To discuss: labor unions

MinM

I was watching a doucmentary on Wal-Mart. The employees wanted to unionize, but Wal-Mart was telling the workers that unions just want to steal their money.

I always thought unions were a good thing.

You?

baconsmom

We haven't ever discussed unions before?

I think they ran their course years ago. They did some good in the early years, and now, yes, they just want people's money. If they can't get it by making you join the union, no worries - they'll just take tax dollars! 

6fsn

Pretty much what Bmom said.  There was a time when they were worth something, but I don't think they are necessary.  In almost 12 years working in a union shop I never once saw them protect good employees.  I also hate that they are all about seniority.  There is no consideration for people that just might be better even though they have been there a shorter amount of time.

Mrs.Thistletwat

The only union i've come into any sort of contact with is the MTA/Subway worker's union and they piss me off to no end. A station sweeper makes $65-70k a year and you're going to shut down the entire subway system for more money for train conductors? They hold the city hostage every 2-3 years trying to get "fair" wages for their workers. Their employees make a very more than fair wage.

katorigasuki

i think unions have their place, but in some cases get out of hand.

take the UAW for example.  they essentially contributed to the downfall of the american automobile industry by making more and more demands on the companies.  granted the executive leadership should have put a stop to a lot of those demands (ie: getting paid NOT to work), but they kind of went off the rails in a lot of cases.

*Barbie*

antiquated - they need to go. 

When I bid out contracts, I always go for non-union when possible. 

loveshine1

There was a time and a place when they were necessary. I think that time has passed.

TheDuckis

I was pro-union until one of them fired my brother for being autistic. I agree with bmom. Their usefullness ran its course years ago.

My uncle's father was the president of that union, and my grandfather was a big wig in another. They're completely different organizations since the time these men worked at the,

There's some very obvious mob involvement, and the stories about embezzlement and such are astounding. Based on my sample size, I say they're corrupt and shittily run organizations.

ETA: FWIW, I limit this opinion to trade unions. Whawt I guess you could call talent unions are a different thing, to me, and I do think that things like the screen actors guild and the writers guild of america are necessary and useful.

MinM

BMom - I don't think we ever have discussed them. H might have to go through one to get health insurance. I don't know what they would require of him.

zsazsa-stl

I think they have their place.  But just like it isn't a good thing when management has too much power and isn't sympathetic to the needs of the workers, unions can have too much power, too. 

baconsmom

Didn't the Writers' Guild just strike over something retarded? I remember crying for the poor babies about something and being disgusted that I couldn't watch TV because they're ass holes. 

And Min, if we had a truly free market for health insurance, he wouldn't be facing this problem. 

TheDuckis

I would consider teachers unions closer to talent unions than trade unions. He'll probably have to pay dues, but I assume the health benefits and job security will far outweigh the costs in his case.

MinM

I don't think he has job security. Although, enrollment at his college is up 10% this semester.

TheDuckis

Bmom, the writers guild strike was 100% warranted and fair. Yeah, it sucked that it ruined a TV season, but studios were trying to get writers to work on webisodes and other online content for free. There was no limit to what could have been required, and with the uncertainty of where internet television is going they had to fight for fair wages now, or they'd have no leg to stand on in 5 years when entire series start going online only.

baconsmom

Teachers' unions are generally reprehensible, IMO. Have you seen what it takes to fire a teacher in most cities these days? 

baconsmom

I don't understand why they couldn't lobby for better salaries by themselves, though, or look for a different job if they didn't like those conditions, like the rest of us do. 

TheDuckis

A major production company isn't going to take the time to negotiate independently with the writers on every show they produce. And it is an industry where if you don't like your job there are 1000 people in line behind you.

And you think of the writers as the people who write your favorite, majorly successful shows. Union minimums are there for the guy who writes two episodes of a show that gets cancelled and then won't get work again until the next pilot season.

baconsmom

I don't know, I still don't buy it, but you know how much I love the market. If there's that much supply, then I don't know that the writers should be in charge of dictating the terms of their employment. Maybe if people stop being writers, their employers will change their tune when demand becomes greater than supply. 

GBCK

Teacher's unions are their own special nightmare because we're legally rquired to have a union in many states (including mine)

And, really, I know the whole "do you have any idea how hard it is to fire a teacher" argument comes up...but, really, I know more than enough teachers who have lost jobs through absolute crap.

I end up having VERY mixed feelings about unions.
Although the Mr. and I both have to watch where we park, what w/ where we live/work, working union jobs (both of us are union) and driving 'foreign' cars to work