NFP and PCOS?

lv2011 · February 2012

I've been doing some reading about NFP, and I love the concept of it and that it is inline with Catholic teaching, though I'm still a bit sketchy on the practice (cervical mucous measuring just sounds gross). I know that's probably very juvenile of me, but I've never been a big anatomy fan.

In any case, I was diagnosed with pcos about 7 years ago. I've always hated being on birth control and I get worried about the possible side-effects (high blood pressure, cancer risk, etc.), but I worry about the hormonal back-lash if I come off it. I cannot find any research or mention of how NFP helps pcos, though I know the claim has been made on this board. Those things that can control regarding pcos, I do control (weight (am actually under), exercise, diet). But I can't figure out the hormone thing. Can anybody clarify it for me?

BCV513 · February 2012

I have PCOS and I do take birth control. I ended up in the emergency room more than once with multiple cysts. One time one of the cysts had actually wrapped itself around my ovary and I needed surgery. After that, I went on the Pill and I haven't had a problem since. Sometimes I get smaller cysts but they have always gone away on their own. I know technically the Church frowns on the Pill, but I honestly don't care.

afrenchprincess · February 2012

I have had my problems with PCOS too. Once I lost 15 pounds which you don't seem have to a problem with it helped a lot. But when you are having horrible pain from cysts and bleeding heavily trying to managae and chart your ovulation is very far from your mind! LOL!
The pill helped so much in the beginning before I lost some weight. You have to do what helps you and your body. The problem with birth control from what I have read and understand is not in using it for medical purposes but using it with the intention of preventing pregnancy and not being open to children.

professorscience · February 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_nfp-and-pcos?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:393c48c7-4bb3-40b1-8a48-fb01519e2565Post:d92cf301-3c06-433e-b10d-f0b6a6823618">Re: NFP and PCOS?</a>:
[QUOTE]I have had my problems with PCOS too. Once I lost 15 pounds which you don't seem have to a problem with it helped a lot. But when you are having horrible pain from cysts and bleeding heavily trying to managae and chart your ovulation is very far from your mind! LOL! The pill helped so much in the beginning before I lost some weight. You have to do what helps you and your body. The problem with birth control from what I have read and understand is not in using it for medical purposes but using it with the intention of preventing pregnancy and not being open to children.
Posted by afrenchprincess[/QUOTE]

This is correct, as I understand it. The church doesn't frown upon the pill for treatment of disease, as long as the "disease" is not pregnancy. It's just like you wouldn't be condemned for having a hysterectomy to remove cancerous cells.

That said, there are non-ABC treatments of PCOS. Many doctors prescribe ABC because it is an easy fix, but it just masks your symptoms, rather than treating them. It's worth it to investigate other methods of treatment because you're going to have to go off ABC eventually if you want to have kids, and your problems are just going to flare up again when that happens.

agapecarrie · February 2012

The pill is the worst thing for PCOS.

I have PCOS, and have treated it through Metformin, because PCOS is connected to insulin resistence. It's done miracles for me.

See a napro doctor. www.omsoul.com

lv2011 · February 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_nfp-and-pcos?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:393c48c7-4bb3-40b1-8a48-fb01519e2565Post:a2f11218-2b7d-4d55-b820-d3fc3806926e">Re: NFP and PCOS?</a>:
[QUOTE]I have PCOS and I do take birth control. I ended up in the emergency room more than once with multiple cysts. One time one of the cysts had actually wrapped itself around my ovary and I needed surgery. After that, I went on the Pill and I haven't had a problem since. Sometimes I get smaller cysts but they have always gone away on their own. I know technically the Church frowns on the Pill, but I honestly don't care.
Posted by BCV513[/QUOTE]

This was exactly how I got diagnosed and was initially put on birth control. It was so big the nurse put her two fists together and said "It's this big". I almost lost the ovary. But even with b/c, I've had cysts needing surgical removal. Seeing as the b/c doesn't really appear to be fixing the problem, and I'm always in favor of green/ eco/ natural forms of anything, nfp sounds great. But I'm worried about the success of that, too.

My fiance and I get married in 8 months. Ideally, I'd like to be on nfp and have it al figured out before then. Hoping it can be done {:(

professorscience · February 2012

You should definitely start learning NFP before you get married so you don't have to abstain while you're learning after you marry! I hope you can work this out!

lv2011 · February 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_nfp-and-pcos?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:393c48c7-4bb3-40b1-8a48-fb01519e2565Post:96376e77-2948-448e-af20-0e93aba3225c">Re: NFP and PCOS?</a>:
[QUOTE]The pill is the worst thing for PCOS. I have PCOS, and have treated it through Metformin, because PCOS is connected to insulin resistence. It's done miracles for me. See a napro doctor. <a href="http://www.omsoul.com" rel="nofollow">www.omsoul.com</a>
Posted by agapecarrie[/QUOTE]

I'm not on the pill, but mirena. An iud was the way I had to go because of cervical issues. I'd love to see a napro doctor, but the nearest is an hour and half away...and in a Michigan winter, that can be suicidal driving. I also don't have health insurance, so cost is a factor too- that's another reason I like the idea of nfp :)

I know symptomatically pcos is different for everyone. But I'm not seeing or reading how nfp will help me, and that makes me sad.

Riss91 · February 2012

I think it might be worth it to make at least one trip to an NFP doctor. Unfortunately, many/most doctors are not educated in methods like NFP and it really would benefit you to have all of your options laid out.

Sorry you're suffering with this. I hope your condition improves.

Calypso1977 · February 2012

I'm not on the pill, but mirena. An iud was the way I had to go because of cervical issues

you are aware that IUDs cause abortions, in that they do not allow a fertilized egg to implant, correct?

id try getting an appointment with teh napro doc on maybe a friday. you could make the trek and spend the night or even make a weekend out of it if the doctor is located in a fun area. here in MA, many travel an hour+ just to get to work every day. once they figure out what you have going on, you may not have to go all the time after hte first few visits.

good luck!

agapecarrie · February 2012

People travel from states away to go to the NFP docs here....because its so worth it.

lv2011 · February 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_nfp-and-pcos?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:393c48c7-4bb3-40b1-8a48-fb01519e2565Post:dec1b637-5fc7-4ef8-a429-bc3f8dcae78e">Re: NFP and PCOS?</a>:
[QUOTE]you are aware that IUDs cause abortions, in that they do not allow a fertilized egg to implant, correct? id try getting an appointment with teh napro doc on maybe a friday. you could make the trek and spend the night or even make a weekend out of it if the doctor is located in a fun area.
Posted by Calypso1977[/QUOTE]

Wow. Thanks for making me feel like a baby-murdering piece of sh#t.

That literally made me cry. Do you have any idea how insensitive that is to say to someone battling between the body saying "no children, and we'll screw up any semblance of normal reproduction" and the heart screaming for want of future children?

I don't have health insurance. I can't afford a regular doctor here, let alone a specialized one an hour and a half away. And you folks are talking about driving to different states and hotel stays, etc ?!?

Just, wow. Thanks for the heaps of understanding, Catholics.

Riss91 · February 2012

lv - we're trying to help you. I apologize that it might come off as harsh. The ladies here want what is best for you - physically and spiritually.

Many women are not aware that certain medical practices are abortificant in nature.

There may be a way to reduce the cost of visiting an NFP doctor. Call them up and speak to them. It's worth it to be sure you are doing what is best for your body and soul.

Calypso1977 · February 2012

omg, that was NOT meant to offend. it was meant to help you as i was not sure if you had an understanding of how an IUD actually works - many people do not.

i guess im not sure what it is you are looking for here. you asked some questions, weve tried to give advice. you must have some level of medical care as i assume (althought i dont know for sure) that an IUD has to be checked out periodically.

if you genuinely dont have the money or insurance, someone may be willing to consult with you for free. but you wont know unless you call.

agapecarrie · February 2012

It would have been way more uncharitable to not have informed you that the items you are using are abortive, and to encourage you to stay on such things that are so harmful to you.

Honestly, with all the info I've seen, I have NO understanding for people to continue to take artificial hormones at all. Its dangerous, its poison.

lv2011 · February 2012

Artificial hormones are why I want to get off the b/c. I was never on any form, pill or iud, for preventative pregnancy purposes ever. So, no. I didn't know of the "abortive nature" of the iud--only that it was hormonally keeping the PCOS in check and holding open my extremely scarred and damaged cervix, as allowing it to scar over and close completely as it had before would cause far more damaging health problems.

I approve of NFP. I want to be on NFP. But I want to be sure that it will work for my circumstances before I go into debt and shell out a lot of money I don't have. My post is an inquiry to any with PCOS that use NFP on how NFP specifically helps control and or fix their problems with PCOS. That was the point. That was always the whole point. Not "is it the right thing to do". I know it is. Not "should I consult". I know I should. Will and how does it work? That is the question. And the only ones I'd like answered.

Thanks, Riss, for attempting to apologize on her behalf. Calypso, whether you meant to offend or not, you really need to watch what and how you say things.

agapecarrie · February 2012

Creighton model NFP charting observes symptoms of the cycle. A teacher and doctor can help interpret these symptoms (and give you more signs to look for) to diagnose issues. Then, you can get hormones tested at certain times of the cycle (Which you will know because you are charting). Possibly ultrasound as well. You can get blood sugar tests (fasting and reaction to sugar).

When its determined that it is blood sugar related, you'll likely go on metformin. If you have cervical scarring, you might get a cryo (uncomfortable but not painful procedure) that will help rid of excess non-fertile confusing mucous.

These are the steps I went through.

afrenchprincess · February 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_nfp-and-pcos?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:393c48c7-4bb3-40b1-8a48-fb01519e2565Post:20c73802-ac41-45d5-98d5-8ef66f112d13">Re: NFP and PCOS?</a>:
[QUOTE]Artificial hormones are why I want to get off the b/c. I was never on any form, pill or iud, for preventative pregnancy purposes ever. So, no. I didn't know of the "abortive nature" of the iud--only that it was hormonally keeping the PCOS in check and holding open my extremely scarred and damaged cervix, as allowing it to scar over and close completely as it had before would cause far more damaging health problems. I approve of NFP. I want to be on NFP. But I want to be sure that it will work for my circumstances before I go into debt and shell out a lot of money I don't have. My post is an inquiry to any with PCOS that use NFP on how NFP specifically helps control and or fix their problems with PCOS. That was the point. That was always the whole point. Not "is it the right thing to do". I know it is. Not "should I consult". I know I should. Will and how does it work? That is the question. And the only ones I'd like answered. Thanks, Riss, for attempting to apologize on her behalf. Calypso, whether you meant to offend or not, you really need to watch what and how you say things.
Posted by lv2011[/QUOTE]
I understand where you are coming from. You feel like you are being attacked when you are just trying to get answers. From my experience and what I have read and what my medical doctor has said to me. NFP-The Creighton Method is helpful in helping in achieveing pregnancy. It does this with charting and cervical checking. But mucus reading alone can result in unplanned pregnancy I feel if you were like me and had highly irregular periods. You may need to do (sympto-thermal) as a way of cross checking. Try the Couple to Couple League. They have different types of NFP services that may work for you. But as far as NFP helping with the actual condition of PCOS and regulating your periods or etc. I haven't found anything that has said that I will or can do that.
BC, weightloss and Metformin has worked for me in the past. Best of Luck to you! PCOS is hard and when you have wacky periods and painful menstration it makes it so hard to get things that work for your body.

agapecarrie · February 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_nfp-and-pcos?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:393c48c7-4bb3-40b1-8a48-fb01519e2565Post:d9156138-4b9d-4133-8dc2-dde11aa27d2c">Re: NFP and PCOS?</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: NFP and PCOS? : I understand where you are coming from. You feel like you are being attacked when you are just trying to get answers. From my experience and what I have read and what my medical doctor has said to me. NFP-The Creighton Method is helpful in helping in achieveing pregnancy . It does this with charting and cervical checking. But mucus reading alone can result in unplanned pregnancy I feel if you were like me and had highly irregular periods. You may need to do (sympto-thermal) as a way of cross checking. Try the Couple to Couple League. They have different types of NFP services that may work for you. But as far as NFP helping with the actual condition of PCOS and regulating your periods or etc. I haven't found anything that has said that I will or can do that. BC, weightloss and Metformin has worked for me in the past. Best of Luck to you! PCOS is hard and when you have wacky periods and painful menstration it makes it so hard to get things that work for your body.
Posted by afrenchprincess[/QUOTE]

This is absolutely incorrect. Creighton method is as effective in avoiding pregnancy as well. ALL NFP methods are for irregular periods. If you had regular cycles, then all you would need is to count days.

Creighton method is for those that have fertility issues as it is attached to napro technology.

ElisabethJoanne · February 2012

If you go here, you can read the "party line" from the nation's leading professional association for women's health. It defines pregancy as beginning at implantation, and is up-front about birth control pills both preventing ovulation and, if ovulation occurs, preventing implantation because the lining of the uterus is not how it would be normally, because of the pills.

It says the same thing about contraceptive implants involving hormones.

There's information on PCOS, and NFP, and almost everything else health-related we discuss here.

Obviously, there are good reasons to disagree with ACOG, but what they say is respected medical practice in the US. I (and my pro-life OB-GYN mother) find it best to argue against ACOG than "lots of doctors."
http://www.acog.org/Resources_And_Publications/Patient_Education_FAQs_List

ElisabethJoanne · February 2012

BTW, just basic cholesterol and insulin tests can cost hundreds of dollars without insurance.

professorscience · February 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_nfp-and-pcos?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:393c48c7-4bb3-40b1-8a48-fb01519e2565Post:20c73802-ac41-45d5-98d5-8ef66f112d13">Re: NFP and PCOS?</a>:
[QUOTE]Artificial hormones are why I want to get off the b/c. I was never on any form, pill or iud, for preventative pregnancy purposes ever. So, no. I didn't know of the "abortive nature" of the iud--only that it was hormonally keeping the PCOS in check and holding open my extremely scarred and damaged cervix, as allowing it to scar over and close completely as it had before would cause far more damaging health problems. I approve of NFP. I want to be on NFP. But I want to be sure that it will work for my circumstances before I go into debt and shell out a lot of money I don't have. My post is an inquiry to any with PCOS that use NFP on how NFP specifically helps control and or fix their problems with PCOS. That was the point. That was always the whole point. Not "is it the right thing to do". I know it is. Not "should I consult". I know I should. Will and how does it work? That is the question. And the only ones I'd like answered. Thanks, Riss, for attempting to apologize on her behalf. Calypso, whether you meant to offend or not, you really need to watch what and how you say things.
Posted by lv2011[/QUOTE]

I think agape did say that she has successfully treated PCOS without the use of ABC.

And I mean this in the nicest way possible, but if you are going to post on an open Internet forum, you need a thicker skin. Not only can people say whatever they want to you, but whether or not their intention is to inflict emotional damage, text on a screen is just that. Calypso was simply stating a fact, and you read into it that she was criticizing you.

Now, as for the affordability or the time committment, I think if you know in your heart that this is something you must do, you will find a way to make it work. Riss already suggested that there are ways to work out finances with doctors, but you will never know until you consult with one.

As for learning Creighton, I'm fairly certain you can skype with the instructors. You could also tell your current doc, "I don't want hormonal bc anymore. Find a way to fix this without it."

lv2011 · February 2012

Thanks, all, for the helpful info. I'm actually really excited to get this iud out of me so I can start learning and charting. And I'm THRILLED because I did some digging around on the diocesan website and found a list of teachers--and there is 1 in my area! Yay! I'm emailing her tomorrow to see what specific method she teaches and how much she costs. I'm sure she'd have info as well on physicians in the area that are NFP knowledgable.

My fiance and I are both definitely wanting kids and getting the PCOS under control is the necessary step to doing so. Even without our faith, we both agree that going non-hormone method is the only real option. Hopefully, it all goes well.

professorscience · February 2012

That's great news!

newlyseliski · February 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_nfp-and-pcos?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:393c48c7-4bb3-40b1-8a48-fb01519e2565Post:96376e77-2948-448e-af20-0e93aba3225c">Re: NFP and PCOS?</a>:
[QUOTE]The pill is the worst thing for PCOS. I have PCOS, and have treated it through Metformin, because PCOS is connected to insulin resistence. It's done miracles for me. See a napro doctor. <a href="http://www.omsoul.com" rel="nofollow">www.omsoul.com</a>
Posted by agapecarrie[/QUOTE]

This for me, too! I've had PCOS for over 10 years... when I was first diagnosed... I'd go for 6-9 months without having a period. Definitely not healthy! My first doctor only did a few blood tests and just put me on birth control. I was not comfortable with this, initially for moral reasons, but it wasn't sinful for me to use it to treat my condition. Eventually, my mom and I researched on our own to find alternative treatments because I was experiencing some not-so-pleasant side effects including significant weight gain. We switched doctors and my next doctor did far more comprehensive hormonal blood tests and discovered that my free testosterone was slightly elevated... an potential symptom of PCOS (a providential side effect being that some of these blood tests also led to an eventual diagnosis of papillary thyroid cancer and subsequent thyroidectomy when I was 17).

The short story is... my new doctor prescribed me with metformin and it has worked very well for me in balancing my hormone levels and regularizing my cycle. I've finally gotten a doctor familiar with NFP and she's been amazing at further treating my PCOS and related conditions beyond metformin with dietary changes and nutritional supplements.

mz07 · February 2012

I also recommend Marquette method. It's probably the easiest to use, because of the monitor, but more expensive because of theonitor and test strips you have to buy. I have pcos and we haven't had any issues with this method. Also,y doc put me on metformin rather than bc because he said bc treats the symptoms only, not the underlying problem. Metformin is standard treatment for pcos, so even if your doc is fine with bc, they should have heard of using metformin.

sigmaurse · February 2012

NFP actually cost less then anything else because it's free while you are monitoring yourself! All you have to pay for are the charts and classes to learn how to do it, then it's free! It's actually pretty easy and not bad. When you go to the bathroom you notice what your secretions are like anyway, its not like you have to do anything weird with them. Observe them and take your temp if you are doing the sympto-thermal method thru the Couple to Couple league like we are doing.

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