Found out husband is "cheating?" Advice needed.

J&K10910

I'm picking up what you're putting down, Cooper.

Frankly, if I had had trust issues in the past that made me need my H's passwords, and then I felt my trust was violated badly enough again to make me want to take away his internet access, I'd probably be throwing in the towel, but that's me. 

angelsong21

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_found-out-husband-is-cheating-advice-needed?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:67fe948f-05e1-4f46-b767-b0b0198222f6Post:a03c4f1e-4215-419b-85d1-3be014d418af">Re:Found out husband is</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re:Found out husband is : I get what you're saying.  I really, really do.  But, IMO, doing it this way is likely to just create resentment and animosity  and hurt more than be helpful.  It might make OP feel better at first, but it won't do anything helpful in the long run. 
Posted by J&K10910[/QUOTE]

<div>Absolutely this.  This is exactly what happens.  I have tried it over and over again but it never gets me anywhere and always makes things worse without fail.  It temporarily gives me some peace of mind, but all it does is create resentment and my addict becomes more resourceful in finding other ways to get what he wants (obviously I'm using my own personal situation as a reference here and am not indicating that OP's H is an addict) without me knowing, worrying, and attempting to control the situation.  When it comes to light that he's been lying to me, things are MUCH worse off than they were before I attempted to control his behavior. </div><div>
</div><div>The only thing that I have found to be successful is to set boundaries to protect myself, not to punish my addict.  I have boundaries as to what I will accept in my home, in my relationship with this person, and in my personal life.  When those boundaries are violated, I have to follow through on what I say will happen when that boundary is crossed.</div><div>
</div><div>I also agree that the "sharing of passwords" things had me curious.  I think that was part of what led me to the assumption that this was probably not the only trust issue she was having.  Perhaps I was wrong (and more often than not, I seem to be, lol), but I guess that's why my answer was what it was earlier on in this post.</div><div>
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angelsong21

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_found-out-husband-is-cheating-advice-needed?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:67fe948f-05e1-4f46-b767-b0b0198222f6Post:c88cede7-eba3-4339-88a5-153f863ed506">Re:Found out husband is</a>:
[QUOTE] I've been here and though I loved my ex, having to take this tack with him [which I did, almost to the letter of your description] was exhausting and emotionally draining for me. Kudos to you for working so damn hard. I very much admire those who have the tenacity to keep relationships like this going.
Posted by coopergirl15[/QUOTE]

<div>Thankfully the other person in this relationship chose to get help and has worked hard to do the next right thing every day.  Will it be perfect?  No.  Will he relapse?  Statistics say its pretty likely (70% in the first year), and that's hard to swallow.  If he wasn't working a program, hadn't willingly accepted help, and hadn't been walking the walk and not just talking the talk, I wouldn't be here.  Yes, these tactics were emotionally exhausting for quite some time, but through Al-Anon, I've learned a lot and I'm learning more and more how to keep myself separate and "detach" in a healthy way.  Thank you for the kudos -- sometimes it feels worth it to stick it out and other times, you just know in your heart its not the right thing to do.</div>

KindaStupid

Sorry for taking off for a little bit, everyone. I went to lunch with a friend of mine, and vented for a bit.

You're right, there has been issues of trust in the past. Early on in our relationship, we were very much on again, off again and the last time we got back together for good, before we were engaged, I found out that he had been perusing the personal ads while on a business trip. Nothing happened, a couple people responded, but he never wrote back, so I believed him when he said that old habits just die hard, and that he was bored and horny while on his business trip, and did what he usually did when he was single. He said he "got a hold of himself", and didn't reply.

When we were in premarital counseling, the subject of sharing passwords was actually in the curriculim that the counselors were using, and we both agreed that we wanted everything to be open. It's really weird that he did that, knowing that I knew his password. It's almost as if he genuinely didn't think I would have a problem with it. There is the possibility he forgot, since that's been almost a year ago, but it's still strange.

angelsong21

Based on what you just posted, KS, I stand beside my original advice.  There are clearly some very serious issues going on here, especially in terms of your trust.  What was involved in the conversation you had about this the first time?

To me, he should have been somewhat aware after the first incident that this behavior bothered you.  He essentially said, "Sorry, old habits die hard and I will stop," and he didn't.  However, by you condoning the two of you looking at postings together, that really muddied the water.  

This is a tough situation, and I still think individual and marriage counseling is essential.  There are some very serious issues here that, if not confronted and worked through, will be even more devastating in the future than they are to you now.

KindaStupid

The first time it happened, we were looking through his email for an address, and I saw something sexual, and did a WTF? He explained what happened, promised never to do it again, and that was that. I trusted him enough to believe that he just fell into an old habit of going on a business trip, and finding some easy asss to keep him occupied in the evening. We'd only been together a week at that point, so, I can see how it would happen.

 I said, yeah, that isn't something I'm going to be ok with, and left it at that. When we discussed keeping out passwords out in the open, I don't know that it was motivated by that breach of trust. The counselors just asked if we would, and it was a "Sure, why not?" response.

He just came back home, and we discussed things. I think that part of the problem is that he smokes MJ frequently, more than twice a week lately, and when he gets high, his inhibitions fly out the window. I've had already a problem with the frequency he's been smoking recently, and have asked him to scale back to how often he was doing it when we first got together, which was just recreationally, on special occasions. Now, its not uncommon for him to "wake n bake" when he gets up earlier than I do, and surf the web or play video games, and the craig'slist thing happened early in the morning as well.

So, I told him absolutely no more MJ, because he obviously has a problem with boundries concerning it, and that we were going to counseling. All he's said since he got home was "You're 100% right, I'll do whatever I need to do, I have a problem." To him, he said, it was like looking at pornography. That barely makes sense though, because HE gave up pornography when we got married, because he said it felt like he was cheating- but I don't even have a problem with that!!! It's the real, live women, that are looking to have sex that I have an issue with. He can have his fantasies, I don't care, I just don't want him talking dirty to real people. 

J&K10910

OP (not to be impersonal, but I refuse to call you KindaStupid), the more you say, the more concerned I get. 

These things don't HAVE to be deal breakers, but they are worth a second thought.  I'm going to go back to my advice of taking a couple days for yourself to figure out what you want and need before moving forward. 

StefffiC

KS -

Edited to add I agree with Stagemanager above as well.

Was your premarital counseling based off Dr Harley's work?

We had issues when we were dating, swept them under the rug, and ended up dealing with them 2 years ago. We used Dr Harley's program, and we are happy together now. I was the one wandering, and even though DH is out of town 4 nights a week we've managed to rebuild our trust.

I don't know that we would go through what we went through had we known what it would take. I hope that makes sense.

DH and I do have each other's passwords, I don't know that he's bothered to look at anything of mine in a year or more. He's really lazy about checking his email for work and sometimes won't have internet while he's out of town, so I check his mail every morning. I have a set of 'Extraordinary Precautions' that we agreed on that I live by. We spend at least 15 - 20 hours of time together every week. There are people I've met through Marriage Builders that did require their spouse's to give up their internet/smartphones/whatever, it's not discouraged through that program. We did not go to those extremes, but he did make some requests on limits on line - no single male FB friends unless their family, no male FB friends we don't both know, no personal emails to opposite sex people, other than work. Whatever he requested for me to do, I did, without complaint, because it's what he needed to heal.

There are a lot of options out there for dealing with an 'affair'. But, if this is a pattern he may be a serial adulterer and you may be better of cutting your loses before you have children. Those are decisions only you can make. I'm so sorry you're going through this.

J&K10910

It's like a reverse summary.  Stage took my summary and extrapolated all the info into her post. 

J&K10910

I like when that happens.  I feel like I'm often not on the same brainwave as anyone.

KindaStupid

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_found-out-husband-is-cheating-advice-needed?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:67fe948f-05e1-4f46-b767-b0b0198222f6Post:ec8ee15a-f838-4305-b74a-02023a15c131">Re:Found out husband is</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re:Found out husband is : Okay, I also think this is really good advice. I've rethought a bit, and I'm going to be 100 percent honest here, and it's going to sound harsh at first, so please read all the way through. I don't think any of the things you described your husband doing are actually all that wrong, in and of themselves. However, they are obviously a problem for you, and I completely understand and support that. I'm not saying you're wrong or even overreacting. But it sounds like you married a man who likes to smoke pot and swap sexy messages with strangers. I get that being a problem, even a deal breaker for you. But I don't think expecting him to change is going to do either of you much good. I used to tell female customers at the shop all the time that there was little point in trying to make their SO's stop watching bondage porn, no matter how much it freaked them out, because that inevitably just led to their SOs doing it behind their back, which put a huge strain on their sex life and relationship, even if they didn't get caught. The better solution was to decide if this was a dealbreaker, and if so, find someone who was more compatible with them. I realize this is a much more serious offense to you, but a lot of them reacted the same way and had the same feelings you're expressing. Likewise, if your husband was single or in a relationship with someone who didn't mind this behavior, there wouldn't be an issue with his behavior in and of itself, so I think trying to convince him it's bad or wrong is probably futile especially if you've already done counseling for this before. I'm certainly not telling you to just break it off, but I think you need to ask yourself is this a deal breaker? Can you handle "relapses", if he does it again even just once 3 or 4 years down the road? Because, if not, I don't think it's fair to him or to yourself to stay on the merry go round. So, I'd take JK's advice, take a few days away from him to really think, and then go see a counselor and decide what you want to do.
Posted by StageManager14[/QUOTE]


I completely understand and agree with what you're saying. We discussed things, and I drew a hard line. And I did ask him if he just didn't think what he did was wrong, if he thought it was harmless. He said that he knew, he just got carried away with the fantasy. I made it clear that I am NOT ok with it, and that we are going to start counseling, and if he didn't agree to that, then I'd be leaving. I'm fine with pornography, in whatever form, as long as it doesn't involve children or animals...whatever floats his boat. I just don't want him conversing with actual people, about the sex, and I made all that clear to him.

As far as the smoking thing goes, I'm fine with him smoking socially. I'm even ok with him taking a single hit off a bowl a couple of times a week. I'm just not ok with coming home to him being stoned off his asss every other day of the week.

It's like alchohol. You don't care if your man has a beer with dinner every night, and gets a little drunk occasionally on the weekends, but if you started coming home to him being a drunk mess on a regular basis, it would start being a problem.
Before we were married, that didn't happen, and now all of the sudden, it is.

I think part of the reason why I'm not too angry about it, is that he didn't deny it, and that he immediately said he was wrong, and would do whatever it took to make it right. He even offered to turn off our internet and sell his computers if it would help me trust him more, and is 100% in agreement about going to counseling...so that helps.

Thanks again for all the words of wisdom, everyone.

daffydillie

My ExH started cheating at 5 months out. It had nothing to do with me, he was an attention whore. He did not want to work through problems. And he was delusional on his thoughts of marriage. He wanted a stay at home wife but he also did not want to work. When people tell you who they are believe them. He damaged me pretty badly from all the agony he put me through. And we had a bitter divorce that I just recently found out wasnt final.

He would find old high school girls on Facebook and start messages like you are talking about. However, he didnt smoke he drank. He was really good about hiding who he was for a very long time until we got married. 2 weeks after we got married he said he did not ahve to pretend to be someone he wasnt anymore since I didnt believe in divorce, I would never leave him. Everytime he thought I was going to leave he would guilt me into taking the victim mentality and change just enough that I would hold out hope the guy I married was coming back even though now it was quite evident hes not.

I would sit down and write a list of dealbreakers, spend some time alone, and really think about where you see yourself as a person in 5 years. If I had done it the first time I caught him stepping outside the boundaries and really took a look at the situation, I would have saved myself years of heartbreak and laid stricter boundaries down and stuck with them.

Perhaps he just slipped up, but I would decide if you could deal with the person he was when he was single with the smoking and the messaging strangers. And I would work on things slowly regardless of which way you want to go.

I was in an infidelity support group for a very long time. My ex was an extreme case but if you need to talk you can pm me if you end up finding more out and not sure where to go.

blubuilding

I am sorry that you are going through this. Going to counseling again is a excellent idea. As some of the problem is repeat behavior, it seems as if he feels a compulsion to do such destructive acts. Does he think he has issues? He may benefit from individual counseling as well. It is not your fault for "not setting boundaries". Most couples agree that answering personal ads is a deal breaker, if not all out wrong, and they don't have to talk about it to figure it out. Best wishes.

entropicbeauty

It doesn't sound like anyone has pointed out that - maybe he honestly didn't know he was doing something that would upset you because he did it right in front of you?

You say it's behind your back, but he knows you have his e-mail account passwords so he would know that you could see any activity he's up to (btw, I'd be interested to hear why you two feel the need to have eachothers personal e-mail passwords to begin with, were there past trust issues?)

....to me it sounds almost like he was just throwing fishing lines out and due to the past (of you two looking at ads together, talking about threesomes etc.) really didn't think it would be a big deal till he saw how you reacted.

Glad to hear you're thinking of going back to counselling, making sure you're both on the same page (particularly when it comes to sex and boundaries) is always a good idea.

melisss789

I would definetely leave him.  Maybe not a divorce necessarily yet... but leave him, take your things and make him beg for you.  Tell him that right now he needs to tell you exactly what hes done.  Right now everything needs to come out.  It will probably be more then what youve already found out, so get ready.  Id move in with a friend, family or someone.  Ignore his calls as long as you can.  Also as hard as you can Id try to go out and give your self esteem a boost.  Get hit on, talk to guys, etc.  Dont cheat.  But then little by little you will probably not be able to keep ignoring his calls and you two will talk.  Then you will tell him how youve bee ngoing out doing what you want, etc.  Make him SEE that you are worth so much more and can indeed go out and do better if you wanted to.  Thenlittle by little Id get back to normal with him... go back home... but ONLY if he is crying for you.  Then once you guys are living back together I would just be cold with him for a little. Even if you are over it, Id still give him the cold shoulder like no kisses, no being romantic, etc.  Try as hard as you can.  Youll get back to normal eventually.  I dont believe in the counseling idea.  But I would be very suspicious and if he begins to comment on anything of how you're being just respond with that hes made you this way and you need time to get over it.  Youll eventually be back the way things were but he needs to work too.  Best of luck, Im sorry this is happening