really insignificant question- about Monograms

carliealissa · March 2014

I don't even know if this is etiquette, but I'm wondering about what is proper or acceptable. Not that it even matters- it might be a "do whatever the hell you want".

I haven't decided yet whether or not I will change my name. I'm not sure if I'll ever be able to decide. I'm wondering, if I don't legally change my last name, can our married monogram still be (Mary Smith and John Doe) MJD or mDj? Am I still considered Mrs. Doe since I am the wife of John Doe? Maybe this is less a question about monograms and more of me just having an identity crisis, but whatever. I want to register for pretty monogrammed things!

CMGragain · March 2014

If you aren't sure about changing your name, don't register for anything monogrammed.

kitsunegari89 · March 2014

I got wedding stationery with my maiden name on it. Truthfully, it doesn't much matter. Nobody cares what you write your thank you notes on as long as it's pretty. I'm not planning on changing my name.

carliealissa · March 2014

@CMGragain, So if I keep my maiden name, we can't have anything monogrammed?

Grabows14 · March 2014

You can have stuff monogrammed if you want, but people might take it as you wouldn't mind going by his last name. if that's the case then sure.

However, if you don't ever want letters addressed to you as Mr John and Jane Do (when you really want Mr John Doe and Mrs Jane Smith) it may seem like you are being nitpicky with people for no reason when you correct them...

ashleyep · March 2014

You can have stuff monogrammed if you want, but people might take it as you wouldn't mind going by his last name. if that's the case then sure.

However, if you don't ever want letters addressed to you as Mr John and Jane Do (when you really want Mr John Doe and Mrs Jane Smith) it may seem like you are being nitpicky with people for no reason when you correct them...

Ms. Jane Smith. She wouldn't be Mrs. Jane Smith.

STARMOON44 · March 2014

If you don't change your name, I wouldn't consider you Mrs. John Doe. If you want monogrammed stuff what about a 2 letter monogram with each of your first initials.

emmyg65 · March 2014

According to old school etiquette, if you marry John Doe, you are Mrs. John Doe. But modern etiquette recognizes that women often choose to keep their names, so you'd be Ms. Jane Smith. If you want to get stuff monogrammed and you don't mind it having the incorrect name, knock yourself out! It might be a little confusing for other people, but there's no harm in it.

HisGirlFriday13 · March 2014

You may certainly have things monogrammed -- in your maiden name initials. Typically, actually, all monogrammed things (sheets, towels, etc) were monogrammed in the bride's maiden name anyway.

But if you do not change your name, no, you cannot have a married monogram, because a married monogram is based on the husband and wife sharing the same last initial, which you and your husband won't if you don't change your name.

Ex. My maiden initials are, let's say, KEM. DH's are DED. Since I did change my name upon our marriage, our married monogram would be kDd -- my first, our last, his first.

I actually ordered a monogram necklace the other week in my new monogram -- kDm.

Maggie0829 · March 2014

prettybirdy27 said:

Can I piggyback on this and ask another monogram question? I made my maiden name into a second middle name and took DH's last name, so now I'm Firstname Middlename 2ndMiddlename Husband'sname, no hyphens. What would my monogram be? Or do I just go with our married monogram?

I am not 100% sure but I believe in married monograms you only put the first names and the one last name. You don't include middle names unless you are doing a monogram solely for yourself but even then I am not sure how 2 middle names would work. Which is funny because I have two middle names, but have always just had things monogrammed with my first middle name that is well known and used most often.

HisGirlFriday13 · March 2014

prettybirdy27 said:

Can I piggyback on this and ask another monogram question? I made my maiden name into a second middle name and took DH's last name, so now I'm Firstname Middlename 2ndMiddlename Husband'sname, no hyphens. What would my monogram be? Or do I just go with our married monogram?

Your name:

Jane Anne Smith Doe

Your monogram:

JASD (all four letters, in order)

You and DH:

John and Jane Doe

Your monogram:

jDj

Men's shirt cuffs are usually monogrammed F-M-L.

If you want to do the middle-letter-bigger monogram, I think you'd have to pick one middle name, and then do jDa or jDs.

carliealissa · March 2014

This is great, thanks for all the opinions! I did read that the "traditional" monogram would be Woman's first name, Married last name, Woman's maiden name... which kinda seems to leave out the husband, so I wondered why it would be any worse to use a monogram with his last name initial even if my last name were different. There are a lot of confusing instructions floating around out there!

If I do end up keeping my name, I wouldn't go crazy correcting someone who called or referred to me as "Mrs. Husband". I love his name; just not sure if I'll be able to let go of mine. I have a feeling whichever way I decide I will probably end up going by either/both.. sigh.

lovesclimbing · March 2014

Am I weird because I never realized that this type of monogram: aDj, was man's first, last, woman's first? I honestly always thought it was first, MIDDLE, last or first, LAST, middle, and I always thought both of those options were incredibly weird. It makes so much more sense now.

To your question, OP, if you don't legally change your name, but go by your husband's last name socially, I think it would be fine to have monograms with your husband's last name.

But if you don't change your name and want to go by your maiden name both socially and legally, that could cause a lot of confusion. Especially if (like some women on these boards), you have trouble convincing people that your real name is your maiden name, even after marriage.

HisGirlFriday13 · March 2014

lovesclimbing said:

Am I weird because I never realized that this type of monogram: aDj, was man's first, last, woman's first? I honestly always thought it was first, MIDDLE, last or first, LAST, middle, and I always thought both of those options were incredibly weird. It makes so much more sense now.

To your question, OP, if you don't legally change your name, but go by your husband's last name socially, I think it would be fine to have monograms with your husband's last name.

But if you don't change your name and want to go by your maiden name both socially and legally, that could cause a lot of confusion. Especially if (like some women on these boards), you have trouble convincing people that your real name is your maiden name, even after marriage.

The monogram you've described, the married monogram, aDj should be woman's first SHARED LAST man's first.

silver0319 · March 2014

I have another monogram question! I've always loved the interlocking monogram, but FI's lastname is a two-initial name. How does one monogram that? FI doesn't actually use his middle name with writing out initials (think Robert DeNiro=RDN), but I don't want to give up my middle name in my monogram!

HisGirlFriday13 · March 2014

@silver0319 -- For name like DeNiro, O'Hara, van Helsing, McClaine, you use the very first letter -- D, O, V, M, in my set of last name examples.

When writing it out, if your FI's name were Robert James DeNiro, his initials for a monogram would be RJD.

lovesclimbing · March 2014

HisGirlFriday13 said:

lovesclimbing said:

Am I weird because I never realized that this type of monogram: aDj, was man's first, last, woman's first? I honestly always thought it was first, MIDDLE, last or first, LAST, middle, and I always thought both of those options were incredibly weird. It makes so much more sense now.

To your question, OP, if you don't legally change your name, but go by your husband's last name socially, I think it would be fine to have monograms with your husband's last name.

But if you don't change your name and want to go by your maiden name both socially and legally, that could cause a lot of confusion. Especially if (like some women on these boards), you have trouble convincing people that your real name is your maiden name, even after marriage.

The monogram you've described, the married monogram, aDj should be woman's first SHARED LAST man's first.

When I said "last," I meant both of their last names - meaning the one they now share.

MollyandD · March 2014

STARMOON44 said:

If you don't change your name, I wouldn't consider you Mrs. John Doe. If you want monogrammed stuff what about a 2 letter monogram with each of your first initials.

We registered for some monogrammed bath towels with letters of our first names. I know I won't drop my maiden name, and I'm debating adding his name or leaving my name alone.

MollyandD · March 2014

Also... I was always under the impression that "mrs" is a married woman, whether or not she changes her name. That's how the women I've know who kept their names handled it. ---—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—--- ETA- I looked up the definitions and only saw that mrs is a title for a married woman, and it originated from the word "mistress."

HisGirlFriday13 · March 2014

Molly&Domenic said:
Also... I was always under the impression that "mrs" is a married woman, whether or not she changes her name. That's how the women I've know who kept their names handled it.
---—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—---
ETA- I looked up the definitions and only saw that mrs is a title for a married woman, and it originated from the word "mistress."

It did. But the original definition of mistress meant 'married woman,' as in 'is the mistress of the house home?'

Only in the last few hundred years has mistress been co-opted to mean 'adulteress.'

MollyandD · March 2014

HisGirlFriday13 said:

Also... I was always under the impression that "mrs" is a married woman, whether or not she changes her name. That's how the women I've know who kept their names handled it. ---—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—------—--- ETA- I looked up the definitions and only saw that mrs is a title for a married woman, and it originated from the word "mistress."
It did. But the original definition of mistress meant 'married woman,' as in 'is the mistress of the house home?' Only in the last few hundred years has mistress been co-opted to mean 'adulteress.'

Right. I was referring to mistress in the married woman sense. So then couldn't any married woman be a Mrs? Even if she keeps her name? That's how I plan to be, whatever I end up deciding about my name.

carliealissa · March 2014

That's what I was wondering! My understanding is that "Mrs." means "wife of", so you would never be Mrs. Maiden name, because that's confusing, like you are saying you are your father's wife. You would be Ms. Maiden name. But following that logic, even if you kept your last name and were Ms. Maiden name, wouldn't you still be Mrs. Husband (socially), since you are his wife?

MollyandD · March 2014

carliealissa said:

That's what I was wondering! My understanding is that "Mrs." means "wife of", so you would never be Mrs. Maiden name, because that's confusing, like you are saying you are your father's wife. You would be Ms. Maiden name. But following that logic, even if you kept your last name and were Ms. Maiden name, wouldn't you still be Mrs. Husband (socially), since you are his wife?

This is the first time I've heard that "Mrs." meant "wife of." The dictionary I looked at said it is short for mistress and refers to a married woman. ——————————————————————————————————————— ETA- I don't think "Mrs." Means "wife of" someone, but if it did, that would make me never want to use it. It would be like I had no identity outside of my husband.

carliealissa · March 2014

I think that's kind of how it was... that's why when you address your wedding invitations, the proper wording is "Mr. and Mrs. John Doe".. like the wife doesn't even have a first name! This is all just stuff I have read from various sources, but I have seen the "wife of" information dozens of times. FWIW.

MollyandD · March 2014

Mrs. (mĭs′ĭz) n. pl. Mmes. (mā-däm′, -dăm′) 1. Used as a courtesy title for a married or widowed woman before the surname or full name of her husband: Mrs. Doe; Mrs. John Doe. 2. Used as a courtesy title for a married, widowed, or divorced woman before her own surname or full name: Mrs. Doe; Mrs. Jane Doe. See Usage Note at Ms. 3. Used in informal titles for a married woman to indicate the epitomizing of an attribute or activity: Mrs. Wonderful; Mrs. Organization. [Abbreviation of mistress.] ——————————————————————————————————————— Sorry. iPad won't let me skip lines. This mentions being a wife, but not "wife of" in the definitions. If you have another source, please share. I want to clear this up before my wedding.

carliealissa · March 2014

Oh, I don't have any official source like the dictionary. I didn't look in the dictionary, I'm just talking about what the general consensus/opinion seems to be. This is all stuff that has evolved over such a long time, sometimes I don't know if there's even one right answer today anyway.

Here's some random examples of places that (arbitrarily?) proclaim that it means "wife of". Again, there's no reference to some kind of official word on the subject, so if you're worried about "clearing it up" before your wedding, I would just go with your dictionary definition.

If you're basing your decision off how it might be perceived and that's all it takes for you to never want to use Mrs., maybe don't change your name. Wherever it came from, "wife of" seems to be what many people think it means.

http://impstrump.blogspot.com/2010/10/choosing-female-titles-in-english.html

http://spaceskc.com/articles/round-usual-suspects/

http://perodicticus-potto.blogspot.com/2008/11/thats-not-my-name-well-it-is-but.html

http://web.ics.purdue.edu/~jpiller/EmailAProfessor_Piller.pdf (this one's interesting- tough prof!)

http://www.ayearofgoodmanners.com/ This page is really long but here's the quote: “Use correct titles of respect for women. Miss for girls, Ms. for adults who want to keep their marital status private. Mrs. is for married women, with the husband's name because "Mrs." means "wife of." Divorced women are no longer "Mrs." but a widow retains the title as long as she wants.”...www.margerysinclair.com

and an untold number of random Yahoo answers

really insignificant question- about Monograms

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