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don't understand something

L*Lopez7784L*Lopez7784
First Comment
in Military Brides
i've only been on this board a couple days, but i've noticed a lot of women referring to having a ceremony after you get married by the JOP strictly a vowel renewal? DH and I decided to have a ceremony because we believe that the license is just in the eyes of the law, not God. That's why we're having it done so to me, that's not a vowel renewal. I dunno, I see a few brides wondering what they should do and maybe that's a way of looking at it that most people don't. I dunno, just sayin'
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Re: don't understand something

  • iluvmytxrgriluvmytxrgr member
    First Anniversary 5 Love Its Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    edited December 2011
    There is a difference in doing a JOP and getting your license.  When you JOP, you have a wedding ceremony. You exchange vows with the Justice of the Peace or a judge presiding over it.   Those people usually didn't have very many people with them, if any.  They usually want to do a traditional "wedding" or they want to be married in a church as well.  That is when they plan a vow renewal.
    When you get your marriage license, you aren't married.  You still have to have some type of officiant marry you.  You still have to exchange "I do's."  The officiant signs your certificate and you have to take it back to the court house to be filed.  Only after you file the signed license are you legally married. 
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  • L*Lopez7784L*Lopez7784
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    i know all this. that has nothing to do with the point i'm trying to make.
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  • iluvmytxrgriluvmytxrgr member
    First Anniversary 5 Love Its Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    edited December 2011

    Can you rephrase then because I don't understand what you are asking?  If you are married by a JOP, then you are married.  It doesn't matter if you did it in the church or not.  When you do it again, in the church or not, you are restating your vows.  That is why it is called a vow renewal.  You don't have two weddings. 

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  • GracieLou FreebushGracieLou Freebush member
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_military-brides_dont-understand-something?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:13Discussion:80951711-fa24-4857-8a48-85adf8968660Post:da4d2050-dd56-47a4-ad02-95c4b214b1f6">Re: don't understand something</a>:
    [QUOTE]i know all this. that has nothing to do with the point i'm trying to make.
    Posted by L*Lopez7784[/QUOTE]

    Were you asking a question (if so, Tx answered perfectly) or were you making a point?  It appears you're asking a quesiton in your OP but then you say "I dunno.  Just sayin'." as if you're making a passive-aggressive point.  Please clarify.
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  • LemonLover33LemonLover33
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    So, does God not see you get married in front of a JOP? Does he turn away at that exact moment while you say your vows and the JOP pronounces you MARRIED? 

    IMHO, if you are this religious about getting married in a church/by a priest (pastor) then you shouldn't have had a JOP WEDDING in the first place. 
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  • Killer CupcakeKiller Cupcake
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    It's a vow renewal  (not vowel, btw) after a JOP wedding because you are already married. Whether you do it in a church or in a courthouse, you have already stated your vows to your spouse and married them. 

    If you "re-do" it in a church, you are no less married then. All you're doing is reaffirming your vows in front of God and whoever else it needs to be done in front of. You are already married. 

    wed   [wed]  Show IPA verb, wed·ded or wed, wed·ding.
    –verb (used with object)
    1.
    to marry (another person) in a formal ceremony.
    2.
    to unite (a couple) in marriage or wedlock; marry.
    3.
    to bind by close or lasting ties; attach firmly: She wedded herself to the cause of the poor.
    4.
    to blend together or unite inseparably: a novel that weds style and content perfectly.
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  • ARMYmarriedNAVYARMYmarriedNAVY
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    What is there to NOT understand. If you are married by a judge or a priest a SECOND marriage ceremony is a VOW (those magic words you said to make you man and wife) RENEWAL (you say the ALL OVER AGAIN).

    It isn't your wedding because YOU ALREADY DID THAT.. remember when the judge said "I now pronounce you man and wife"? or maybe it set in when your H started collecting BAH w/ Dependants... How about after you wore a RING on your Left Ring Finger... did it all click then?
     
    It really is a simple concept.
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  • marisah83marisah83 member
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    A church wedding or any other ceremony after any legal form of marriage is just a vow renewal.  Some people consider the "big" ceremony their wedding day, but legally, the first time you said your vows was your true marriage.  You can't get another marriage license for your church wedding because you are already married.  The only one that legally counts is the JOP one, and your wedding date will legally be that first one.  The church wedding is strictly symbolic.
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  • BiMWaTBiMWaT member
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    Lopez, I understand what you're saying.  Of course when you JOP you are married, but the church ceremony may be the more important aspect for you.  And Lemon, in some religions you are NOT considered married until you are married in the church, so in this case the ceremony is in fact a wedding - just a religious one, not a legal one.

    I have found that people in "real life" are very supportive of both my second ceremony and calling it a wedding.  Many people on these boards are not, because for some reason they are caught up in the technicalities.  If you want to JOP and then have another wedding ceremony, go for it.  Sometimes the circumstances dictate untraditional ways of doing things (and no, that does not mean I had to JOP, it just means that it was the best option for my H and I.)
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  • L*Lopez7784L*Lopez7784
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    finally! someone gets it. and there's that bitchiness coming out again. well technically i've had a ring on my finger for a year and a half since we got engaged, but i don't think that automatically makes us married.

    did i seriously write vowel? lol i need sleep. my point was i don't understand why you all feel it's strictly a vow renewal. And no, the way I see it if i got to a courthouse we're just married on paper. we weren't married by a priest so through our religious views we want to do it proper. it has nothing to do with getting more bah or not considering each other married once we get that marriage license.

    i guess my entire point is i see people asking about having a wedding ceremony after getting married by a JOP and they get their heads bitten off for just considering it. That judgement is what I don't understand. If I wanna have 50 weddings I'll have 50 weddings. dammit.
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  • iluvmytxrgriluvmytxrgr member
    First Anniversary 5 Love Its Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    edited December 2011

    There is nothing wrong with having a religious ceremony after going to the JOP.  Several of us have done it.  That isn't your wedding, though.  You already got married.  Are you saying that this person's marriage is less legit that that person's because one was a JOP and one was a church wedding?  That's a bunch of BS.  I think the bitchiness is comming out becuase you brought it upon your self.  Did you honestly think a question like that would bring out rainbows and unicorns?

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  • BiMWaTBiMWaT member
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    Having a religious wedding after a JOP does not make anyone's strictly legal wedding any less legit, but in some religious beliefs you need to be married in a religious ceremony.  There are 2 possible parts to a wedding: religious and legal.  Some people don't care about the religious part, and get legitimately married legally.  There are probably people out there that don't care about the legal part and only get married in a religious ceremony.  Many people obviously do both.  Just because they are usually done in one ceremony doesn't mean they can't be done at 2 different times.  In some countries, you HAVE to do it separately because religious wedding ceremonies are not legal.  Just because in this country they are doesn't mean that you can't do it separately.  And while religious ceremonies are legal, strictly legal ceremonies obviously aren't religious.  No one is saying a person who got married in a civil ceremony doesn't have a legit marriage.
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  • mommakx3mommakx3 member
    First Anniversary First Comment
    edited December 2011

    Do people know you had a JOP wedding? I

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  • iluvmytxrgriluvmytxrgr member
    First Anniversary 5 Love Its Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    edited December 2011
    In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_military-brides_dont-understand-something?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special Topic Wedding BoardsForum:13Discussion:80951711-fa24-4857-8a48-85adf8968660Post:e21dd161-4323-4dd1-9f34-ed8d94661e10">Re: don't understand something</a>:
    [QUOTE]Do people know you had a JOP wedding? I
    Posted by mommakx3[/QUOTE]

    This is what I was wondering.
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  • Luke&Sam625Luke&Sam625
    First Comment
    edited December 2011

    I'm totally sick of this conversation being had. I have to agree with the poster that said you brought this "bitchiness" on yourself, it had been a while since everyone got their feathers ruffled about this topic, and you had to ask a question.. or make a statement.. I'm still not clear about which one it was. I think that what most girls disagree with is not being honest with your loved ones & guests on what they are attending. Alot of girls on these boards had a JOP & a ceremony, as well as one or the other. The point is.. You already said your vows weather or not you feel that they were recognized by God or not. Plus alot of Priests or Pastors or whatever your particular religion calls for will not perform the ceremony as a wedding, because you've already said vows in front of God and on paper. To stay on the safe side, make sure everyone including the person performing the ceremony knows that you had a JOP beforehand. The 50 weddings comment, to me, sounded selfish and immature, also.. You can't get married 50 times, but you can renew your vows 50 times.. but then again those are VR not weddings. Thnk things through before you post them on here.. I can't help but to feel like you were playing the devils advocate with this whole post and personally I think that you knew it was going to cause a ruckus and that sort of thing is frowned upon in my book.

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  • EbattaniEbattani
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    **rolls eyes** 

    It's your day, if you want it to be called a wedding, call it a wedding :)  Like someone said earlier, there is no grand rule book. My only suggestion would be to not keep it a secret that you had a JOP beforehand. Congrats!
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  • misscarolbmisscarolb
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    I've read this a lot too (especially on the military boards), have a million ceremonies and call them what you want. I think people get upset when you do the courthouse thing to make it legal and then hide it. 

    I have tons of friends who JOP'd it and then had what they considered a 'real' wedding, the difference is whether or not people know you're already married. I hate when people get married for that extra BAH/health benefits and then lie about being married. There's nothing wrong with wanting the ceremony with all your family and friends. Call it what you will. Just, please, don't lie about already being married.
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  • CylaCyla member
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    Wow, you people get in such a hissy fit over what the NAME OF THE CEREMONY. This is amazing to read...


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  • L*Lopez7784L*Lopez7784
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    what in my post made anyone think i hid it from my family? that's ridiculous and another misconception all of you had about it. i wasn't trying to just ruffle feathers. i saw someone ask about their wedding being a waste or not and people jumped down her throat claiming "it's not a wedding it's a vow renewal!" that was the only point i was trying to make. if I choose to call it a wedding then I'm gonna call it a wedding. don't yell at me that i'm wrong for it. and no i don't proclaim anyone else who went to the jop as having an illegitimate marriage. if that's what you're fine with that's what you're fine with but for ME it's not.
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  • AriaGooseAriaGoose member
    First Comment
    edited December 2011
    Lopez,  I fully understand what you are trying to say.  In my religion, I can get legally "married" by a JOP, but my church would consider us singles until we actually had a church wedding.  In that case, REGARDLESS of what the law says, I would not be married until my actual wedding day, in the church.  Legally, it would be a vow renewal, but in the eyes of the church (and myself) it would be my actual wedding day because my vows don't count and aren't sacramental until I say them to my husband in front of the church, witnessed by the officiant, and then consumate my marriage. 

    However, in other religions or beliefs, this is not the case.  Professing one's vows in public (in front of a JOP for instance) would be considered legitamate as a wedding.  In that case, the second "wedding" would truly, in all senses, be a vow renewal. 

    Basically, I think everyone should be sensitive to each other.  If one's particular faith determines that a JOP is not a legitimate vow exchange, then doing the "legal paperwork" does not constitute marriage and in the eyes of that couple, they are not married yet, and thus must plan for and have a true wedding later.  If one does not hold these beliefs, then they are legitimately and accurately married - without any prejudice or condescension from those who have a "church" wedding.

    I know many folks who have done the JOP just so they can be stationed together or whatnot but have not considered themselves married until they are married in church.  In my opinion, this should not be frowned upon, but lovinginly supported, just as we should all support those who choose to be married entirely and only by a JOP or wish to renew their vows in a church. 
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