Moms and Maids

FMIL HELP

I really like my future mother in law, no she's not perfect but I still like the woman...that is until today. She's the type of person who does not take no for an answer, and always gets her way and throws a fit if she doesn't. Originally my fiance and I, my parents and his agreed to a 140 person guest list. Now the guest list is 150 people. I never wanted a big wedding, I always wanted a destination wedding and I'm not getting that. In order to compromise I asked that everyone invited to the wedding was someone that knew both my fiance and I as a couple, I didn't want people that I don't know invited. His mother doesn't have a lot of family but is a very social person. She decided to invite numerous friends, many of which I do not know or have only met once or twice in the past 5 years. My family and his had a big sit down to discuss the guest list and cut people, she refused to cut anyone and instead pointed at her ex-husband to start cutting people, which he refused to do too (the majority of his list is family who we are close with). So I lost on cutting the guest list, no I'm not happy but I've put my big girl panties on and am dealing with it. Well today was the day that I was going to do the invitaitons, and his mother called and said that she HAS to add two more people! My fiance, who is currently away on a boys trip, told her she could invite them only if she cut two other people. She could not find anyone to cut and her ex-husband is refusing to cut anyone as well. She has spent all day sending me mean and low blow text messages stating that these guests HAVE to be invited. She keeps saying how it's not fair that she cannot have her friends at the wedding, when I explain that it is OUR wedding and not hers she throws a fit (I put it nicer than that of course). She is turning our wedding into a huge social event, and it's not longer about us as a couple. I tried to drop the subject but then she kept calling me. I finally answered the phone and she spent 5-10 minutes screaming at me, telling me that these people need to be invited, that some of her friend's husbands cannot go so these people should replace them, that she raised her son for over 20 years, telling me how I'm being selfish, etc. I kept saying I'm sorry but we cannot invite them, every time I tried to talk she interrupted me. Finally she screamed "I'm done with this wedding" and hung up on me, and that is were we left things. I'm miserable and my fiances miserable. I wish he would handle the situation but unfortuantley he hates confrontations and fights and will not tell her that she is wrong and will not say no to her, which of course makes me look like the bad guy. I do not know what to do. She has done nothing for this wedding, expect to keep trying to throw money at us which isn't the point, and expects that all of her drinking buddies should be invited. I have given in so much for this wedding and am so tired of it, I'm not giving in any more. I'd love to hear some advice because I really don't know what to do. As of now she is still invited to the wedding but we aren't sending any invites to her friends because she claimed she is done with the wedding and we cannot afford all of these people. I'm sorry this was so long but I'm really stressed and desperately need advice. Thanks!

Re: FMIL HELP

  • Personally I fully agree with retreadbride. Second what you can do if she brings it up again is have a price quote list of what it will cost to have all her "friends" there including but not limited to: place settings, tables/chairs, food/drink etc. If she insists that these people be there then tell her "we don't have the resources to have these extra people, if you want them there then here is the price quote of what it is going to cost and you can pay for them if you would like. Otherwise I'm sorry but it is out of OUR budget so it is out of the question". As retreadbride said, your fiance NEEDS to be backing you up because it is definitely causing an issue that he stays silent and the FMIL thinks she has the dog and pony show because he isn't sticking up for the two of you.
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_moms-maids_fmil-help?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:357Discussion:b27dfb19-d54c-47f0-9a6d-639c3b875cc4Post:63cc5c14-2e5c-4285-a0a7-3a3ece0b30f3">FMIL HELP</a>:
    [QUOTE]I really like my future mother in law, no she's not perfect but I still like the woman...that is until today. She's the type of person who does not take no for an answer, and always gets her way and throws a fit if she doesn't. Originally my fiance and I, my parents and his agreed to a 140 person guest list. Now the guest list is 150 people. I never wanted a big wedding, I always wanted a destination wedding and I'm not getting that. In order to compromise I asked that everyone invited to the wedding was someone that knew both my fiance and I as a couple, I didn't want people that I don't know invited. His mother doesn't have a lot of family but is a very social person. She decided to invite numerous friends, many of which I do not know or have only met once or twice in the past 5 years. My family and his had a big sit down to discuss the guest list and cut people, she refused to cut anyone and instead pointed at her ex-husband to start cutting people, which he refused to do too (the majority of his list is family who we are close with). So I lost on cutting the guest list, no I'm not happy but I've put my big girl panties on and am dealing with it. Well today was the day that I was going to do the invitaitons, and his mother called and said that she HAS to add two more people! My fiance, who is currently away on a boys trip, told her she could invite them only if she cut two other people. She could not find anyone to cut and her ex-husband is refusing to cut anyone as well. She has spent all day sending me mean and low blow text messages stating that these guests HAVE to be invited. She keeps saying how it's not fair that she cannot have her friends at the wedding, when I explain that it is OUR wedding and not hers she throws a fit (I put it nicer than that of course).  She is turning our wedding into a huge social event, and it's not longer about us as a couple.  I tried to drop the subject but then she kept calling me. I finally answered the phone and she spent 5-10 minutes screaming at me, telling me that these people need to be invited, that some of her friend's husbands cannot go so these people should replace them, that she raised her son for over 20 years, telling me how I'm being selfish, etc. I kept saying I'm sorry but we cannot invite them, every time I tried to talk she interrupted me. Finally she screamed "I'm done with this wedding" and hung up on me, and that is were we left things. I'm miserable and my fiances miserable.<strong> I wish he would handle the situation but unfortuantley he hates confrontations and fights and will not tell her that she is wrong and will not say no to her, which of course makes me look like the bad guy. </strong>I do not know what to do. She has done nothing for this wedding, expect to keep trying to throw money at us which isn't the point, and expects that all of her drinking buddies should be invited. I have given in so much for this wedding and am so tired of it, I'm not giving in any more. I'd love to hear some advice because I really don't know what to do. As of now she is still invited to the wedding but we aren't sending any invites to her friends because she claimed she is done with the wedding and we cannot afford all of these people. I'm sorry this was so long but I'm really stressed and desperately need advice. Thanks!
    Posted by michele41389[/QUOTE]

    It sounds like you know the lifetime you're willingly signing up for. That means you don't get to complain about his spineless, doormat ways ever again after you say "I do." You'll spend the rest of your married life coming in second to this woman because he cares more about her feelings than he does about yours. Remember, actions speak louder than words. He's showing you how you rate in his life, and it's not very high.
  • In Response to Re:FMIL HELP:[QUOTE]Personally I fully agree with retreadbride. Second what you can do if she brings it up again is have a price quote list of what it will cost to have all her "friends" there including but not limited to: place settings, tables/chairs, food/drink etc. If she insists that these people be there then tell her "we don't have the resources to have these extra people, if you want them there then here is the price quote of what it is going to cost and you can pay for them if you would like. Otherwise I'm sorry but it is out of OUR budget so it is out of the question". As retreadbride said, your fiance NEEDS to be backing you up because it is definitely causing an issue that he stays silent and the FMIL thinks she has the dog and pony show because he isn't sticking up for the two of you. Posted by Atlossforwords[/QUOTE]

    I tried this tactic, my mom agreed to it, and we never got the money. Now she has a whole new list of people we barely know she wants included.

    I think OP and FI should stay firm on no additional people. After this big blowup, it will get easier if she stays consistent with saying no. FI needs to come to her defense, too. There is no reason his mom should be able to bully her without him stepping in.
  • "She has done nothing for this wedding, expect to keep trying to throw money at us which isn't the point, and expects that all of her drinking buddies should be invited." She's not paying but she's offering to pay, am I correct?
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  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_moms-maids_fmil-help?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:357Discussion:b27dfb19-d54c-47f0-9a6d-639c3b875cc4Post:63259d9f-523d-4940-a360-0efd16e279e4">Re:FMIL HELP</a>:
    [QUOTE]"She has done nothing for this wedding, expect to keep trying to throw money at us which isn't the point, and expects that all of her drinking buddies should be invited." She's not paying but she's offering to pay, am I correct?
    Posted by Simply Fated[/QUOTE]

    <div>She has offered to pay a big chunk of the wedding but so far we have not seen a penny from her (my parents have already paid a lot of money and so has his father). She has not helped plan the wedding at all and doesn't even ask questions about the wedding. She's just very concered about inviting every friend she has ever had and when we say no her resolution is to offer us more money (but we haven't actually received any), but it's not just about the money, it's about the fact that I wanted a small intimate wedding and now it's just enough is enough. After her yelling at me that she is done with the wedding I doubt we will see any money from her, which is fine, we will manage.</div>
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_moms-maids_fmil-help?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:357Discussion:b27dfb19-d54c-47f0-9a6d-639c3b875cc4Post:8e5cdf08-cbc7-47ce-953f-ce131fea9595">Re: FMIL HELP</a>:
    [QUOTE]You have a fiance problem, not a FMIL problem. If he won't stand up to his parents now he won't do it later, either.  He'll cave, and expect YOU to cave to them for the rest of your lives.  It will be worse, not better, if you have children. Why do you "have" to have the wedding they want?  They only get to call the shots if they are footing the bill.  If that's the case, then you should decline their money, and have the wedding you and your fiance can afford to host yourselves.
    Posted by RetreadBride[/QUOTE]

    <div>I understand that the issue does somewhat reside with my fiance but I don't think he's completely to blame. He has stuck up for me a little bit but if you knew his mother you would know that there is no reasoning with her, she's extremely selfish and childish. Also we won't have any issues when we have children because she's already told us, prior to even being engaged, that she would never watch our kids for us. She isn't the motherly type at all! My mom is very giving and always puts her children before herself, so having to deal with a self-centered mom is a new experience for me. I have spoke with my fiance since my first post and he promises to solve everything when he gets home from his trip, it's hard because he's away right now. I'll just have to see if he sticks to his word once he gets back, but until then I'll be in a ball of knots.</div>
  • Don't give in to her.  Like you said, it's not her wedding, so it's okay if not every single one of her friends is invited.  This is your day, and as you said, you have already compromised a lot.  I think the best plan of action is to give her a number of people she can invite, and leave the cutting decisions to her.  If she won't, they it looks like you get to make the decision.  You are the one who sends out the invitations after all.  Don't take any money from her.  


    Also, your fiance really does need to stand up for you.  It doesn't matter if he doesn't like confrontation.  Speak now or forever hold your peace.
  • I would have a mental break trying to plan a wedding without a FI to back me up.  I would get about 1/4 of a way through, then pile everything wedding related into a dumpster, light it on fire, then spend about a solid hour screaming at him until my voice broke,

    Then I'd probably never speak to him again.  But that's just me.  I don't have much patience for people abandoning me to crap jobs.  Especially people that are SUPPOSED to have my back.  That's the entire point of joining your lives together.  If my man can't stand up and have my back, he can't be my man. 
    Don't make me mobilize OffensiveKitten

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    Anniversary

  • AddieCakeAddieCake member
    First Anniversary First Answer First Comment 5 Love Its
    edited March 2013
    Just because she says she will never watch your kids for you does not mean she won't meddle in how you raise them. Your fiance needs to tell her that you cannot afford to invite these extra guests. Period. If she offers to pay, he needs to say, "Hand it over and we'll address an invitation to them."
    What did you think would happen if you walked up to a group of internet strangers and told them to get shoehorned by their lady doc?~StageManager14
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  • If she hasn't paid or helped in other ways, she doesn't get a say. Hold your ground.

    Talk to your fiance about the future. If he's not taking a stand now, he never will. She should not be talking to you like this and making you upset. He should intervene.
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  • Your FI definitely needs to stand up to her.  Call her bluff, he should tell her (preferably in person, not on the phone) "Mom, since you are done with the wedding, we're sorry you won't be there.   You will be missed.  Please tell any of your friends that you may have already told they were invited that there has been a change in plans and they will no longer be invited".  She will likely backpedal like crazy about wanting to be there and have her friends there.

    Stand your ground on the number of guests and insist that she write you a check right there and then for her share of the expenses that she had agreed to pay for.  If she does not, explain this is non negotiable and she will be missed. When the check clears send the invitiations.

  • I agree with holding your ground. Sometimes it is not about the money. In my case, it is about space. Our venue will only hold 70. When FI's mom tried to add people on the guest list before STD's went out, we had to tell her we just aren't able to do it due to space. If we had more space, we'd be wanting to have the money in pocket before anyone else was added.

    You and your FI are due for a big talk. I ditto Retread on counseling.
    Daisypath Wedding tickers
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_moms-maids_fmil-help?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:357Discussion:b27dfb19-d54c-47f0-9a6d-639c3b875cc4Post:2dd491e9-fe3e-4473-87d7-7b957a9c0fd4">Re: FMIL HELP</a>:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: FMIL HELP : I understand that the issue does somewhat reside with my fiance but I don't think he's completely to blame. He has stuck up for me a little bit but if you knew his mother you would know that there is no reasoning with her, she's extremely selfish and childish. Also we won't have any issues when we have children because she's already told us, prior to even being engaged, that she would never watch our kids for us. She isn't the motherly type at all! My mom is very giving and always puts her children before herself, so having to deal with a self-centered mom is a new experience for me. I have spoke with my fiance since my first post and he promises to solve everything when he gets home from his trip, it's hard because he's away right now. I'll just have to see if he sticks to his word once he gets back, but until then I'll be in a ball of knots.
    Posted by michele41389[/QUOTE]

    Nope, your FI is indeed 100% completely to blame. He's the one who allows himself and you to be treated this way by his mother. She's not going to see the error of her ways and just out-of-the-blue do a complete personality switch. You know why? Because behaving the way she does GETS HER WHAT SHE WANTS. Why on earth would she do anything to change that? What has to change is your FI's reaction to her behavior, but that won't because he's a doormat who's afraid of his mommy.

    Good luck with that and remember what I said -- you know how he is and you're willingly signing up for a lifetime of him always caving into mommy's crazy demands because her feelings are more important to him than yours. Remember when you're standing at the altar that you are not the most important woman in his life. Remember that you will never be considered first when mommy is in the equation. Remember that any children that you have will never be considered first when mommy is in the equation. As long as she is alive, your FI will always let her win.
  • melb2013melb2013 member
    5 Love Its Name Dropper Combo Breaker First Comment
    edited March 2013
    Ok, been there done that.  I have literally been through this exact situation.  Here was the difference: I never once communicated with my FILs- my FI did.  It is his family, and he handled them.  I never said no to them, he did.  When they tried to bypass him and attack me, he drove 500 miles to put them in their place and tell them to back off.  In that moment I wasn't sure if I could marry his family.  He told his family this and said that if he lost me, he would never forgive them.  He told them that if they couldn't learn to respect the decisions we make together, they would no longer be welcome in our lives.  I learned through our struggles with my FILs that my FI was on my side 110%.

    On to the specifics of the guest situation.  We kept giving in and giving in without much fuss thinking that we were compromising with them (even though they aren't paying).  A few months ago they decided they needed to invite a whole group of people more.  We put our foot down, they threw a fit to end all fits. 

    Ultimately we gave in on the last group of people with some very particular stipulations.  We literally wrote a contract that we all signed that stated:
    1. The guest list was now final
    and
    2. If we heard one more negative comment about the wedding, they could no longer invite this group of people and we didn't care what they threatened us with.

    That actually bought us peace.  It's been 3 months of wonderful quiet.  

    May 2013 February Siggy: Invitations

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  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_moms-maids_fmil-help?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:357Discussion:b27dfb19-d54c-47f0-9a6d-639c3b875cc4Post:8b3ac454-2cf7-4b95-a1b0-60d22906ad3e">Re:FMIL HELP</a>:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re:FMIL HELP : She has offered to pay a big chunk of the wedding but so far we have not seen a penny from her (my parents have already paid a lot of money and so has his father). She has not helped plan the wedding at all and doesn't even ask questions about the wedding. She's just very concered about inviting every friend she has ever had and when we say no her resolution is to offer us more money (but we haven't actually received any), but it's not just about the money, it's about the fact that I wanted a small intimate wedding and now it's just enough is enough. After her yelling at me that she is done with the wedding I doubt we will see any money from her, which is fine, we will manage.
    Posted by michele41389[/QUOTE]

    This is still vague to me. I assume you are planning your entire wedding as if you were not getting money from her? Or do you actually expect to get some money from her in the end / does she seem like she's under the impression that she will be paying a large portion?
    If she's under the impression that she will be financially contributing, that could explain some of this.
    If there is still any question at all, I'd get that sorted out now.

    If she did have the money and put it in your hand, would you accept it? If the answer is yes you'd need to be prepared to cave some on the guest list.

    I know you want to know everyone at your wedding, but 140 is not small. Odds are you will hardly notice her friends there<em> if</em> they end up being invited.
    And I'm actually impressed that you know everyone's significant other? (I'm assuming you're inviting everyone with their spouses, fiances and/or boyfriend/girlfriends).

    If you're prepared to not accept any money from her, and if she knows that, then I agree with PPs. Have your fiance tell her she gets X number to invite, and that is final.

    If there's still a chance that she might be involved financially, you have to take her wants more into account.
  • You are correct that your fiance is not 100% to blame in that he is not responsible for his mom's choice to treat other people so horribly.  That doesn't mean that his sticking up for you a little bit once in awhile is an adequate response.  He needs to tell her in no uncertain terms that the two of you will be making your guest list, that he will not be accepting any money from her, and if she doesn't start treating him and you with basic human decency she won't be invited to the wedding and he will not have a relationship with her going forward.  If he's not willing to do that, you need to accept that this is the way things will always be, and then decide whether you can live with it or not.  If you can't live with it, then this is not the person you should marry.

    Before you move ahead with any further wedding planning, I would strongly suggest that you do some fairly intense couples counseling.
  • The other ladies here gave great advice.  Especially Retread.  I would only add that if your FMIL tries to call and yell at you for 5-10 minutes, you are the one to blame that you continue to listen to her!  If she tries anything like this again.  Tell her (even if she is trying to scream over you at the time): "FMIL, I'm sorry, but FI and I have already decided on this issue.  If you would like to discuss this, call me back when you have calmed down."  Then hang up the phone!  No one needs to sit and listen to a raving loon!
  • PPs have given good advice but I just wanted to add: I get that your FI is OOT right now and probably busy, but he's clearly in communication with you.  If anyone had called and screamedat me you can bet your ass my H would not "deal with it when he got home" he would be on the phone in a split second to make it absolutely clear that it wasn't acceptable.  That, IMO, needs to be dealt with way before any talk of guest lists even begins.

    As for the add-ons, I agree that the two of youshould stand your ground.  I don't know how you originally divided your numbers; presumably it was evenly among the three sets of parents (not sure why she keeps trying to steal seats from FFIL).  FI needs to tell her she has X guests and that's it.  She can cut the list or he will do it for her.
  • Personally I would talk to fiancée and have him put his foot down with mom. Se either tells him what 10 people to cut or he will choose which 10 to cut, period! He should be having this discussion with his mother, not you. Oth posters are right if she meddles and demands and both of ou ave she will continue to do it.
  • edited March 2013
    While I also have a FMIL problem but I think yours is in a much worst situation so I just want to say that I feel sorry for you.  I don't know if you still need advice now but I'll just tell what I'd do.  I definitely think that you should have your FI to tell his mother that you two are not changing your decision and that she has to make up her mind of who to invite and who to cut off.  If he is not confortable in doing that, he can call his mother and ask to give him the final guest list and if she doesnt take out the 2 guests, he'll decide that for her.  I think you just have to make it clear that if she doesn't give you the final guest list, then no one from her side will be invited to the wedding.  Just make it her choice of cuting two people or none of her friends will be at your wedding.
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