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Need advice. FIL's taking advantage of son's.

I really need to vent. This has been building up inside of me for months. I will eventually explode.  This is very long, I’ll try my best do describe the situation in an understanding manner.

So here goes.....
 My fiancé’s parents have 7 boys all which are adults. His parents are currently struggling financially.

Here is where it all started...... FFIL retired when he was around 40 if not sooner. He is now 58. Over the years FMIL brought in income by taking in foster children, babysitting, and working as a cashier. Another source of income is taking rent from the still at home boys including my FI at $400 per son. Their total current rent intake is 1,600 not being claimed on taxes, $2000 a month babysitting ($500per month per child). Right there is $3600 a month with house payments only being $600 a month. 

Four years ago my FFIL asked my fiancé to take out a loan with the parents promising to pay him back. (At the time I didn’t know this). My FI felt obligated to help as he thought it was to help with house payments. Later on he found out it was for a trailer. Another brother was asked to loan 10,000 which he did (wife didn’t know at the time either).  Then there was the eldest brother who was asked to borrow another 10,000 (his wife knew about it and put a stop to it). On top of all this some how the parents have access to 3 of the boys bank accounts (taking money out for personal use).  FFIL finally sold the trailer and spent that 10,000 including another 10,000 from the other son, and got another 10,000 somewhere else to start a jewellery business, instead of paying the loan off for my FI.  

Currently the FIL’s are telling the sons that they “filed” for bankruptcy. Not only are the sons paying for rent they are paying $50 each here and there for groceries. My FI had to pay $100 for pizza (which he doesn’t even like or eat), his dad over ordered. His dad needed glasses so for his birthday the boys all gave him money for new glasses. He pissed the money away on crap. They have no working vehicle so the one brother offered to buy his mother a used van FFIL heard about this and said “take your F*#&%* van and shove it, I won’t be seen in a van”. I’m sick of my FI being on demand to drive them places. 

Before all of this “money situation happened” FIL’s said they would pay for the liquor for the wedding. Now they cancelled out and are throwing demands left and right of what “they want”. My FI is so far in debt now due to the loan and his own school payments that we can’t get a mortgage for a house. (Credit gone bad).

  All of us wifey’s  feel the boys are being taken advantage of. The father won’t get off his butt to get a job apparently he’s got a “disability”. Even though he lifts weights for 2 hours which he got my FI for buy for him. And brags how he can do “squats”. They won’t seek financial help either. We girls are also sick of the boy’s father telling us girls that “it’s not our fault that your parents make more money than us” and “Maybe the boys should go get money from your parents”. Yes our parents are better off financially because they work hard and save money (and no we don’t brag about money). Now that us wifey’s discuss the situation, we are getting snapped at a constantly by the boy's parents. We discuss it with our wonderful FI’s and husbands, but they are too kind hearted to say no when help is asked by the parents. The boys were also brought up to “respect and support” their parents. As in "we took care of you growing up now you take care of us". Eventually when all the boys move out there will be a lot less income coming in and no form of transportation with a 1,400 sq ft house... then what happens? 

Are we over reacting? help? advice? Anything is appreciated! We are struggling with the sons feeling guilty that we think we need to take matters into our own hands.

Re: Need advice. FIL's taking advantage of son's.

  • I think that your FI needs to put his foot down and that is going to be very hard because these are his parents we are talking about.  Unfortunately it seems like your FIL's see their sons as a meal ticket for the rest of their lives.  Not only that but they are rather ungrateful when something is offered. 

    What would worry me the most would be that once married you are going to be put on a back burner to his parents' needs and wants.  Also you and him will always struggle financially if they are constantly draining him.  You and him need to have a talk about where his priorities will be once you are married.  I personally would need to know that once we are married and are our own little family that I will come first. 

    Maybe your FI is as frustrated as all the wives and just really doesnt know what to do about it.  Talk to him and see where he stands.  And I would like to say that there is a big difference between respecting your parents and supporting two independent adults.  Also there is no need to "repay" being taken care of when they were growing up.  That is a parent's job.  When they decided to have 4 children they made the concious decision to need to support thosee 4 children.  I can't stand people who seem to think they need a reward for feeding and clothing children that they decided to have.  Sorry you get no symthy from me.  That is your job as a parent.  So I really dont think that your FI or any of his brothers owe their parents anything. 

    Unfortunately there really isnt anything you can do right now.  I would however let it be known that once you are married, all financial decisions will be made together and there will be no supporting his parents.  And no sneaking money to them behind your back. 

  • Have you read the Glass Castle?  Sorry I just finished it yesterday and it actually sounds like your story.  Anyways, I actually used to work for a lady who said her husband's sis was always asking for money for things instead of getting a loan from a bank - for things like redoing her basement.  Eventually this woman got her husband to put his foot down and say, my ability to provide for my family is more important than you having your basement redone right now (mind you this was always a grown sister 40+ with a good income).  

    This isn't terribly different from a parent letting their kid live with them too long and figuring when to kick them out.  I'm sure the brothers feel like they owe their parents because their parents provided for them for so long, but fact of the matter is they chose to have kids who they would take care of for 18 years and your FI didn't come in to this life choosing to take care of his parents. 

    I think it's a crutch.  As long as they can get away with this they will.  This is now an established behavior and until people put their foot down they will not change their ways.  

    This would be a dealbreaker for me if my FI couldn't stand up to his parents (or anyone in his family for that matter.)  It's a time in your life when you and whatever future family you may have should be his concern in providing, and not his parents.  To be honest, it sounds like they could get by just fine.  They might not get to have their house, but even on $2000 a month they could comfortably afford an apartment or smaller home.  Some people just suck when it comes to money and it's not up to those around them to compensate for that fact.
  • as far as your FI's checking and banking accounts....he should go to the bank and close all the current accounts and reopen in his name only or jointly with you. Have the statements mailed to your address or do paperless and bank online.
  • redheadfsuredheadfsu member
    2500 Comments
    edited September 2010
    This is something your FI needs to handle by himself.

    You can't make him stand up to his parents. His parents can only use him as much as he lets them. "Fool me once, shame on you; but, fool me twice shame on me." Well, at this point you
    FI knows what his parents are doing. You can't force him to stand up to them. All you can do is decide if you can marry someone who lets his parents walk all over him. Can you? If your FI isn't discussing financial decisions with you, that is a HUGE problem. He doesn't respect you. It most likely will not change after you get married. You need to fix this now or walk. I would suggest therapy for your FI.

    Personally, I would break off the engagement. It really sounds like your FI does not respect you.

    Planning Bio
    Married 9/15/11

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    *This is Not Legal Advice*
  • redheadfsuredheadfsu member
    2500 Comments
    edited September 2010
    In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_chit-chat_need-advice-fils-taking-advantage-of-sons?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:14Discussion:316a7c0b-23d3-4461-b061-56e4655272b8Post:6f4db2fd-2288-4021-8b2a-dbee0f800746">Need advice. FIL's taking advantage of son's.</a>:
    [QUOTE]I really need to vent. This has been building up inside of me for months. I will eventually explode.   This is very long, I’ll try my best do describe the situation in an understanding manner. So here goes.....   My fiancé’s parents have 7 boys all which are adults. His parents are currently struggling financially. Here is where it all started...... FFIL retired when he was around 40 if not sooner. He is now 58. Over the years FMIL brought in income by taking in foster children, babysitting, and working as a cashier. Another source of income is taking rent from the still at home boys including my FI at $400 per son. Their total current rent intake is 1,600 not being claimed on taxes, $2000 a month babysitting ($500per month per child). Right there is $3600 a month with house payments only being $600 a month.   Four years ago my FFIL asked my fiancé to take out a loan with the parents promising to pay him back. (At the time I didn’t know this). My FI felt obligated to help as he thought it was to help with house payments. Later on he found out it was for a trailer. Another brother was asked to loan 10,000 which he did (wife didn’t know at the time either).   Then there was the eldest brother who was asked to borrow another 10,000 (his wife knew about it and put a stop to it). On top of all this some how the parents have access to 3 of the boys bank accounts (taking money out for personal use).   FFIL finally sold the trailer and spent that 10,000 including another 10,000 from the other son, and got another 10,000 somewhere else to start a jewellery business, instead of paying the loan off for my FI.     Currently the FIL’s are telling the sons that they “filed” for bankruptcy. Not only are the sons paying for rent they are paying $50 each here and there for groceries. My FI had to pay $100 for pizza (which he doesn’t even like or eat), his dad over ordered. His dad needed glasses so for his birthday the boys all gave him money for new glasses. He pissed the money away on crap. They have no working vehicle so the one brother offered to buy his mother a used van FFIL heard about this and said “take your F*#&%* van and shove it, I won’t be seen in a van”. I’m sick of my FI being on demand to drive them places.   Before all of this “money situation happened” FIL’s said they would pay for the liquor for the wedding. Now they cancelled out and are throwing demands left and right of what “they want”. My FI is so far in debt now due to the loan and his own school payments that we can’t get a mortgage for a house. (Credit gone bad).   All of us wifey’s   feel the boys are being taken advantage of. The father won’t get off his butt to get a job apparently he’s got a “disability”. Even though he lifts weights for 2 hours which he got my FI for buy for him. And brags how he can do “squats”. They won’t seek financial help either. We girls are also sick of the boy’s father telling us girls that “it’s not our fault that your parents make more money than us” and “Maybe the boys should go get money from your parents”. Yes our parents are better off financially because they work hard and save money (and no we don’t brag about money). Now that us wifey’s discuss the situation, we are getting snapped at a constantly by the boy's parents. We discuss it with our wonderful FI’s and husbands, but they are too kind hearted to say no when help is asked by the parents. The boys were also brought up to “respect and support” their parents. As in "we took care of you growing up now you take care of us".   Eventually when all the boys move out there will be a lot less income coming in and no form of transportation with a 1,400 sq ft house... then what happens?   Are we over reacting? help? advice? Anything is appreciated! We are struggling with the sons feeling guilty that we think we need to take matters into our own hands.
    Posted by ~moonshine~[/QUOTE]

    Planning Bio
    Married 9/15/11

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    *This is Not Legal Advice*
  • Ditto redhead.  Hear this loud and clear now: THIS WILL NOT CHANGE unless your FI decides to stand up for himself.  If he's not capable of that, then welcome to the rest of your life.
    This is a neglected planning bio.
    This is a belated married bio, with no reviews yet because I'm lazy.

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    Sometimes I feel like people think that brides are delicate little flower princesses who get all dressed up and pretty for one special moment of their dreams, when really they're just normal people who just happen to be getting married. Things shouldn't have to be sugar-coated for grown-ass women. -mstar284
  • Here's my advice -

    1. Give back the ring

    2. Tell your fiance that when he is out of the house, living on his own, has his own bank account, has re-established his credit, paid off his loans, and is no longer under his parents's thumbs, you'll *think* about marrying him.

    Otherwise, you're heading for disaster.
  • His parents only get what he gives them. Until he grows up, says no and stops this will continue. Realize this now. 

    What he should do - stop giving them any money. Close all accounts and open new ones in his name or his and your name. All financial information (bills, etc) go to your address and not his parents.

    He also, if he hasn't, needs to do some research to be sure they haven't taken out loans and credit cards in his name and/or with his social security.

    If you want the "disability" to stop, turn him in. You can do it anonymously.  We knew a man who was listed as "disabled" for 20 years. We didn't know exactly what disability or that he was abusing it. Someone figured it out and turned him in.  Investigators secretly filmed him doing all kinds of things he shouldn't have been able to do. Not only did his payments stop but he went to jail over it. 

    His disability payments are probably OUR tax money, at least to some extent, so he's cheating ALL of us.


  • Financial leechers will ALWAYS be financial leechers.  They are never going to change, so if you want change it has to come from you and your FI. 

    The best thing he can do is to completely separate himself financially.  This means moving out, and giving plenty of notice.  Open up a new bank account in both of your names, and transfer the funds from his joint account into the new account. 

    Then, anytime they ask for money, you demand to see the bills.  You pay only the necessary ones, and you pay it directly to company.  If they need money for groceries, you go to the store and purchase them.  Only buy the essentials (meat, fruits, veggies, bread etc.) and skip all junk food, alcohol and cigarettes.  Don't include the receipts, because they don't need to know how much you spent.
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  • If anything, you are under-reacting. While I don't necessarily agree with woodie that you should refuse to marry him until he's debt-free and has great credit- she does have a point. Financial health is a sign of maturity, and a person who isn't ready to take responsability for his own finances isn't ready to do his part in providing for a family.

    To me, what that involves in this situation is:
    1) Accepting that he's never going to be repaid for the money he loaned his father.
    2) Developing a plan for getting out of the debt he has now, either on his own, or with a financial counselor or reputable debt consolidation agencey, depending on the nature of the debt.
    3) Moving out of his parents' home. I don't know where you live, but in all but the most expensive markets one can find an apartment with a roommate for $400/month.
    4) Opening his own bank account.
    5) Telling his parents he's not going to give them any more money.

    If he's not willing to do these things and you still want to marry him, you're signing up for a life of financial exploitation by your in-laws and ever increasing debt. I wouldn't do it, but if you do, I recommend accepting it and finding happiness in things that aren't financial security, a fancy wedding, or a home that you own.
  • Ditto a lot of PPs.  You need to put your foot down, your Fi needs to put his foot down. 
    Therapists call this setting boundaries and its REALLY hard, I know from personal experience.  But they will continue to suck away your money and life.  They will continue to do this as long as your Fiance lets them.

    If I personally were in your situation, I would set boundaries with the FI first.  That you cannot and will not live your life together supporting his parents, so if he must do it he will do it without you.  You don't need to leave him, but don't become legally or financially bound to him while this continues. 
    Once he is on board you (as a couple) or he needs to set boundaries with the parents.  While Nillawafers suggestions about paying bills directly will help with the parents squandering YOUR money, if you are still paying for things they will squander their own money and rely on yours to live.  If you really want this to stop, you need to have the FI stop giving them any money or access to his financials or credit.

    Good luck.  My ILs have a big culture of family loyalty.  This will be a difficult journey, but like Aerin said, if you do not stop it this will be your life.
  • Not.Your.Business.

    You are not a blood relative of FI's family.  You aren't currently married to anyone in FI's family.  So FI's relationship, financial or otherwise, with his parents is HIS business.

    After you get married, you and FI will need to build your marriage and follow this advice already posted:

    I would however let it be known that once you are married, all financial decisions will be made together and there will be no supporting his parents.  And no sneaking money to them behind your back. 
  • ~moonshine~~moonshine~ member
    10 Comments
    edited September 2010
    Hey Everyone, thanks for your responces.

    I haven't read the book The Glass Castle, although now im tempted to.


    However for my defence of the few responses, I do feel it is my business. His parents very openly talk about what they take in(income). This is how I know they don't pay certain taxes due to complaining. My fiance made it my business when he came to me and told me about the loan. As others have mentioned on here that in reality his parents will quit making payments. I highly doubt that anyone if they see their fiance or a loved one get taken advantage of, will just sit back and do nothing? Maybe I'm wrong?

    In response to majority of you on here... I agree and this is what has happened so far.

    My fiance and I have talked, he got the loan papers (in his name) and is transferring banks for lower interest. He told his parents (his choice) that his rent money is going towards the loan and thats final. I am proud of him for saying this because in all fair his parents shouldn't be charging him rent when they owe him 10,000 in the first place!!!

    I made it clear that once we move out this is not happening anymore without first discussing it as a couple. He assured me that it is not going to happen and that he wants me to deal with all of the finances. If his parents ask him for money he's going to tell them to ask me since im the one handling the finances.

    I think this is a start. And i must say im very proud of him for sticking up for himself!

    I appreciate everyones opinions/advice, thanks!
  • if the other brothers wives have not been able to put a stop to it how are you going to make a difference. you need to serioulsly re evaluate everything. This will affect your life forever if there is no stop to it
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  • Here's a huge red flag for me:

    "He assured me that it is not going to happen and that he wants me to deal with all of the finances. If his parents ask him for money he's going to tell them to ask me since im the one handling the finances."

    He's going to make you be the bad guy.  You'll be the known as the witch who won't help out his parents. 
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_chit-chat_need-advice-fils-taking-advantage-of-sons?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:14Discussion:316a7c0b-23d3-4461-b061-56e4655272b8Post:4628d261-1c7f-479c-bfd2-6c6db7d825d3">Re: Need advice. FIL's taking advantage of son's.</a>:
    [QUOTE]Here's a huge red flag for me: "He assured me that it is not going to happen and that he wants me to deal with all of the finances. If his parents ask him for money he's going to tell them to ask me since im the one handling the finances." He's going to make you be the bad guy.  You'll be the known as the witch who won't help out his parents. 
    Posted by woodie[/QUOTE]

    Yep, that is my first thought too. OP will be the bad guy. But, maybe it will work. I just think you need to be very careful. Remember this could very well ruin your credit too.

    Planning Bio
    Married 9/15/11

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