Civil Unions

KatyRoseM

So Fi mentioned that there is a heterosexual couple suing to be allowed to have a civil union.  What do people think of this?  Do you believe marriage is different from a civil union?  Would you have a civil union if it were an option?  How are the two different? 

Blueyed228

This isn't my area of expertise but I *think* it varies state by state. Don't quote me on it though.

zippityb

Civil Union makes me think of the Civil War. I picture old people going to reinactments. That's all I got.

AllAboutTheBenjamin

I think it varies by state too - but I could be wrong.

I don't see why a heterosexual couple should be denied a civil union if that's what they want.  Then again, I don't think gay couples should be denied a marriage if that's what they want.

The idea of putting people in different classes of citizenship (ie - second class citizens, not being allowed certain things) just repulses me.

Anysunrise

I'll admit, I don't know what exactly goes into a civil union.

KatyRoseM

Yes in some states they are different, but in some it has the exact same benefits.  In those situations do you feel there is a difference?

zippityb

Is it different from common law?

AllAboutTheBenjamin

Well - when someone says "just let them have a civil union and it can have all the same rights/privileges that come with marriage, but don't CALL it marriage," that bugs the hell out of me in the gay marriage argument.  So people think it's okay to give gays and lesbians something that's exactly the same as marriage, but don't let it be recognized as a marriage.  It's stupid.

If there isn't a difference, don't call it something different.  If it IS different, then do.  KWIM?

ohwhynot

If there's absolutely no difference, then why does it exist?  In most cases, it's "marriage lite", conferring some but not all of the benefits of state-sanctioned marriage. 

On one hand, I'm kind of sad that civil unions exist, because they take the teeth out of the arguments for allowing marriage equity, but on the other hand they are better than nothing.

Some friends of ours had a civil union, in protest against the ban on gay marriage. 

TheCranberry

I think gay people should have the same rights that opposite sex couples do.  In states where civil unions confer the same rights as marriage, I think civil union is just a cop out to people who don't want gay people to get married (for whatever reason).

In states where they confer different rights, it's just BS.  Then any couple should be able to have a civil union or a marriage depending on what arrangement they prefer.

slubkin

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_civil-unions?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:b9cb2a5d-210f-473e-ba84-2b15679b99b2Post:cb01283f-fdd9-4e0c-97a6-e1c9d98838a7">Re: Civil Unions</a>:
[QUOTE]Well - when someone says "just let them have a civil union and it can have all the same rights/privileges that come with marriage, but don't CALL it marriage," that bugs the hell out of me in the gay marriage argument.  So people think it's okay to give gays and lesbians something that's exactly the same as marriage, but don't let it be recognized as a marriage.  It's stupid. If there isn't a difference, don't call it something different.  If it IS different, then do.  KWIM?
Posted by AllAboutTheBenjamin[/QUOTE]
Yes.  I can't help but feel convinced that eventually gay marriage will have to become legal, because the distinction between marriage and civil unions is the same situation of "separate but equal" that was at issue with the civil rights movement.

K&J64

NJ is actually the only state that has civil unions. CA, NV, OR and WA all have statewide law allowing same sex couples domestic partnerships which aim to provide the same rights as marriage much like the NJ civil unions. Domestic partnerships in WI do not provide the same level of rights, but do provide some rights and ther are similar laws in place in CO, HI and ME. CT, IA, MA, NH, VT and DC allow same sex marriage.

In the case of the OP in Britain the civil unions as I understand them in Britain are like the ones we have in NJ, the same but in name. I don't personally understand why the heterosexual couple wants a civil union when they are allowed a civil marriage, but that's their own business, they stated they don't like the connotations of husband and wife and expectancies of marriage, so more power to them, I support their cause. I think having laws set up that are designed to grant couples the same rights, but calling the social institution by another name has proven not to work. People get caught up in schematics. People like the word marriage. Telling a nurse at a hospital that I need to see my civil union partner doesn't hold the same weight as I need to see my spouse. Studies in NJ have actually shown that even though the law was set up to provide the same rights, a rose by any other name actually doesn't smell as sweet and the law is failing.

TurtlesAllTheWayDown

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_civil-unions?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:b9cb2a5d-210f-473e-ba84-2b15679b99b2Post:9ddfe026-e841-4621-a0cb-9f2705d65050">Re: Civil Unions</a>:
[QUOTE]Yes in some states they are different, but in some it has the exact same benefits.  In those situations do you feel there is a difference?
Posted by KatyRoseM[/QUOTE]

Yes, I think it's different, even with the exact same benefits, because it's CALLED something different and people have an impression that it's not "really" a marriage, it's just something to appease the gay folk. Hence the whole "separate but equal" thing and how anything other than marriage for gay couples is unconstitutional, IMO.

jemmini6

I think civil unions are a joke.  Marriage (in the eyes of the law) is just a legal contract entered into by 2 consenting adults that grants specific rights.  If that's what a 'civil union' aims to be, then why not just let them get married.

I always tell the neysayers that one day, the inequalities shown to the GBLT community will be looked at with the same shamefullness as the inequalities to blacks, women, interracial couples, etc etc etc.