Career vs. children ~ Update

beharrington

Need some advice:

I'm supposed to be going to Africa for work in May.  I went to get the required vaccines today and I can't get them if I'm pregnant (we'll know by the end of the week).  If I'm not pregnant and I get them, I have to wait 3 or so months before we begin trying again.

I work in the oil industry (so, mostly male) so I don't think many of my coworkers have had this problem.  I don't want to stop trying but I don't want to have this conversation with my boss either.  I don't know how that would even go.  And, if I'm pregnant, that's a whole different conversation because I wouldn't be able to get the vaccines till I finished breastfeeding.

Any suggestions for how to have the conversation with my boss?  Maybe irrelevant but just in case it affects your responses, my boss is a woman but she chose career over kids (as far as I know).  Also, I've only worked here 7 months but she does know that I want kids.

UPDATE: Well, we're not pregnant yet.  So, after a lot of discussion with H, I'm going to go ahead and get the vaccines next Tuesday.  Mostly because, if I wait and the boss was understanding, it would be at least a year before I could get the vaccine (you can't until you stop breastfeeding).  We're looking at it as 3 more months to save up money and finish unpacking our new-ish house.  Thank you all for the words of wisdom last week.

HisGirlFriday13

Well, first of all, I wouldn't bring it up until the end of the week, when you know for sure, because that will affect how you approach your boss.

If you ARE pregnant, then you say, 'Boss-lady, I need to have a conversation with you. I'm pregnant, which means that I am unable to get the necessary vaccines for the trip to Africa.'

Then she what she says.

If you're NOT, then you say to her, 'Boss-lady, I need to talk with you about my concerns. It is medically not recommended that I get the Africa trip vaccines right now (which is true; if you're trying to get pregnant, your doctor won't want you getting these vax).'

Then see what she says.

Good luck! It's a hard place to be in.

beharrington

Thanks HisGirl.  Luckily for me, I'm out of the office tomorrow at a meeting and in training all day Thursday so maybe she won't ask how the vaccines went...

HisGirlFriday13

Ugh...good luck!

beharrington

Thanks.  I'm just so lost.  What if something comes up in three months and they need me to go somewhere else?  I want to start having kids sooner rather than later.  We waited after the wedding last April so we could get into a house first (which we did a month and a half ago) and now, if I choose my career, we're putting it off for at least another three months.  We've been together for 8 years so it's not like I'm rushing things.

Is there ever really a "good" or "right" time to try?

KatWAG

Is it part of your job requirement to go on this trip? If so, could she potentially fire you for not fulfilling your job duties?

HisGirlFriday13

Take one day at a time, honestly. If you find out on Friday that you are pregnant, then all the rest of the worries are moot.

If you're not, then you drop back and punt. And if you lay it out to your boss in medical terms, that your boss doesn't want you to get the vaccines, then it's a medical issue, not a family-planning one.

But, no, there's never a good or right time to try -- you take the best time you can get and hope everything else falls into place.

climbingsingle

I just need to say something. You assuming she picked career over kids seems to have no basis. I'm guessing you came to this conclusion because she doesn't have children? What if she was unable to have them? Also, just because a woman is childless doesn't mean she wouldn't understand your situation. I have no kids and I will not be having any. When my assistant told me she was pregnant, I was overjoyed for her. I, in no way made her feel bad or was angry with her for missing work. And I threw her an awesome work baby shower. When she needed to take off because her kid was sick, I understood. 

PrettyGirlLost

beharrington said:

Thanks.  I'm just so lost.  What if something comes up in three months and they need me to go somewhere else?  I want to start having kids sooner rather than later.  We waited after the wedding last April so we could get into a house first (which we did a month and a half ago) and now, if I choose my career, we're putting it off for at least another three months.  We've been together for 8 years so it's not like I'm rushing things.

Is there ever really a "good" or "right" time to try?

Can you negotiate to be sent to places that don't require you to have these types of vaccinations?

There is never a good or right time to begin your family, and no amount of planning can make it happen exactly when you want it to.  But it's a personal decision for you and your Husband. 

Just realize that you may need to consider a job or career change if your company is unwilling to be flexible with you and insists on assigning you to travel to regions that are dangerous or require vaccinations that would interfere with your pregnancies.

beharrington

ClimbingBrideNY said:

I just need to say something. You assuming she picked career over kids seems to have no basis. I'm guessing you came to this conclusion because she doesn't have children? What if she was unable to have them? Also, just because a woman is childless doesn't mean she wouldn't understand your situation. I have no kids and I will not be having any. When my assistant told me she was pregnant, I was overjoyed for her. I, in no way made her feel bad or was angry with her for missing work. And I threw her an awesome work baby shower. When she needed to take off because her kid was sick, I understood. 

The reason I said that she chose career over kids as far as I know is because she mentioned in a few conversations that her previous marriages ended because she put her career before having a family.  I added the "as far as I know" part because there is the possibility that there may be other reasons she doesn't have kids and just doesn't feel like sharing them.  My concern is because she has stated that her career comes first.  Aside from her and myself, the only other female in our department doesn't want kids and has said so.  That means that in our entire department, I am the only one for whom pregnancy is an issue (again, based on what the other women have said).

I swear that I don't think negatively of her because she chose not to have children.  I'm just worried she won't understand my desire to put my career second.

KatWAG - this time, I have to go international to watch one of my employees do his job so I can sign off that he's ready to fly solo.  He cannot work in the US for visa reasons, so, yes it's a requirement unless I can convince her that someone else can validate his work performance for me.

ETA: when I mention pregnancy being an issue, I mean that it could prevent me from travelling.  I don't mean that the men in our department aren't affected by their wives and children.  Just that the probability of one of them being unable to schedule a three day long trip is much slimmer.

beharrington

I feel like I'm coming across all wrong and offensively.  I really don't mean to.

KatWAG

beharrington said:

ClimbingBrideNY said:

I just need to say something. You assuming she picked career over kids seems to have no basis. I'm guessing you came to this conclusion because she doesn't have children? What if she was unable to have them? Also, just because a woman is childless doesn't mean she wouldn't understand your situation. I have no kids and I will not be having any. When my assistant told me she was pregnant, I was overjoyed for her. I, in no way made her feel bad or was angry with her for missing work. And I threw her an awesome work baby shower. When she needed to take off because her kid was sick, I understood. 

The reason I said that she chose career over kids as far as I know is because she mentioned in a few conversations that her previous marriages ended because she put her career before having a family.  I added the "as far as I know" part because there is the possibility that there may be other reasons she doesn't have kids and just doesn't feel like sharing them.  My concern is because she has stated that her career come first.  Aside from her and myself, the only other female in our department doesn't want kids and has said so.  That means that in our entire department, I am the only one for whom pregnancy is an issue (again, based on what the other women have said).

I swear that I don't think negatively of her because she chose not to have children.  I'm just worried she won't understand my desire to put my career second.

KatWAG - this time, I have to go international to watch one of my employees do his job so I can sign off that he's ready to fly solo.  He cannot work in the US for visa reasons, so, yes it's a requirement unless I can convince her that someone else can validate his work performance for me.

So I assume you wont be allowed to go to Africa without these vaccines, right? (that was my experience, when traveling abroad)

 So what happens if you are pregnant? Then you cant get the vaccines and you cant travel. Meaning you cant do part of your job. So they would be within their rights to fire you.

If traveling abroad is a regular part of your job, you may need to consider a new career.

mbross3

Did you have a full understanding of what your job requirements were when you accepted the position? 

If your first priority is getting pregnant, you may have to pick another career or job. It's not fair to you or to your employer for you to be in a position that is not your priority and that you may just physically be unwilling (or unable) to do. 

ETA: I am not going to touch on the issues raised about women's choices having children, family, career, etc. Just realize that your choice is not everyone's and that no woman's choice needs validation. 

beharrington

This trip to Africa is a weird one.  If he had been fully approved before I started (and he should have been), this wouldn't even be an issue.  We work primarily in the Gulf of Mexico, so pregnancy/travel isn't an issue there.  My job is 98% in the office - I manage the auditors who travel to our rigs.

The option/ability to travel to places where these vaccines are required was mentioned in my interviews.  The requirement was not.  I've been in the industry 10 years and this is the first time the issue of international travel has even come up.

I'm not worried about being fired.  I'm mostly worried about losing respect or approval in the eyes of my boss (the person who determines how much I can advance in this company).  She already knows that DH will be a stay at home dad when we do have kids so it's not like I have never told her that we are trying.

daria24

KatWAG said:

beharrington said:

ClimbingBrideNY said:

I just need to say something. You assuming she picked career over kids seems to have no basis. I'm guessing you came to this conclusion because she doesn't have children? What if she was unable to have them? Also, just because a woman is childless doesn't mean she wouldn't understand your situation. I have no kids and I will not be having any. When my assistant told me she was pregnant, I was overjoyed for her. I, in no way made her feel bad or was angry with her for missing work. And I threw her an awesome work baby shower. When she needed to take off because her kid was sick, I understood. 

The reason I said that she chose career over kids as far as I know is because she mentioned in a few conversations that her previous marriages ended because she put her career before having a family.  I added the "as far as I know" part because there is the possibility that there may be other reasons she doesn't have kids and just doesn't feel like sharing them.  My concern is because she has stated that her career come first.  Aside from her and myself, the only other female in our department doesn't want kids and has said so.  That means that in our entire department, I am the only one for whom pregnancy is an issue (again, based on what the other women have said).

I swear that I don't think negatively of her because she chose not to have children.  I'm just worried she won't understand my desire to put my career second.

KatWAG - this time, I have to go international to watch one of my employees do his job so I can sign off that he's ready to fly solo.  He cannot work in the US for visa reasons, so, yes it's a requirement unless I can convince her that someone else can validate his work performance for me.

So I assume you wont be allowed to go to Africa without these vaccines, right? (that was my experience, when traveling abroad)

 So what happens if you are pregnant? Then you cant get the vaccines and you cant travel. Meaning you cant do part of your job. So they would be within their rights to fire you.

If traveling abroad is a regular part of your job, you may need to consider a new career.

This is not necessarily true. The Pregnancy Discrimination Act requires employers to treat pregnant women in the same manner as they would any other temporarily disabled employee. For example, if a colleague broke their leg and was unable to travel, would this person be fired? Firing a pregnant employee is very very dangerous for employers, as it opens them up to lawsuits. 

From the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission:

If a woman is temporarily unable to perform her job due to a medical condition related to pregnancy or childbirth, the employer or other covered entity must treat her in the same way as it treats any other temporarily disabled employee. For example, the employer may have to provide light duty, alternative assignments, disability leave, or unpaid leave to pregnant employees if it does so for other temporarily disabled employees.

beharrington

daria24  -  Thanks so much.  After the posts where they spoke about it, I added that to my list of reasons to worry.

NYCBruin

daria24 said:

KatWAG said:

beharrington said:

ClimbingBrideNY said:

I just need to say something. You assuming she picked career over kids seems to have no basis. I'm guessing you came to this conclusion because she doesn't have children? What if she was unable to have them? Also, just because a woman is childless doesn't mean she wouldn't understand your situation. I have no kids and I will not be having any. When my assistant told me she was pregnant, I was overjoyed for her. I, in no way made her feel bad or was angry with her for missing work. And I threw her an awesome work baby shower. When she needed to take off because her kid was sick, I understood. 

The reason I said that she chose career over kids as far as I know is because she mentioned in a few conversations that her previous marriages ended because she put her career before having a family.  I added the "as far as I know" part because there is the possibility that there may be other reasons she doesn't have kids and just doesn't feel like sharing them.  My concern is because she has stated that her career come first.  Aside from her and myself, the only other female in our department doesn't want kids and has said so.  That means that in our entire department, I am the only one for whom pregnancy is an issue (again, based on what the other women have said).

I swear that I don't think negatively of her because she chose not to have children.  I'm just worried she won't understand my desire to put my career second.

KatWAG - this time, I have to go international to watch one of my employees do his job so I can sign off that he's ready to fly solo.  He cannot work in the US for visa reasons, so, yes it's a requirement unless I can convince her that someone else can validate his work performance for me.

So I assume you wont be allowed to go to Africa without these vaccines, right? (that was my experience, when traveling abroad)

 So what happens if you are pregnant? Then you cant get the vaccines and you cant travel. Meaning you cant do part of your job. So they would be within their rights to fire you.

If traveling abroad is a regular part of your job, you may need to consider a new career.

This is not necessarily true. The Pregnancy Discrimination Act requires employers to treat pregnant women in the same manner as they would any other temporarily disabled employee. For example, if a colleague broke their leg and was unable to travel, would this person be fired? Firing a pregnant employee is very very dangerous for employers, as it opens them up to lawsuits. 

From the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission:

If a woman is temporarily unable to perform her job due to a medical condition related to pregnancy or childbirth, the employer or other covered entity must treat her in the same way as it treats any other temporarily disabled employee. For example, the employer may have to provide light duty, alternative assignments, disability leave, or unpaid leave to pregnant employees if it does so for other temporarily disabled employees.

True, but someone TTC is not afforded such protections.  

AprilH81

From this point on I would limit how much you talk about family planning with your boss. Even if she doesn't hold it against you it is always *there* in her mind. Well, beharrington might be/get pregnant so maybe we will promote this other person... It might not be an intentional thought but it could still be there. Your familiy planning should be on a need to know basis at work. They don't need to know until it in fact interferres with your work.

jenajjthr

If you are pregnant, then like a PP stated, you are protected by law since you can't get the vaccine. If you are not pregnant, and you HAVE to travel to Africa in the near future, then you are gonna have to suck it up, get the vaccine, and wait 3 months before trying. 

I get not wanting to have to wait. I had trouble conceiving my first child, couldn't get pregnant after that, told I would never have more kids, then two more miracles came along 7 and 10 years after the first. You want to have kids sooner rather than later and that is fine. But if you told your boss, I won't (you can, but don't want to) because I'm trying to conceive, then they may have to replace you with someone who is already vaccinated/will get vaccinated.  

Waiting 3 months doesn't mean you are putting career before kids, you are still gonna try and have kids. Besides, there is no guarantee that you will get pregnant in those 3 months. What happens if you don't get vaccinated and then don't get pregnant? How would your boss respond then? That is not a conversation I see that would end well for you.

If you and hubby decide that there is no way you are postponing TTC, then you have to find a new job.