Divorced ILs?

SteelHibiscus · December 2012

FH's parents divorced 8 years ago. FFIL is still with the woman he left FMIL for, but they haven't married and I doubt they will.
Thing is, FH's mother is a little BSC and absolutely refuses to be around "that woman." FH doesn't want to invite FFIL's girlfriend, but a) they're a long-term social unit and b) FFIL and GF have treated me WAY better than FFMIL from the start since (unlike her) they're not crazy racists and (shocker) never once lost it over our mixed-race relationship.
What to do?

AddieCake · December 2012

Your fiance should probably sit down with everyone and tell them they need to be civil to one another if they attend the wedding. You can't NOT invite the girlfriend.

thurmanpowell · December 2012

I say let your FI handle his own family. They've got tons od drama you don't want to get into. Let him do what he thinks is best.

thurmanpowell · December 2012

Personally, though, If I were him and it were my family, going off of soley this info I would invite Dad and GF, but not mom.

jenferian · December 2012

Ohhhh do I have experience in this arena :-)

My advice? FI needs to have a powow with Mom and tell her how incredibly important it is to have her there and to please take the focus off "that woman." It's selfish and unfair for FMIL to ask or expect you to disclude Dad's GF to attend, IMHO.

ashleyy00 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:655b384e-435a-4be9-a5e2-5e74724b7738">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]Ohhhh do I have experience in this arena :-) My advice? FI needs to have a powow with Mom and tell her how incredibly important it is to have her there and to please take the focus off "that woman." It's selfish and unfair for FMIL to ask or expect you to disclude Dad's GF to attend, IMHO.
Posted by jenferian[/QUOTE]

agree! I'm in a veryyy similar situation, and have already told my FI it's up to talk to his mom and tell her that it's selfish that she would put her own feelings above her sons and not be there for his day. He's also laying down an ultimatum: come and get along or you will be kicked out.

LiLe422 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:655b384e-435a-4be9-a5e2-5e74724b7738">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]Ohhhh do I have experience in this arena :-) My advice? <strong>FI needs to have a powow with Mom and tell her how incredibly important it is to have her there and to please take the focus off "that woman." It's selfish and unfair for FMIL to ask or expect you to disclude Dad's GF to attend, IMHO.</strong>
Posted by jenferian[/QUOTE]

I agree.

Oh yeah, and if this cray-cray named NYU shows up in this post (which we all know she will) try not to take her advice seriously. She will tell you dads GF is the devil and your mother has a right to act all BSC.

Peledreamsofrain · December 2012

CMGr is spot on. FMIL has given you the answer on a silver platter. Invite everyone involved, and be very honest that you did so.

FMIL has made it clear that she won't attend if GF does. Ok, so she won't and it's completely her decision.

s-aries8990 · December 2012

I absoloutely love when a person goes BSC on the other woman when it was the husband's decision to leave, but I digress. Invite both and have FI speak to both mom, dad and dad's GF. He needs to tell his mom she will be welcome, but only if she acts appropriately, and if she can't, its best that she does not attend.

Also, does mom acknowledge her BSC tendencies? Is there a "safety person" like an aunt or friend who can whisk her away if she starts to act up?

OwningAHome1981 · December 2012

I think everyone needs to be an adult and suck it up. We had an engagement party- both my FI's parents are divorced and remarried. There is no hard feeling anymore but they hadn't seen eachother since the divorce which was 24 years ago prior to the engagement party. Granted this is different b/c no one left the other one because of cheating (it just didn't work out), BUT my point is that both sets of parents came and were civil and it was fine. We could not have imagined not having them all there.

You from LI, as am I, so I assuming you are going to have a pretty big, traditional wedding. With a room of about 200 people or so, really, your FMIL doesn't need to say one word to the GF if she doesn't want to. It is a big place most likely. She will find someone else to hang out with and avoid the GF.

I think they need to put on their big people panties and suck it up b/c they are there for you and your FI.

LiLe422 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:c44d50ef-02e6-49c4-bdb3-bd9ead0d59c0">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]So no one cares what FDH wants? <strong> I think the B/G with the divorced parents get more say. </strong>
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

You would. Don't you think its a moot point? I mean, the GF must be invited. She is, afterall, the SO of FFIL.

OwningAHome1981 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:c44d50ef-02e6-49c4-bdb3-bd9ead0d59c0">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]So no one cares what FDH wants? <strong> I think the B/G with the divorced parents get more say.
</strong>Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

Why should they? It is just as much the bride's wedding as it is the groom's.

mcda04 · December 2012

You have to invite dad’s spouse. Your FI should talk to his mother and inform her that his dad’s gf will be in attendance. It’s then up to his mom to decide if having a grudge is worth missing her son’s wedding.

My parents are also divorced and I was afraid my mom would act inappropriately but she was fine, they all sat in the same table so they actually surprised me. (in a good way)

s-aries8990 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:430b2d95-fedb-47ef-89b4-655e71925066">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]Eddie, a spouse or fiance must be invited, or it would be a breach of etiquette. The rules are not as clear on GF/BF (other than in Knot World). Some authorities look to whether they are living togethor, some how long-term. The social unit rule, as intrepreted in Knot-World land, is an extreme position. Especially if dad is not living with his GF, I think there are authorities that would support not having to invite the GF.
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

There is a difference between a friend with benefits and a girlfriend. I think SO's should always be invited. I don't live with my boyfriend and we've been together for almost 6 years- I'm 22, he's 23. Right now we can't live together becase my mom needs me at home to help pay the mortgage for the house she, I and my autistic brother (my mother his legal guardian) live in while we're battling it out with my dad for buying out the house 15 years after the divorce was finalized. If someone were to question my seriousness with him I would be greatly offended- we did not get married yet because we are still young and are trying to save (I want a PPD damnit and I'm going to do it the right way!) and I have a lot of family ish right now that I need to make sure is ok. He understands how important my family is to me and for you to judge my relationship based on a set of hard and fast rules is wrong.

If a guest considers their SO their SO, like talks all about their SO, goes to holidays with them, attend parties together, are together often, then the host must also consider the SO a real SO. Even if they don't, if guest says "Hey you forgot to invite my SO" the host must accomodate. A person can't judge the seriousness of someone else's relationship, so you have to take their word for it.

ETA: etiquette changes and is updated as times change. Now, SO's are staying together longer if they even get married at all. The validity of a relationship can and should only be judged by those in the relationship.

OwningAHome1981 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:c5e8b7b9-c452-4e26-9dc6-fd43b49ff36c">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Divorced ILs? : There is a difference between a friend with benefits and a girlfriend. I think SO's should always be invited. I don't live with my boyfriend and we've been together for almost 6 years- I'm 22, he's 23. Right now we can't live together becase my mom needs me at home to help pay the mortgage for the house she, I and my autistic brother (my mother his legal guardian) live in while we're battling it out with my dad for buying out the house 15 years after the divorce was finalized. If someone were to question my seriousness with him I would be greatly offended- we did not get married yet because we are still young and are trying to save (I want a PPD damnit and I'm going to do it the right way!) and I have a lot of family ish right now that I need to make sure is ok. He understands how important my family is to me and for you to judge my relationship based on a set of hard and fast rules is wrong. If a guest considers their SO their SO, like talks all about their SO, goes to holidays with them, attend parties together, are together often, then the host must also consider the SO a real SO. Even if they don't, if guest says "Hey you forgot to invite my SO" the host must accomodated. A person can't judge the seriousness of someone else's relationship, so you have to take their word for it.
Posted by sydaries[/QUOTE]

I was invited to a wedding once without my FI. We had been dating 3 months at the time (been on and off for 13 years... this was after a break and we had gotten back together) but regardless I was not invited with him. The B&G didn't think we were in a serious enough relationship to warrant him being invited.

it's kinda funny actually b/c that couple is getting a divorce now. Karma is a b*tch ;)

thurmanpowell · December 2012

As far as inviting SO's, does anyone know the rule for underage SOs?

My aunt added my underage cousin's boyfriend to the reply card, but luckily he couldn't come (go figure, they live out of state) so I didn't have to address it. But still, I wonder.

OwningAHome1981 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:5ee81b86-1aca-49d1-929a-f9bedb273253">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]As the Knot board rule of BFs and GFs MUST be invited, that is not what many etiquette authorities say -- Here is what Peggy Post, Emily Post and Jodi Smith say. Peggy Post -- page 89 says spouses, fiances and live in partners. Emily Post, page 573 says same thing Jodi Smith, The Etiquette Book, page 133, says spouse and live -in As to the board's insistence that any BF or GF must be included, that is a rule of some people here. Maybe their thinking is that their relationship was just as good as any live-in, so a BF or GF should be invited. That is not what Peggy Post, Emily Post (I realize not her, but whomever is editing that book now) or Smith are saying. As to this GF being long-term, this GF is also fomer "other woman", so I think both those facts should be on the table. In any event, I think at best, this is not clear, and FDH should decide.
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

It doesn't matter if she is the other woman or his prostitute, if this is FI's father, he should be allowed to have a date.

Now, I'm not one to say everyone should get a date- BUT I think certain factors need to be considered ex: age of the person and closeness to the B&G. I don't really think my 16 year old cousin needs to be invited with a date nor do I think my 3rd cousin once removed from UT needs to be invited with a date. Any close adult relative should be invited with a date.

OwningAHome1981 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:d4110737-456c-47cb-b2e5-32b42204d5f1">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]Thurman, I personally would have let it slide, but I think a lot of people on here would say you don't have to for underage couples.
Posted by Edie Bee[/QUOTE]

Ya, we are not inviting dates for underage couples. Too freakin bad, this is not romper room.

thurmanpowell · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:d4110737-456c-47cb-b2e5-32b42204d5f1">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]Thurman, I personally would have let it slide, but I think a lot of people on here would say you don't have to for underage couples.
Posted by Edie Bee[/QUOTE]

Good to know! I think I would have let it slide too, although I was weirded at by my Aunt transporting who I presume is a minor across state lines for a party!

s-aries8990 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:5ee81b86-1aca-49d1-929a-f9bedb273253">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]As the Knot board rule of BFs and GFs MUST be invited, that is not what many etiquette authorities say -- Here is what Peggy Post, Emily Post and Jodi Smith say. Peggy Post -- page 89 says spouses, fiances and live in partners. Emily Post, page 573 says same thing Jodi Smith, The Etiquette Book, page 133, says spouse and live -in As to the board's insistence that any BF or GF must be included, that is a rule of some people here. Maybe their thinking is that their relationship was just as good as any live-in, so a BF or GF should be invited. That is not what Peggy Post, Emily Post (I realize not her, but whomever is editing that book now) or Smith are saying. As to this GF being long-term, this GF is also fomer "other woman", so I think both those facts should be on the table. In any event, I think at best, this is not clear, and FDH should decide.
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

Both of those facts were still on the table and FMIL knows that FFIL and GF are still together.

Again, OP, invite both and let FMIL decide if she would like to attend.

Only a person in the relationship can judge it's seriousness and to knowingly make your guests uncomfortable and not accomodate their reasonable request is against etiquette.

s-aries8990 · December 2012

I think if a guest gets their own invite and they have a SO, that SO should be invited. If the guest is included on their parents, they are presumably still children and don't have to have their SO's invited.

AddieCake · December 2012

We invited all SO's regardless of age.

NYU, to not invite the father's girlfriend of EIGHT YEARS would be absurd.

OwningAHome1981 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:84aecc44-ca94-43a3-b4d7-0d06732d5a86">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Divorced ILs? : Which is why the rule of married, engaged or (maybe) live togethor works so well - it eliminates any need to judge the seriousness of the relationship. These are objective criteria which do not require any judgement.
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

yes but just b/c a couple is not engaged or living together doesn't mean their relationship isn't serious... and conversely, just b/c a couple lives together doesn't mean that it is.

thurmanpowell · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:84aecc44-ca94-43a3-b4d7-0d06732d5a86">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Divorced ILs? : Which is why the rule of married, engaged or (maybe) live togethor works so well - it eliminates any need to judge the seriousness of the relationship. These are objective criteria which do not require any judgement.
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

What about gay and lesbian couples? While it may not be a problem in NY, in most of the country (at least until maybe june *crosses fingers*) being married or engaged truly is no judgement on their relationship.

thurmanpowell · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:3b0de074-77a9-43ab-938b-4d7a7b90a599">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]We invited all SO's regardless of age. NYU, to not invite the father's girlfriend of EIGHT YEARS would be absurd.
Posted by AddieL73[/QUOTE]

Even kids? I didn't even think about who minors were dating when planning my guest list.

Edit: not that I'm saying your wrong, I just truly didn't even consider it until I got the reply card back!

OwningAHome1981 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:477add1c-6079-4106-a32f-bfa6efa4ff01">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Divorced ILs? : Even kids? I didn't even think about who minors were dating when planning my guest list. Edit: not that I'm saying your wrong, I just truly didn't even consider it until I got the reply card back!
Posted by thurmanpowell[/QUOTE]

I don't think minors need to be invited with dates, How serious can that be? I love him b/c he bought me a lollipop.... lol. I'm drawing the line at minors with dates.. def. not, lol.

AddieCake · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:477add1c-6079-4106-a32f-bfa6efa4ff01">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Divorced ILs? : Even kids? I didn't even think about who minors were dating when planning my guest list. Edit: not that I'm saying your wrong, I just truly didn't even consider it until I got the reply card back!
Posted by thurmanpowell[/QUOTE]

<div>Yes, even kids, but we only had 1 teenager under 18. The "young" people were 18-20. There were about 10 of those. Everyone we invited got a +1, whether they were in relationships or single. </div>

AddieCake · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:fee89a81-970e-414a-976f-fec2ddaa6b63">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Divorced ILs? : I don't think minors need to be invited with dates, How serious can that be? I love him b/c he bought me a lollipop.... lol. I'm drawing the line at minors with dates.. def. not, lol.
Posted by OwningAHome1981[/QUOTE]

<div>For us, it didn't matter how "serious" it was. My 17-year-old cousin had been dating his girlfriend for over a year. We were not about to suggest he couldn't bring her. And I wouldn't have cared if he had been single and wanted to bring a random girl. We felt strongly in giving everyone a +1. </div>

LiLe422 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:84aecc44-ca94-43a3-b4d7-0d06732d5a86">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: Divorced ILs? : Which is why the rule of married, engaged or (maybe) live togethor works so well - it eliminates any need to judge the seriousness of the relationship. These are objective criteria which do not require any judgement.
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

You're joking, right? FI and I were together almost 10 years before were got engaged. So by your logic, our relationship wasn't considered <em>serious </em>until he put a ring on it? Give me a flucking break.

mcda04 · December 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_divorced-ils?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:242924ce-5d7b-42a5-9c07-da79a1a74f03Post:7f5f53f6-4943-4c90-9a82-5be1bc28493a">Re: Divorced ILs?</a>:
[QUOTE]McD -- the dad does not have a spouse. Eddie -- you are wrong. I went back a few months ago and cited chapter and verse from Emily Post, etc. Not every BF/GF is an automatic invite.
Posted by NYUgirl100[/QUOTE]

It's still his SO. Even if they're not living together, 8 years is a serious relationship therefore his gf must be invited.

H and I just got married after being together for 8, would you seriously exclude me from the guest list if we weren't married?

StephBeanWed61502 · December 2012

Oh goody! Today it's NYU's turn to turn a relatively simple question into a 200-post thread where everyone repeatedly bangs their head into the same brick wall for two days.

Seriously though, why do we keep doing this to ourselves?

Divorced ILs?

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