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Zsa, I watched Orange is the New Black, can discuss if you want

Re: Zsa, I watched Orange is the New Black, can discuss if you want

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    I am open for discussion as well.
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    I really really really liked it.  My favorite stories are Red, Ms. Claudette (and what the what, is she really gone!?) and Sophia.

    Finally, the last scene?  I couldn't figure out why Piper actually started beating the crap out of Pennsatucky.  She's a coward, the last thing she'd do is actually jump someone and then keep hitting them once she could get away.  And I couldn't see her cracking either; she just tells herself whatever story she needs to believe to keep going.

    It hit me last night:  she's beating her in the face so she can get her new teeth.  That's why the shot showing the teeth being slapped out into the snow. 

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    Yeah, I didn't get the teeth thing until like a day later.

    I love the story of Sophia- I'm really curious to see if they show more of that especially because I so want her son to come around and be more accepting. I cried when she opened the Christmas card and he had signed his name.

    Red's story is meh to me. I want to find out what she actually did to get in prison though. I don't think that was clear enough.

    And I'm dying to find out if something happens to Pornstache. I have a feeling he'll come back and harass Daya though.
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    I got misty-eyed too at the Christmas card.  I like Sophia's story b/c I really love her wife.  I think they're being honest with her wife's emotions and needs.  When Sophia asked her to smuggle in the hormones and she finally lost it?  I believed that.

    I like Red b/c I like that she took control of something.  I loathed her rat-faced husband.

    What is up w/Mr. Healy?  He is so incredibly creepy and gross.  IDK how he's keeping his job at all.  When Piper went off on him in solitary?  Wow.

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    I waffle on Healy. I sort of feel sorry for him and the Russian wife thing. I have to wonder if he was married before and had some issue in that marriage that makes him so lesbian-phobic.

    Mr. Caputo gets me. Like I get skeeved out and need a shower if he's in a scene for too long.

    I want to see if somethign happens with Morello. Nikki made mention that her fiance hasn't been to see her in a long time but she's still planning her wedding regardless.

    I do have to say- one thing I love is the flashbacks to the prisoner's lives and how they got there. Like Ms. Claudette. They did horrible things that obviously deserve a punishment, but then again you almost feel their justification.
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    I think Healy has some sort of white man christian guilt re: the lesbians.  Like he's turned on, but he finds that disgusting.  And Caputo had the most heinous introduction of a character in a long time for me.  He out pornstaches Pornstache.

    I like the flashbacks too.

    Oo, I forgot about Nikki.  I like her character too.  Also, the track star. 

    I can't really say that there isn't anyone I don't enjoy watching.  I do think Piper and her ex-GF are the least interesting characters there.

    I think there's going to be more story to that new female guard too.

    Do you think Bennett slept with Dayna's mom?  I go back and forth on that.  I knew that note wasn't from Dayna, but her mother is just crap.  But she wants to be a good grandmother?  Okay.

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    I don't think she did. I think if she did sleep with Bennett, she'd rub it in her face. And she seems more interested in her cocaine dealing boyfriend's business than anything else.

    Oh- other cry moment. When the the woman who doesn't speak (can't remember her name) sang during the Christmas pageant.

    And I want to hear more about Crazy Eyes. She seems like she has an interesting background (white parents, seems well educated).
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    That's what I thought too re: sleeping with Bennett. 

    Crazy Eyes is fascinating.  I loved that scene, "I LIKE my hair this way".  I love that she quotes Shakespeare all the time, b/c she perfectly fulfills the role of the clown.  Everyone thinks she's crazy, but really she sees, knows and tells the truth.  Like when she tells Piper she's not a good person.  I really dislike Piper.  The whole, "Then I came back and became the nice blonde lady I was supposed to be". Come again?!  Only she has to keep borrowing money from her parents to become anything.

    I dislike Larry.  I can't pinpoint why, but he totally sells Piper out, then gets mad at her for being the good story he needs?  He's so weak and just malleable. 

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    Piper's naïveté bugs me. At some point she has to stop- like pleading with Pennsatuckey to leave her alone. Really? At the point shed been in prison long enough to know it wouldn't work. Larry needs to man up.
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    I was googling Sophia out of curiousity.  The actress portraying Sophia is a transgender woman.   Her twin brother played Marcus for them. 

    I liked the flashes we were getting of Pennsatucky.  I'm wondering what happened that the leap from, "I'm using this platform" to "I believe this platform" was.  I can't wait to see that.

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    I want to know what the smarmy guy who visits Pennsatuckey in prison is all about. He's another one like Caputo that I just want to punch.
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    Isn't he her attorney?  The one that set her all up with the anti-abortion people?

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    I think he's from a pro-life group- not necessarily a lawyer, but more like a PR person who is sort of using her. I thought he said that they had paid for a lawyer for her.
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    What/how I remember is he introduces himself as her attorney and she says, No, Random man's name is my attorney.

    He hands her a card and saying something about the Christian law firm of X, Y, and Z and when she asked who paid for him, he said my services have already been paid for.  She asked by who and he said her friends and opened the courthouse door showing all the protestors. 

    I remember this b/c there are attorneys is this town who put fish on their cards and introduce themselves as christian lawyers.  It bothers me, greatly.  So, I could be remembering it how I'm biased too.

    There has to be something hidden though.  I mean, she had 5 abortions and the pro-lifers like her b/c she took a gun to the clinic?  That's a white washed story if there ever was one.

     

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    VarunaTTVarunaTT member
    First Anniversary First Comment 5 Love Its First Answer
    edited August 2013
    I have to add that I've loved reading all of the shows criticism and critiques as well.  I tend to agree with the critiques that Piper's shallowness and white privileged outlook is the point of the show.  That these women, who seem to "fit" stereotypes, are real people with complicated nuances that Piper's stereotypes don't allow.  

    I also don't think the show continues to revolves around Piper the farther you get into it.  It starts to revolve (to me) around the prison as a whole and the lives contained in it; like when Piper is in SHU and this voice just starts talking.  We never find out who that is or if she's even real.  Some blogs I've read have critiqued it as just another "education" tool for white people; the thing I disagree with is that Piper is learning...at all.  She's still just manipulating things to make her come out on top and as unscathed as possible.  So far, the
    only thing I respect about her is that she calls Crazy Eyes, Susanne.
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    You are right about the lawyer. I had to think about it. One thing I love about this show is that I've read several responses by people who would be similar to Piper (upper class and white) is that their times in federal prison were by and large very similar. I thought to a certain extent Piper was an exaggeration but its interesting to read that she's not. And the people she encounters aren't either. Especially Taystee- one thing I read said that almost every prisoner they knew was a "Taystee". It was easier to be back in prison than out.
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    I didn't know it was based off of a memoir.  Piper is a real person.  Interesting.  The show creator says that she used Piper as the "Trojan Horse" to tell the stories she really wants to tell.  Some bloggers have taken exception to that; one of the really great critiques took exception and points out that schools don't teach how to dismantle racial politics and recognize intersectionality,  so TV is going to have to.  So, go ahead and hate the show, but let the show do it's job for those who don't know better.

    I loved Tasytee's character.  I thought she was very political and really played w/stereotypes (the fried chicken comment).  I also thought she was really smart, when she schooled Piper about the real purpose of WAC.  The conversations between her and Poussey about "white people politics" had me cackling.  I also like how she explained how she ended up back.  Especially after reading an update to "Nickel and Dimed" and Tasytee brings up how minimum wage doesn't pay for anything and all of the other difficulties she experienced just by being who she was.  "At least in prison they give you dinner".  It was hard to hear that, but I think it's an important statement.

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    The Taystee and Poussey scene where they acted like rich white ladies was hilarious- and sort of sadly on point. And I agree with you on the racial aspects. In a certain sort of way, I do feel a bit bad for Piper because when your in school and surrounded by people of your same socioeconomic status, where do you learn this? I'm not saying its right, it is what it is. And really, TV and outside activities (that can also be limiting) are where your going to address this for kids. Maybe in college you get exposure to this. But again, probably not.
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    Yes, loved the white lady scenes. I didn't even catch the teeth thing. But I think she just lost it and tried to kill the girl.

    Mostly I wanted to make sure that I wasn't crazy for finding NONE of the main characters all that likable. I almost quit watching at first because I was afraid that selfish, immature Piper was going to be glorified, but I don't think that happened at all. Miss Claudette and the track star were the only truly likable characters. I'm also glad that I wasn't the only one that didn't quite understand Red's crime. I'm thinking that maybe she ends up killing her husband. We haven't seem him visit, have we?
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    You're right, Zsa, I didn't think about that.  And she doesn't refer to him ever, either.

    I really don't think you're supposed to "like" any of them.  None of them are really good at being "good" people anyway.  But I like that they have stories that show how they got there.

    I keep reading a lot of debate between Piper cracking and people thinking it was for the teeth.  I just think Piper is a coward, so she would've run once she was able, rather than sitting down on her and just beating her.  Also, the shot of the teeth shooting out, seemed so out of place if it was just about the violence.  Then you add that they had just previously had the conversation about her wanting the teeth.  Now, IDK that I think Piper had this grand scheme in mind to lure Pennsatucky outside (why do they call her Pennsatucky, are they just making fun of her being poor and white?  Is this explained?  B/c her name is Tiffany Grogett or something like that) and do this.  But it worked. 

    I think we'll see her run and Pennsatucky won't sell her out.  B/c what happens if Piper gets time added?  She's the "nice blonde lady" with a good lawyer, that seems unrealistic.  But Mr. Healy is going to be able to get at her now, since he's somewhat of a witness.  Man, I hate that guy.  I love that all of the guards are also stereotypes, but we see their stories too (Pornstache).

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