judging.

I'm still on DS1's account just because we haven't gone in and changed it - we both have to be present (we haven't lived in the same city for 5 years- even more if you count college). I was on his account through college so if we needed to add money I could. We hope to change this at Christmas. I never look at the balance and NEVER take money out.

Please don't judge.

Yeah, my parents are still on one of my accounts because I was a minor when it was opened.  My parents and I never actually thought twice about it because it is my account, I am the only one who uses it, but they had to be on it when it was opened.  I haven't lived near my parents or spent much more than a weekend with family since I graduated college, and it hasn't been a huge priority when we all do get together for that limited time to change that.  But, since we want to add DH to my accounts, and we discovered we can't do that without all account holders present, we are planning to waste our limited family time at the bank addressing all that nonsense over Christmas. 

kimmiinthemitten

@ILoveBeachMusic, admittedly my position comes from the POV of someone who has been 100% independent since I was 18, and prior to then the only dependency was the roof over my head.  I own my judginess over adults who are still dependent on their parents.

But I'm not going to lie, if FMIL was on FI's bank account, it could be a deal breaker for me.  There comes a point when you have to cut the umbilical cord.  Clearly it works for you and your family, but it is not working for LW's.

FI lived at home after he graduated through getting his Master's.  He had his apartment for 8 months when he had met.  He didn't understand then, but understands now why I would not have dated him if he still lived at his moms.

Although, it's crazy to me that they've had the same bank account for 10 years as well!  In the last 10 years I think I've had 3!

Jen4948

I would withdraw whatever funds are still in the account and put them in a new account on which the parents have no signatory authority. If that doesn't actually close the account, I'd leave it open and let the parents continue to keep the account open for their own use without keeping any of my own funds in it.

Then I would tell the parents, "I've decided that as I'm an adult, it's time for me to have my own bank account." Simple, straightforward, and non-accusatory.

thefanciestbeckler

ILoveBeachMusic said:

thefanciestbeckler said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

Am I the only person judging LW for being a grown ass person who still has a joint account with their parents at age 28 plus?  They should have been an adult and opened their own account 8 some years ago. 

And now in unshocking news they can't have a conversation with them about closing it?  This is getting just an eye roll from me. 

Nope you're not. I'm totally judging.

I'm still on DS1's account just because we haven't gone in and changed it - we both have to be present (we haven't lived in the same city for 5 years- even more if you count college). I was on his account through college so if we needed to add money I could. We hope to change this at Christmas. I never look at the balance and NEVER take money out.

Please don't judge.

Good point, @ILoveBeachMusic and I totally see where you're coming from. I mean no disrespect. I guess in my mind I see a difference in your situation and a situation where an adult has a joint account with his/her parents and allows them to continually withdraw money without saying anything. I just can't help but wonder why a conversation hasn't taken place between LW and her/his parents before now. 

Eta words

banana468

thefanciestbeckler said:

ILoveBeachMusic said:

thefanciestbeckler said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

Am I the only person judging LW for being a grown ass person who still has a joint account with their parents at age 28 plus?  They should have been an adult and opened their own account 8 some years ago. 

And now in unshocking news they can't have a conversation with them about closing it?  This is getting just an eye roll from me. 

Nope you're not. I'm totally judging.

I'm still on DS1's account just because we haven't gone in and changed it - we both have to be present (we haven't lived in the same city for 5 years- even more if you count college). I was on his account through college so if we needed to add money I could. We hope to change this at Christmas. I never look at the balance and NEVER take money out.

Please don't judge.

Good point, @ILoveBeachMusic and I totally see where you're coming from. I mean no disrespect. I guess in my mind I see a difference in your situation and a situation where an adult has a joint account with his/her parents and allows them to continually withdraw money without saying anything. I just can't help but wonder why a conversation hasn't taken place between LW and her/his parents before now. 

Eta words

This is where I'd be too.   DH has a joint account with his dad.   On occasion his dad can easily make a deposit which has been handy.   Dad has never withdrawn from the account and it hasn't been an issue.

If it ever DID become an issue then we'd have words.  

flantastic

I don't understand why LW's paycheck still goes into this account. He should understand that you can have more than one bank account, right?

I have a joint account with my dad at his work's credit union, and he saved a small amount monthly for me as I grew up. That account is still open, and there are certain things I use it for. My paycheck goes into the (relatively) new bank account that my parents don't have access to, because I'm an adult and I own and monitor that account. If my parents want to give me a gift, or I want to gift them money, we can write a check, or we can transfer money to that other account.

ILoveBeachMusic

AtomicBlonde said:

ILoveBeachMusic said:

thefanciestbeckler said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

Am I the only person judging LW for being a grown ass person who still has a joint account with their parents at age 28 plus?  They should have been an adult and opened their own account 8 some years ago. 

And now in unshocking news they can't have a conversation with them about closing it?  This is getting just an eye roll from me. 

Nope you're not. I'm totally judging.

I'm still on DS1's account just because we haven't gone in and changed it - we both have to be present (we haven't lived in the same city for 5 years- even more if you count college). I was on his account through college so if we needed to add money I could. We hope to change this at Christmas. I never look at the balance and NEVER take money out.

Please don't judge.

Yeah, my parents are still on one of my accounts because I was a minor when it was opened.  My parents and I never actually thought twice about it because it is my account, I am the only one who uses it, but they had to be on it when it was opened.  I haven't lived near my parents or spent much more than a weekend with family since I graduated college, and it hasn't been a huge priority when we all do get together for that limited time to change that.  But, since we want to add DH to my accounts, and we discovered we can't do that without all account holders present, we are planning to waste our limited family time at the bank addressing all that nonsense over Christmas. 

Yes, that what we will be doing too! I just think it is necessary to get me off his account - especially for the like @lyndausvi said in the case of death part of the account would be considered my estate. None of that money is mine, we have just been lazy about getting it done. 

MissKittyDanger

kimmiinthemitten said:

Am I the only person judging LW for being a grown ass person who still has a joint account with their parents at age 28 plus?  They should have been an adult and opened their own account 8 some years ago. 

Depends. After my dad passed away, my mum put my name on all her accounts so then they wouldn't get frozen.
My mum was on my bank account for years, mainly because I didn't take her off and didn't feel the need to. I think if she was dipping into the account it would be completely different, the fact they started touching their child's account has me wondering why it took so long to remove them or start the convo.

Heffalump

mrsconn23 said:

Dear Prudence,
When I first went to college, I set up a joint bank account with my parents because they were helping me financially. They’ve also paid for pretty much everything else in my entire life growing up, including some pretty big medical bills from an illness I had. Fast forward 10 years and now I am making good money, but my parents keep taking funds from my bank account. When my mom does it, she tells me about it and says she’ll try to pay me back, but my dad just takes the money. Dad doesn’t know Mom dips into my account, and Mom has no idea Dad is doing it too. I feel guilty about closing the account and starting a new one they can’t access because they’ve always been so generous to me. And I’m always happy to give them what they need, but I’m particularly annoyed with Dad for just taking money. It’s a pride thing with him. I could also deal with it if the sums were really minor, but we’re at close to $4,000 now, which is a lot of money. (But not even a fraction of what they’ve given me over the years. See why I’m so conflicted?) What can I do to a) protect my money?, b) still be helpful to my parents, and c) allow Dad to save face?

—Incredible Shrinking Bank Account

So the LW is 28, and the only way they could figure out how to do this 10 years ago was a joint account?  That seems weird to me.  When DH and I were living together but hadn't combined finances, we could transfer money to each other for rent, utilities, etc. with a few mouse clicks.  (This was pre-mobile banking, if y'all younger knotties can believe it--you actually had to sit down in front of a computer to pull up your account.)  And we've been married for 10+ years, so it was definitely available in the LW's timeframe.

Anyway, yeah, she really needs to sack up and discuss why the current setup isn't working for her.  And I don't think it's constructive for her to say this, but I think it's really shitty that both of her parents are treating her like their personal piggy bank.  It's one thing if they ask for help and she agrees, but to just pull the money out of her account without so much as a please and thank you?  Hell no.

cupcait927

Heffalump said:

mrsconn23 said:

So the LW is 28, and the only way they could figure out how to do this 10 years ago was a joint account?  That seems weird to me.  When DH and I were living together but hadn't combined finances, we could transfer money to each other for rent, utilities, etc. with a few mouse clicks.  (This was pre-mobile banking, if y'all younger knotties can believe it--you actually had to sit down in front of a computer to pull up your account.)  And we've been married for 10+ years, so it was definitely available in the LW's timeframe.

Anyway, yeah, she really needs to sack up and discuss why the current setup isn't working for her.  And I don't think it's constructive for her to say this, but I think it's really shitty that both of her parents are treating her like their personal piggy bank.  It's one thing if they ask for help and she agrees, but to just pull the money out of her account without so much as a please and thank you?  Hell no.

To the bolded - my dad and I had a join account when I went away to college (I'm 30 now, for context since the LW is 28) because he was SUPER old school and didn't use a computer - didn't even know how to use one. When he needed to put money into my account, he physically went to the bank and did it. It's possible that this LW's parents were old school and this was the easiest set up for them.  

charlotte989875

cupcait927 said:

Heffalump said:

mrsconn23 said:

So the LW is 28, and the only way they could figure out how to do this 10 years ago was a joint account?  That seems weird to me.  When DH and I were living together but hadn't combined finances, we could transfer money to each other for rent, utilities, etc. with a few mouse clicks.  (This was pre-mobile banking, if y'all younger knotties can believe it--you actually had to sit down in front of a computer to pull up your account.)  And we've been married for 10+ years, so it was definitely available in the LW's timeframe.

Anyway, yeah, she really needs to sack up and discuss why the current setup isn't working for her.  And I don't think it's constructive for her to say this, but I think it's really shitty that both of her parents are treating her like their personal piggy bank.  It's one thing if they ask for help and she agrees, but to just pull the money out of her account without so much as a please and thank you?  Hell no.

To the bolded - my dad and I had a join account when I went away to college (I'm 30 now, for context since the LW is 28) because he was SUPER old school and didn't use a computer - didn't even know how to use one. When he needed to put money into my account, he physically went to the bank and did it. It's possible that this LW's parents were old school and this was the easiest set up for them.  

Mine did the same thing. 

But we closed that account when I finished grad school and moved out of state. 

DrillSergeantCat

I don't really understand why the need for the joint account either. As long as you have the account number, you can deposit into an account. I've deposited into my son's account with just his name. My MIL and H have a joint account together, but they don't use it. I'm not sure why they don't just close it.

mrsconn23

AtomicBlonde said:

ILoveBeachMusic said:

thefanciestbeckler said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

Am I the only person judging LW for being a grown ass person who still has a joint account with their parents at age 28 plus?  They should have been an adult and opened their own account 8 some years ago. 

And now in unshocking news they can't have a conversation with them about closing it?  This is getting just an eye roll from me. 

Nope you're not. I'm totally judging.

I'm still on DS1's account just because we haven't gone in and changed it - we both have to be present (we haven't lived in the same city for 5 years- even more if you count college). I was on his account through college so if we needed to add money I could. We hope to change this at Christmas. I never look at the balance and NEVER take money out.

Please don't judge.

Yeah, my parents are still on one of my accounts because I was a minor when it was opened.  My parents and I never actually thought twice about it because it is my account, I am the only one who uses it, but they had to be on it when it was opened.  I haven't lived near my parents or spent much more than a weekend with family since I graduated college, and it hasn't been a huge priority when we all do get together for that limited time to change that.  But, since we want to add DH to my accounts, and we discovered we can't do that without all account holders present, we are planning to waste our limited family time at the bank addressing all that nonsense over Christmas. 

Yep, my dad's on an account of mine too for that same reason. But my parents don't even know (remember?) the account number.  My dad and I discussed taking his name off quite a few years ago, but we haven't gotten around to it.  It's really not a big deal. 

cupcait927

charlotte989875 said:

cupcait927 said:

Heffalump said:

mrsconn23 said:

To the bolded - my dad and I had a join account when I went away to college (I'm 30 now, for context since the LW is 28) because he was SUPER old school and didn't use a computer - didn't even know how to use one. When he needed to put money into my account, he physically went to the bank and did it. It's possible that this LW's parents were old school and this was the easiest set up for them.  

Mine did the same thing. 

But we closed that account when I finished grad school and moved out of state. 

We finally took his name off of the account when I was 25 or 26. We both had to be at the branch to do it and since he hadn't touched it since I graduated, we just never got around to it until many years later. Now had my dad been taking money out of my account whenever he felt like it, that account would've been taken care of MUCH sooner.

ILoveBeachMusic

As far as having a parent's name on an account in order to put money in it, it may vary from bank to bank. When we opened DS1's account he was still a minor and it was required for a parent to co-sign the account. Even now, if the money is a large amount (not sure how much) the name has to be on the account (know this because DS2 just finished college).