Question re: badly behaved children

**O-Face**

Do you think people know their children are poorly behaved and just chock it up to age, sex, stages or whatever?

Or do you think they're entertained by their children's bad behavior?  Or are they that clueless?

I just don't get it. 

ReturnOfKuus

I have no idea.  All kid-ness is kind of annoying, though, especially the pitch and volume of their voices, so maybe they just get so desensitized that they don't know where the line is for acceptable kid behavior any more?

**O-Face**

Ugh.  nephew screeches like a ninny constantly.  Is backhanding a 2 year old acceptable.

MrsMyrtle

I think parents today don't have any balls/sense to tell their kids no, so they just let them do whateverthefuck they want.

**O-Face**

*chalk*  Ugh. 

TheDuckis

I think there are a variety of reasons for bad parenting. Some people think it's hilarious to teach their kids to cuss and act up. Some people just think "boys will be boys," and some people think if they don't give in to their child's every whim and demand then their kids won't love them.

baconsmom

I think it's a combo, like Duckis said. Some people really and truly believe that the bad behavior is just Pweshus "expressing himself" or some nonsense. 

There's a thread going on EHell right now about when kids should have basic manners down - "please", "thank you", "excuse me" - and at least two people have posted that they know, personally, people who think that teaching toddlers to say these things are "abusing" their kids. 

Because the kids can't possibly know what it means, so it's no good for them to learn it. Seriously.

I don't understand allowing screaming. Ever. At all. We nipped that in the bud real damn fast with Bacon - and not with that stupid "outside voice" crap. We just told her "No." It's a magical word. 

loveshine1

I also think it's a lot of factors.

One of them being parents just not caring. As long as they're enjoying their meal in a restaurant, it doesn't matter if the kids are behaving like little howler monkeys. They think it's perfectly acceptable to continue on their adult conversation and drink their wine while the rest of the restaurant gets annoyed.

I actually saw a family get kicked out of Brewzzi's about a year and a half ago. I was eating dinner with friends and 2 parents and kids were sitting at the round table about 3 feet away. The kids were little hellions to the point where the manager came over at least 3 times before asking them to leave.

hmonkey

well, with most families being two income, neither parent feels like they have a lot of time to spend with the kid, so they want that time to be fun and discipline and other actual parenting is not fun and doesn't make their kid like them.  never mind that it teaches them life skills or how to function in society, mom and dad are not fun.

i do think when you see a kid misbehaving in public, you only see a snippet.  if mom and dad are witness to good and bad behavior throughout the day, they see the whole picture and can ignore a little bit of bad behavior for the few minutes they are out in public.

HookaPants

I think the parents are immune to their kids being obnoxious or they don't play into the child's tantrum. How many times have we seen or heard a whining/crying child trailing their mother and mom is just going along with her life like nothing is going on? Just because it happens daily in your world, doesn't mean you have to subject me to it.

[Deleted User]

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_wedding-woes_question-re-badly-behaved-children?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special Topic Wedding BoardsForum:47Discussion:4fbce658-4dbb-46bf-933b-c16b05498198Post:4b30fe35-1f6e-4b12-83a9-bb16e62c42ab">Re: Question re: badly behaved children</a>:
[QUOTE]There's a thread going on EHell right now about when kids should have basic manners down - "please", "thank you", "excuse me" - and at least two people have posted that they know, personally, people who think that teaching toddlers to say these things are <strong>"abusing"</strong> their kids.  Because the kids can't possibly know what it means, so it's no good for them to learn it. Posted by baconsmom[/QUOTE]

WHAT!?
::strokes out::

MrsMyrtle

Bacon - Please, thank you, and you're welcome were some of the first things our parents taught us. My mom always says that, even back then, people were shocked when they heard a toddler use their manners. INCONCEIVABLE!

loveshine1

I guess I was an abused child. If I asked my parents for something without saying please, they went right on back to what they were doing without batting an eye.

I personally find that allowing children to be hellions is far more abusive.

hmonkey

i am convinced that using "yes, please" and "no, thank you" as an adult has rocketed me to the top of customer service issues and eliminated hours of hold time.  it still works, yo.

i know i respond well to it.

MrsMyrtle

I wholeheartedly agree, hmo. 

notamrs

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_wedding-woes_question-re-badly-behaved-children?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special Topic Wedding BoardsForum:47Discussion:4fbce658-4dbb-46bf-933b-c16b05498198Post:4b30fe35-1f6e-4b12-83a9-bb16e62c42ab">Re: Question re: badly behaved children</a>:
[QUOTE]There's a thread going on EHell right now about when kids should have basic manners down - "please", "thank you", "excuse me" - and at least two people have posted that they know, personally, people who think that teaching toddlers to say these things are "abusing" their kids.  Because the kids can't possibly know what it means, so it's no good for them to learn it. Posted by baconsmom[/QUOTE]

WTF?  and hell no. 

One of the DJ's on the morning show I listen to was worried that his kids were getting spoiled and too entitled - good for him for being concerned (I think the fact that he was even thinking about it was a good sign that they weren't going to let the kids get out of control).  But while he was talking about how to get his kids to start showing more consideration and appreciation, he made a comment along the lines of kids "getting a pass" up until they are about 4 or so.  I was YELLING at the radio about that one. 

My niece is almost 4 and she has known since she started speaking how to say "please" and "thank you," especially to adults.  You don't have to be militant about it, but kids can be taught how to be polite.

Case in point/funny story along those lines - when my nephew was a few months old, we were all together cleaning out my mom's house and some long-time family friends brought over a gift for him.  We were all cooing about it and Natalie looked at him and said "Say thank you, Clay." 

*Barbie*

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_wedding-woes_question-re-badly-behaved-children?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:47Discussion:4fbce658-4dbb-46bf-933b-c16b05498198Post:92e85624-4fd2-46ec-bb76-7510ca17ed29">Re: Question re: badly behaved children</a>:
[QUOTE]Ugh.  nephew screeches like a ninny constantly.  Is backhanding a 2 year old acceptable.
Posted by **O-Face**[/QUOTE]
yes, it is. I bet you won't have to do it twice... unless he's REALLY stupid. 

6fsn

Like everyone said it's a combo.  I also think hmo hit on something about parents not wanting their kids to hate them.  Dh has said more than once "I see him for 2 hours and I make him cry."  It is hard for him, he does it, but it is hard.

I'll also say that some people find it hard to discipline in public.  I'd say 1 in 10 posts on the bump is "I judged..."  I've had people say things when I haven't seen an issue.  6let likes to push the cart.  He makes a little motor sound and pushes away.  He's not screaming.  He's not running.  I steer the cart.  We also go first thing in the morning when nobody is there.  99% of the people we see either laugh or say nothing.  There is a 1% that will tsk or say something.

6fsn

oh and 6let doesn't say much, but thank you was one of his first words.  He works really hard at saying please, but someone else would think he was sticking his tongue out at me.

nicoleg1982

DD is 11 mo. old and likes to shriek when she's excited.  She loves the sound.  She has no clue she's making a disruptive, ear piercing noise.  To her, it's fun.  And at home or outside, it's fine.  But when we're out in public, I tell her no and put my finger on her chin to get her attention.  She stops.  Parenting is not hard.

Paulo's Menina Bela

In SIL's case it's

1) Funny
2) Chocked up to age
3) She feels bad if the kids get mad at her

She knows her kids are PITAs. At Easter I gave each a book when we gathered at MIL's for Easter. SIL joked that I did it to keep them occupied while we waited for dinner. Then, when it was time to eat Nephew wouldn't come to the table and we couldn't get started until he came to the table. H said Eff it and started eating. SIL, BIL and MIL, all sitting at the table, kept begging Nephew to put his book down. Not a one got off his or her ass to go get him. Just to get the adults to STFU, I got up and told him to get to the table or I was taking the book. That finally did the trick. H was serving himself seconds by then.

DG1

Wow, there are a lot of sweeping generalizations here.

Yes, there are parents/families who fall into all of these categories. And there are those who "blanket train" (and the like), which to me does seem to cross the line - perhaps not "abuse," but certainly unnecessary.

I've gotten a side-eye at Target while Dex was shrieking with delight.  I've gotten sympathetic nods when he's had a meltdown in public.  I've gotten compliments on his behavior at dinner.

He does say "please" and "thank you," sometimes without prompting, sometimes with. (he's 20m, fwiw)

But really, if we were in a store and he decided he wanted to shriek, there's not a whole heck of a lot I can do about it. I can tell him no. I can tell him no forcefully. I can try to distract him with something else.  I could slap his hand (which breaks his little heart but doesn't hurt him, but that also makes him cry brokenhearted tears, which doesn't solve the problem either.) 

But in the end, it's entirely possible that none of that will work.  If all else fails, I will leave the store at my earliest opportunity, but I'm not going to just walk out the second he starts shrieking if I haven't gotten what I need to get (usually staples like milk or baby formula, or a prescription). 

A couple of weeks ago, we had our first full-out public meltdown, complete with thrashing and throwing himself on the floor.  He was pissed because I wouldn't let him move the entire inventory of igloo coolers from the shelf to various places all over the outdoor section. 

I chose not to reward that behavior with extra attention, so I'm sure it looked like I was unaware or not caring that he was screaming his head off.  I dragged him to the pharmacy to pick up the prescription we were waiting for, and then we left.  I'm sure some people were momentarily inconvenienced, but it's target. Sht happens. That's why we don't take him to morton's steakhouse, you know?