"cultural Catholic" commercial

jfellows82 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:e96f88df-e15d-4853-a941-1cdca0a64af6">Re:quot;cultural Catholicquot; commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]And chemotherapy is poison. I am disgusted because there is this strange belief that women are running around having tons of abortions or that paying it for it means that will hapen. You must think very little of women and their ability to choose to think there is a holocaust of the unborn.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]

<div>The rationale for not paying for abortions is not that paying for them will cause an increase in abortions. Abortion is inherently evil because it is the killing of another human life. To pay for even one abortion is evil and violates the Catholic faith. </div>

Riss91 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:5c614234-943f-4fe0-837d-a7693f4eab9d">Re:</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re:: You can not win every battle.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]

Not sure what you mean? My point is that no one has ever cared about dental/vision not being covered - when they are just as basic of a health need as reproductive health care....

Just saying it is a bit fishy... it comes off as a direct attack...

agapecarrie · June 2012

I will not take part in someone else's murdering a human being. I will not pay for it. and by making me pay a premium to health insurance that would cover others to do it is making me take part in murder.

I will not comply.

chelseamb11 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:996be9d5-9851-4456-8e6d-e63fa37e0d8d">Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]Many employers don't cover dental or vision - why aren't people FREAKING THE HELL OUT about that?
Posted by Riss91[/QUOTE]

Because eyecare and dental have nothing to do with women's rights. DURRR. A woman should only care about her vagina/uterus, not her teeth or eyes. <img src="http://cdn.cl9.vanillaforums.com/downloaded/ver1.0/content/scripts/tinymce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-undecided.gif" border="0" alt="Undecided" title="Undecided" />

chelseamb11 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:e96f88df-e15d-4853-a941-1cdca0a64af6">Re:quot;cultural Catholicquot; commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]And chemotherapy is poison. I am disgusted because there is this strange belief that women are running around having tons of abortions or that paying it for it means that will hapen. You must think very little of women and their ability to choose to think there is a holocaust of the unborn.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]

Um a baby is not cancer, TYVM. The fact that you even (subconsciously) compare babies to cancer is appalling.

HandBanana · June 2012

I pray for CW too. I pray that the Holy Spirit will bless you with compassion, understanding, sympathy, and acceptance.

caitriona87 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:996be9d5-9851-4456-8e6d-e63fa37e0d8d">Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]Many employers don't cover dental or vision - why aren't people FREAKING THE HELL OUT about that?
Posted by Riss91[/QUOTE]

I wonder this too...or *actual* preventive measures like prenatal vitamins, baby aspirin for heart patients, insulin for diabetics, etc.

And the only way you could argue that the massive number of abortions in this country and around the world is *not* a holocaust is if you deny their humanity.

lalaith50 · June 2012

[QUOTE]In Response to Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial : Because eyecare and dental have nothing to do with women's rights. DURRR. A woman should only care about her vagina/uterus, not her teeth or eyes.
Posted by chelseamb11[/QUOTE]
LMAO! (three thumbs up!)

shawna127 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:9680b256-f4a2-434a-b980-d655d27bccc5">Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial : I wonder this too...or *actual* preventive measures like prenatal vitamins, baby aspirin for heart patients, insulin for diabetics, etc. <strong>And the only way you could argue that the massive number of abortions in this country and around the world is *not* a holocaust is if you deny their humanity.
</strong>Posted by caitriona87[/QUOTE]

Which is actually a part of the definition of holocaust isn't it? :o)

lalaith50 · June 2012

[QUOTE]I pray for CW too. I pray that the Holy Spirit will bless you with compassion, understanding, sympathy, and acceptance.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]
because those are all MUCH more important things than Truth...

Ciardasully · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:a4f4efbc-e396-42c4-b425-d73c52b4af7b">Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]according to the numbers THERE ARE LOTS OF WOMEN RUNNING AROUND HAVING ABORTIONS. Also, you are in my prayers handbanana, I will say the rosary for you when I get home tonight.
Posted by shawna127[/QUOTE]

Seriously!

Doesn't Planned Parenthood claim that 1 in 3 women have had abortions?

caitriona87 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:e45d939b-2e3f-47b5-bbf7-0a37350e65a6">Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial : Which is actually a part of the definition of holocaust isn't it? :o)
Posted by shawna127[/QUOTE]

Indeed. Dehumanization always comes first.

agapecarrie · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:96bdb474-5261-4198-9698-20499111f241">Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial : Indeed. Dehumanization always comes first.
Posted by caitriona87[/QUOTE]

<div>Yea, I mentioned this earlier.</div><div>
</div><div>It's so amazing that I'm covering a lot of this stuff this week at my class.</div><div>
</div><div>
</div>

chelseamb11 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:505b3cdd-1d2c-4d79-83b1-eaefcf9103e6">Re:quot;cultural Catholicquot; commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]I pray for CW too. I pray that the Holy Spirit will bless you with compassion, understanding, sympathy, and acceptance.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]

Let's say someone you know killed their 10 year old son.
Would you understand/accept/sympathize with them?
Didn't think so.

To those who believe life begins at conception, killing a 10 month old boy is NO DIFFERENT than killing a 10 week old (or any week old) fetus/embryo. Do you accept/understand murder?

Riss91 · June 2012

Ladies.... let's all take a deep breath. Honestly, Handbanana is discussing this in a much more respectful manner than most of us see. We can all be less snarky (myself included).

I appreciate anyone that is honestly willing to talk it out and hear each other's point of view. It's much more productive.

HandBanana · June 2012

In Response to Re::[QUOTE]In Response to Re:quot;cultural Catholicquot; commercial:I pray for CW too. I pray that the Holy Spirit will bless you with compassion, understanding, sympathy, and acceptance.Posted by HandBananaLet's say someone you know killed their 10 year old son.nbsp; Would you understand/accept/sympathize with them?Didn't think so.To those who believe life begins at conception, killing a 10 month old boy is NO DIFFERENT than killing a 10 week old or any week old fetus/embryo.nbsp; Do you accept/understand murder? Posted by chelseamb11[/QUOTE]

Last comment: yes I would. I feel sympathy for all of God's children from murderers to pedophiles to thieves etc. Sympathy compassion and understanding does not mean you accept. It is frustrating hearing so many young people lacking compassion for God's children because I am a compassianate Catholic and surrounded by the same. Please do not twist my words because I am not going to come back to defend myself. I commented yesterday that I loved CW for the discussion. You can not have discussion without listening.

chelseamb11 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:901c17cf-41d9-4c79-b14e-42e089f4f46b">Re:</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re:: Last comment: yes I would. I feel sympathy for all of God's children from murderers to pedophiles to thieves etc. Sympathy compassion and understanding does not mean you accept. It is frustrating hearing so many young people lacking compassion for God's children because I am a compassianate Catholic and surrounded by the same. Please do not twist my words because I am not going to come back to defend myself. I commented yesterday that I loved CW for the discussion. You can not have discussion without listening.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]

I was listening.
I'm sorry if it seems like I was twisting your words. You yourself used the word acceptance, which seemed to mel ike you were saying we need to accept abortion. Sorry if I misread that.

lalaith50 · June 2012

HandBanana-

I really hope you don't leave!

(And I also really hope you are able to read and respond to my last comment on the other thread...)

professorscience · June 2012

The issues behind all of this go much, much deeper than just the HHS mandate. It's not like the Church SUDDENLY decided to be opposed to various forms of contraception. This has always been a thing. The HHS mandate thrusts the opposition into the spotlight. Perhaps the fault lies with the Catholic body, for sort of letting this be a "wayside" issue, you know? But it's not really going to do any good to pass blame. My biggest problem with the healthcare reform that was found constitutional today is that it's a band-aid. Let's forget for a second that some of these mandatory "healthcare" provisions are counter to my conscience. Just saying, "Okay, you all have to buy healthcare now. Insurance companies, you all have to provide it," is NOT enough. The insurance industry as a whole needs a massive overhaul and it's not something that can happen just because Congress passes a bill.

Also, I agree with Riss. It's getting very "Mean Girls" up in here.

And jfellows, I didn't watch the video, but I read the quote, and that is absolutely ridiculous.

monkeysip · June 2012

I don't really see lack of compassion here an issue.

I feel compassion for both the mother and the child in the case of abortion. In most cases, I think the woman has been unfairly disadvantaged and put in an extremely difficult position. She feels that this is the only choice she can make because she doesn't have the means to properly raise the child, whether financially, physically, or emotionally. Of course these women need our love and support.

But compassion, sometimes, means helping someone not make the wrong choice. Women who are thinking of abortion need compassion before they make a huge mistake. Abortion hurts women too, and real compassion would be to stop them before it happens. And even if she still decides to have one, compassion doesn't mean I have to support her decision or pay for it. But it means that I won't judge her or stop supporting her as a fellow human being.

professorscience · June 2012

Somewhat relevant, the $120 test I'm taking and sending off to find out why I'm not ovulating is NOT covered by my insurance. I'd like to know what treatments to INCREASE fertility are mandated by the ACA or HHS mandate (legit question, not just sarcastic complaining).

chelseamb11 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:e63c731a-f3e0-43c4-8962-45d0a2c657bf">Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]I don't really see lack of compassion here an issue. I feel compassion for both the mother and the child in the case of abortion. In most cases, I think the woman has been unfairly disadvantaged and put in an extremely difficult position. She feels that this is the only choice she can make because she doesn't have the means to properly raise the child, whether financially, physically, or emotionally. Of course these women need our love and support. But compassion, sometimes, means helping someone not make the wrong choice. Women who are thinking of abortion need compassion before they make a huge mistake. Abortion hurts women too, and real compassion would be to stop them before it happens. And even if she still decides to have one, compassion doesn't mean I have to support her decision or pay for it. But it means that I won't judge her or stop supporting her as a fellow human being.
Posted by monkeysip[/QUOTE]

Amen sista

lv2011 · June 2012

I'm not trying to stir the pot, but someone asked me this the other day and I didn't really know how to respond. No one likes have the beliefs and opinions of others foisted onto them. No one wants to be made to comply with something they don't personally agree with. But if Catholics are in the minority of people that believe abortion is murder and birth control is murder, than why do their beliefs trump those of everyone else who believes differently? Don't get me wrong. I am Catholic and hold the same opinion of abortion and birth control for non-medical necessity as most of the rest of you. But how do you answer that? Why should what we believe take precedence over what the majority believe? And why does religion have anything to do with public health?

My answer to the person was that just because the majority believe differently, doesn't make them right. I'm not good at making arguments, so I'm interested in your collective take on this.

professorscience · June 2012

I mean, there was a time when "the majority" thought owning slaves and segregation were good things. I think your answer was completely correct, lv.

Also, first amendment, etc, etc.

Disclaimer: No, I am not saying the fight over birth control is the same as the fight over civil rights.

chelseamb11 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:833891a3-605a-492f-aa9d-78c40be99919">Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]I'm not trying to stir the pot, but someone asked me this the other day and I didn't really know how to respond. No one likes have the beliefs and opinions of others foisted onto them. No one wants to be made to comply with something they don't personally agree with. But if Catholics are in the minority of people that believe abortion is murder and birth control is murder, than why do their beliefs trump those of everyone else who believes differently? Don't get me wrong. I am Catholic and hold the same opinion of abortion and birth control for non-medical necessity as most of the rest of you. But how do you answer that? Why should what we believe take precedence over what the majority believe? And why does religion have anything to do with public health? My answer to the person was that just because the majority believe differently, doesn't make them right. I'm not good at making arguments, so I'm interested in your collective take on this.
Posted by lv2011[/QUOTE]

Just because everyone's doing it, doesn't make it right. There was a point in time where a majority of people though that blacks were inferior. There was a point in time where a majority of people thought the world was flat. I can come up with a bunch more examples but I think you get the gist :)

professorscience · June 2012

Jinx, Chelsea!

monkeysip · June 2012

Just to add to prof and chels, the law should not be about majority opinion. That's mob rule, and it opens the door to all sorts of terrible ills being thrust upon us.

While the law is not to be based upon religion (in a society in which church and state are separated), the law HAS to be based upon objective morality. If it's not, then the law becomes simply arbitrary, and whoever has the most power gets to decide the law. That's not the kind of society we want to live in.

agapecarrie · June 2012

The thing is, catholics are not forcing ANYONE to stop using birth control.

We should not be the ones to PAY for it.

ootmother2 · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural Wedding BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:64d0768a-659c-4655-822e-7a69e02b2332">Re:</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re:: I am disgusted that you use the term holocaust so easily. You still haven't touched on my point about the religion of employeers. As usual, politicians have manipulated the religious by using a single issue instead of excitement for all of the already born children that will have healthcare.
Posted by HandBanana[/QUOTE]

hey Banana, if she's already addressed it , the subject should be settled,, you get it?

ElisabethJoanne · June 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/cultural-wedding-boards_catholic-weddings_cultural-catholic-commercial?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Cultural%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:615Discussion:0cd2ef46-1292-4f53-acc1-5be45bfd0491Post:9680b256-f4a2-434a-b980-d655d27bccc5">Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: "cultural Catholic" commercial : I wonder this too...or *actual* preventive measures like prenatal vitamins, baby aspirin for heart patients, insulin for diabetics, etc. And the only way you could argue that the massive number of abortions in this country and around the world is *not* a holocaust is if you deny their humanity.
Posted by caitriona87[/QUOTE]

Few plans cover over-the-counter medications. Many plans don't cover maternity care at all. Coverage for injectibles like insulin vary from plan to plan. All plans cover malnutrition and diabetes and hypertension, if diagnosed while on the plan (not a pre-existing condition).

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