Chit Chat

I think I just got hit with the wedding truck (long with CN)

Gah-- so much wedding shit happened this morning.  Cliffs Notes at the bottom in red.  We stayed over FPILs' house last night for FSIL's bday party (everybody went out afterwards and slept over).  This morning I was chatting with Fi, FMIL, and Fi's grandpa over coffee.

Awesome thing first: FPILs offered to host our rehearsal dinner!  Yippee!  I am so excited about this.

Less awesome thing: FMIL said Fi's cousin-- we'll call her Anna-- is really hurt she isn't in the wedding party.  Fi and Anna are exactly the same age and grew up very close.  Anna and her younger sister are going to be BMs in FBIL's wedding this July, our wedding is May 2015, and Anna is getting married a few months after us.  She is really excited about all the weddings and is feeling left out of ours.
--First off, I feel terrible.  Anna is a sweet person and the last thing I would want to do is hurt her feelings.  She is sensitive so I don't think FMIL is making this up.
--I spoke with Fi about including Anna earlier in our engagement, but he said my BM's are my friends and my business.
--We have not finalized our BP yet, though.  We're still a little more than a year out.
--So when FMIL said this, I suggested she could stand up on Fi's side.  The family totally balked at this idea and didn't even understand the concept.  FMIL said, "If you decide to ask her, it needs to come from both of you and she needs to stand with the girls."  Fair enough, they are a very traditional family.
--Fi said he would have to think about it.  Decent enough answer, I suppose.

Thing I'm just confused about: Grandpa (he speaks only Italian) asked through FMIL as translator what church we are getting married at.  FMIL told him we're getting married outside, not in the church, and poor Grandpa looked completely crushed.  His face fell, he held his head in his hands, and I could understand a little bit of what he was saying-- something about how it's not a marriage if it's not in the church, or you have to get married in the church, it won't be real, that kind of thing.  The poor guy looked so, so depressed.  
--The part I'm most upset about: when Grandpa asked this, Fi made some kind of awkward joke and left the table for a few minutes.  He came back a couple minutes later but I was pissed that he left me there.
--FMIL wants to ask the family priest if he will come out to our venue and do the ceremony.  I told her I'm open to hearing about it but I'm not sure, I have to see whether I'm comfortable with it.
--I think FMIL is going to turn out to be wrong, and the priest will not perform a ceremony outside of the church for no good reason, so this concern might be moot.
--But now Fi looks really excited about that prospect.  He has said a couple of times that he really wants to receive the marriage Sacrament.  I just don't know what to do if it turns out the priest will come perform the wedding.  I don't know if it's okay that I'm not Catholic (I'm baptized Presbyterian but don't practice any religion actively).  The religious aspect of the ceremony is just not terribly important to me-- yes, I believe in God, but I'm just no longer a fan of organized religion.  I'm wondering if I should just cave on this and let Fi have what he wants.  We have already decided to raise our children Catholic.  
--Paging @HisGirlFriday13 and @monkeysip for Catholic help, please.  Would the priest even come do this?  Would it be disrespectful of me to go through with a Catholic ceremony as a non-Catholic?  I guess I should also mention that neither Fi nor his family actually attends church except maybe once per year.

When Fi and I got home, I told him how upset I was that he just walked away-- we really need to present a united front.  He apologizes and says he knows it was rude.  He has a lot of trouble with words (we both suspect he has dyspraxia) and he clams up in stressful situations.  Usually he's good with confronting his family about these things, but that's when he plans out ahead what he's going to say and calls when he's ready.  But that still doesn't make it okay to bail on me.

Fi said once we got home that as he thinks about it, he really does want to include Anna as a BM.  This would mean I have 7 or 8 BMs depending whether I ask a certain friend.  I guess this is okay.  Anna is really sweet.  I just wish his family was less traditional and was cool with the idea of a grooms maid.

Cliffs Notes: 1) Fi's female cousin wants to be a BM, and now Fi wants her as well.  I'm wondering whether to just make her a BM even though we aren't close friends.  2) Fi left me in a conversation with his family about having a Catholic wedding (which he wants and I don't) and I'm A) annoyed he left me and B) now wondering if we can have a Catholic ceremony because I see it's important to him.  3) And yippee, FPILs offered to host the RD!
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"I'm not a rude bitch.  I'm ten rude bitches in a large coat."

Re: I think I just got hit with the wedding truck (long with CN)

  • Sorry you got hit with the wedding truck. When we started planning our wedding I had a few relatives who were a little upset that we aren't getting married in a church or by a baptist minister. They weren't trying to push it on me or anything they were just really confused and kept asking why (it should be noted that my mom's aunts were the upset ones, my mom, grandmas, and great grandma could have cares less. Lol). Anyway when I got sick of them asking I lied. I said that we thought about getting married in a church (didn't happen we're both pagan) but that since we aren't practicing we thought it would be disrespectful and a little blasphemous. Not only did they stop asking about the the church they started telling other relatives that I had a healthy dose of respect for their beliefs and started offering to help do wedding stuff. You just never know what is going to work with people. I hope that you and your FI can find a similar solution that makes everyone happy (I know that usually doesn't happen) and gives you and FI what you want on your wedding day.
  • For a priest to do a marriage outside the Catholic church, he needs a dispensation from the Bishop.  This is usually done in cases of interfaith marriage, where one spouse really wants to get married in their non-catholic church, for example.

    Or in extreme cases, like a hospitalized person or something.

    It's not granted by the bishop for reasons of convenience, appearance, etc.  

    I understand your grandpa is upset, but I think the real issue is that you and FI have chosen not to live your lives as practicing Catholics, right?  Or else you'd be marrying in the Church.  That's the deeper issue that grandpa needs to deal with ,and it can't be remedied just by you bringing a priest out to your non-Church wedding.  So much more goes into a Catholic wedding and marriage like that.

    If that's what you and FI have decided, you need to stick with your beliefs.  It would be disrespectful to try and have a Catholic wedding if you and FI do not want to practice by going to mass regularly, raising your children Catholic, etc.  It's hard for religious family to deal with, but you have to stick with your own conscience here.

    Of course, if FI has changed his mind and really wants a Catholic wedding, then that's something to discuss.  I doubt you'd be able to have it at your secular venue though.  But does he want it just to make family happy, or does he want to try and practice his faith now and stay in communion with the Church?

    Hope things get better with your planning!

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  • (Feel special; I actually turned on my laptop to Knot with you, rather than Knotting on mobile!)

    So, the short answer is, the family priest can't do what you/FI/FMIL want him to do. The Sacrament of Marriage must be performed in a Catholic church building (or another space designated as acceptably by the church; some colleges have inter-faith chapels that the RC church has okayed for use).

    If this is something that's important to your FI, and it sounds like it is, you and he need to have a sit-down conversation about this. If he is married outside the Church, he will be out of communion with the Church and he will not be able to receive the sacraments (like communion). That's a very big deal to Catholics (and that's probably why grandpa was so upset).

    (OT: Your FI was a douche for leaving you alone during that, btw. I want to yell at him for you).

    If you and your FI have decided to raise your kids Catholic, then you should do pre-Cana. And if you plan to raise your kids Catholic, you need to be married in the Church, which either means changing your plans and having a Catholic Mass (you wouldn't have to convert), or trying for a convalidation of your union after your marriage.

    A word of warning on convalidations, though -- the church is cracking down on those. A friend of mine and a cousin of mine both got married outside the church and planned to have a convalidation afterwards. Both of them are being denied that because they haven't, in the eyes of their priests, shown 'good reason' that they didn't get married in the church.

    Part of that, to be fair to the priests, is because neither of the Catholics (my male friend and my male cousin; both of whom married non-Catholic women. My cousin's wife is the daughter of a Protestant minister) in the couples actually practises his faith. They're both lapsed Catholics who rarely attend Mass unless nagged by their mothers (or in the case of my friend, at my own wedding).

    Is your FI going to church regularly now? If not, that's likely going to be an issue for the priest --he's going to want to know why your FI wants to get married in the Church if he's not actually part of the Church.

    A convalidation isn't guaranteed -- you have to show the priest you had a 'good reason' for getting married outside the Church, and that you're serious about being part of the Church now. 

    How important is this to your FI? The answer to that question will control what other actions you and he take regarding your marriage.

    As far as Anna the cousin -- that's pretty shitty of your FMIL to do, IMHO. People get to pick their own BPs, and if your wedding isn't until 2015, they don't even know for sure that she's not going to be asked. But if your FI wants her there, I agree with having her stand on his side, even though your FI's family is apparently really traditional and wants her on your side.

    This is one of those etiquette v. real-life questions. The etiquette answer is that you are within your rights not to ask her or within your rights to say to FI, 'Then have her stand on your side,' but the real-life answer is, will either of those cause problems with the family? And what's more important -- hewing strictly to etiquette or risking WWIII? It might, for the sake of family peace, be worth making her a BM (although that answer grates on me).

    (Side note; I am effing sick of people getting hurt about not being a BM and then telling other people about it in an effort to guilt the B&G into putting them into the WP).

    Congrats on the RD!!
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    I'm gonna go with 'not my circus, not my monkeys.'
  • It's not uncommon for the groom to have girls on his side or vice versa. When my sister got married it happened that one of her best friends was a guy and one of her husband's best friends was a girl. They each stayed on those respective sides (girl even wore a tux, but that's not necessary) even though they were all mutual friends at that point. 

    Do what feels right. She could stand on your side if you want, or on his, or you really don't have to make her part of the BP at all. She'll get over it. She could do a reading or something else that will make her feel important. Do you know what side she would prefer to stand on? 

    As far as the church thing goes, I'm getting the same crap from my dad. The blasphemous line that jdluvr06 mentioned didn't even work (and it's true, in my case). I'm not sure how things work when one person isn't Catholic, but I know they won't perform a wedding outside of a church (which ended up being my excuse for not having a Catholic wedding- I really wanted to get married outside). A blessing might be a possibility. But you have to do what feels right to both of you. 

    I'd be pissed if FI left me in the middle of a tense conversation with his family. 
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  • I don't understand why people get butthurt about not being in the WP; especially if you would be standing on the side of someone you're really not that close to.  I also don't understand why she's so upset because the wedding is still a ways off.

    I would talk to your FI in a few days to see if he just feels bad, or if it would mean a lot to him.  If he really wants her to be in the wedding, but you already have your nearest and dearest standing with you, (and his family would be upset if she was on his side) could she do a reading?

    For the ceremony, figure out what you both want, and then find the compromise.  I think the ceremony is where couples should not be people pleasers, obviously if it's your choice and it happens to make everyone happy, cool, but if it's not what you want as a couple, don't give in. 

    Oi.  Big glass of wine for you tonight!
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  • I also don't now why people get hurt or offended if they are not asked to be in the WP. Get the F over it. I think it's shitty that this cousin went whining about it to the family, thus putting you in an awkward position. If FI really wants her there though, then she should def stand on his side. It's your wedding , not his family's, and maybe that will teach them to butt out. But - do not put her in your BP. I'm a firm believer that you should have those that you love the most, your bestest friends or family be in your BP. The one's that have been there through thick and thin, and have seen you at your best and at your worst. Don't add her in just because she's complaining about it, she is just going to have to get over it. 

    As for the ceremony, do what you both want. It sucks that Grandpa is upset, but this is your wedding. We are both non practicing Catholic's so we are not getting married in a church. If anyone in out family has a problem with it, too bad. I'm sorry FI left you there to dodge that bullet, I hope he knows for next time not to do that! Like you said, you guys need to be a united front, especially in situations like this. @hisgirlfriday13 - I don't remember  lot of the things I learned about Catholicism, but if my parents were not married in the Church, was I really raised Catholic? 

    Congrats on the RD, though! And yea I got hit with the wedding truck the other day - I'm sure this is just the beginning smh. Lot's of wine in the next year lol.
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  • @pinkcow13 -- that's a good question and I don't know. But my guess is that their marriage was convalidated by the church so you could be raised Catholic. I know my parents had to provide their sacramental records at my sacraments, so there is a fail-safe in there.
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    I'm gonna go with 'not my circus, not my monkeys.'
  • A child can still be baptized catholic even if their parents were married outside the Church.  It kind of depends on the priest--and by that I mean that some priests may be hesitant to baptize if they feel that the parents have no intention of trying to raise the baby Catholic, since baptism is supposed to be the first step of many steps to raise a child in the faith.  But canon law does not require the parents to be validly married to baptize the baby.

    Being "really raised Catholic" is kind of a tricky term.  You could baptize a baby, but if  you never bring them to mass or teach them the faith, then you're probably not really raising them Catholic.  

    You don't have to be validly married, but I think it can make it more difficult if you're not.  If you tried to teach the child  the faith, but then they ask, "so can't you or daddy receive communion?" that would be tricky to answer.  Children learn by following your example much more than they learn by following your words.

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  • I don't think the marriage has to be convalidated or anything like that for kids to be raised Catholic. My parents were married by the JOP (my dad was divorced and my mom refused to let him get an annulment because of my older half siblings) and we were all raised Catholic, got baptized, had First Communion, went to Catholic grade school, etc.

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  • JCbride2015JCbride2015 member
    5000 Comments 500 Love Its Second Anniversary First Answer
    edited February 2014
    Thanks for the thoughtful responses everyone.  @HisGirlFriday13, yes, I feel special! :) A computer response!

    @monkeysip and HisGirl, the funny thing about all this is that Fi's family does not attend church, like at all.  They attend maybe once out of every three Easters or Mothers Days.  Not even Grandpa.  So it's harder for me to take them seriously when they get bent out of shape about what kind of wedding we have, when they don't even practice.

    I think for them, it's more about being Italian than devoutly practicing the religion.  It's part of their identity.  Fi says it's partially about family pressure and partially about religion.  I think he's confused about what he really wants.  If really practicing as a Catholic is something he wants to do, I want to support him in that however I can.  But I personally will never be a practicing Catholic, and I think it's disrespectful to act like I am just for a day so Fi and his family can see us have a church wedding.

    Fi says he wants to reflect for a while.  I suggested he should think about it, and maybe call the church to make an appointment to talk with his family priest about his options and sort out his feelings.  I'd come with him for that if he wants me to.

    As for "Anna," I will revisit this in a day or two with Fi, but right now he's saying he really wants her.  I think being a reader would feel to her like she got B-listed.  And Fi is on board with his family on the gender-separated even sides thing (eye roll).  I'm leaning that this is just not a hill to die on, she's a very sweet girl and I genuinely enjoy her company.  As HisGirl said, the etiquette answer and real life answer are not always the same, and she would happy about it.

    Oh, ETA: I know Fi is in the doghouse a bit for bailing on me.  I told him he was a jerk and he said "yeah, I know."  At least he admits he was an ass.
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    "I'm not a rude bitch.  I'm ten rude bitches in a large coat."

  • @JCBride2014

    Either way, you definitely don't have to convert or pretend to be Catholic just for the wedding.  If it's really important to FI, and not just for family reasons, then you might decide to still have a Catholic wedding for him (or a con validation ceremony later IF POSSIBLE), but the non-Catholic spouse doesn't have to do anything particularly Catholic.  You wouldn't receive communion or profess anything you don't believe.  That would be disrespectful to both the Catholic Church and to your own personal beliefs.



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  • I just want to chime in that my youngest sister was baptised, had holy communion, and was confirmed in the Catholic church, but my parents never didn't get married in the church, nor did they have a convalidation. My dad had been a lapse Catholic for many years until my sister was born and we moved to our current town. Our parish is very warm, welcoming, and supportive with a very family atmosphere (it's a small town). My dad started attended mass every week and brought my sister before discussing baptism with the priest. My parents wrote a nice donation to the church and my sister was baptised.

    @JCBride2014 I hope your FI can figure out what he wants so you guys can get on the same page with the wedding planning.
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  • I just want to chime in that my youngest sister was baptised, had holy communion, and was confirmed in the Catholic church, but my parents never didn't get married in the church, nor did they have a convalidation. My dad had been a lapse Catholic for many years until my sister was born and we moved to our current town. Our parish is very warm, welcoming, and supportive with a very family atmosphere (it's a small town). My dad started attended mass every week and brought my sister before discussing baptism with the priest. My parents wrote a nice donation to the church and my sister was baptised.

    @JCBride2014 I hope your FI can figure out what he wants so you guys can get on the same page with the wedding planning.
    Thanks.  The bolded is the most frustrating part.  He can't really articulate what he wants and what role he sees religion playing in his life, so it's hard for me to support him if he doesn't know what he wants.  And I read this indecision as basically meaning he isn't really devout or deeply religious, so I don't see why he and his family are pushing for the Catholic ceremony.  I still think it's more out of tradition and Italian heritage than actual faith.  Which I find disrespectful.
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    "I'm not a rude bitch.  I'm ten rude bitches in a large coat."

  • @JCBride2014  Tell him to make write it out, make a pros and cons list; especially if he is being indecisive and/ or having a hard time articulating what he wants.  

    My FI can be SUPER indecisive, but it helps him to put everything into perspective when he writes it all out.
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  • FI had originally talked about getting married at his family's church (they're Lutheran, I was raised Buddhist/Catholic). I balked because he attends church so infrequently (major holidays), while I attend Mass more regularly though not every week. I said if his faith was so important to him, that he would have to act like it or else it would be disingenuous. We talked about it a lot, and agreed that since it was more about tradition than anything else, we would have a secular ceremony at our beautiful outdoor venue.
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  • I just want to chime in that my youngest sister was baptised, had holy communion, and was confirmed in the Catholic church, but my parents never didn't get married in the church, nor did they have a convalidation. My dad had been a lapse Catholic for many years until my sister was born and we moved to our current town. Our parish is very warm, welcoming, and supportive with a very family atmosphere (it's a small town). My dad started attended mass every week and brought my sister before discussing baptism with the priest. My parents wrote a nice donation to the church and my sister was baptised.

    @JCBride2014 I hope your FI can figure out what he wants so you guys can get on the same page with the wedding planning.

    Thanks.  The bolded is the most frustrating part.  He can't really articulate what he wants and what role he sees religion playing in his life, so it's hard for me to support him if he doesn't know what he wants.  And I read this indecision as basically meaning he isn't really devout or deeply religious, so I don't see why he and his family are pushing for the Catholic ceremony.  I still think it's more out of tradition and Italian heritage than actual faith.  Which I find disrespectful.

    Which, you're right, it is. If this is a 'tradition' thing then too damn bad -- that's not enough reason to either get married Catholic or have a convalidation.

    Also, if your FI isn't really good about going to Mass, why is it so important to him to get married and raise the kids Catholic? And will he actually RAISE them Catholic, or is it just get them baptised and go to church occasionally.

    Also, hearing that your FILs don't actually go to Mass but still want you to have a Catholic wedding or blessing g infuriates me -- practice what you preach here, people.
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    I'm gonna go with 'not my circus, not my monkeys.'
  • I just want to chime in that my youngest sister was baptised, had holy communion, and was confirmed in the Catholic church, but my parents never didn't get married in the church, nor did they have a convalidation. My dad had been a lapse Catholic for many years until my sister was born and we moved to our current town. Our parish is very warm, welcoming, and supportive with a very family atmosphere (it's a small town). My dad started attended mass every week and brought my sister before discussing baptism with the priest. My parents wrote a nice donation to the church and my sister was baptised.

    @JCBride2014 I hope your FI can figure out what he wants so you guys can get on the same page with the wedding planning.
    Thanks.  The bolded is the most frustrating part.  He can't really articulate what he wants and what role he sees religion playing in his life, so it's hard for me to support him if he doesn't know what he wants.  And I read this indecision as basically meaning he isn't really devout or deeply religious, so I don't see why he and his family are pushing for the Catholic ceremony.  I still think it's more out of tradition and Italian heritage than actual faith.  Which I find disrespectful.
    Which, you're right, it is. If this is a 'tradition' thing then too damn bad -- that's not enough reason to either get married Catholic or have a convalidation. Also, if your FI isn't really good about going to Mass, why is it so important to him to get married and raise the kids Catholic? And will he actually RAISE them Catholic, or is it just get them baptised and go to church occasionally. Also, hearing that your FILs don't actually go to Mass but still want you to have a Catholic wedding or blessing g infuriates me -- practice what you preach here, people.
    Yes!  All of this.  I am not religious but I have respect for people's beliefs and the institution.  I find it disrespectful that they only want the church as a backdrop for a pretty wedding, or just for comfort at funerals, or so they feel better about themselves and can call themselves Catholics.

    I did ask him if he actually sees himself bringing the kids to Mass every Sunday and he said yes.  But then, I just don't understand why he isn't going now if it's so important.
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  • ^in that case, I'd forget about the mass thing. I had a similar situation- GMIL was shocked we weren't having a church wedding (not as bad as my parents, but just more flabbergasted I guess). FI hasn't been to church since he was a kid and I doubt GMIL has either. It makes no sense to me.

    Some people just have a really hard time picturing a wedding outside of a church for some reason, which is bizarre to me because it isn't unusual at all. Maybe like 40 years ago, but not now. I agree that tradition is not a good enough reason to get married in a church, especially Catholic. 
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  • I'd recommend that your FI make a list and maybe even get some counseling.

    HE needs to make this decision for himself even though that's easier said than done when he has a strong family presence and guilt pushing him to do things "their way."

    Like you I don't understand the desire to get married in a church if the only reason is "that's how we do it in this family" and has little to do with constantly practicing the faith.    I have way more respect for the couple who says, "Yes this is how many people in our family do it but we don't believe in the requirements of the faith and don't feel comfortable using a building to perpetuate a lie."   


  • Catholic Knotties: can Fi just call up his family church and arrange to chat with his priest about this?  Would this be a good idea in your opinion?  
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  • Catholic Knotties: can Fi just call up his family church and arrange to chat with his priest about this?  Would this be a good idea in your opinion?  
    Sure.  He should be able to.  Maybe the priest can ask the right questions to get him to really figure out why he wants to marry in the Church and whether he truly understands what that means.

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  • Thanks for the thoughtful responses everyone.  @HisGirlFriday13, yes, I feel special! :) A computer response!

    @monkeysip and HisGirl, the funny thing about all this is that Fi's family does not attend church, like at all.  They attend maybe once out of every three Easters or Mothers Days.  Not even Grandpa.  So it's harder for me to take them seriously when they get bent out of shape about what kind of wedding we have, when they don't even practice.

    I think for them, it's more about being Italian than devoutly practicing the religion.  It's part of their identity.  Fi says it's partially about family pressure and partially about religion.  I think he's confused about what he really wants.  If really practicing as a Catholic is something he wants to do, I want to support him in that however I can.  But I personally will never be a practicing Catholic, and I think it's disrespectful to act like I am just for a day so Fi and his family can see us have a church wedding.

    Fi says he wants to reflect for a while.  I suggested he should think about it, and maybe call the church to make an appointment to talk with his family priest about his options and sort out his feelings.  I'd come with him for that if he wants me to.

    As for "Anna," I will revisit this in a day or two with Fi, but right now he's saying he really wants her.  I think being a reader would feel to her like she got B-listed.  And Fi is on board with his family on the gender-separated even sides thing (eye roll).  I'm leaning that this is just not a hill to die on, she's a very sweet girl and I genuinely enjoy her company.  As HisGirl said, the etiquette answer and real life answer are not always the same, and she would happy about it.

    Oh, ETA: I know Fi is in the doghouse a bit for bailing on me.  I told him he was a jerk and he said "yeah, I know."  At least he admits he was an ass.
    I would put my foot down about this..personally. My side, my choice..if he wants someone to stand up with you..it should be on his side....gahh..that makes me pissy. 
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  • Catholic Knotties: can Fi just call up his family church and arrange to chat with his priest about this?  Would this be a good idea in your opinion?  
    He should be able to do this, if not to the priest then, depending on the structure of his church, a deacon or a lay minister working in the area of family formation.  But there should absolutely be someone there you can talk to about your options. (Which will include whether or not you want a full mass with the Liturgy of the Eucharist or a shorter service with only the Liturgy of the Word.)

    Agree with PPs that there are some bigger questions that need to be sorted out as part of this process.  DH and I were the first people on his side NOT be married in the Catholic (or any) church, and while we later had a convalidation, it was an emotional process and, being completely honest, it didn't change how I practice or relate to my faith.  I still have questions and issues and I have a hard time going to Mass regularly.   

    But I definitely when talk to someone.  Getting some advice and counsel can only be beneficial to figuring out your long term goals.
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  • CMGragainCMGragain member
    10000 Comments 500 Love Its Fourth Anniversary 25 Answers
    edited February 2014
    There are consequences for your FI if he is not married in a Catholic  church ceremony.  He will no longer be able to take communion.  This is not easy to fix.
    There are no consequences for you if you are married in a Catholic church ceremony.  As long as you are a baptized Christian, the priest can marry you.  You must take classes (Pre-Cana) to learn about the faith, and you must agree "not to interfere" with your children being raised Catholic.  You do not have to convert.  The Catholic marriage ceremony is not much different from a Presbyterian one if there is no mass said.
    As an alternative, you can have a marriage co-officiated in the Catholic church.  My mother was married in a ceremony conducted by a priest and a Methodist minister together.  This is up to the priest, but it should be permissible.
    Ask your FI to make the call and find out what your options are.
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  • @JCBride2014 : I would definitely have him look into talking with someone, especially a family priest, who could help him sort out his desires with his faith.  It's one of those things that you really should feel like you want to be a part of the Church going forward before you get married in the Catholic church because your family wants you to or "tradition."  Cafeteria Catholics really annoy me and the fact that they're trying to pressure you guys to have a Catholic wedding when you don't feel it would be respectful of the faith bugs me.

    As for the girls and boys segregated sides...maybe you could just hang out with Anna more and see if that fosters more of a close relationship so you're not compromising just because FI wants her there and wants her on your side?  You have a little time before you have to have the BP finalized and everything might work out where you actually feel close to her and would want her on your side anyway.  I agree with not putting someone on your side just because they whined about it, but if your FI really wants her as part of the party it might be worth trying to get closer to her for his sake.

    Also, maybe instead of leaving next time, if he's having trouble articulating his support, he could try staying with you, holding your hand or otherwise showing support without having to verbalize?  Just a random thought I had. 
  • Catholic Knotties: can Fi just call up his family church and arrange to chat with his priest about this?  Would this be a good idea in your opinion?  

    He definitely can, and I think that's a great idea! Almost every priest I know would be willing to sit down with someone and talk about this, even if your FI isn't a member of that parish.

    And I ditto @banana468 that making a list of the pros and cons of what he wants is a good idea.

    I also think you guys should sit down and talk about what role you see religion playing in your married lives. Raising the kids Catholic means different things to you two (as a Catholic, the burden is on him; you just have to promise not to interfere), but how is that going to look in your marriage?

    Will you go to church together? If not, how will you handle the inevitable questions from children about why Mommy doesn't go to church with Daddy or why Mommy doesn't get to go up during communion and Daddy does?

    My mother was Presbyterian when my parents got married, and she didn't convert until I was in middle school, so I definitely remember asking these same questions of my dad, especially at First Communion time.
    Anniversary

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    I'm gonna go with 'not my circus, not my monkeys.'
  • I just want to chime in that my youngest sister was baptised, had holy communion, and was confirmed in the Catholic church, but my parents never didn't get married in the church, nor did they have a convalidation. My dad had been a lapse Catholic for many years until my sister was born and we moved to our current town. Our parish is very warm, welcoming, and supportive with a very family atmosphere (it's a small town). My dad started attended mass every week and brought my sister before discussing baptism with the priest. My parents wrote a nice donation to the church and my sister was baptised.

    @JCBride2014 I hope your FI can figure out what he wants so you guys can get on the same page with the wedding planning.
    Thanks.  The bolded is the most frustrating part.  He can't really articulate what he wants and what role he sees religion playing in his life, so it's hard for me to support him if he doesn't know what he wants.  And I read this indecision as basically meaning he isn't really devout or deeply religious, so I don't see why he and his family are pushing for the Catholic ceremony.  I still think it's more out of tradition and Italian heritage than actual faith.  Which I find disrespectful.
    Which, you're right, it is. If this is a 'tradition' thing then too damn bad -- that's not enough reason to either get married Catholic or have a convalidation. Also, if your FI isn't really good about going to Mass, why is it so important to him to get married and raise the kids Catholic? And will he actually RAISE them Catholic, or is it just get them baptised and go to church occasionally. Also, hearing that your FILs don't actually go to Mass but still want you to have a Catholic wedding or blessing g infuriates me -- practice what you preach here, people.
    Yes!  All of this.  I am not religious but I have respect for people's beliefs and the institution.  I find it disrespectful that they only want the church as a backdrop for a pretty wedding, or just for comfort at funerals, or so they feel better about themselves and can call themselves Catholics.

    I did ask him if he actually sees himself bringing the kids to Mass every Sunday and he said yes.  But then, I just don't understand why he isn't going now if it's so important.
    I find the bolded kinda funny because, FI is agnostic. He was raised Catholic but never continued it during college and after. Despite being very agnostic, and us only going to our non-catholic church about once or twice a month, he is adamant that our children will be going to church every Sunday and that it will most likely be a Catholic Church. So they can get a good moral education/base. For a religion he doesn't really believe.

    Sometimes, I think that boys logic is faulty. :)
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