Need Advice and a just a place to say something...very shook up

kristi-ji · June 2010

Hi ladies! I'm sorry for a long(er) post, in advance. I am very shook up and, as my wedding gets closer, this is the last thing I needed...

Long story short, I moved out to Co. 4 years ago to escape a very abusive relationship (and not the slap in the face, emotional abusive - broken ribs, burns, you name it.)

Since then, I've worked very hard to put my life back together, surrounding myself with good people who I love and trust, including my absolutely amazing FI.

I also have several very good "guy" friends. One of whom I've known for almost 3 years. I've babysat his daughter, worked with him - he's a part of our family and was coming to our wedding - very sweet, caring, kind, etc. Would have trusted him with my life.

2 days ago, when he hadn't come to work in 3 dyas, I called his mother to find out what was wrong.

Turns out, a few nights ago, he got drunk, crashed his car into a tree, and became enraged. He stumbled home (he and his girlfriend live a few doors down from me and FI-he's been talking a lot about their future together) and proceeded to "snap." He smashed her head into the oven and strangled her, nearly killing her. He's being charged with attempted murder and will probably spend the next 15-25 years in jail.

I want to slam him up against the wall and ask him what the hell he was doing. How he oculd do something like that to someone he loves? He has ruined his career, will never see his daughter again, and has hurt an innocent woman whom he claimed to have loved.

What's more, I never would have thought he was capable of this. Never. Like I said, I would have trusted him with my life. How could I not see this anger or rage in him? If he would have knocked on my door after the car crash, would he have done the same thing? I can't believe this is even the same person. I love my friend, but I hate the monster that he's seemingly become.

This is the 3rd time a man has hurt either me or someone I know and love. Do all men have the potential to just snap? And how could I have not seen this? I haven't slept in days. FI has stayed up with me both nights, helping me through all these terrible feelings and memories, but I have to ask...are all men capable of rage like this...or am I just getting "unlucky" and "stupid" with my selection of friends?

Thanks ladies.

SarahPLiz · June 2010

Wow! That is a lot to deal with. It is very hard when people we thought we knew are really not those people.

My first thought was that he was upset, got drunk and crashed, but that a brain injury from the crash made him snap on her. I am not a medical professional, however, so I don't know if that is a sound theory.

I have a friend whose uncle recently committed suicide after having 3 such incidents in his life. The details are not important at this time, but his friends and family still miss him, because he did have some positive influence in their lives at some point in time. It is very difficult to reconcile that, and I'm sorry you were put in that position. I'm very glad that your FI has been there for you, and will continue to be there. Presumably he is having the same difficulties as you are making sense out of it the whole situation.

J&K10910 · June 2010

Wow, well I'm sorry all of that happened to you, and to your friend's girlfriend, and I hope she recovers quickly.

Look at how many men (or people in general) don't "snap" ever. When pushed to the exteme I think most people have the capability to "snap" but I think for most people it is extemely unlikely. It sounds like your friend may have a drinking problem, which complicates matters sufficiently as well.

I encourage you (if you're not already) to see a therapist or counselor. The trauma of an abusive relationship is severe. I can't imagine what you must be going through now, and I think seeking professional help will be the best course of action.

[Deleted User] · June 2010

Wow, heavy stuff. First of all, sorry about the abusive relationship. I've been there, not staying with a guy for 4 years but being abused a man who thought he could treat women however he wanted, and I'm still paying the price.

As for your friend, you can't blame yourself for not seeing what was going to happen. Often times you don't know what goes on behind closed doors. This may not be the first time he acted that way but regardless it's unforgiveable.

To answer your question, no, not all guys are like that. I used to think the same thing. I grew up having personally experienced what men are capable of doing and it wasn't until I met DH that I snapped out of it. After all, if all men were like that, then he would be to, your FI would be. But it's not true. Your FI stayed up with you and been there for you, which means he loves and cares about you. Women are just as capable of being abusive and doing horrible things too, so you can't put all the blame on men.

shellydiane820 · June 2010

I don't want to say you're "unlucky" but it seems like your surrounding yourself with these types of men, whether unintentional or not.

I personally have never known a man who gets angry like this. I consider myself lucky in that respect.

However, if you're nervous about getting married now, I suggest going to counselling. Maybe talk to someone about your fears and take your fi with you, so you two can talk together.

MarriedInAFever · June 2010

Oh wow. I'm really sorry you've been through so much. This recent situation must really make you feel confused and vulnerable. If you're not already doing so, I would REALLY suggest to seek counseling. I think it's best to speak with a medical professional about all this so you can find peace with the situation. Again, really, truly sorry. I wish you luck.

sarahmk5 · June 2010

I'm so sorry for all you've been through. To answer your question, I think everyone does have the potential to "snap," but for most it is extremely unlikely. I agree with PPs - you should seek out counselling to work through your issues.

Blueyed228 · June 2010

Sorry this happened. I hope his wife is ok.

I dont think you need to worry about all men eventually doing something like this.

If you are this upset and scared about it, maybe you could talk to someone about it.

Labrnr · June 2010

That's really sad. The same thing happened to a guy I know. He wasn't a close friend anymore,s o it really had no affect on my personal life or feelings like your situation.

Although, he too snapped after a drunken/drug night and smashed his Fiance's head into the cement. They were engaged and due to get married July 10th. Needless to say, he lost his home, his job and is facing jail time.

He was a really sweet guy who happened to have alcohol and drug addictions that ruined his life.
The really sad thing is she still loves him and wanted to work things out.

I'm not sure what happen but he broke up with her a few weeks back. I believe his family is getting him help to fight his addictions, unfortunately a little to late.

TheSaltyPeanut · June 2010

Oh no

Your thread gave me chills. I'm so sorry that you had to go through this. Please don't think that it's "you" and that "you" attract these types of people. People suck. They make mistakes and they hurt the people they love. Some mistakes are worth forgiving and others, as you know, are absolutely not worthy of any sympathy and/or forgiveness.

When you ask, "are all men capable of rage like this" - I have to honestly say that everyone is capable of rage. It's a human emotion. The majority of people know how to suppress their anger and not get anywhere near the level you had just described.

You are not stupid nor is your friend selection (from what I have gathered). You stated yourself that you have several good friends. Unfortunately too many people persoanally know someone who is abusive. The issue lies with THAT person, NOT you.

I'm so sorry you are going through this... it must be devestating taking into consideration your terrible past

hugs.

AllAboutTheBenjamin · June 2010

Oh wow - this is an absolutely insane story.

First off, and I truly believe this: No. Not every man has the potential to just snap. Certainly we are all capable of the occasional outburst that could result in say, a broken plate, a hole in the wall, whatever. But I don't think all of us have it in us to do serious harm to someone, or kill someone.

You couldn't see it because oftentimes abusers are masters at concealing their rage from the outside world. It's very possible that there were problems inside the home that no one knew about, that his girlfriend was too ashamed to speak of, and that his little daughter didn't understand.

I don't think all men are capable of snapping like this but I also don't believe you are unlucky, and definitely you are not stupid with your selection of friends. How could you have known?

Last summer, my aunt called me in tears. One of her best girlfriends, who had moved to Arizona with her husband and two little boys was gone. Her husband - who to everyone else seemed like a normal family man, shot her and both her little boys - and then killed himself. An entire family, gone. Just like that. It was later discovered after this that what appeared to be the perfect family and perfect marriage was not that at all. He had been laid off from his job and was struggling to make a living for his family. It was obviously causing great stress for him and he took the cowardly way out - he left a note that disgusted everyone, which explained that if he couldn't take care of his family, no one else would. The worst part was a section of the letter that gave instructions on how to care for the family dogs. He murdered his whole family but wanted to make sure his dogs would be ok.

My point in sharing that story is just to let you know that while something may look fine to the outside world - you may never know the whole story. Something obviously was wrong. What happened with your friends has nothing to do with you or your choice in friends. This guy had a lot of other people fooled, too.

I'm very sorry that this happened and that you're all going through this - and I'll certainly keep you and your friend in my prayers. But don't beat yourself up over this. There was nothing you could have done - you didn't know.

ETA - Just wanted to echo what others have said about talking to a therapist or a counselor. I think your fears are understandable but you are a strong woman for having left an abusive relationship. There is no shame in reaching out for help to cope with horribly tragic situations - and you need to understand that none of this has anything to do with how you choose your friends.

PharmacyBride · June 2010

Wow that is horrible!!! There is just one thing I want everyone in his life to consider. Was there serious brain damage from the accident? I am not talking about excuses, but if there is a part of the brain that tells you no.. if that part doesn't work, it may not have been his fault.

If however, he was just pissed.. then I am so sorry to hear that he destroyed his life in one fell swoop and ruined the trust of his daughter, gf, and you in the process.

To answer your question.. everyone can snap.. male.. female.. young.. old... everyone. It is about what it takes to snap and what they did during the snap. The death of your child led you to freak out and break things.. vs. car accident and almost killing someone. Not everyone is capable of the latter, it is pretty extreme and rare (thank god)!!

mandapanda78 · June 2010

I echo the sentiments of others who have recommended a therapist to get through this. It is entirely possible this situation has triggered an episode of PTSD for you, or a similar type of occurrence. I am so glad for you that you have a FI who sounds like he is really supporting you through this.

jasmineh7777 · June 2010

I'm so sorry you're going through this.
No, not all men are like this.

I really think that seeing a counselor could help you work through these feelings. Maybe this incident has triggered your previous trauma?
It sounds like your FI is being very supportive. I hope this incident doesn't negatively affect your relationship with him.
Again, a counselor can help you identify if there are any patterns of behavior that are putting you in high-risk situations. But it may well be what you said, your friend just snapped and no one could have predicted it. Obviously, his girlfriend and family didn't anticipate this either.

BecW2be · June 2010

Woah. That's a lot to take in and deal with. I'm so sorry. I don't think you are stupid in your selection of friends, but markers in your personality may attract this type of man, which is unlucky. These people are attracted to sweet, caring and seemingly gentle women. I'm guessing you are not outspoken, and you genuinely care deeply for the people around you. Unfortunately, power-hungry and potentially violent men see you as someone who will take their shiit, and it's easier for them to "snap". It's not your fault, though.

I don't think all men have the potential to snap, but many do have a violent streak. It's not something you can always see in a person, so you need to stop kicking yourself. I think outwardly confident women who are outspoken and brash just aren't appealing to men who tend to be violent. They look for easy prey. The level of desperation they may feel, combined with alcohol, will trigger outbursts.

My EX snapped the night I kicked him out. He always had a temper, but he never directed it to me physically because I always made it very clear he'd have to kill me or not ever sleep again if he ever hurt me. He threw me down and choked me the night it all ended, and I told him then he needed to either leave or prepare to kill me or die trying. I think it was the shock talking.

Thankfully, he left.

I would never even date someone with a temper stronger than yelling at a sporting event on TV. How DH reacts to everyday life and stressors is a very big reason I fell in love with him and married him.

I think there's nothing you can do right now other than just process what's happened and know that none of this is your fault. I do think if you really start to notice a person's behavior as you get to know them, you'll recognize common triggers and tempers that can be red flags that prevent you from making friends with potentially violent people. Even then, some of them are so good at hiding it, you won't see it until you get to know them. But know that it's NOT YOUR FAULT.

kd.joseph · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_need-advice-just-place-say-somethingvery-shook-up?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:447e66bd-e6ea-412f-8762-72d7b4c5908bPost:7737aab1-5648-444b-8e71-bfb1f727424d">Re: Need Advice and a just a place to say something...very shook up</a>:
[QUOTE]Wow, well I'm sorry all of that happened to you, and to your friend's girlfriend, and I hope she recovers quickly. Look at how many men (or people in general) don't "snap" ever. When pushed to the exteme I think most people have the capability to "snap" but I think for most people it is extemely unlikely. It sounds like your friend may have a drinking problem, which complicates matters sufficiently as well. I encourage you (if you're not already) to see a therapist or counselor. The trauma of an abusive relationship is severe. I can't imagine what you must be going through now, and I think seeking professional help will be the best course of action.
Posted by J&K10910[/QUOTE]

This.
You took the words out of my mouth.

jasmineh7777 · June 2010

Oh my gosh Bec.

I'm so sorry you and your girls went through that.
I have a lot of family in the military. They're big guys. Care to give me your ex's address?

betrothed123 · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_need-advice-just-place-say-somethingvery-shook-up?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:447e66bd-e6ea-412f-8762-72d7b4c5908bPost:7389f983-0c71-410c-84eb-4f80488b7f22">Re: Need Advice and a just a place to say something...very shook up</a>:
[QUOTE]I don't want to say you're "unlucky" but it seems like your surrounding yourself with these types of men, whether unintentional or not. I personally have never known a man who gets angry like this. I consider myself lucky in that respect. However, if you're nervous about getting married now, I suggest going to counselling. Maybe talk to someone about your fears and take your fi with you, so you two can talk together.
Posted by shellydiane820[/QUOTE]

Reread this but pretend I said it.

BecW2be · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_need-advice-just-place-say-somethingvery-shook-up?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:447e66bd-e6ea-412f-8762-72d7b4c5908bPost:f3f31aee-8907-4a86-bc8a-8ca1b53a8e61">Re: Need Advice and a just a place to say something...very shook up</a>:
[QUOTE]Oh my gosh Bec. :( I'm so sorry you and your girls went through that. I have a lot of family in the military. They're big guys. Care to give me your ex's address?
Posted by jasmineh7777[/QUOTE]

Oh, the girls were not part of that. They weren't at home when it all went down. He'd be in the ground 3 years past if they'd seen or experienced any of that. It was the first and last time he ever snapped, and I think he realized in an instant it was a mistake. I truly would have either killed him or died trying that night if he hadn't left.

He showed up at the foot of my bed three nights later at 2am. Waking up to see him standing there was 10x scarier than when he got physical. He just "wanted to talk", but I have no doubt he could have gotten violent again if that had escalated. I told him he had 12 seconds to be out of my house and in his car before I called the police. I changed the locks the next day.

Karma has since taken care of him. But thanks for the offer! :)

J&K10910 · June 2010

Holy mother, there is nothing that would scare me more than waking up to see someone standing at the foot of my bed. Especially someone that had assaulted me in the past.

Except maybe looking up from brushing my teeth or washing my face to see them standing behind me in the mirror.

jasmineh7777 · June 2010

I'm so glad they weren't there. If you happen to change your mind, the offter remains open.

OP- A support group might be good for you too. So many women have gone through this. Sometimes it helps a lot to know you're not alone.

BecW2be · June 2010

It was truly the most terrifying moment of my life. I had a butcher knife under my pillow, and my hand was around the handle before I even realized it. I didn't know what he wanted, which was the scariest part. But I would have stabbed that fucker in a heartbeat if I needed to. He was pissed when I changed the locks, and I don't even think I was legally in my right to do so, but I did not give a shiit. No way was he going to do that again, for any reason.

sarahmk5 · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_need-advice-just-place-say-somethingvery-shook-up?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:447e66bd-e6ea-412f-8762-72d7b4c5908bPost:7c31da91-c788-4406-b228-b9e653bfe318">Re: Need Advice and a just a place to say something...very shook up</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Need Advice and a just a place to say something...very shook up : Oh, the girls were not part of that. They weren't at home when it all went down. He'd be in the ground 3 years past if they'd seen or experienced any of that. It was the first and last time he ever snapped, and I think he realized in an instant it was a mistake. I truly would have either killed him or died trying that night if he hadn't left. <strong>He showed up at the foot of my bed three nights later at 2am</strong>. Waking up to see him standing there was 10x scarier than when he got physical. He just "wanted to talk", but I have no doubt he could have gotten violent again if that had escalated. I told him he had 12 seconds to be out of my house and in his car before I called the police. I changed the locks the next day. Karma has since taken care of him. But thanks for the offer! :)
Posted by BecW2be[/QUOTE]

<div>Bec, that is so scary. I'm so sorry you had to go through that.</div>

[Deleted User] · June 2010

Holy crap, Bec, that would have scared the sh!t out of me. I woke up to DH standing next to me once in the middle of the night. he was looking for the aspirin on my nightstand but it scared me to death and I punched him in the butt. He knows better now.

kristi-ji · June 2010

thanks ladies! I've seen a therapist in the past, and it might be time to find another. It's just a lot to deal with. And I can't seem to make sense of it all. FI has been amazing helping me through everything. I'd be lost sometimes without him.

What's more, I want to HATE my friend. I want to DESPISE him for what he's done. But for some reason, I just feel hurt and numb.

I think that's the biggest issue. Why can't I get mad about this? Why can't I still get mad about what happened to me? About what's happened to other women I know and speak with?

Again, time to call up some people and start working through some things.

Thanks ladies

BecW2be · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_need-advice-just-place-say-somethingvery-shook-up?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:447e66bd-e6ea-412f-8762-72d7b4c5908bPost:da6fd101-1a10-49b1-97d6-f1f7dc21fb2d">Re: Need Advice and a just a place to say something...very shook up</a>:
[QUOTE]Holy crap, Bec, that would have scared the sh!t out of me. I woke up to DH standing next to me once in the middle of the night. he was looking for the aspirin on my nightstand but it scared me to death and I<strong> punched him in the butt</strong>. He knows better now.
Posted by Seshat411[/QUOTE]

That made me LOL!

I didn't sleep for WEEKS after that night. I was constantly up, checking the locks, turning the outside lights on and off, checking closets. I never want to feel that vulnerable again as long as I live. I still do it to an extent in my house now, but when DH stays over I sleep like a damn rock. He says I sleep like I'm dead. I know it's because I feel like I don't have to protect myself or the girls with him in the house, which is a nice feeling.

SheDiva4 · June 2010

I'm very sorry for what your are going through. I do not think all men are capable of things like this. I agree with Bec, you probably have traits that attract men like this. I know because I was the same way.

My ex too had a temper, but it wasn't till after the wedding when I was in a new state and away from my family and friends he decided to unleash his rage. Luckily I'm proficient with an handgun and own several. I got out of the marriage before he hurt me or I killed him. However for a few years after that the friends I made were either in abusive relationships or they were the abusers.

Through a lot of hard work and assistance I was able to determine what it was about me that attracted people like this. I've had to make some changes and had to end some friendships but it was for my benefit.

Counseling is a great option, and it will hopefully give you some peace.

missy68 · June 2010

Bec, if I would have known you then, I could've given you the name of a GOOD family lawyer there, and my "moving and security" guys. Uncle's sis is the lawyer (and gave me all my advice) and she's the one who sent the team down.

OP, I'm sorry you're dealing with this. I echo the sentiments of many to seek out professional help with a therapist or counselor. If you have a church, you could start there.

betrothed123 · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_need-advice-just-place-say-somethingvery-shook-up?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:447e66bd-e6ea-412f-8762-72d7b4c5908bPost:da6fd101-1a10-49b1-97d6-f1f7dc21fb2d">Re: Need Advice and a just a place to say something...very shook up</a>:
[QUOTE]Holy crap, Bec, that would have scared the sh!t out of me. I woke up to DH standing next to me once in the middle of the night. he was looking for the aspirin on my nightstand but it scared me to death and I punched him in the butt. He knows better now.
Posted by Seshat411[/QUOTE]
I've done this to my H before.

kd.joseph · June 2010

Bec- So sorry you had to go through that. My mother was a legal liason for 20 yrs with Project Woman, so she's heard a lot. My first husband was abusive and she always said when you get your belly full you'll leave. And I did, and she was there waiting.
I tell people when I met my DH that I "fixed my picker" and I have never seen him mad in 6 1/2 years. He's a gentle soul.

ETA: the only time DH has woke me up like that, he thought he was having a heart attack and wanted to go to the hospital. That will scare you.

[Deleted User] · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_need-advice-just-place-say-somethingvery-shook-up?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:447e66bd-e6ea-412f-8762-72d7b4c5908bPost:c588987d-3f92-4a94-8b88-c6723965ae83">Re: Need Advice and a just a place to say something...very shook up</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Need Advice and a just a place to say something...very shook up : That made me LOL! I didn't sleep for WEEKS after that night. I was constantly up, checking the locks, turning the outside lights on and off, checking closets. I never want to feel that vulnerable again as long as I live. I still do it to an extent in my house now, but when DH stays over I sleep like a damn rock. He says I sleep like I'm dead. I know it's because I feel like I don't have to protect myself or the girls with him in the house, which is a nice feeling.
Posted by BecW2be[/QUOTE]

He's just lucky he wasn't facing me, otherwise it would have been a more painful spot.

And yeah, I know that feeling of vulnerability and it totally blows. I can't sleep right without H next to me. And I always check the locks like 3 times before turning out the lights. I admit, I'm a chicken.

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