Plus one or no???

jess28191

Here is my dilemma, hopefully you can help. My cousin and his wife are recently seperated and more than likely getting a divorce. Now I will still be inviting his wife to the wedding because we are somewhat friends and there daughter is the flower girl in the wedding. My dilemma is that My cousin came to me the other day and asked me if I had thought about if each of them were to bring a guest to the wedding? My fiance and I hadn't thought about it but were not quite sure what to do. I don't want any drama at the wedding if they both decide to bring dates and if I do let them bring someone else, how would I seat them? Anyone have any advice?

vanityink

Personally I would say no (unless they are in serious relationships, but it doesn't sound like they are). Then again, I'm trying to keep my wedding small and thus am only having "+1s" to people who are in serious relationship, not just for everyone to bring someone. FI and I have enough single friends it would add another third to our guest list if we allowed everyone a +1...

achiduck

If either of them are in a relationship you need to invite the SO, however if they're both truly single you don't need to add a guest for them. 

Since it sounds like they're pretty newly separated I think if you give one a plus one, you need to give the other the same courtesy otherwise if could turn into a big thing depending on how bitter and/or raw their emotions are at this point. 

SlothGoals

As long as neither is dating anyone at the time invitations go out you do not have to give them a +1. If they are dating someone you need to invite them together, regardless of how "serious" you believe the relationship to be.

lyndausvi

Honestly,I think I would wait and let this play out a little before making any decisions.    But if he is already talking about bringing a date it seems like he already has one.  Which is sad.

 That could make for a sticky situation.

More than likely I would still give the date and hope they can remain civil and sit them across the room from each other.

KellyBrian2013

In Response to Re:Plus one or no???:[QUOTE]Hugs, sorry.nbsp;nbsp; Do you think that cousin's soon to be ex still wants to come?nbsp;nbsp; It may be that she would rather stay home.nbsp; As the Knot board rule of BFs and GFs MUST be invited, that is not what many etiquette authoritiesnbsp; say Here is what Peggy Post, Emily Post and Jodi Smith say.Peggy Post page 89 says spouses, fiances and live in partners.Emily Post, page 573 says same thingJodi Smith, The Etiquette Book, page 133, says spouse and live inAs to the board's insistence that any BF or GF must be included, that is a rule of some people here. Maybe their thinking is that their relationship was just as good as any livein, so a BF or GF should be invited. That is not what Peggy Post, Emily Post I realize not her, but whomever is editing that book now or Smith are saying. Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

You seriously need to lose the URL to the etiquette board. Seriously. Go away. OP: when do invites need to go out? Anyone in a relationship needs to have their SO invited by name, regardless of how serious you think they are. Some people are serious after only a few weeks and you don't want them to feel as though you don't respect them or their relationship simply because they haven't moved in together or because there is no ring.

lyndausvi

kelly - I waiting for the URL to end up in her siggy.

KellyBrian2013

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_plus-one-or-no?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:2fa1adcc-1c98-4453-a720-ce65eb002867Post:26e7c183-d58c-4ebd-8c48-064fb706d51f">Re: Plus one or no???</a>:
[QUOTE]kelly - I waiting for the URL to end up in her siggy.
Posted by lyndausvi[/QUOTE]

That's a very frightening thought.

Also, Chef D is ridiculously adorable.

lyndausvi

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_plus-one-or-no?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:2fa1adcc-1c98-4453-a720-ce65eb002867Post:87b526e4-fdd4-4486-ab22-6bc4956bc9f8">Re: Plus one or no???</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Plus one or no??? : That's a very frightening thought. Also, Chef D is ridiculously adorable.
Posted by KellyBrian2013[/QUOTE]

<div>thanks</div>

ootmother2

I would not invite them with a plus one until they are divorced or at least legally seperated for a reasonable amount of time.

Kristin789

Your invitations would go out March 3, 2013 - 8 weeks prior to the wedding.
This isn't even OCTOBER 3.
You have OVER FIVE MONTHS before you need to decide.
Not the time to be fretting about your cousin and his wife.

arendiva

I would wait until late February to open that can of worms. The situation could be very different by then (heck they could be reconciled). So if your cousin asks just say that it's too early for you to know your guest list.

Jen4948

I agree-this isn't the time to answer that question.

When it is, certainly you need to invite people together who are married, engaged, or living together, but beyond that there's no "requirement" that you invite +1s for anyone else.  It's a kindness to do so, but some people here seem to be equating "requirement" with "kindness."

Also, the rule exists so you don't have to gauge how "serious" a relationship is, because unless the two people are married, engaged, or living together as a romantic couple (not just roommates), there's no way for you or anyone other than the two people in question to tell how "serious" it is.  Only they know the answer to that and it isn't really fair to expect all hosts to compare single, non-living together relationships for "seriousness."

theelusive1

I would say no.  It sounds like he is trying to get her all spun up at your wedding by bringing a date. 

KellyBrian2013

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_plus-one-or-no?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:2fa1adcc-1c98-4453-a720-ce65eb002867Post:003baabb-df0a-47a2-ab17-398775a04697">Re: Plus one or no???</a>:
[QUOTE]I agree-this isn't the time to answer that question. When it is, certainly you need to invite people together who are married, engaged, or living together, but beyond that there's no "requirement" that you invite +1s for anyone else.  It's a kindness to do so, but some people here seem to be equating "requirement" with "kindness." Also, the rule exists so you don't have to gauge how "serious" a relationship is, <strong>because unless the two people are married, engaged, or living together as a romantic couple (not just roommates), there's no way for you or anyone other than the two people in question to tell how "serious" it is.  Only they know the answer to that and it isn't really fair to expect all hosts to compare single, non-living together relationships for "seriousness."</strong>
Posted by Jen4948[/QUOTE]

And this is EXACTLY why ANYONE with a SO gets an invite, regardless of living situation or marital statuts. Who are you to say that two people who haven't combined households are less serious (after, say, 5 or 6 years) than someone who moved in with their boyfriend after only two months?

My very best friend, for instance, dated her now-H for SEVEN YEARS before they got engaged and, because of their religious convictions, they opted not to live together until marriage. Their engagement was ~9 months long. I, on the other hand, was engaged to DH after only 8 months of dating. So, by your standards (and NYU's), my best friend's now H shouldn't have been invited because they "weren't serious"?

KellyBrian2013

<p>In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_plus-one-or-no?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:2fa1adcc-1c98-4453-a720-ce65eb002867Post:f0775ecf-c25a-4dcf-84c5-b519d9ed9346">Re: Plus one or no???</a>:
[QUOTE]Kelly, it is fine for you say, in your opinion, that every SO MUST get an invite, but that is NOT what Emily Post, Peggy Post and Jodi Smith, in their books say.   So it is not just my opinion, but their's too.    By limiting the "MUST" invites to those people with objective standards, it eliminates anyone being "mortified" etc that they missed someone.  
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

Please post your sources - and NOT wikipedia, as that is NOT a legitimate source.

Also, inviting ANYONE who considers themself in a relationship with the person they are in a relationship with eliminates "objective standards". A signficant other is not a plus one - they are a spouse, and should be treated as such.

And based on your reply, I'm guessing that no, you wouldn't have invited my friends now-H (prior to their engagement) because they didn't fit your no-ring, no bring standard. I feel sorry for your friends and family.</p>

KellyBrian2013

In Response to Re:Plus one or no???:[QUOTE]Kelly from the most recent versions of their Wedding books Peggy Post page 89 says spouses, fiances and live in partners.Emily Post, page 573 says same thingJodi Smith, The Etiquette Book, page 133, says spouse and live in Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

First, post direct quotations please, not just your paraphrasing. Secondly, WTF do you think a "spouse" is?! Lol. Hello, significant other! AKA, someone a person is IN A RELATIONSHIP with.

allychase

In Response to Re:Plus one or no???:[QUOTE]In Response to Re:Plus one or no???:Kelly from the most recent versions of their Wedding books Peggy Post page 89 says spouses, fiances and live in partners.Emily Post, page 573 says same thingJodi Smith, The Etiquette Book, page 133, says spouse and live in Posted by NYUgirl100

First, post direct quotations please, not just your paraphrasing. Secondly, WTF do you think a "spouse" is?! Lol. Hello, significant other! AKA, someone a person is IN A RELATIONSHIP with. Posted by KellyBrian2013[/QUOTE]

Spouse
Noun
A husband or wife, considered in relation to their partner.

Hate to play devils advocate but a spouse isn't just someone's boyfriend or girlfriend. I disagree with not inviting SOs though. Just wanted to correct that before they went apeshittt on you

lyndausvi

NYU - just agree to disagree.   

s-aries8990

So, by this standard, long term couples whose current situations/ convictions prevent them from living together are not considered a social unit? Just because a book tells you to jump off a bridge means that it's the right thing to do??  Good thing i'm not going to NYU's wedding! (Kelly doesn't need citations- she didn't reference anything.)

ANYWAY, OP, I think that you don't need to answer this question just yet, it's still to early to know for sure, so just wait it out. If they do both come and do bring dates, just seat them at separate tables, preferably at least with one table in the middle.

s-aries8990

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_plus-one-or-no?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:2fa1adcc-1c98-4453-a720-ce65eb002867Post:03e0abed-fa17-4763-87eb-22a137fbb5c1">Re: Plus one or no???</a>:
[QUOTE]Fine, sydaries, no need for references, but then do not say that "Etiquette" demands all BFs/GFs get invites.  
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

1) No one on this thread said "demand" besides you, so don't put word in the mouths of others
2) Etiquette changes with the times, so at one point, BFs/GFs were only around a few months and then they were either gone or married to the person. Times have changed.
3) Etiquette is a code of conduct that, although you should follow, you don't have to.  "And thirdly, the code is more what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules." ...."You're pirates. Hang the code, and hang the rules. They're more like guidelines anyway." <a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0325980/quotes">and here's my citation</a>

KellyBrian2013

In Response to Re:Plus one or no???:[QUOTE]Fine, sydaries, no need for references, but then do not say that "Etiquette" demands all BFs/GFs get invites.nbsp;nbsp; Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

Common sense and common decency to friends and family demands it.

s-aries8990

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_plus-one-or-no?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:2fa1adcc-1c98-4453-a720-ce65eb002867Post:bf88cc41-2e0c-4f33-bea9-fe0184d49145">Re:Plus one or no???</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re:Plus one or no???: Common sense and common decency to friends and family demands it.
Posted by KellyBrian2013[/QUOTE]

Exactly! You don't need to have any sense or decency, let alone the common type, but if you did posess those qualities, you would invite the SO's of your guests.

s-aries8990

There are no sources. Etiquette is created as new circumstances arise ie. pagers, cell phones, the modernization of relationships with living together prior to marriage, longer term relationships prior to marriage, and the social acceptance of both. Not to metnion the emergence of social media etiquette. Emily Post was not around to suggest proper form for tweets.

KellyBrian2013

In Response to Re:Plus one or no???:[QUOTE]Kelly you said "First, post direct quotations please, not just your paraphrasing. "nbsp; and "Please post your sources and NOT wikipedia, as that is NOT a legitimate source."Would you rather say request, not demand OK but using the word please doesnt change a directive to a request, but OK.nbsp; You have asked for my sources, now I am asking for yours.nbsp; You say etiquette has changed over time fine what sources do you have, and please post direct quotations, and not wiki. Posted by
NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

First, reading comprehension is your friend. I did not say etiquette has changed over time, nor have I addressed "demanded" versus "requested". Second, you want a SOURCE for what common sense and common decency say? Really? You're an idiot. Go away.

KellyBrian2013

In Response to Re:Plus one or no???:[QUOTE]Kelly, I am not certain why you asked me for my sources and refuse to give any of your own.nbsp;nbsp; Either you think sources are relevant or you don't or have none to cite.nbsp;nbsp; All this continues to make me believe that there is no established rule of etiquette that demands all SOs be invited.nbsp; As much as you say common sense demands an invite, I can say that common sense is that people can enjoy a wedding without a BF/GF, especially a new one, of unknown connection. Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

Well, it's already well established that you're an idiot, so there's that. I'm not quoting sources, so therefore I do not need to provide you with citations. I am acting upon common decency to my friends and family because, apparently unlike you, I value their relationships and want to make them comfortable . If their nonlivein, nonfiance, nonhusband or wife eventually becomes their husband or wife, they'll remember that I loved them enough to recognize their relationship. Again, I'll ask you: was my best friend's 7 year dating relationship with her now husband less serious over those 7 years than mine with my DH where we were engaged and living together after less than a year?

s-aries8990

I admit I was too eager to type on the "living together" part. And you are certainly entitled to you opinion. Just because a person has an opinion doesn't make it hurtful to others, including your potential guests. You don't haveee to do anything. As the economy still hasn't made a recovery, more coupes are choosing to postpone their nuptials in order to save more money, and if you choose to punish them by breaking up their social unit, that's their bone to pick with you, not me.  (And I know Emily Post isn't alive, what I'm saying is that etiquitte rules don't get written down in-step with social trends).

KellyBrian2013

In Response to Re:Plus one or no???:[QUOTE]Sydarie, if people are "postponing nuptials" I would think they would be for the most part be engaged, and would have to be invited under the finance provisions.nbsp; Kelly if single people can not be comfortable at a wedding without their BF or GF, it can also be viewed as their connection with the bride/groom being at best tenuous.nbsp; This is an etiquette board.nbsp; I do not see a lot of support in etiquette books for "must" invites to other than spouse, fiancee, livein partner maybe longterm also.nbsp;nbsp; I can see, as someone else, said being kind, and extending invites, especially if not many othe rsingles, single doesnt know anyone else not certain why that person would be invited, but OK, destination wedding, out of town.nbsp; Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

Are you purposely obtuse? It has nothing to do with "being uncomfortable without boyfriend/girlfriend". It has everything to do with recognizing that your friends and family have relationships that are meaningful to them and showing that you respect that. I, for one, would not have attended a wedding even of a closest friend had they said DH wasn't invited when we were 4 months into our relationship. And on top of that, it certainly would have affected the relationship with the bride and or groom that they felt justified in judging the seriousness of my personal relationship in such a manner as to purposely EXCLUDE my significant other.

Girlie1030

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_plus-one-or-no?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:2fa1adcc-1c98-4453-a720-ce65eb002867Post:9ceb2da5-ad03-4167-969c-903f068237b8">Re: Plus one or no???</a>:
[QUOTE]Here is Martha Stewart weighing in  - again, so it is not just me, it is Post, etc and Stewart.  Inviting Plus Ones If your relatives or friends are engaged to be married, their fiances (or fiancees) must be invited; their live-in romantic partners must be as well. However, if they are only dating, you need not invite their boyfriend or girlfriend. Should you decide to include some dates and not others, draw your cut-off line at a clearly identifiable place and communicate it to everyone who is not allowed to invite someone to accompany them. Beware, many unmarried people find it tremendously upsetting to not be allowed to bring a date.<strong> Prepare them for the idea and pay careful attention to where the singletons sit during dinner.</strong> As for your attendants -- letting them bring an escort would be a considerate gesture. It's not required, but they've done a lot for you.
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

Table 9. 

<a href="http://cdn.cl9.vanillaforums.com/downloaded/ver1.0/content/images/store/4/10/94fa4480-856c-4772-aa8a-8f515ee03120.large.jpg" title="Click to view a larger photo" class="PhotoLink"><img src="http://cdn.cl9.vanillaforums.com/downloaded/ver1.0/content/images/store/4/10/94fa4480-856c-4772-aa8a-8f515ee03120.medium.jpg" alt="" /></a>

And seriously, you only need to consider allowing your bridal party to bring a date?  Martha's a bigger tool than I already thought. 

StephJean83

NYU have you never known someone from work/school/church and not known their other friends or family from other areas in there life? I was invited to a wedding a couple years ago and I knew 7 people pretty well and had 1 other person once or twice before not including the bride's mom and brother. Everyone that I knew except 1 were in the wedding party so had I not be allowed a +1 I wouldn't have known many people at the wedding to talk to during dinner. My FH came with me to wedding even though we just started dating. My FH was invited to a wedding last year for a former classmate of his, he only knew the bride and 4 other guests(his great aunt and uncle and their daughter and son in law who know the parents of the bride). He was glad I was also invited because it gave him someone to talk to once his relatives went home(they left pretty early) because he would have left when they did had I not been invited simply because he knew NO ONE there. The bride wasn't close to many of their classmates since they graduated, so she didn't invited anyone else from the class to the wedding. So yes, it is possible for people to be invited to a wedding and not know a single guest there. 

My FH and I just moved in together in July and he previously been invited to 4 weddings PRIOR to us moving together that would happen AFTER we moved(thus at the time invites went out we were "just bf/gf" and when the weddings were we were "living together") and they all included +1 for him because they knew it would be rude not to invite me, even though none of them knew we were looking to move in together or how serious we were/are. Based on your logic because I highly doubt it proper etiquette would permit them separating a SOCIAL UNIT(even though we lived in separate apts we were a social unit from sending out Christmas cards/gifts and birthday cards together to presenting ourselves as one in public), the weddings my FH was invited to this summer, he should have only gotten it for him and no plus one because the day the invites went out I lived in a different town than my FH even though by the time the wedding would be happening we would be living together.

Kamakanani

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_plus-one-or-no?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:2fa1adcc-1c98-4453-a720-ce65eb002867Post:d5217697-3522-4091-9ecb-996ff1dbbdc6">Re: Plus one or no???</a>:
[QUOTE]Sydarie, <strong>if people are "postponing nuptials" I would think they would be for the most part be engaged, and would have to be invited under the finance provisions.</strong>  Kelly -- if single people can not be comfortable at a wedding without their BF or GF, it can also be viewed as their connection with the bride/groom being at best tenuous.  This is an etiquette board.  I do not see a lot of support in etiquette books for "must" invites to other than spouse, fiancee, live-in partner (maybe long-term also).   I can see, as someone else, said being kind, and extending invites, especially if not many othe rsingles, single doesnt know anyone else (not certain why that person would be invited, but OK), destination wedding, out of town. 
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]<div>And, if the couple is waiting to become officially engaged until they actively and financially able to plan their wedding?  I don't think you've yet answered the question of the 7 year courtship, where the parties live separately. </div><div>
</div><div>I may not own a book specifically on etiquette, nor do I consider myself the most versed in the minuitae of etiquette, but I highly doubt any etiquette rules would encourage anything that could be percieved as rude (such as not inviting the non-engaged, non-live-in significant other of a friend in a long-term relationship).

</div>