Wedding Timeline

theartistformerlyknownas · October 2014

Butterflyz419 said:

I didn't say that an afternoon wedding is boring. I've been to them, and am going to another next week. They're fine. Sometimes they feel a little ant-climatic to me personally once they were over but I've enjoyed the ones I've been to. I've also been to weddings with gaps, also fine. This is not the world ending, friendship ending, oh my God how can you be so rude I don't want to ever socialize with you again, a despicable cultural norm on the level of genital mutilation type of situation. And to treat it like it is, is hyperventilated nonsense and I felt a desire to point it out today since I'm not particularly busy.

Another poster sure as hell did.

I put a hell of a lot of thought into the plans for my ceremony and reception because I wanted MY GUESTS to have a wonderful time for the entire time I asked them to spend with me. Call me crazy, but if I didn't give two squirts about my guests, why would I have bothered inviting them? It doesn't personally affect "my big day" if someone doesn't like the food, but that doesn't mean I won't choose things I think people will like. I'm sure lots of my friends would have sucked it up if I'd had a gap, or boring entertainers, or crappy food, or made them sit outside in the cold. But damned if I wanted to risk any of them thinking I didn't care about their time.

Butterflyz419 · October 2014

novella1186 said:

Butterflyz419 said:

I didn't say that an afternoon wedding is boring. I've been to them, and am going to another next week. They're fine. Sometimes they feel a little ant-climatic to me personally once they were over but I've enjoyed the ones I've been to. I've also been to weddings with gaps, also fine. This is not the world ending, friendship ending, oh my God how can you be so rude I don't want to ever socialize with you again, a despicable cultural norm on the level of genital mutilation type of situation. And to treat it like it is, is hyperventilated nonsense and I felt a desire to point it out today since I'm not particularly busy.

Nobody here is treating them that way. I was the only one that brought that stuff up, and I didn't mean to compare those things, which I've already explained plenty of times. So applying my odd choice of example to EVERYONE in this thread is nonsense.

Actually if you think this is a problem so big you should throw out your deposit of probably a couple thousand dollars if not more to "fix" it (given all of the suggestions of, just find a new venue) then you must think it's an outrageously serious problem along the lines that or you have so much money that you can't conceive that a couple thousand dollars is a big deal for someone to throw away.

This is a not "change your venue" level problem. This is not I'm inviting 200 people but my venue has a max of 100 people. This is a, well it's not ideal, so if you can do something to make the gap more comfortable for your guests, you should, otherwise, it's water under the bridge as long as everybody knows what time everything is, so it's not a surprise, and provide some suggestions even if you can't pay for them, and expect that some people may skip your ceremony or choose not to attend, which of course can happen no matter how well hosted your wedding is. That's it.

beethery · October 2014

@butterflyz419 all we are saying is that people should either host the time in between, or start the party right after the ceremony.

Now, if a person goes into their planning and put deposits down on shit and plans to have an unhosted gap, they're going to get educated and told to figure something out. That's really all there is to it.

southernbelle0915 · October 2014

JFC - what a cluster.

This is an etiquette board and gaps are against etiquette. So there it is!

If someone says "well, I don't give a shit about etiquette, so I'm going to do what I want" then go forth... do as you please. But take into consideration people's responses here. That they feel disrespected and poorly hosted when there's a gap. And do not for a moment think that you are an all powerful mind reader and "know what every single one of (your) guests are thinking". You don't.

No one is going to call the police or hunt you down and curse you because of your choice. But now you know what's good etiquette and what is not. And you know what some of your guests will be thinking. Take it or fucking leave it.

And FWIW, when I'm invited to a wedding with a gap, I often skip the ceremony and only attend the reception. Sorrynotsorry. If they can't execute simple planning, I'm not going to go out of my way either...

abl13 · October 2014

Attending just the reception to try to prove a point is so fucking bitchy. If I found out someone I know did that I would throw your ass out.

Butterflyz419 · October 2014

I think some people here forget that gossiping about and badmouthing others behind their back, as well as repaying an etiquette breach with one of their own is actually a sign of poor breeding, not to mention a lack of class and dignity.

When you tout these etiquette rules as LAW but then go on to say that you personally repay breeches of them with some of your own, it tells me that these rules don't matter to you as much as the feeling of superiority does.

southernbelle0915 · October 2014

abl13 said:

Attending just the reception to try to prove a point is so fucking bitchy. If I found out someone I know did that I would throw your ass out.

It's not "to prove a point". It's because I am not going to drive to a ceremony, waste time for multiple hours doing nothing and then drive to the reception. It's simply a disrespectful waste of my time.

Also, I'd love to see a bride try to kick out a wedding guest because she heard through the grapevine that said guest didn't attend her ceremony. That would make for an awesome bridezilla video/article. Kind of like the bride who made headlines for her "thank you" note to the wedding guest who gave a gift basket (CLICKY), or the bride who asked her friend "where's my money" and the girl sent her a penny in the mail (CLICKY).

ETF links

southernbelle0915 · October 2014

Butterflyz419 said:

I think some people here forget that gossiping about and badmouthing others behind their back, as well as repaying an etiquette breach with one of their own is actually a sign of poor breeding, not to mention a lack of class and dignity.

When you tout these etiquette rules as LAW but then go on to say that you personally repay breeches of them with some of your own, it tells me that these rules don't matter to you as much as the feeling of superiority does.

Who exactly are you referring to?

Butterflyz419 · October 2014

Anyone who says that they talk badly about a bride who commits a breech of etiquette such as a gap behind her back and anyone who intentionally skips a ceremony, only to attend a reception intended to thank them for attending a ceremony they couldn't be bothered to attend just to prove a point about how valuable every minute of their time is. It's petty and eye-roll inducing coming from people who think that etiquette = morality.

southernbelle0915 · October 2014

Butterflyz419 said:

Anyone who says that they talk badly about a bride who commits a breech of etiquette such as a gap behind her back and anyone who intentionally skips a ceremony, only to attend a reception intended to thank them for attending a ceremony they couldn't be bothered to attend just to prove a point about how valuable every minute of their time is. It's petty and eye-roll inducing coming from people who think that etiquette = morality.

So you're saying I'm the result of poor breeding. And anyone who says a "gap is rude" is also the result of poor breeding. Well done.

Butterflyz419 said:

I think some people here forget that gossiping about and badmouthing others behind their back, as well as repaying an etiquette breach with one of their own is actually a sign of poor breeding, not to mention a lack of class and dignity.

When you tout these etiquette rules as LAW but then go on to say that you personally repay breeches of them with some of your own, it tells me that these rules don't matter to you as much as the feeling of superiority does.

theartistformerlyknownas · October 2014

Butterflyz419 said:

I think some people here forget that gossiping about and badmouthing others behind their back, as well as repaying an etiquette breach with one of their own is actually a sign of poor breeding, not to mention a lack of class and dignity.

When you tout these etiquette rules as LAW but then go on to say that you personally repay breeches of them with some of your own, it tells me that these rules don't matter to you as much as the feeling of superiority does.

Well, I'm actually not livestock. So there's that.

novella1186 · October 2014

Butterflyz419 said:

Anyone who says that they talk badly about a bride who commits a breech of etiquette such as a gap behind her back and anyone who intentionally skips a ceremony, only to attend a reception intended to thank them for attending a ceremony they couldn't be bothered to attend just to prove a point about how valuable every minute of their time is. It's petty and eye-roll inducing coming from people who think that etiquette = morality.

Wow. No one ever said that etiquette and morality are the same thing. No one ever even hinted at that at all. You're getting way too carried away. Someone asked for the etiquette on something and they were told the proper etiquette for the thing they asked about. You need to stop insulting people and being nasty.

Butterflyz419 · October 2014

No, you can think it's rude all you want. You are free to tell people seeking advice that you believe that's it's rude. But once done is done, and done is definitely done by the time you get the invitation, gossip and pettiness is a sign of poor breeding. If you only want to follow these etiquette rules as far as it makes you feel good about yourself, then you've missed the point.

southernbelle0915 · October 2014

Butterflyz419 said:

Anyone who says that they talk badly about a bride who commits a breech of etiquette such as a gap behind her back and anyone who intentionally skips a ceremony, only to attend a reception intended to thank them for attending a ceremony they couldn't be bothered to attend just to prove a point about how valuable every minute of their time is. It's petty and eye-roll inducing coming from people who think that etiquette = morality.

I think you missed the part where I said I don't skip the ceremony "to prove a point". I skip it because the bride and groom created a situation that was impractical for me.

You said yourself an invitation isn't a subpoena. As a guest, I'm not breaking etiquette by attending a reception to which I was invited.

To any of you having gaps...look out in the crowd during your ceremony. Then look out in the crowd at the reception. I'll bet you money you'll see more people at your reception.

lyndausvi · October 2014

abl13 said:

Attending just the reception to try to prove a point is so fucking bitchy. If I found out someone I know did that I would throw your ass out.

So are there any good reasons for one to skip the ceremony when there is a gap involved?

Butterflyz419 · October 2014

Personally, if you'd be available for free food/entertainment at the same time, then IMO, no, there wouldn't be a good reason for skipping the ceremony. If you have a conflict that would have caused you to miss a no-gap reception, but because of the gap you are able to be there, then that's fine.

Kauris · October 2014

@Butterflyz419, isn't it a little ironic that you would call out @novella1186 so hard about her comment and then say that people who would choose the reception over the ceremony are just a result of poor breeding?

lyndausvi · October 2014

Butterflyz419 said:

Personally, if you'd be available for free food/entertainment at the same time, then IMO, no, there wouldn't be a good reason for skipping the ceremony. If you have a conflict that would have caused you to miss a no-gap reception, but because of the gap you are able to be there, then that's fine.

I work on Saturday days. I do not get paid time off. I'm willing to take unpaid time off for a ceremony and reception back-to-back. I'm not willing to take a whole day off to go to an hour long ceremony and then sit around doing nothing for a few hours. I could just work through the ceremony and gap, then attend the reception which starts after I get off work.

According to you that would be rude. To me it's money in my pocket.

Butterflyz419 · October 2014

I see nothing ironic at all. I'm saying that some of you only care about the etiquette rules selectively. It is poor form to intentionally skip the ceremony and only show up for the free food, but you feel justified because someone else made a poor decision. I'm saying gossip and badmouthing is poor manners and anyone who cares about the etiquette rules that much shouldn't do those things and it shouldn't be, oh I attended this wedding with a gap and we were ALL talking about how AWFUL it is.

But there's nothing ironic for me. I don't slavishly quote Post and Martin like it's the Bible and then ignore them as soon as I've been inconvenienced by someone else. Etiquette is a useful tool, nothing more. I don't take a Gaps are RUDE. PERIOD. attitude. Nor do I take Skipping the Ceremony is RUDE. PERIOD. attitude. There can be good reasons for both and I think in these small things we can certainly take a gentler, more understanding approach toward our friends and family (since I'm assuming you're not attending the wedding of strangers), assuming their good will as much as possible.

novella1186 · October 2014

Butterflyz419 said:

Anyone who says that they talk badly about a bride who commits a breech of etiquette such as a gap behind her back and anyone who intentionally skips a ceremony, only to attend a reception intended to thank them for attending a ceremony they couldn't be bothered to attend just to prove a point about how valuable every minute of their time is. It's petty and eye-roll inducing coming from people who think that etiquette = morality.

Butterflyz419 said:

I see nothing ironic at all. I'm saying that some of you only care about the etiquette rules selectively. It is poor form to intentionally skip the ceremony and only show up for the free food, but you feel justified because someone else made a poor decision. I'm saying gossip and badmouthing is poor manners and anyone who cares about the etiquette rules that much shouldn't do those things and it shouldn't be, oh I attended this wedding with a gap and we were ALL talking about how AWFUL it is.
But there's nothing ironic for me. I don't slavishly quote Post and Martin like it's the Bible and then ignore them as soon as I've been inconvenienced by someone else. Etiquette is a useful tool, nothing more. I don't take a Gaps are RUDE. PERIOD. attitude. Nor do I take Skipping the Ceremony is RUDE. PERIOD. attitude. There can be good reasons for both and I think in these small things we can certainly take a gentler, more understanding approach toward our friends and family (since I'm assuming you're not attending the wedding of strangers), assuming their good will as much as possible.

K then.

Butterflyz419 · October 2014

I mean seriously, it's not as if I speak from hypotheticals, I've experienced gaps before. I went to a wedding a couple years ago, for one of my FI's former roommates to whom he wasn't even particularly close, that was a tiered reception with like a 6 hour gap---we went to the ceremony, they had guests hang around afterward for some pictures, then they went out with close family for dinner. Later that evening there was an informal shindig, with light snacks for everyone else. My FI and I went out for dinner and hung out and then went back. No big deal. You want to know what I remember most about that wedding? Not how OMG RUDE it was, but that I got to see an MIT professor sing Britney Spears karaoke at that later reception--worth it and I don't even have a personal connection with that person nor have I even seen them since that wedding. It's just not a big deal.

lyndausvi · October 2014

Since I've attend a lot of weddings with no gaps, often during the day, with full blown open bars and dancing, I will NEVER understand the desire to have gap in order to have a night wedding.

I just do not understand the concept? I do not understand asking family and friends to wait around for 2-6 hours because of your desire to have a night wedding?

I'm happy to say it's only happened a few times. I still rolled my eyes. I can guarantee those wedding were no more special because the wedding happened at night. They were fun weddings, but they would have been just as fun regardless of the time of day. People make a fun wedding, not the time of day.

southernbelle0915 · October 2014

Butterflyz419 said:

I mean seriously, it's not as if I speak from hypotheticals, I've experienced gaps before. I went to a wedding a couple years ago, for one of my FI's former roommates to whom he wasn't even particularly close, that was a tiered reception with like a 6 hour gap---we went to the ceremony, they had guests hang around afterward for some pictures, then they went out with close family for dinner. Later that evening there was an informal shindig, with light snacks for everyone else. My FI and I went out for dinner and hung out and then went back. No big deal. You want to know what I remember most about that wedding? Not how OMG RUDE it was, but that I got to see an MIT professor sing Britney Spears karaoke at that later reception--worth it and I don't even have a personal connection with that person nor have I even seen them since that wedding. It's just not a big deal.

Just because you had a certain opinion about this particular wedding or even weddings in general doesn't make it the New Etiquette Standard.

You're quick to dismiss reputable etiquette sources, like Miss Manners, but you seem to think your opinion should be held in higher esteem? This is for you:

novella1186 · October 2014

southernbelle0915 said:

Butterflyz419 said:

I mean seriously, it's not as if I speak from hypotheticals, I've experienced gaps before. I went to a wedding a couple years ago, for one of my FI's former roommates to whom he wasn't even particularly close, that was a tiered reception with like a 6 hour gap---we went to the ceremony, they had guests hang around afterward for some pictures, then they went out with close family for dinner. Later that evening there was an informal shindig, with light snacks for everyone else. My FI and I went out for dinner and hung out and then went back. No big deal. You want to know what I remember most about that wedding? Not how OMG RUDE it was, but that I got to see an MIT professor sing Britney Spears karaoke at that later reception--worth it and I don't even have a personal connection with that person nor have I even seen them since that wedding. It's just not a big deal.

Just because you had a certain opinion about this particular wedding or even weddings in general doesn't make it the New Etiquette Standard.

You're quick to dismiss reputable etiquette sources, like Miss Manners, but you seem to think your opinion should be held in higher esteem? This is for you:

This just made me literally laugh out loud

Butterflyz419 · October 2014

Not higher esteem. Equally valid an opinion and point of view as they're just a person with a point of view, nothing more. I'm familiar with the "rules". Some are useful, some are not. Some are useful in some cases, but not in others. I think it's more useful to have empathy and understanding for others rather than clutching my pearls and copy of "Etiquette".

I could have responded to that invite with indignation and tsk tsking. I could have marched on to TK and proclaimed the RUDE for all to scoff at. I could have refused to go on principle that my Saturday was worth more. Instead I was happy for the invite. Instead because I understood that they had reasons for why they did things that way even if that wasn't literally the only way, I got to witness a beautiful ceremony and see a really awesome sight at the reception. Just because you know all the rules doesn't actually make you a decent human being. Understanding and empathy in these little things, and they are very little things, rank higher to me than any of those rules. You don't have to agree, but I don't have to keep it to myself either, even on the Etiquette board.

tcnoble · October 2014

Butterflyz419 said:

Not higher esteem. Equally valid an opinion and point of view as they're just a person with a point of view, nothing more. I'm familiar with the "rules". Some are useful, some are not. Some are useful in some cases, but not in others. I think it's more useful to have empathy and understanding for others rather than clutching my pearls and copy of "Etiquette". I could have responded to that invite with indignation and tsk tsking. I could have marched on to TK and proclaimed the RUDE for all to scoff at. I could have refused to go on principle that my Saturday was worth more. Instead I was happy for the invite. Instead because I understood that they had reasons for why they did things that way even if that wasn't literally the only way, I got to witness a beautiful ceremony and see a really awesome sight at the reception. Just because you know all the rules doesn't actually make you a decent human being. Understanding and empathy in these little things, and they are very little things, rank higher to me than any of those rules. You don't have to agree, but I don't have to keep it to myself either, even on the Etiquette board.

Why do the bride and groom get a pass on empathy and understanding by inconveniencing their guests? Does that not make them products of "bad breeding"? They had choices, made based on whatever, just like the guests have a choice about whether or not to attend, based on whatever. It goes both ways.

levioosa · October 2014

JFC, the last time I saw someone this dense was when I tried to explain (in vain) to someone that it was impossible to drive from Hawaii from California.

Gaps are rude. How is that so hard to grasp?

Butterflyz419 · October 2014

tcnoble said:

Butterflyz419 said:

Not higher esteem. Equally valid an opinion and point of view as they're just a person with a point of view, nothing more. I'm familiar with the "rules". Some are useful, some are not. Some are useful in some cases, but not in others. I think it's more useful to have empathy and understanding for others rather than clutching my pearls and copy of "Etiquette". I could have responded to that invite with indignation and tsk tsking. I could have marched on to TK and proclaimed the RUDE for all to scoff at. I could have refused to go on principle that my Saturday was worth more. Instead I was happy for the invite. Instead because I understood that they had reasons for why they did things that way even if that wasn't literally the only way, I got to witness a beautiful ceremony and see a really awesome sight at the reception. Just because you know all the rules doesn't actually make you a decent human being. Understanding and empathy in these little things, and they are very little things, rank higher to me than any of those rules. You don't have to agree, but I don't have to keep it to myself either, even on the Etiquette board.

Why do the bride and groom get a pass on empathy and understanding by inconveniencing their guests? Does that not make them products of "bad breeding"? They had choices, made based on whatever, just like the guests have a choice about whether or not to attend, based on whatever. It goes both ways.

They don't get a pass, but I think it's ridiculous to assume, in most cases, that they didn't consider their guests at all when they made the decision. Perhaps, like another poster on this thread mentioned, the venue that would have afforded them with no gap, would have had questionable food. Their solution was to move their wedding to a Friday, which as I pointed out is a tremendous inconvenience for some people (like my coworker who's been complaining about the 4:30 wedding she had to go to tonight). Would you rather no gap and crappy food or have a gap to get to a venue with good food? Or instead of a gap have to drive an hour from the ceremony site to get to a venue with good food? Sometimes these are the options.

I simply don't assume ill will on the part of the couple at all. They are likely balancing the expectations of a number of people who are in their ear about what should be done along with a budget. I started off on this thread by offering suggestions to the OP on how to deal with the gap; I'm not unmindful of the fact that some people are annoyed by them and I said that a couple with a gap needs to accept that people may skip their ceremony. But I also know that people are annoyed by all sorts of things, and pleasing 150 people or however many people you have at the wedding (most of whom do not spend time on TK and have absolutely zero clue on the technicalities of wedding etiquette) is impossible even if you follow every rule down to the letter. My view, brides, do the best you can, consider all your options fairly and be honest with what your guests options will be if there is a gap or if you're violating any other etiquette rule. Don't surprise people with anything that could cause discomfort so they have the information needed to make a decision regarding their attendance. And guests, be understanding and empathetic and assume the best in other people. If you love them enough to go to their wedding, this really shouldn't be a stretch.

beethery · October 2014

MairePoppy · October 2014

Knottie32752756 said:

Thank you for your responses, let me clarify. The ceremony would start at 2 and end at 3. My one want for this wedding was to get married in a church so it is not really an option to move it to the venue. Also in talking with other venues in the area moving our venue besides the lost deposit would constitute us needing to spend upwards of $10,000 above budget. I suppose I was looking for justification for this as I agree there doesn't seem to be a great answer.

In my area, Catholic churches insist that Sat ceremonies be over before 3 to accommodate Sat PM Mass. Many receptions venues have two allotted times for receptions. 12 to 5 and 6 to 11, give or take an hour on those times. I'm assuming that you're dealing with that situation.

You could move your wedding ceremony to 11 a.m, with the reception immediately following. Keep the same venue so you won't lose your deposit. Problem solved.

To the person who said you can't drink, dance, and party in the afternoon: BS. I have attended many Catholic weddings in the afternoon and the guests took full advantage of open bar and the dance floor.

edit- spelling

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