Intentional pregnancy before marriage

Goldlie11

I'm kind of curious as to what others think about this.  My friend is engaged, but not planning on getting married any time soon.  She is looking to buy a home and says that she won't be able to afford a nice wedding any time soon.  She and her fiance do not want to JOP it. 

So, now she told me she is pregnant and that the pregnancy was planned.  I don't know why, but I find this decision odd.  Of course I respect her and I'm happy for her.  It just seems kind of strange to "do things backward".  I guess in some ways, marriage isn't going to change their situation much.  Still, I don't get it.  Maybe I'm old fashioned.  Thoughts?

P.S.  I hope I'm not coming across as judgmental bitch.  I strongly feel that people should do whatever they feel is best for them.  

[Deleted User]

They could have been ready for a baby.

They also could have accidentally become pregnant and are playing it off as planned.  Wait for them to slip up about it before you decide to judge them on this.  I know a couple who ran off to Vegas to get married and were suddenly pregger.  They had been planning a nice christian wedding but skipped it for Vegas and claimed they didnt run off to get married because they were pregnant.  She slipped up one day about her "after marriage" pregnancy though, and the truth just came out.

lunarsongbird

::shrugs:: Guess her priorities are different then ours. I'm pretty sure that babies are more expensive then weddings.

Andrew is very traditional. He just told me last week how disappointed he would be if we had a child without being married.

I think marriage would help with things like health insurance- and other benefits such as FMLA. Most employers wont let you take FMLA for a fiance or girlfriend/boyfriend. 

Whose last name is the baby taking? His?

Ember01

I'm old fashioned, I agree with you. I think it is odd If you can't afford a wedding or a house, you can't afford a baby.

Goldlie11

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_intentional-pregnancy-before-marriage?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:136Discussion:353fd74e-0556-4bcc-9325-b9777b685d63Post:33774a5c-745d-480c-b0ff-c82918122fef">Re: Intentional pregnancy before marriage</a>:
[QUOTE]They could have been ready for a baby. They also could have accidentally become pregnant and are playing it off as planned.  Wait for them to slip up about it before you decide to judge them on this.  I know a couple who ran off to Vegas to get married and were suddenly pregger.  They had been planning a nice christian wedding but skipped it for Vegas and claimed they didnt run off to get married because they were pregnant.  She slipped up one day about her "after marriage" pregnancy though, and the truth just came out.
Posted by amsybot[/QUOTE]
No, the baby was definitely planned.  She told me before she became pregnant how they were planning on having a baby.  <div>
</div><div>I'm not judging, I just find it strange.  </div><div>Edit:  I guess by finding it strange I'm technically judging.  </div>

sparkles88

I feel very iffy about this matter. There are couples that have children before they get married, and they seem to be just fine. I don't understand your friend's reasoning, though. I'm not sure how she can say she isn't ready for a wedding, because that's too expensive, but having a baby isn't. I don't see how they're going to be able to find the money to ever save up for wedding when they have to buy diapers and a crib.

lunarsongbird

LOL. Teehee...

Goldlie11

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_intentional-pregnancy-before-marriage?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:136Discussion:353fd74e-0556-4bcc-9325-b9777b685d63Post:4fc1cf0c-5d4f-4adf-9a8a-85cc5f24f6bd">Re: Intentional pregnancy before marriage</a>:
[QUOTE]I feel very iffy about this matter. There are couples that have children before they get married, and they seem to be just fine. I don't understand your friend's reasoning, though. I'm not sure how she can say she isn't ready for a wedding, because that's too expensive, but having a baby isn't. <strong>I don't see how they're going to be able to find the money to ever save up for wedding when they have to buy diapers and a crib.</strong>
Posted by sparkles88[/QUOTE]
This is my feeling too.  Daycare alone is around here $1,000 a month for infants.  I have a couple of family members who had small weddings with the intention of having bigger vow renewals later.  The party never happened because of expenses relating to having a family.  

kibo8

I once had a friend who wanted to get pregnant go on and on about how babies aren't even expensive. I was blown away.

I don't really get the reasoning either. I personally would never intentionally get pregnant before marriage, even if I was engaged.

leia1979

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_intentional-pregnancy-before-marriage?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:136Discussion:353fd74e-0556-4bcc-9325-b9777b685d63Post:0e5d80ce-67f9-4f8e-9ee5-1c9678c8806b">Re: Intentional pregnancy before marriage</a>:
[QUOTE]::shrugs:: Guess her priorities are different then ours. <strong>I'm pretty sure that babies are more expensive then weddings.</strong> Andrew is very traditional. He just told me last week how disappointed he would be if we had a child without being married. I think marriage would help with things like health insurance- and other benefits such as FMLA. Most employers wont let you take FMLA for a fiance or girlfriend/boyfriend.  Whose last name is the baby taking? His?
Posted by lunarsongbird[/QUOTE]

That's what I thought. It certainly doesn't hurt anyone to change the order around, but "too expensive" makes no sense if you're then going to have a kid. Once they have a house and a kid, they may never be able to afford a PPD.

ETA: After seeing some of my friends/coworkers, I don't know how any can afford kids. $2k-$4k per month for childcare, $20k a year for preschool?! I'm not even exaggerating.

Strangely, I guess I'd respect it more if someone said they just don't want to get married.

KatyRoseM

I think its weird and wouldn't do it.  Babies are more expensive.  Babies are more of a commitment than marriage.  Why would you do it in that order?  I don't really get it. 

Goldlie11

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_intentional-pregnancy-before-marriage?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:136Discussion:353fd74e-0556-4bcc-9325-b9777b685d63Post:60812601-777a-4132-b548-d6c813b92895">Re: Intentional pregnancy before marriage</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intentional pregnancy before marriage : That's what I thought. It certainly doesn't hurt anyone to change the order around, but "too expensive" makes no sense if you're then going to have a kid. Once they have a house and a kid, they may never be able to afford a PPD. ETA: After seeing some of my friends/coworkers, I don't know how any can afford kids. $2k-$4k per month for childcare, $20k a year for preschool?! I'm not even exaggerating. Strangely, I guess I'd respect it more if someone said they just don't want to get married.
Posted by leia1979[/QUOTE]
I think you hit the nail on the head.  I'm not against people having children out of wedlock if that's what they want.  I guess I just don't understand the reasoning.   

bethsmiles

I'm old fashioned and I wouldn't do it that way but that's not what I would side-eye them for. What I would side-eye them for is saying they can't afford a wedding but planned for a pregnancy. Babies are more expensive than weddings.

sparkles88

I imagine that couples who aren't married might also run into issues with places like daycares, schools, and medical offices. If they aren't married, I would think schools would be a lot more hesitant to release a child to anyone but the mother. Do they consider both parents guardians or just the mom? I bet there would be a lot of additional paperwork to fill out and have on file, just so it would be okay for the father to pick the kid up from school.

ravenray

That seems very odd to me.  Not that they are having the child before their wedding but that they think that they can't afford a wedding but they can a child.  Maybe they are trying to save their relationship?  That seems to be a common misunderstanding that a child will save your relationship...

mandi921vh

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_intentional-pregnancy-before-marriage?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:136Discussion:353fd74e-0556-4bcc-9325-b9777b685d63Post:6dccbc16-95dc-4140-8079-0deb3f9ef4d2">Re: Intentional pregnancy before marriage</a>:
[QUOTE]I'm old fashioned, I agree with you. I think it is odd :) If you can't afford a wedding or a house, you can't afford a baby.
Posted by Ember01[/QUOTE]

<div>Exactly.</div>

Sparrow87

That's probably not a decision that I would make but it takes all kinds. Your not putting the cart in front of the horse if you never plan on buying a horse in the first place IMHO. 

But your friends don't seem like that kind of couple, at first I thought they were trying to pass it off as a planned thing like PP's suggested.  But since you said the baby was definitely planned, I'm not sure what they were thinking. 

lavenderfields13

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_intentional-pregnancy-before-marriage?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special Topic Wedding BoardsForum:136Discussion:353fd74e-0556-4bcc-9325-b9777b685d63Post:cce02d9d-5a2c-44cb-8f2a-5860be604bad">Re: Intentional pregnancy before marriage</a>:
[QUOTE]I'm old fashioned and I wouldn't do it that way but that's not what I would side-eye them for. What I would side-eye them for is saying they can't afford a wedding but planned for a pregnancy. Babies are more expensive than weddings.
Posted by bethsmiles[/QUOTE]

Exactly! Don't feel bad for judging. I do it all the time. I can't help it

loves2shop4shoes

...


If she can't afford a wedding, how the hell can she afford a child?  Tell her that from now on, when in doubt, open a book and close your legs.

peekaboo2011

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_intentional-pregnancy-before-marriage?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:136Discussion:353fd74e-0556-4bcc-9325-b9777b685d63Post:1636fb39-237b-49b3-9292-b2c25e607a15">Re: Intentional pregnancy before marriage</a>:
[QUOTE]... If she can't afford a wedding, how the hell can she afford a child?  Tell her that from now on, when in doubt, open a book and close your legs.
Posted by loves2shop4shoes[/QUOTE]

<div>If FI moves to Boston, can we be BFFs?</div>

desertsun

I think that the expense really depends not only on where you live, but your health care costs, and what type of jobs you have.

I know some couples where one person works full time, and the other works part time, and schedules around the other person's job so that they're able to do without day care. And if you're breastfeeding and maybe using cloth diapers, and have generous friends and family who help you out with some of the expensive baby gear...I can see how a baby could possibly cost less than a traditional wedding. Of course JOP will be cheaper than a baby.

My H and I were very careful with our BC to avoid an unplanned pregnancy, precisely b/c it was important to us to be married first.

BC is relatively cheap. I will never understand why more people don't use it properly.

But in any case...I agree with you, Goldie. I find it strange that people knowingly choose to go that route. I don't get it either. But I guess as long as they are happy, that is what matters.

bethsmiles

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_intentional-pregnancy-before-marriage?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:136Discussion:353fd74e-0556-4bcc-9325-b9777b685d63Post:f1e7ac2b-8384-4308-917b-f40c614579be">Re: Intentional pregnancy before marriage</a>:
[QUOTE]I think that the expense really depends not only on where you live, but your health care costs, and what type of jobs you have. <strong>I know some couples where one person works full time, and the other works part time, and schedules around the other person's job so that they're able to do without day care. And if you're breastfeeding and maybe using cloth diapers, and have generous friends and family who help you out with some of the expensive baby gea</strong>r...I can see how a baby could possibly cost less than a traditional wedding. Of course JOP will be cheaper than a baby. My H and I were very careful with our BC to avoid an unplanned pregnancy, precisely b/c it was important to us to be married first. BC is relatively cheap. I will never understand why more people don't use it properly. But in any case...I agree with you, Goldie. I find it strange that people knowingly choose to go that route. I don't get it either. But I guess as long as they are happy, that is what matters.
Posted by desertsun[/QUOTE]

This is so true. BF's mom swears she didn't have to buy any clothes for BF and his siblings until they were like 5. I'm sure she is exaggerating but for some people, having a baby is not as expensive as others because of support from family, different incomes, and ability to stay home instead of doing day-care - and I'm sure there are a million other factors I'm not even thinking of.

Also, maybe they can't afford the wedding because they decided they wanted the baby instead? As in they could afford one or the other but not both?

loves2shop4shoes

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_intentional-pregnancy-before-marriage?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:136Discussion:353fd74e-0556-4bcc-9325-b9777b685d63Post:b790c609-cdef-4f1f-b155-c764167c8ef3">Re: Intentional pregnancy before marriage</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Intentional pregnancy before marriage : If FI moves to Boston, can we be BFFs?
Posted by peekaboo2011[/QUOTE]


Deal.

NurseyK

I'm the product of parents who got pregnant, then bought a condo, then got married, and didn't honeymoon until I was 2. It all worked out in the end, even if my mom's strict catholic church made her feel guilty about it for 20+ years. They are still married.

Life doesn't ever happen the way you plan it. In fact, I think God laughs when you make your own plans.

SassyFlats

a) Also agree that babies are usually more expensive than weddings,

b) Seriously believe that having a baby together is even more of a binding commitment than marriage, so why not get married first?

Other than that, as long as they're in a healthy, stable relationship and are good parents, whatever floats their boat is fine by me. I can think their reasoning isn't quite sound and I can think they are going backwards, but in the end there are things that matter a lot more.

Queen Jane

I agree with desertsun (I would quote but iPhone makes it difficult when the original is so long). FI and I had our son last year. We pushed back the wedding because of it. It was not planned, but out of personal experience I can say that our wedding will cost more than the birth plus expenses from the first year. And we did not have health insurance at the time. We got lots of hand-me-downs, good deals on used stuff, cloth diaper and worked our schedules so no daycare is necessary. Our biggest expense is formula, which was not planned, but it is what it is. When I do buy clothes for the baby I usually get a size up and am able to use them longer. Maybe they are just "ready" for kids and that's more important than a PPD. I understand that some people believe marriage needs to come first, but not everyone thinks that way and it is unfair to judge based on such a personal decision, IMO.

scooterpie7

I'm not at all old fashioned and I have absolutely no problem with people having kids before marriage - planned or not - but for me, there is just no way I would plan to have a child with someone I wasn't ready to commit to for life. 

I get that some people are not marriage people, and I think thats fine. Two unmarried people can be just as committed and loving and wonderful parents as married people. But I don't understand why someone who actively wants both kids and marriage would choose the baby as the lesser commitment, either financially or relationship-wise. I can't imagine being ready to have kids with someone but not ready to marry them, unless marriage was something I didn't want or care about. 

I think, in most cases, if the baby is the cheaper of the two options, you could be spending too much on the wedding, or underestimating the incidental costs of raising a baby. But I agree with desertsun and Queen Jane that this won't necessarily be the case in every circumstance. 

Queen Jane

The only thing I can think is maybe it's not a matter of readiness. It sounds like they are ready to be married but would not be content with a JOP. Idk why they would have the baby first though. How old are they? Maybe she is reaching an age where she needs to have kids soon for health or personal reasons.