Wedding Woes

You're not wrong, but you also need to let this ride for a minute.

Dear Prudence,

My boyfriend and I just made the very exciting decision to purchase our first home together. We are thrilled, with one caveat. His younger brother has been a real estate agent in the state we are purchasing in for less than a year. After talking at length about it, we decided to go with a realtor we found who has been selling houses for over 30 years, lives in the neighborhood we are looking at, and has glowing reviews. We were expecting the conversation with his brother to be difficult and tried to approach it with sensitivity, but I don’t think either of us anticipated the level of blowout we are dealing with. Not only is his brother furious, but so are my boyfriend’s parents. His brother is accusing us of “deceit and betrayal” and says he has “no room for two fake people in his life.” He thinks that we purposely misled him about our timeline for purchasing a home when in reality we made a decision three days prior to attempting to talk to him. I know that his feelings are hurt and he feels like we don’t believe in him, which I feel terrible about. We have tried to reiterate that we think he is a great agent, but since we are first-time home buyers, we think it’s best to go with someone with more experience, as well as avoid mixing family and business. Both my boyfriend and I would do anything to support our loved ones, but this is a huge financial commitment, and we agree that it’s too big of a deal to make our decision based on his feelings. Ultimately, the other agent is a better fit. I feel like he and his parents aren’t looking at the situation from our perspective at all. We are hurt by their reaction—his parents didn’t so much as say congratulations—and have no idea how to proceed with his brother who says he doesn’t want us in his life and refuses to sit down, hear us out, or even let us apologize.

— Not in Escrow

Re: You're not wrong, but you also need to let this ride for a minute.

  • LW is absolutely correct.  It's a shame that they're getting ridiculed for NOT mixing business w/ pleasure.

    I think going no contact for a while is best AND the important thing is that the BF MUST MUST MUST be the voice of contact that this was a JOINT decision because I guarandamntee you that the LW will take the majority of the criticism.
  • downtondivadowntondiva member
    First Anniversary First Comment 5 Love Its Name Dropper
    edited March 2022
    You are not wrong for choosing to go with a more experienced agent. You are also not wrong for choosing not to do business with family - it often doesn't end well.

    I agree that going no contact for a while is a good idea. Let this blow over and don't give yourselves or your boyfriend's family any opportunities to add fuel to the fire or say anything you'll regret. And yes, boyfriend absolutely needs to make clear that this was a joint decision, and that you didn't override him wanting to work with his brother or anything like that.
    image
  • LW, y'all made the correct decision for all of the reasons you explained.  However, it doesn't sound like BF can explain it in a way that they will understand any time soon.  Continuously pressing them to see it from your end of things will just lead them to keep their backs up.  

    Just prepare for the house hunting and buying process with your partner.  When you close on your home and move in, invite them to dinner.  



    FWIW, I understand why the brother is hurt.  Going through real estate licensing is no joke and it does take a lot of work.  You invest a lot of money up front in hopes it pays off later and to have family not want your assistance is disheartening.  Also, as a new agent you typically are set up with an established broker to mentor your first sales.  So if brother isn't some flake or otherwise untrustworthy, then there could have been compromise...like asking brother if there was a broker from his office he could have partnered with that knew the neighborhood where BF and LW wanted to live.  We worked with my mom to buy and sell houses when we moved 8 years ago and it honestly made the process easier because she knew us so well and what we wanted.  She also took us to any house we wanted to see. 
  • Were BF's family always ridiculous? 

    I think it's time to step back and let boyfriend be the only one in contact with them for a bit, but also think about the relationship altogether. If they're willing to cut ties over this, it's their loss. 

    I wouldn't work with this brother either. Suppose they had gone with brother and wound up making a decision that he didn't like or didn't benefit him. He likely would have pulled the same crap. 
  • I’m with @mrsconn23; they can make whatever decision they want but I can see why the brother is hurt. Blowing up isn’t cool but really unless there’s something else going on brother could have done the job. 

    Theyre not wrong but also nothing they say at this point is going to help, so let everyone cool off for a bit. 
  • @mrsconn23 I agree with you but I also think it is a loaded thing to mix business and pleasure especially if the brother may not have had the experience and it's a seller's market now.    These are often single digit in a lifetime purchases.  

    Also, what if they went with the brother.  Is a guy starting out going to reduce his commission for the brother and the LW?   A lot about this rubs me the wrong way.
  • mrsconn23mrsconn23 member
    First Anniversary First Answer 5 Love Its First Comment
    edited March 2022
    banana468 said:
    @mrsconn23 I agree with you but I also think it is a loaded thing to mix business and pleasure especially if the brother may not have had the experience and it's a seller's market now.    These are often single digit in a lifetime purchases.  

    Also, what if they went with the brother.  Is a guy starting out going to reduce his commission for the brother and the LW?   A lot about this rubs me the wrong way.
    IDK if he'd even be able to.  I didn't ask (would have never thought to) my mom to not take her full commission, and I think I remember her telling me it was broker policy not to cut commission deals with friends/family.  I think that really only happens once you're an independent broker.  
  • I think a good thing would have been to say to the brother that they didn't think it was a great idea to mix family and business, but if there was another realtor he could recommend, he could have gotten himself a referral kickback, I'm pretty sure. I get why he's hurt. If they had been up front with him that they weren't wanting to go with him (for a reason not to do with them thinking him a bad realtor), he could have at least made a little lemonade out of the situation.

    That ship has sailed, though, so I'd just let him cool off and buy your house.
  • banana468 said:
    @mrsconn23 I agree with you but I also think it is a loaded thing to mix business and pleasure especially if the brother may not have had the experience and it's a seller's market now.    These are often single digit in a lifetime purchases.  

    Also, what if they went with the brother.  Is a guy starting out going to reduce his commission for the brother and the LW?   A lot about this rubs me the wrong way.
    The seller pays all REA commissions, so that part doesn't necessarily matter.  Though I've occasionally heard about one/both agents lowering their commission %, for a deal to still go through.  Usually it's after something unexpected, like the inspection uncovers a major repair(s) needed or an appraisal gap.

    The brother is definitely being outrageous and a jerk.  But I can understand why he's disappointed and hurt.  Depending on a couple things, I do think the LW and the b/f were kind of jerks themselves for not using the brother.

    Maybe it's just been my experience, even for buying my first home, but it was pretty standard and straight forward stuff that any agent can do.

    My one exception is if the brother doesn't live that close to the area they are looking.  In this hot market, you need a REA who can get you into showings ASAP.

    That's the biggest reasons I have dropped agents like hot potatoes.  And I haven't even been looking in the current market.  When I have a question about a property and/or want to set up a showing, I mean TODAY.  Because that listing will probably be under contract by tomorrow.

    I actually find the newer and thirstier agents are the best for this.  

    --------------------------

    I'm reminded of my early investment property buying "trauma", lol.

    I wasn't happy with the agent I used to buy my first home.  Overall, she was great for when I was buying my personal duplex.  But the area she lives in and focuses on is about 30 minutes outside of NOLA.

    When I started looking for rental properties, she was a bit slow in responding back to me and always sent someone else from her agency for showings I requested.

    I decided it was time for someone new and pre-emptively made contact with another agent and spoke to him on the phone.  About my RE goals, the kinds of properties I was looking for, that I need an agent that moves quickly, etc.  Then I found a property I was SUPER interested in on the MLS.  It was a run-down triplex, but in a spectacular neighborhood.  I e-mailed him a couple questions about it.  It went under contract in two days.

    He finally replied back FOUR days later to tell me it was under contract, smh.

    I changed my work route home a few years ago.  And, wouldn't you know.  I drive past that property every day, smh.  Maybe the deal wouldn't have worked out for me.  But I still think of it as the "one that got away" and it eats my heart out.

    They fixed it up some and kept it a triplex.  Then someone else bought it.  Added a second floor to half of it and turned it into a single, family house.  
    Wedding Countdown Ticker
  • banana468 said:
    @mrsconn23 I agree with you but I also think it is a loaded thing to mix business and pleasure especially if the brother may not have had the experience and it's a seller's market now.    These are often single digit in a lifetime purchases.  

    Also, what if they went with the brother.  Is a guy starting out going to reduce his commission for the brother and the LW?   A lot about this rubs me the wrong way.
    The seller pays all REA commissions, so that part doesn't necessarily matter.  Though I've occasionally heard about one/both agents lowering their commission %, for a deal to still go through.  Usually it's after something unexpected, like the inspection uncovers a major repair(s) needed or an appraisal gap.

    The brother is definitely being outrageous and a jerk.  But I can understand why he's disappointed and hurt.  Depending on a couple things, I do think the LW and the b/f were kind of jerks themselves for not using the brother.

    Maybe it's just been my experience, even for buying my first home, but it was pretty standard and straight forward stuff that any agent can do.

    My one exception is if the brother doesn't live that close to the area they are looking.  In this hot market, you need a REA who can get you into showings ASAP.

    That's the biggest reasons I have dropped agents like hot potatoes.  And I haven't even been looking in the current market.  When I have a question about a property and/or want to set up a showing, I mean TODAY.  Because that listing will probably be under contract by tomorrow.

    I actually find the newer and thirstier agents are the best for this.  

      
    I don't necessarily agree with that. Sure, any agent can find listings and set up showings, but knowledge and experience make a difference when you go to make/negotiate an offer, get through due diligence, and negotiate with lenders. I completely understand why a first time home buyer in this market would want to work with someone with experience who is based in the location they're targeting. Things have calmed down a little, but there were neighborhoods here where homes would have multiple offers before listings were even official, so you really had to have a locally connected realtor to even try. 

    More than that, the fact that the brother's response to not being hired was to completely fly off the handle, accuse them of deceit and involve the parents leads me to believe that he's not the type of person who would be good at mixing business and family. I get why that would hurt his feelings, but his reaction doesn't exactly paint him as an even keeled professional. 
  • short+sassyshort+sassy member
    First Anniversary First Comment First Answer 5 Love Its
    edited March 2022
    banana468 said:
    @mrsconn23 I agree with you but I also think it is a loaded thing to mix business and pleasure especially if the brother may not have had the experience and it's a seller's market now.    These are often single digit in a lifetime purchases.  

    Also, what if they went with the brother.  Is a guy starting out going to reduce his commission for the brother and the LW?   A lot about this rubs me the wrong way.
    The seller pays all REA commissions, so that part doesn't necessarily matter.  Though I've occasionally heard about one/both agents lowering their commission %, for a deal to still go through.  Usually it's after something unexpected, like the inspection uncovers a major repair(s) needed or an appraisal gap.

    The brother is definitely being outrageous and a jerk.  But I can understand why he's disappointed and hurt.  Depending on a couple things, I do think the LW and the b/f were kind of jerks themselves for not using the brother.

    Maybe it's just been my experience, even for buying my first home, but it was pretty standard and straight forward stuff that any agent can do.

    My one exception is if the brother doesn't live that close to the area they are looking.  In this hot market, you need a REA who can get you into showings ASAP.

    That's the biggest reasons I have dropped agents like hot potatoes.  And I haven't even been looking in the current market.  When I have a question about a property and/or want to set up a showing, I mean TODAY.  Because that listing will probably be under contract by tomorrow.

    I actually find the newer and thirstier agents are the best for this.  

      
    I don't necessarily agree with that. Sure, any agent can find listings and set up showings, but knowledge and experience make a difference when you go to make/negotiate an offer, get through due diligence, and negotiate with lenders. I completely understand why a first time home buyer in this market would want to work with someone with experience who is based in the location they're targeting. Things have calmed down a little, but there were neighborhoods here where homes would have multiple offers before listings were even official, so you really had to have a locally connected realtor to even try. 

    More than that, the fact that the brother's response to not being hired was to completely fly off the handle, accuse them of deceit and involve the parents leads me to believe that he's not the type of person who would be good at mixing business and family. I get why that would hurt his feelings, but his reaction doesn't exactly paint him as an even keeled professional. 
    I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, just commenting.

    In this market, having access to off-market listings is a good point for a more experienced agent.  But he might have had that also, depending on what brokerage he is working under.

    The brother's response was multiple red flags!  To where I wouldn't use him at all, for the future.  But they wouldn't have known that ahead of time and were surprised by it.

    But the bolded...and I totally realize this may have just been me...almost none of that, even for my first home.  I just needed comps.  It helps a little to have an agent guide you in what to offer, but you'll be in the ball park anyway with comps.  Maybe just not in this market.

    For example, my first home was a foreclosure, but they had the square footage WAY off.  Like listed at 2600, but it was actually about 2000.  I asked her if I could take their $/sq ft amount and recalculate it for 2000 sq ft.  She laughed and said, "No way.  Foreclosures won't go much below list price."  Okay.  Though I was able to negotiate $3K toward closing costs.

    She was at the inspection with me.  But I'm taking advise from the inspector.  Though, one question for her.  "Can I make the bank fix XYZ? Or have them take more money off?"  Again, a laugh, and a, "No, banks won't fix jack and they'll still be set on the agreed price."  Fair enough.

    I've never had my agent speak to my lender for any of my RE deals.  At least I don't think so.  Is that a thing in other areas?  What would they talk about?

    Edited to add:  For my first home, she didn't even find listings for me.  I thought that was what agents were supposed to do but, the first bunch she sent me were garbage.  So I just scoured the MLS myself.  I would also drive past houses I might be interested in, before requesting a showing.  I had a long list and was able to cross off most of them, just by doing that. 
    Wedding Countdown Ticker
  • FWIW, a good agent WILL find those listings for you.

    MIL and FIL went through this when they moved nearly 4 years ago.  They signed with an agent who knew the competitive market and the area but more than that, with the 55 and over places, he knew which communities were better and more solvent than others.  Right now in our area I wouldn't buy without an agent at all.   Agents are showing up at open houses with contracts in hand or houses are going to contract the day before a public listing.  And then there are the bidding wars that do happen.  Our tutor lost houses she wanted because people were offering cash and she just couldn't compete with that. 

    In a different market a scouring approach could work - but that isn't now.  You need an agent that knows the area and is literally up before dawn ready to get you what you need. 
  • banana468 said:
    @mrsconn23 I agree with you but I also think it is a loaded thing to mix business and pleasure especially if the brother may not have had the experience and it's a seller's market now.    These are often single digit in a lifetime purchases.  

    Also, what if they went with the brother.  Is a guy starting out going to reduce his commission for the brother and the LW?   A lot about this rubs me the wrong way.
    The seller pays all REA commissions, so that part doesn't necessarily matter.  Though I've occasionally heard about one/both agents lowering their commission %, for a deal to still go through.  Usually it's after something unexpected, like the inspection uncovers a major repair(s) needed or an appraisal gap.

    The brother is definitely being outrageous and a jerk.  But I can understand why he's disappointed and hurt.  Depending on a couple things, I do think the LW and the b/f were kind of jerks themselves for not using the brother.

    Maybe it's just been my experience, even for buying my first home, but it was pretty standard and straight forward stuff that any agent can do.

    My one exception is if the brother doesn't live that close to the area they are looking.  In this hot market, you need a REA who can get you into showings ASAP.

    That's the biggest reasons I have dropped agents like hot potatoes.  And I haven't even been looking in the current market.  When I have a question about a property and/or want to set up a showing, I mean TODAY.  Because that listing will probably be under contract by tomorrow.

    I actually find the newer and thirstier agents are the best for this.  

      
    I don't necessarily agree with that. Sure, any agent can find listings and set up showings, but knowledge and experience make a difference when you go to make/negotiate an offer, get through due diligence, and negotiate with lenders. I completely understand why a first time home buyer in this market would want to work with someone with experience who is based in the location they're targeting. Things have calmed down a little, but there were neighborhoods here where homes would have multiple offers before listings were even official, so you really had to have a locally connected realtor to even try. 

    More than that, the fact that the brother's response to not being hired was to completely fly off the handle, accuse them of deceit and involve the parents leads me to believe that he's not the type of person who would be good at mixing business and family. I get why that would hurt his feelings, but his reaction doesn't exactly paint him as an even keeled professional. 
    I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, just commenting.

    In this market, having access to off-market listings is a good point for a more experienced agent.  But he might have had that also, depending on what brokerage he is working under.

    The brother's response was multiple red flags!  To where I wouldn't use him at all, for the future.  But they wouldn't have known that ahead of time and were surprised by it.

    But the bolded...and I totally realize this may have just been me...almost none of that, even for my first home.  I just needed comps.  It helps a little to have an agent guide you in what to offer, but you'll be in the ball park anyway with comps.  Maybe just not in this market.

    For example, my first home was a foreclosure, but they had the square footage WAY off.  Like listed at 2600, but it was actually about 2000.  I asked her if I could take their $/sq ft amount and recalculate it for 2000 sq ft.  She laughed and said, "No way.  Foreclosures won't go much below list price."  Okay.  Though I was able to negotiate $3K toward closing costs.

    She was at the inspection with me.  But I'm taking advise from the inspector.  Though, one question for her.  "Can I make the bank fix XYZ? Or have them take more money off?"  Again, a laugh, and a, "No, banks won't fix jack and they'll still be set on the agreed price."  Fair enough.

    I've never had my agent speak to my lender for any of my RE deals.  At least I don't think so.  Is that a thing in other areas?  What would they talk about?

    Edited to add:  For my first home, she didn't even find listings for me.  I thought that was what agents were supposed to do but, the first bunch she sent me were garbage.  So I just scoured the MLS myself.  I would also drive past houses I might be interested in, before requesting a showing.  I had a long list and was able to cross off most of them, just by doing that. 
    For our second house, our realtor was helpful in the negotiations after the inspection. It's an older house, so there was a lot. Having some industry knowledge was helpful; I could see where a first time homebuyer would really want that.

    The lender thing might be regional or situational. I remember our first realtor connecting me with a local lender that got us better rates than our banks, but that was years ago. 
  • My problem with not using someone because they don't have experience is how the heck are they going to get experience if people don't use them. This is such a problem with jobs in general. I agree that the brother acted totally inappropriately, but also think the LW and BF could have talked to him about their concerns. Maybe as someone else pointed out, he has a mentor that would have worked with him to get him through the first couple of sales. Also, it does require coursework to become a realtor - you just don't decide you are one. I would let things cool off, have BF do any communication after that then hopefully they all will be able to repair the relationship.
  • My problem with not using someone because they don't have experience is how the heck are they going to get experience if people don't use them. This is such a problem with jobs in general. I agree that the brother acted totally inappropriately, but also think the LW and BF could have talked to him about their concerns. Maybe as someone else pointed out, he has a mentor that would have worked with him to get him through the first couple of sales. Also, it does require coursework to become a realtor - you just don't decide you are one. I would let things cool off, have BF do any communication after that then hopefully they all will be able to repair the relationship.
    The brother may have had a lot of sales.  They only say he has been doing it for less than one year, not that he hasn't had any sales yet.

    But you put it better than I did.  It sounds like the couple didn't even talk to the brother about their concerns and that's what I thought was crappy.  They could have still decided not to use the brother and that would have been fine, but they didn't even give him a chance to tell them what he and the brokerage he works for could have brought to the table.

    A big plus for the brother is he (probably) would have worked harder and been prompt with them.  An experienced agent who has a gazillion clients...probably including investors who buy multiple properties a year from them...isn't necessarily going to be giving the couple the "choice" off-market listings. 
    Wedding Countdown Ticker
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