Whaaaaaaa?

mrsconn23 · February 2017

Dear Prudence,
I need an unbiased opinion over whether I’m overreacting. My 8-year-old daughter Grace received a kitten for her birthday and loves her cat Pasta very much. She’s been talking about Pasta frequently at school, and this annoyed a girl named Holly, who has a history of saying mean things to Grace. During art period, Holly made a clay cat and encouraged the rest of their classmates to take pieces of “Pasta” to “eat.” Grace cried, and the teacher eventually alerted the vice principal. My husband and I have a meeting with Holly’s parents and the school this week, but I know several other parents in the class think this is an overreaction. They’ll allow it was not nice but claim no one knew how upset Grace would become. Are my husband and I out of line for thinking this is bullying that needs to be addressed, at least at an administrative level?

—Class “Butcher”

6fsn · February 2017

One incident does not make a bully, but I'm not sure what the other mean things were. So bizarre. I think I'd have a conversation with the art teacher then maybe the principal? I can't tell if the art teacher couldn't stop it or was choosing not to intervene early enough.

OliveOilsMom · February 2017

I think MrsConns title says it all!

banana468 · February 2017

One bad incident isn't in itself bullying. Bullying becomes a pattern of behavior and is usually not one bad afternoon - at least not in an 8 year old classroom under proper adult supervision.

The parents need to figure out what they're addressing. Is it Holly's pattern of behavior saying mean things to Grace that CULMINATED in the "eat the cat" incident or do they want to talk about one thing??

MissKittyDanger · February 2017

The part of "eating" pieces of the clay cat would have red flags up. That just sounds creepy.

Joney · February 2017

If this was just one of multiple incidences where Holly orchestrated the entire class to do something that was distressing to Grace, then I would think a discussion is in order. Not really because of this extremely *weird* stunt, but more because being ganged up on by your entire class over an extended period of time is bullying.

It sounds like Grace is more sensitive than most kids, and Holly picked up on that. Instead of LW getting the administration involved, I think she should talk to her daughter about strategies to ignore this type of behaviour. I bet it would have been a lot less funny for Holly had Grace stood up a asked for her own piece of clay "Pasta".

mrsconn23 · February 2017

Joney said:

It sounds like Grace is more sensitive than most kids, and Holly picked up on that.

I think this is the crux of the issue. And yes, if Holly is being cruel, it should be addressed. But more so to me, LW needs to use this as a tool for Grace to learn coping strategies and how to manage her feelings.

NOLABridesmaid · February 2017

I think as kids grow up they have to start learning how to deal with conflict. There are situations where parents should step in, but we are really taking away the normal skills of kids to figure stuff out. I see it everyday.

6fsn · February 2017

The cat's name is pasta. Of course they wanted to eat it.

charlotte989875 · February 2017

Teachable moment for the art teacher to say, "it's not nice to eat other people's pets"?

Heffalump · February 2017

I have so many questions.

Like 6, I want to know what the other things were. If it was along the lines of the Pasta incident, then I'm sorry, but I don't see bullying here. At all. If it was more like "You can't play with us, go sit on the bench by yourself" and she got the other kids to shun Grace, then that's a whole other issue. Although, I think if worse things had happened, she would have mentioned those, not the cat eating thing.

"The teacher eventually alerted the vice principal." What precipitated the "eventually?" Was it in line with the school's disciplinary policy, and Holly had escalated things to the point where it needed to addressed higher up the chain? Or did the LW badger the school until she wore them down and they agreed to a meeting? It's not really clear.

"No one knew how upset Grace would become." I totally buy that. Because honestly, I can see this being hilarious to those kids. Not the part about hurting Grace, but the part about pretending to eat a cat named Pasta. They're kids. It's amusing. They need to learn that if they're making Grace cry, that's not cool, but I'm with @mrsconn23 --I don't think the average kid would lose it over this, so it sounds like Grace is more sensitive than average. I have one of those, and you need to teach them how to deal so the world doesn't make them miserable. That doesn't mean that you ignore actual bullying, but there's a lot of a-hole kid behavior that's just a-hole kid behavior, and needs to be dealt with on that level, not adjudicated by the administration.

kimmiinthemitten · February 2017

This sounds more like the creepy things kids do post to me.

6fsn said:

The cat's name is pasta. Of course they wanted to eat it.

This cracked me up!!

VarunaTT · February 2017

I've pondered on this all night. Mainly b/c I was a kid like Grace with a super active imagination and a little too sensitive. And I kind of hate the idea of telling Grace to toughen up, over telling kids not to be assholes who pretend to eat someone's cat. I'm an adult, and that imagery made me wince.

While I wouldn't put the whole class on notice, Holly is obviously a leader and is using it to manipulate and needs some attention paid to her to make sure she starts using those skills in a more healthy manner. If it isn't, this is a foray into becoming a big bully.

mrsconn23 · February 2017

VarunaTT said:

I've pondered on this all night. Mainly b/c I was a kid like Grace with a super active imagination and a little too sensitive. And I kind of hate the idea of telling Grace to toughen up, over telling kids not to be assholes who pretend to eat someone's cat. I'm an adult, and that imagery made me wince.

While I wouldn't put the whole class on notice, Holly is obviously a leader and is using it to manipulate and needs some attention paid to her to make sure she starts using those skills in a more healthy manner. If it isn't, this is a foray into becoming a big bully.

My intent in my reply was not for Grace to be told to toughen up, but more how to manage your emotions in the moment. I have always worn my emotions on my sleeve and to this day, I blush at the slightest feelings of uncertainty or embarrassment. I was a quirky kid (and still am quirky) and I remember the sting of being made fun of in my youth. I am totally a person who's brain loves to trick her into remembering an embarrassing moment at the most inopportune times. I understand Grace's struggles, trust me. I wish I had been given more tools earlier to deal with those feelings and self-management.

I definitely think that Holly needs to be dealt with if she's going out of her way to be mean to Grace.

MesmrEwe · February 2017

Joney said:

If this was just one of multiple incidences where Holly orchestrated the entire class to do something that was distressing to Grace, then I would think a discussion is in order. Not really because of this extremely *weird* stunt, but more because being ganged up on by your entire class over an extended period of time is bullying.

It sounds like Grace is more sensitive than most, and Holly picked up on that. Instead of LW getting the administration involved, I think she should talk to her daughter about strategies to ignore this type of behaviour. I bet it would have been a lot less funny for Holly had Grace stood up a asked for her own piece of clay "Pasta".

Because I have "that kid" with the eldest (She's pure Indigo child), it's easy to say as adults/parents with the adult brain and perspective to many of these things what to do. That won't help a sensitive kid figure out their way in the world nor how to actually "toughen up" without completely hardening them to the world.

This coming from the parent who went to the school office this week for a "Have a non-intervention intervention you need to know about the situation between DD and (boy) is bubbling up again, just to let them both know they're still being watched for the what's likely just 6th grade drama (because we had tears and a girl who didn't want to go to school because of meany-head last week and I'm here after she missed the bus trying to get out of coming to school and unlucky for her, she's got the parents who unless she's got exclusionary criteria she's going...)".. Amazing how things magically got better once DD had a chat with the Principal!

...and yes, metaphorically taking chunks and eating the cat - in American Culture - is creepy AF...

Joney · February 2017

MesmrEwe said:

Joney said:

If this was just one of multiple incidences where Holly orchestrated the entire class to do something that was distressing to Grace, then I would think a discussion is in order. Not really because of this extremely *weird* stunt, but more because being ganged up on by your entire class over an extended period of time is bullying.

It sounds like Grace is more sensitive than most, and Holly picked up on that. Instead of LW getting the administration involved, I think she should talk to her daughter about strategies to ignore this type of behaviour. I bet it would have been a lot less funny for Holly had Grace stood up a asked for her own piece of clay "Pasta".

Because I have "that kid" with the eldest (She's pure Indigo child), it's easy to say as adults/parents with the adult brain and perspective to many of these things what to do. That won't help a sensitive kid figure out their way in the world nor how to actually "toughen up" without completely hardening them to the world.

This coming from the parent who went to the school office this week for a "Have a non-intervention intervention you need to know about the situation between DD and (boy) is bubbling up again, just to let them both know they're still being watched for the what's likely just 6th grade drama (because we had tears and a girl who didn't want to go to school because of meany-head last week and I'm here after she missed the bus trying to get out of coming to school and unlucky for her, she's got the parents who unless she's got exclusionary criteria she's going...)".. Amazing how things magically got better once DD had a chat with the Principal!

...and yes, metaphorically taking chunks and eating the cat - in American Culture - is creepy AF...

I was also "that kid", and I grew into a pretty sensitive adult, so when I said it sounded like Grace was sensitive, I didn't intend to say that the solution was for her to toughen up. Grace absolutely deserves to have her feelings validated, especially by the adults in her life. Perhaps I was hasty in my assessment, but I still stand by my initial statement that there isn't enough information from LW that indicates one way of another whether a meeting with the administration is necessary - there is a whole multitude of approaches that can be taken here, and likely more than one of them is "right". It's really great that you had success with talking to your school's principal, and hopefully LW has the same.

As an aside, I'm hesitant to say that one day Grace is going to have to learn to deal with the "Holly's" of the world. Not necessarily bullies, but people who don't really understand (or care to understand) what it's like to be sensitive. The ones who think that just because something doesn't have a deep emotional impact on them, means it won't have a deep impact on anyone (e.g. the people who mock trigger warnings or Safe Spaces). I guess I've been tossing this around in my head for a couple days now, at what age do you start preparing kids for the "real world" as opposed to what you want the real world to be?

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