Second Weddings

Attacking the message

As instructed, this post will attack messages.  I find the wording rather harsh, since I choose NOT to attack anything, and prefer to engage in healthy debate with qualified equals, but in order to walk the fine line laid out by our esteemed moderator, I will follow the prescribed terms of behavior.  (1)The message of censorship: The fundamental problem with censorship is that the censor is reading the material through his/her own eyes, and interpreting it through his/her own viewpoint.  Often, when the censor reads something that evokes a personal emotion it is implied that the emotion is universally felt, and that it was the intent of the writer to evoke that emotion.  Each of us filters the world around us through the context of our own personal lives, and cannot experience it exactly like anyone else.  Sometimes that results in a reader feeling offended.  To censor the offending writing based on the filter through which just one reader views it does one of two things.  It either results in only the most vanilla of writings to exist- those that no one reader has an emotional reaction to.  Or, if the censors are a small group versus  the entire reading audience, it skews the published material toward the opinion of the censor(s).  I attack the message of censorship because I believe that in order to develop a more robust world view, the reader is best served by reading a variety of opinions and perspectives, filtering them personally and responding to the content.  If the reader is offended, I feel the reader has the right and perhaps obligation to point out the offending material, and the writer can then expand their understanding of how the written work is understood, beyond their own small realm.  All involved benefit.  For example: if, in response to a writer's statement, the respondent wrote, "I find it hard to believe that educated people even ask this question" or "for shame that someone your age doesn't act with human decency" both of those statements imply a negative judgement about the original writer.  Should those writings be censored, or should the original writer respond by stating that the phrases are offensive?  In censoring it, no one is educated by the realization that such statements are offensive to the OP.   While it would be a violation of Knot rules to copy and post an actual posting, please know that these are paraphrased from responses given on the knot by an unnamed moderator within the last 60 days.(2) The message that grammar and spelling do not matter:  In a setting where the essential function is to communicate via the written word, promoting that it is not better to utilize the rules of the language we are writing/reading is counterproductive.  When the writer abandons grammar, syntax and spelling, the comprehension of what is written is far more likely to be incorrect and misunderstood.  Having said that, it is certainly understood that writers who speak (and probably think) in primarily another language will struggle with using the English language proficiently.  Other than getting directions to the bathroom or a beer- I would be completely unable to communicate in any other language.  In addition, there are many native English speakers for whom the rules of grammar and spelling were not learned, for any variety of reasons, some of them inherent in the individual, others through no fault of their own.  I attack the message because I think that the writer without the grammar and spelling necessary (not perfect, by the way) to convey their message will be misunderstood-- and that acknowledging the challenge of reading such writing is valid. On the other hand, stating that you "hate anybody" who does not follow a rule is rather extreme.  (3) The message that rules can be applied arbitrarily:  I believe in equity and parity.  The range of responses varies widely on the boards, and even the advice to new members encourages posters to start on certain places, such as month boards and local boards before advancing to national boards, where the responses may be less gentle.  If the Knot ackowledges that up front, then it must accept it as well.  Second Weddings is a national board.  It is obviously not Snarky Brides or one of the other well known challenging boards.  It is also not a local or club board.  If other national boards are not moderated with the level of rigidity that this one is, then it is neither equitable nor fair. I also attack the message of lack of parity when the one applying the rules fails to follow them as well.  (4) I attack the message that lying is to be accepted and not challenged:  Just as a completely made up example-  If I tell you that I live in a 32 bedroom castle on a 4000 acre estate on the ocean, would you not find that a bit far-fetched?  And if you suggest that you would like proof of that fairy tale, perhaps a picture, should your request be considered "luring" me out for ridicule?  This is the internet, and anyone can write anything they want.  I would expect that seeking to validate a hard to believe claim would be par for the course.  (5) I attack the message that a resume is needed to post on the boards: Published or not, certified or certifiable, employed or not, moderator or mere lowly poster - I value the opportunity to interact with a variety of writers.  I don't believe that any one has more right to participate than any other.   Some I will enjoy, some I will ignore, some I will challenge, and some will elicit profound emotional responses from me.  WHO anyone is really doesn't matter.  ~Donna

Re: Attacking the message

  • handfast4mehandfast4me member
    5 Love Its First Anniversary First Comment
    edited December 2011
    Here, here.  It's the about the rules, and the way they're applied. I've stated this numerous times about other definitions, for example "trolling" which I won't return to here.   If someone is attacked, and the attacker is immediately banned, then much drama would not ensue. 
    image Don't mess with the old dogs; age and treachery will always overcome youth and skill! BS and brilliance only come with age and experience.
  • edited December 2011
    I agree with you completely on all accounts. 
    Wedding Countdown Ticker
  • edited December 2011
    Agreed. Well thought out and beautifully articulated. 
  • SharranMattSharranMatt member
    First Anniversary First Comment
    edited December 2011
    Agreed!
    SharraLynn
  • handfast4mehandfast4me member
    5 Love Its First Anniversary First Comment
    edited December 2011
    I just thought of something. And since I'm an adult, and always learning, I'm going to ask.  Is it hear, hear? Or here, here?  I think hear makes more sense, but my first thought was here.  Hmmmmmmmm.
    image Don't mess with the old dogs; age and treachery will always overcome youth and skill! BS and brilliance only come with age and experience.
  • edited December 2011
    I don't actually know.  I have always written here, here, but you are right that Hear, hear makes sense.  On another topic, do you think referencing someone's age is poor etiquette?
  • LesPaulLesPaul member
    First Anniversary Combo Breaker First Comment
    edited December 2011
    I believe it is 'Hear, Hear'.  Sort of an early version of 'Listen up' maybe?
    imageFollow Me on Pinterest
  • edited December 2011
    haha thats the EXACT reason I never use here here! lol..
  • handfast4mehandfast4me member
    5 Love Its First Anniversary First Comment
    edited December 2011
    Well, I guess it depends on the cirumstances.  Certainly saying "you old hag" is not very nice.  However, in my line of work, I'm forever referencing age.  "Those of advancing age" and "early sexual debut" are my current favorites.   Hmmmm.  I guess it also depends on the person.  I'm usually the oldest in my social circle, but that's also because DH is 10 years younger than I am.  If I were at a wedding, however, and 93 year old Great Aunt Sue were referenced as being the oldest person there, dang, I'd give her a standing ovation.  But that's me. What are the circumstances? 
    image Don't mess with the old dogs; age and treachery will always overcome youth and skill! BS and brilliance only come with age and experience.
  • edited December 2011
    what in the bloody he11 are we talking about??? lmao??
  • handfast4mehandfast4me member
    5 Love Its First Anniversary First Comment
    edited December 2011
    Right1 asked, after her very eloquent post, if it was proper to reference someone's age.  But we can switch subjects at the drop of a hat, us ole' timers.  :-)   Cuz that's the way we are.  And 'cuz we know one another so well. 
    image Don't mess with the old dogs; age and treachery will always overcome youth and skill! BS and brilliance only come with age and experience.
  • edited December 2011
    lol oh ok I must have missed that part about age, I saw your post about a hag and I was SOOOOOO lost. lol...
  • handfast4mehandfast4me member
    5 Love Its First Anniversary First Comment
    edited December 2011
    So, if I'm following correctly, Retread, it's Ok for HollieHeidi to post something regarding this (and we all stayed out of that line, as I recall) but it's NOT ok for others?  How is that fair and impartial? And, once again, let's recap.  The OP asked for opinions. She got them.  When she didn't like them, she attacked others.  She wasn't banned by the moderator.  If she HAD been banned, as the rules have been interpreted for us, then the ensuing drama would never have happened.  I refuse to go out quietly.    
    image Don't mess with the old dogs; age and treachery will always overcome youth and skill! BS and brilliance only come with age and experience.
  • handfast4mehandfast4me member
    5 Love Its First Anniversary First Comment
    edited December 2011
    #1.  I never attacked back; I only said "This is a personal attack, and that is against The Knot rules.   Then I clicked "report." #2.  I don't remember anyone attacking HH, but just countered against what she said.  No one called her names, no one told her to shove anything up her you-know-what like I was told.  So, again, it's Ok for you to attack this post, but agree with HH's?  Not fair, not equitable.  Either they all get attacked equally or none at all.  Obviously the knot gods don't see the problem with these posts; Knot Annie is only referencing the DD post being re-posted. 
    image Don't mess with the old dogs; age and treachery will always overcome youth and skill! BS and brilliance only come with age and experience.
This discussion has been closed.
Choose Another Board
Search Boards