Thanks for everyone's thoughts

Mrs.B6302007

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:140cc382-d9ad-4beb-80b3-cdf0855cfbeb">Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party : Based on your logic:  If your husband cheats on you but doesn't tell you about it, it's not considered a lie?  Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds?
Posted by emarston1[/QUOTE]

Touche'

cookiesandwich

I think when you start your post with, "Okay -- here's the deal," you already know what you're doing is wrong.

Mrs.B6302007

It's already been quoted.

ogrady88

Honestly Ladies,
You're going to jump all over her about something that in no direct way impacts you...awesome, what a classy bunch.  I think you would probably be surprised at how frequently couples are married before they have their formal ceremony and reception.

andy71781

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:a7d2f647-db00-4675-9320-91240294bc07">Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party</a>:
[QUOTE]Honestly Ladies, You're going to jump all over her about something that in no direct way impacts you...awesome, what a classy bunch.  I think you would probably be surprised at how frequently couples are married before they have their formal ceremony and reception.
Posted by ogrady88[/QUOTE]
When did you get to the courthouse?

cookiesandwich

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:a7d2f647-db00-4675-9320-91240294bc07">Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party</a>:
[QUOTE]Honestly Ladies, You're going to jump all over her about something that in no direct way impacts you...awesome, what a classy bunch.  I think you would probably be surprised at how frequently couples are married before they have their formal ceremony and reception.
Posted by ogrady88[/QUOTE]

She asked.

emarston1

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:a7d2f647-db00-4675-9320-91240294bc07">Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party</a>:
[QUOTE]Honestly Ladies, You're going to jump all over her about something that in no direct way impacts you...awesome, what a classy bunch.  I think you would probably be surprised at how frequently couples are married before they have their formal ceremony and reception.
Posted by ogrady88[/QUOTE]
Just because other people do it, doesn't make it right.  You are still lying to your loved ones which is never ok.

SwedishChick2011

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:1f5bbecc-177c-4d6f-b999-5b53cc45643f">"Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party</a>:
[QUOTE]Okay -- here's the deal. My husband & I got married in June of this year. Our plan was to keep it hush-hush and have our <strong>actual </strong>wedding celebration & reception next year on the same date, so that it would really be on our first anniversary, and we wouldn't have two "anniversaries." Please spare me the negativity, because I know a lot of people don't like this idea and think it's greedy, dishonest, whatever. We chose how we wanted to do it because of financial reasons and ultimately (and most importantly) because of our love for each other. Our goal was to have the <strong>actual </strong>ceremony and everything else a year later, so that we could save up more money to have the <strong>actual</strong> event. Posted by aegifford[/QUOTE]
The <strong>actual</strong> wedding, ceremony, and event has already happened. The best thing you can do is let people know you're married and move on with married life.  If your heart is set on celebrating with your friends and family, the only semi-okay way to do it is with a vow renewal (and announcing it as such).  It's wrong to take advantage of people's generosity by not telling them that you're already married.  Sorry.  And if anyone offers to throw you a shower, you should graciously decline.  Once people know you're already married, I doubt they'll be flocking to do one for you anyway, though.

banana468

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:a7d2f647-db00-4675-9320-91240294bc07">Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party</a>:
[QUOTE]Honestly Ladies, You're going to jump all over her about something that in no direct way impacts you...awesome, what a classy bunch.  I think you would probably be surprised at how frequently couples are married before they have their formal ceremony and reception.
Posted by ogrady88[/QUOTE]

If I found out that my close friend or relative lied to me, I'd be quite dismayed by it.

Personally I think the vow renewal is fine.  It's the lying about what she's done that's really inappropriate and out of line to the people that she cares about so much.

And I don't think stating an opinion on how to handle something appropriately on an etiquette board  is unclassy.  I do think that lying about your marriage is unclassy though.

ogrady88

This is a decision between you and your husband.  No one else needs to know about it, it's not a lie, just a personal decision.  She asked for our advice and instead of giving any sort of constructive criticism we all just call her a liar.  We were facing a very similar decision, but ultimately decided not to go file our paperwork down at city hall.  I don't begrudge this couple on their decision, but ultimately it's up to them what they want to do.  Like I said I've known several couples who have had their official private ceremony before the public one.  It's not uncommon.

banana468

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:67bf8944-8bab-4aae-ba40-a25c88f0dc61">Re: Thanks for everyone's thoughts</a>:
[QUOTE]This is a decision between you and your husband.  No one else needs to know about it, it's not a lie, just a personal decision.
Posted by ogrady88[/QUOTE]

It IS a lie.  If you get married and then send out a wedding invitation, by not telling people that you're already married, you are indeed lying to them.
And you're also lying to yourselves.   You're already married!  Shout it from the rooftops don't hide it!

Getting married is indeed a personal decision.  But when you opt to involve others (what the OP is doing) it stops being about just her.  By not telling people what she and her husband have done, she's lying about it.

And EVERY TIME she calls her husband her FI, she's lying to someone.  And that's a bold-faced lie.

emarston1

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:67bf8944-8bab-4aae-ba40-a25c88f0dc61">Re: Thanks for everyone's thoughts</a>:
[QUOTE]Like I said I've known several couples who have had their official private ceremony before the public one.  It's not uncommon.
Posted by ogrady88[/QUOTE]
And as we've said, just because it's not uncommon, doesn't make it right.  If you want/need to get married before the big ceremony/reception.  Fine, do it.  But call the big day a vow renewal.  No one has anything negative to say about <em>this</em> scenario.  But it's the lying to your guests that is absolutely rude.  You invite them to watch you get married and to spend the most important day of your life with you but WHOOPS!  you're already married.

It's about being an adult and making difficult decisions.  Then living with those decisions.  OP got married and now wants her pretty princess day.  Well guess what, you've already gotten married, you can't change that.  Grow up and get passed it.

TurtlesAllTheWayDown

Well, no one is planning a shower for me, so I'm not getting one before I get married. Does that mean that after I'm married someone can plan a bridal shower for me? Good to know!

missy68

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:4a9fbec5-b370-46f5-9554-336204a13ccf">Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party</a>:
[QUOTE]I missed that part. Yes you did indeed lie.  It's a lie of omission.  You witheld information from your families and that is absolutely a lie.
Posted by banana468[/QUOTE]

Tiger Woods tried this, too. It didn't work out so well for him, either.

ogrady88

Both of the weddings that I've been to I didn't know they were already married until I saw the photos after...no where....no where on the invite did it say this was going to be a vow renewal ceremony.  Should I in someway feel offended?  I don't, and clearly that's just me.  I didn't feel lied to, I was happy for the couple, regardless of whether or not I saw their "real" vows or not.  I was am to celebrate with them as a married couple.

Night_Sprite

Then you are far more forgiving than lots of people ogrady.

cookiesandwich

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:79550af9-414e-4110-a8f5-49f957d6a97a">Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party : Tiger Woods tried this, too. It didn't work out so well for him, either.
Posted by missy68[/QUOTE]

haha!

ogrady88

Night-clearly, I just don't see what all the fuss is about.  At the end of the day, you should be happy for the married couple.

Ae-My advice would be, tell your close family if you are feeling guilty, this is what FI and I thought about when we consider this, we just weren't sure that we could get married without our family there.  I would decline the wedding shower and when you do sent out your wedding invites, perhaps word them: join us in the celebration of our marriage.  I just don't feel like most of your guests will care all that much about it, they will be glad they were a part of the celebration.

banana468

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:18356ffd-0b9b-4467-b457-034531704bc9">Re: Thanks for everyone's thoughts</a>:
[QUOTE]Both of the weddings that I've been to I didn't know they were already married until I saw the photos after...no where....no where on the invite did it say this was going to be a vow renewal ceremony.  Should I in someway feel offended?  I don't, and clearly that's just me.  I didn't feel lied to, I was happy for the couple, regardless of whether or not I saw their "real" vows or not.  I was am to celebrate with them as a married couple.
Posted by ogrady88[/QUOTE]

That's great that you weren't offended.  But understand that many people are.

And understand that if you invite people to a wedding when you're already married it's a lie.

And understand that if you're married then every time you call your husband your FI, it's a lie.

So whether or not you're offended, please do understand that keeping this information from others is lying to them.

ogrady88

I think we're going to have to agree to disagree here banana.  I just go back to this is a personal decision between the couple.  And I believe that OP was asking for some advice, you can still invite people to a celebration of marriage.  Is that a lie too?  And if we are going to go there,  when they introduce couples as Mr. and Mrs. So and So....technically that is a lie....as most likely the name change hasn't been submitted.  It is a personal choice for this couple.  I would advise her to tell her family, because I wouldn't feel comfortable keeping that a secret, but there again it is a personal decision.

emarston1

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:cd139166-6074-4505-9354-f2862b84dcb8">Re: Thanks for everyone's thoughts</a>:
[QUOTE] And if we are going to go there,  when they introduce couples as Mr. and Mrs. So and So....technically that is a lie....as most likely the name change hasn't been submitted.
Posted by ogrady88[/QUOTE]
Oh.My.God. This is by far one of the worst arguments I've ever heard.

ARod22

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:033c165d-9d96-475f-85d6-9ce4b08d30a1">Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party</a>:
[QUOTE]So....my favorite part is that OP eloped (and lied about it) because "of our love for each other"
Posted by andy71781[/QUOTE]

Yes, it does sound like she's been watching too many soap operas, doesn't it?

banana468

So you actually don't think it's a lie?  I don't understand. 

Can you please explain how it's telling the truth?

And you're really splitting hairs here on the "She's not a Mrs. until she changes her name" thing.  Once they're married the paperwork is a formality.  That's akin to telling someone in the hospital who just delivered a child that the baby's name isn't Ben until they sign the birth certificate.

rubyjem00

If you aren't offended when a friend or family member gets married and then lies about it, you are a far better person than I am. My sister got married without telling anyone. When my family found out (in the midst of planning her wedding), there were some incredibly hurt feelings. It sucks to be lied to. Don't do it.

ogrady88

I just think it's up to the couple.  She obviously is feeling guilty about it and was wondering how best to proceed and we just jump down her throat about it.  If you invite people to a celebration of marriage, how is that lying?
emarston-well, isn't it a lie too?  Maybe we should all be introduced as the happy couple to eliminate any possible lies from our wedding.  I think this idea that it is a total unforgiveable lie is a silly argument too.  It is a secret, not a lie, there is a difference.

arbolita

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:a7d2f647-db00-4675-9320-91240294bc07">Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party</a>:
[QUOTE]Honestly Ladies, <strong>You're going to jump all over her about something that in no direct way impacts you...</strong>
Posted by ogrady88[/QUOTE]


Some of us have been on the receiving end of finding out that families members have lied about getting married, and know what that feels like. Excuse me for trying to spare her friends and family the same pain I went through.

emarston1

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:0b831106-2b87-42f6-ab43-c39d80ad3aa9">Re: Thanks for everyone's thoughts</a>:
[QUOTE]It is a secret, not a lie, there is a difference.
Posted by ogrady88[/QUOTE]
Yes you're right, it's a secret up to the point where you start asking people to witness your marriage.  They can't, it's already happened.

Justify it to yourself however you want, you are still lying to your guests if you call it a wedding.

ARod22

Had she not lied, I'd say that she can accept offers from family and friends who want to throw her a shower so she and her husband can start their lives together. The dishonesty and secrecy of this marriage/engagement changes things completely. If someone close to me--a very good friend or my sister-- did this, I'd be pissed and so completely hurt, as woudl the rest of my family and friends.  I would still go to the vow renewals and get them a gift, but I'd never look at that person and her husband the same way again.  I would not offer her a shower.

OP, I think that you have an obligation as a daughter, sister, friend, whatever, to be honest with people in your life.  You should brace yourself for tears, yelling, and ever broken relationships... people may or may not be right for reacting this way, but you can't say that you didn't ask for it.  Avoiding it by lying isn't right.  I think it's terrible to continue this lie for the rest of your life.  Come clean and tell people that you haven't been honest with them, and explain to them why this is, and apologize profusely.  Tell them that this so-called wedding is really a vow-renewal.  Wear white or whatever color you want, hire a florist and a DJ, accept gifts graciously... but do not expect everyone to treat you the same as they would have if this were really a wedding.  I think turning down any offers for a shower and/or bach party (which would be extraordinarily kind for people to do at this point) would be appropriate.

Congratulations on your marriage, good luck with your vow renewal, and I hope that you can be honest with people and make amends with those you have hurt.  There's no sense dwelling on what's been done, but you do need to come clean and try to be as gracious about the situation as you can be from this point forward.

arbolita

Wow, someone from South Florida who is not insane.  You should come around more ARod.  I like the cut of your jib.

baystateapple

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_wedding-vs-vow-renewal-party?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:02665be1-dcdb-4854-8637-ed4f4c5d1b94Post:28c65a49-49ba-4115-b808-533e4493f1ee">Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: "Wedding" vs. Vow Renewal Party : Some of us have been on the receiving end of finding out that families members have lied about getting married, and know what that feels like. Excuse me for trying to spare her friends and family the same pain I went through.
Posted by arbolita[/QUOTE]

I second this.

Finding out that my friend had lied to not just me, but her family and friends, the <em>night before</em> her faux wedding, really, really stung.  Worse, I was MOH, which means that I stood up there and played along with their fake charade.  I really wish nobody had told me until it was over.  I also wish I'd had the balls to walk away and not act like I condoned that.  But.  We live and learn.