Wedding Etiquette Forum

NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.

I don't know if anyone remembers my posts or not, I doubt it, they were from close to a year ago...

Whether you remember or not, I have since stopped talking to my mother. At first, it was active, we would specifically avoid her, but that was annoying, so we just don't go out of our way to deal with her. I am still extremely close to my siblings.

My youngest sister found out recently that she is pregnant (so is my DW! For those who followed my old posts), and it was not planned. She is young, she'll need some help, but she'll be a great mom, no one is worried about that. She has plenty of support from W and I, and my brothers and their wives will absolutely step in when they can. My sister has been with her BF (the father of the child) for a few years, but honestly, I don't see this dude ever growing up. Don't get me wrong, he's a cool guy, but that's about it.

OK, he sucks. Everyone knows he sucks. My sister knows he sucks. He wears his hat sideways. I despise this kid. But he was never a problem, so I never felt the need to say anything. Well, my darling mother has basically convinced my sister that the only two options that would be good for baby are either to give baby to my parents, or marry loser BF. She does not want to do either of these, and shouldn't have to. She is a complete mess now and frankly, I'm afraid it will cause something bad to happen. 

My sister will not stand up for herself, and she has never been one to question "authority." My question is, WWYD? Do I step in and say something to one/both of them?
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Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.

  • How old is your sister?  Is she in school?  Does she have a diploma, college degree of some sort?  Is she working?

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  • I remember you, groom!  Welcome back.  Glad you've mostly gotten that toxicity out of your life, and congrats on your baby on the way!  Sorry for the situation with your sister.

    I also am curious to know more about your sisters situation - is she dependent on your mother in any way? living at home, mom paying for school anything like that?  I think you should absolutely step in if for no other reason than to re-assure your sister that she CAN do this on her own (without marrying BF) and that you and your siblings will be there for her 100%.  If she's really stuck on the authority thing remind her that she's a grown-up now and going to be a mom so she gets to make her own decisions.
  • edited February 2013
    In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:255dd986-7248-47d5-9a1a-37ccb752b647">Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]How old is your sister?  Is she in school?  Does she have a diploma, college degree of some sort?  Is she working?
    Posted by GoodLuckBear14[/QUOTE]

    <div>She is 21, she has her associate's degree in nursing, and she is working as a nurse PT. She is working towards her bachelor's degree. She makes decent money, certainly more than I did at her age. Like I've said, I know she'll still need help, I'm just saying she has support in whatever choice she makes. DW is going to be a SAHM, and she has offered to watch niece/nephew whenever my sister needs her.</div><div>
    </div><div>ETA: She does still live at home with my parents. This can also change. We've offered her a room at our house for as long as she needs (we offered this long before she got pregnant, but it still applies).</div>
  • I was just a lurker when you posted before, but I remember!

    I think the first thing that you should do is tell your sister that she has way more options than she's been presented. I don't know what kind of voodoo magic your mom has done to convince her that her only options are give the baby to them or get married, but you should remind her of all her other options STAT. Your sister cannot give up the baby to her parents without consent, so I would maybe suggest that she employ a doula or birthing coach to help her get a birth plan in place that does not include giving up the baby.

    Other than that, consistent support from you and your brothers (which it sounds like she has) will do a world fo good for her.
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  • IMO, young girls never should be pressured into feeling like they have to keep their pregnancy unless they are able to support themselves and said possible baby, but I understand that everyone's situation/beliefs are different, so... 

    As PP said, what is the age/status of your sister concerning education and job? How far into the pregnancy is she?

    And, NO she should NOT marry anyone unless she truly wants to. This sounds like an accidental pregnancy that has spiraled out of control. 

    Marriage should never be used as the 'you're pregnant, now you HAVE to get married' thing. That never ends well, and makes it worse if they decide to split. They should only marry if they feel ready, not because of what other people think. 
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  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:e95daac6-eee3-4133-b298-e661d205b63c">Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]IMO, young girls never should be pressured into feeling like they have to keep their pregnancy unless they are able to support themselves and said possible baby, but I understand that everyone's situation/beliefs are different, so...  <strong>As PP said, what is the age/status of your sister concerning education and job?</strong> How far into the pregnancy is she? And, NO she should NOT marry anyone unless she truly wants to. This sounds like an accidental pregnancy that has spiraled out of control.  Marriage should never be used as the 'you're pregnant, now you HAVE to get married' thing. That never ends well, and makes it worse if they decide to split. They should only marry if they feel ready, not because of what other people think. 
    Posted by Amsdragonfly[/QUOTE]

    <div>OP already answered this.</div>
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  • I'd definitely talk to your sister and remind her that she does not have to marry her BF just because they're having a kid. Actually, she shouldn't marry him if the only reason is they're having a kid. A marriage license does  not make coparenting any easier. 

    She absolutely doesn't have to give up her rights as a mother. She'll need help, yes, but most people with kids can and do need support from their family. It's great that you're offering to help her so much. Just remind her again that she has love, support and options, then let her decide what she wants to do.
  • Im so sorry that your sister is going thru this :[ Anyway, just talk to your sister & let her know the options that were presented to her are not the only options she has. I would just let her know that not only does she have your support, but she has support from your wife, your brothers & their wives. I think its really great that all of you have come together to show your little sister support in this time. She is probably scared out of her mind. Maybe remind her of the offer you gave her to stay at your house and get away from your mom, who seems to be extremely toxic.
    I really hope it works out for your sister. Keep us updated!
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  • Sorry, I did not explain that very well. My sister is aware of (some) other options, like abortion and adoption, but those absolutely did not interest her. My mother also does not want the baby to be anywhere out of eyesight, but is very traditional and for some reason hates the idea of a single mother.

    You know what? For all intents and purposes, picture my mom as Judge Frollo. Remember? From The Hunchback of Notre Dame? The Disney version. I haven't seen the others. She is really manipulative, and I love my sister, but she buys into it pretty easily. It can be really hard to watch.

    My mom has pretty much convinced my sister that she can't raise her child on her own, and insists she can't depend on anyone for help (I see where mom is coming from with this, but in this case, she can) except the father of the child, who is essentially moss. Oh, and my parents, but only if they get to raise the child as their own. WTF? Who even thinks of that?
  • SlothGoalsSlothGoals member
    1000 Comments 250 Love Its Third Anniversary First Answer
    edited February 2013
    In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:5ba5b161-d962-4d0e-b222-99ba69a4a117">Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]Sorry, I did not explain that very well. My sister is aware of (some) other options, like abortion and adoption, but those absolutely did not interest her. My mother also does not want the baby to be anywhere out of eyesight, but is very traditional and for some reason hates the idea of a single mother. You know what? For all intents and purposes, picture my mom as Judge Frollo. Remember? From The Hunchback of Notre Dame? The Disney version. I haven't seen the others. She is really manipulative, and I love my sister, but she buys into it pretty easily. It can be really hard to watch. My mom has pretty much convinced my sister that she can't raise her child on her own, and insists she can't depend on anyone for help (I see where mom is coming from with this, but in this case, she can) except the father of the child, who is essentially moss. Oh, and my parents, but only if they get to raise the child as their own. WTF? Who even thinks of that?
    Posted by GroomNeedsAdvice[/QUOTE]<div>
    </div><div>Your sister needs some professional counseling or something. Like, legal counsel so she knows her rights if she gives the baby to your parents. Your mom is BSC and if your sister buys into it easily, well, there might not be much you can do. Does your sister live with your parents? I can't recall if you've mentioned this already. If she does then another good thing to do would be getting ehr out of there asap. Even if it were just for a while so she can see how normal people function in society.

    </div><div>ETA: I missed your earlier ETA about her living arrangements! Sorry!</div>
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  • Has she looked sound recently. Somewhere sound half the kids out there are raised by single parents and a good chunk of them are doing just fine.
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:f5dff810-96eb-491a-a209-343edbf15031">Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]Has she looked sound recently. Somewhere sound half the kids out there are raised by single parents and a good chunk of them are doing just fine.
    Posted by MsYeck[/QUOTE]

    <div>What? Sorry, I've read this several times over, and what?</div>
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:f97d7fb7-3822-4228-bb8c-f4a347eb1da6">Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts. : What? Sorry, I've read this several times over, and what?
    Posted by GroomNeedsAdvice[/QUOTE]

    <div>I think where it says "sound" it should say "around"</div>
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  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:4f728937-e000-4eac-83f7-e9a928730bde">Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts. : I think where it says "sound" it should say "around"
    Posted by kristbot[/QUOTE]

    <div>How did I miss that? I need to start drinking.</div>
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:e3a3cd5b-f449-45b1-b27d-08afffc9e5c2">Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts. : Your sister needs some professional counseling or something. Like, legal counsel so she knows her rights if she gives the baby to your parents. Your mom is BSC and if your sister buys into it easily, well, there might not be much you can do. Does your sister live with your parents? I can't recall if you've mentioned this already. If she does then another good thing to do would be getting ehr out of there asap. Even if it were just for a while so she can see how normal people function in society. ETA: I missed your earlier ETA about her living arrangements! Sorry!
    Posted by kristbot[/QUOTE]

    This. 
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  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:5ba5b161-d962-4d0e-b222-99ba69a4a117">Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]Sorry, I did not explain that very well. My sister is aware of (some) other options, like abortion and adoption, but those absolutely did not interest her. My mother also does not want the baby to be anywhere out of eyesight, but is very traditional and for some reason hates the idea of a single mother. You know what? For all intents and purposes, picture my mom as Judge Frollo. Remember? From The Hunchback of Notre Dame? The Disney version. I haven't seen the others. She is really manipulative, and I love my sister, but she buys into it pretty easily. It can be really hard to watch. My mom has pretty much convinced my sister that she can't raise her child on her own, and insists she can't depend on anyone for help (I see where mom is coming from with this, but in this case, she can) except the father of the child, who is essentially moss. Oh, and my parents, but only if they get to raise the child as their own. WTF? Who even thinks of that?
    Posted by GroomNeedsAdvice[/QUOTE]

    I'm glad that your sister has looked at all of her options and is choosing the one most suited to her. I think you should absolutely step in and say something to your sister at least. Honestly, it sounds like your mom wouldn't change what she's saying/how she's thinking even if you did say something, so I'd save my breath and a lot of frustration.

    Your sister could be worried that she'll be a burden on you and your wife and you'll resent her for "mooching" off of you if she lives with you for a long time. I'm not saying that will happen, that could just be a fear in the back of her mind that makes her think giving up her parental rights or getting married are her only options. Perhaps sit down with her, offering her a place to live and maybe put down some guidelines that would make her feel like she wouldn't be a burden? Whatever you and DW are comfortable with. I imagine she's scared right now and really not sure. Can you convince her to live with you for awhile to get her out from mom's influence so she can consider everything and decide what would be best for her and her child?
  • Your mom is ridiculous.  She thinks that sister should turn over parental rights to her, so that she would be the baby's mom and your sister would be Auntie??  That reminds me of a really bad soap opera plot. 

    I agree with winelover, convince your sister to move in with you for a little bit so she can clearly think about what she wants to do.  Then discuss the option of her living with you until she finishes school.  Since she works part time, let her pay a small amount of rent, if that would make her feel better (and so she wouldn't consider herself a mooch).  While she is with you, keep your mom as far away from her as possible.

    Good luck.  She is a lucky young woman to have a loving brother and SIL to help her out.

  • Your sister is not the first or last single parent. It happens, your sister should find help for herself. I can imagine she's probably ashamed and to deal with your mom on top of everything is definitely too much for her.

    I am getting this feeling that your mom is one of those people that's always so worried about what people think of her so she's making your sister's pregnancy about her and what her friends will think of a single mom. (my mom is like this and threw a fit when my sister got pregnant really young). I'm sorry if my assumptions are wrong.

    There's free help out there; but I'm glad you've opened the doors to your house to her. She's going to need all the help she can get. She sounds pretty stable but an unplanned pregnancy is always so stressful.

    God Bless you all.
  • Liatris, that's really awesome for your family. When my wife first heard what my mom was doing, she immediately jumped on the idea again of my sister moving in, and now her being "baby buddies," as she put it. This is something we are really excited about, not a burden at all. My wife and I have been together for a long time, and friends for much longer, so really, she has been part of our family since we were kids. She was around when my sister was born, and they're very close. She would love for the kids to grow up together.

    Our home is very old, but completely renovated. It's not huge, but it does have a seperate area where she and her baby could live and not really have to even see us every day, if she didn't want to. We would be able to put a very small, but fully functional kitchen (cabinets, counters, standard refridgerator/freezer, stove/oven, sink, small dishwasher) in her space. We are really willing to do anything to get her away from my mom and help her. 

    I also really like winelovers suggestion of "ground rules" so she wouldn't feel like she's "in the way."
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:e6fa90c9-47b6-45a0-8149-1149e3368ffe">Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]Your sister is not the first or last single parent. It happens, your sister should find help for herself. I can imagine she's probably ashamed and to deal with your mom on top of everything is definitely too much for her. I am getting this feeling that your mom is one of those people that's always so worried about what people think of her so she's making your sister's pregnancy about her and what her friends will think of a single mom. (my mom is like this and threw a fit when my sister got pregnant really young). I'm sorry if my assumptions are wrong. There's free help out there; but I'm glad you've opened the doors to your house to her. She's going to need all the help she can get. She sounds pretty stable but an unplanned pregnancy is always so stressful. God Bless you all.
    Posted by mcda04[/QUOTE]

    <div>No, don't apologize, you're exactly right. Everything is 100% about her, it's been that way since she was born, and it will until the day she dies. </div>
  • Groom, you and W are saints to offer your home and child care. Sis is very lucky to have you. God bless you.
  • winelover123winelover123 member
    1000 Comments 250 Love Its First Anniversary First Answer
    edited February 2013
    In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:3716ade2-5eeb-4f2b-9fc3-a1c8fe0d924b">Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]Liatris, that's really awesome for your family. When my wife first heard what my mom was doing, she immediately jumped on the idea again of my sister moving in, and now her being "baby buddies," as she put it. This is something we are really excited about, not a burden at all. My wife and I have been together for a long time, and friends for much longer, so really, she has been part of our family since we were kids. She was around when my sister was born, and they're very close. She would love for the kids to grow up together. Our home is very old, but completely renovated. It's not huge, but it does have a seperate area where she and her baby could live and not really have to even see us every day, if she didn't want to. We would be able to put a very small, but fully functional kitchen (cabinets, counters, standard refridgerator/freezer, stove/oven, sink, small dishwasher) in her space. We are really willing to do anything to get her away from my mom and help her.  I also really like winelovers suggestion of "ground rules" so she wouldn't feel like she's "in the way."
    Posted by GroomNeedsAdvice[/QUOTE]

    It comes from years of watching and supporting FI with his family's issues - he's felt in the way and like a burden before, so I imagine that could be a very real fear that your sister has. You sound like you're a great and loving brother. Hope it works out and your sister finds an option she's comfortable with! GL!
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:3716ade2-5eeb-4f2b-9fc3-a1c8fe0d924b">Re: NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]Liatris, that's really awesome for your family. When my wife first heard what my mom was doing, she immediately jumped on the idea again of my sister moving in, and now her being "baby buddies," as she put it. This is something we are really excited about, not a burden at all. My wife and I have been together for a long time, and friends for much longer, so really, she has been part of our family since we were kids. She was around when my sister was born, and they're very close. She would love for the kids to grow up together. Our home is very old, but completely renovated. It's not huge,<strong> but it does have a seperate area where she and her baby could live and not really have to even see us every day, if she didn't want to. We would be able to put a very small, but fully functional kitchen (cabinets, counters, standard refridgerator/freezer, stove/oven, sink, small dishwasher) in her space</strong>. We are really willing to do anything to get her away from my mom and help her.  I also really like winelovers suggestion of "ground rules" so she wouldn't feel like she's "in the way."
    Posted by GroomNeedsAdvice[/QUOTE]

    I would tell your sister all of what you are offering to do for her.  Perhaps you can have all your siblings together when you tell her this.  Not to be ganging up on her, but to maybe help see that this would be best for everyone that she is out of mom's house.  She may be more receptive to the idea, when she realizes she will have a separate living area, but still be close to you & DW, so that you can assist with the baby.

    Welcome back groom!  Congrats on the babies and good luck with your situation!
  • edited February 2013
    PPs have it covered, I just wanted to chime in to agree that it sounds like moving in with you is a terrific option for her.  You sound like a wonderful brother.  Congrats on the babies!
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  • You sound like a wonderful brother (and a great human being in general).   Your sister is very lucky to have you, your wife and other siblings. 

    From what I gather from this and your prior posts, your mom is just way too controlling and crazy.  And your dad unfortunately keeps to himself until the sh!t hits the fan.  It sounds like the best thing for her would be to move in with you and your wife.  It sounds like an ideal situation given the circumstances.  I wish more people had the opportunity like what you're proposing for your sister. 

    Also, if the boyfriend doesn't help out with expenses initially she can (and should) apply for child support for the child.  The father should support the child as well.  It's not just on her.  It takes two to make a baby. 
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  • I hope you don't mind me asking but what do yiy mean when you say he's a bad Guy? The reason I ask is because I have some information but idk if its appropriate. I had my lo when I was nineteen and bd is def a bad Guy he basically bailed on us. Things have turned out for the better though so I hope I can help. The first and most important thing to dobthough which you seem to he doing a wonderful job of is to be a positive support system. Pregnant ladies, let alone single ones, really need that.
  • Thanks, ladies! I appreciate everyones advice, welcomes, and congrats'! Hopefully I'll have an update for everyone soon!
  • ALSO is your sister aware of all of the parental/custody laws in your state?
  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwrish-remember-me-my-mom-is-still-nuts?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:a46299bd-cae5-4514-a6f2-518e82af2ba8Post:17275ce3-c819-4c4c-8583-dbd4bfafd3d4">Re:NWRish. Remember me? My mom is still nuts.</a>:
    [QUOTE]I hope you don't mind me asking but what do yiy mean when you say he's a bad Guy? The reason I ask is because I have some information but idk if its appropriate. I had my lo when I was nineteen and bd is def a bad Guy he basically bailed on us. Things have turned out for the better though so I hope I can help. The first and most important thing to dobthough which you seem to he doing a wonderful job of is to be a positive support system. Pregnant ladies, let alone single ones, really need that.
    Posted by ridedatbike[/QUOTE]

    <div>I don't think he's bad, I just think he's useless. They were "OMG dating since like middle school you guys!!" but if she had met him a few years later, I don't think she would have spoken to him for more than 5 minutes. I don't think he's matured much since then. I think he cares for my sister and will care for their child, but I do not believe he is ready to parent.</div>
  • ALWAYS the martyr! How's THAT working out for you, Groom?
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