I'd say it's 3rd or 4th date conversation.

mrsconn23

Dear Prudence,

I have a bit of a moral question for you. I am a straight male who is about to turn 30. For a number of reasons (initially medical, which has evolved into just not being my preference to explore other options), I will not be having children. I would still like to find a life partner. As I have dated throughout my twenties, I haven’t felt the need to lead off with this information with women I have dated. Of course, if anyone asked, I answered truthfully, but it hasn’t felt like something that I need to advertise on the first, or even second, date. I’ve waited for it to arise naturally. As I am nearing 30, I am aware that the situation for women I date is changing. Biologically, if they want to have children, it is more imperative for them to “not waste time” with a potential partner who cannot offer that. My question is, do I need to bring this up very early on? It seems rather presumptuous to just offer this information to someone I just met, but I also do not want to be an impediment for someone with that goal. Broaching this also feels like a backhanded way to say to someone “hey, you’re getting old,” which is rude. Any advice would be appreciated.

—Rude Either Way

banana468

I think this is a wait and see thing. 

VarunaTT

I wonder how LW is meeting women.  When it's on apps, most profiles I see just lay it out there about kids.  Why waste time for anyone?

If IRL, I guess I'd wait to see if an actual relationship is going to develop.  I'm assuming LW is a cishet man, but I feel like cis women in their 30s who want children that they don't already have, will also be very frank on this subject early on.  I think he's kind of borrowing trouble.

CharmedPam

Exactly @VarunaTT.  i was wondering how he was meeting them too. I always look at the “have kids” and “want kids” category.  However some people dont read that - or think they can change minds

charlotte989875

I’m trying to believe he’s well intentioned and doesn’t want to lead anyone on- if that’s the case wait until it comes up naturally. I doubt anyone dating in their 30s hasn’t figured out their own stance on kids, and you should share yours when it feels appropriate. I’d also say 3-4 dates is probably right. 

MyNameIsNot

This was a 3 date rule thing for me. I've been married to long to have been out there for dating apps, but I knew from college that kids were not in the plan. I didn't mind dating someone who didn't want kids, but I wanted to get it out there before we started thinking about being a couple or anything. 

I split with my first love because we weren't aligned on kids, so I might have been overly cautious. But I do remember H and I bonding about not wanting kids the first time we hung out, before we even decided it was actually a date.

short+sassy

I was a heavy online dater back when I was single.  Those were the earlier days of online dating and I don't remember there being a big profile to fill out.  This question usually came up early on in chatting conversation (not by me).  Before a date was requested, but when there seemed to be enough of a vibe that we'd both want to meet.  At the time, I was unsure if I'd ever want children or not.  I felt pretty ambivalent about it.  Like if I married someone who did, that's cool.  And if I married someone who didn't, that's also cool (and a bit my lean).

So I'm also finding it weird that his experiences sound different.

I specifically remember one guy who told me up front that he couldn't have children and also didn't want any.  I think it was on our first chat.

Uggghhh!  Then there was this "winner".  Who was so bad I still remember it, even though we never met.  The first sentences in our chat was him establishing that he was looking for a serious relationship that would hopefully lead to marriage and that he wanted children.  I told him I also wanted to get married someday and was open to having children.  We also talked about our ages, what we did for a living, and both mentioned that we'd never been married and didn't have any kids.  The troubling conversation that followed:

Him:  "Why don't you have any kids?"
Me:  "Because I've never been married."
Him:  "Still, that's weird at your age.  Is there something wrong with you?"
Me (so ancient at 25):  "As far as I know there isn't anything wrong with me.  But since we live in a first world country with readily available access to birth control, I have always taken great pains to not get pregnant until I am ready.  But you're 32.  What's your excuse?  Is there something wrong with you?"
Him:  "It sounds like there is something wrong with you.  Just be honest.  I told you it is very important to me to have children."
Me:  "I don't know what you are not understanding about the concept of birth control.  But good luck with your search."  (Block)

CharmedPam

25 @short+sassy!!! 25?!? I scoff at him.

short+sassy

CharmedPam said:

25 @short+sassy!!! 25?!? I scoff at him.

OMG, yes!  And such a chauvinistic vibe that somehow all women should be pregnant before they hit their mid-20s and it's so unusual if they aren't.

But "Is there something wrong with you" will forever live on in my top 10 of one of the most ridiculous things a guy has said to me.  Something I still LMAO off about 25 years later when I think of it.  Thanks for the memories, creepy dude.

MyNameIsNot

short+sassy said:

I was a heavy online dater back when I was single.  Those were the earlier days of online dating and I don't remember there being a big profile to fill out.  This question usually came up early on in chatting conversation (not by me).  Before a date was requested, but when there seemed to be enough of a vibe that we'd both want to meet.  At the time, I was unsure if I'd ever want children or not.  I felt pretty ambivalent about it.  Like if I married someone who did, that's cool.  And if I married someone who didn't, that's also cool (and a bit my lean).

So I'm also finding it weird that his experiences sound different.

I specifically remember one guy who told me up front that he couldn't have children and also didn't want any.  I think it was on our first chat.

Uggghhh!  Then there was this "winner".  Who was so bad I still remember it, even though we never met.  The first sentences in our chat was him establishing that he was looking for a serious relationship that would hopefully lead to marriage and that he wanted children.  I told him I also wanted to get married someday and was open to having children.  We also talked about our ages, what we did for a living, and both mentioned that we'd never been married and didn't have any kids.  The troubling conversation that followed:

Him:  "Why don't you have any kids?"
Me:  "Because I've never been married."
Him:  "Still, that's weird at your age.  Is there something wrong with you?"
Me (so ancient at 25):  "As far as I know there isn't anything wrong with me.  But since we live in a first world country with readily available access to birth control, I have always taken great pains to not get pregnant until I am ready.  But you're 32.  What's your excuse?  Is there something wrong with you?"
Him:  "It sounds like there is something wrong with you.  Just be honest.  I told you it is very important to me to have children."
Me:  "I don't know what you are not understanding about the concept of birth control.  But good luck with your search."  (Block)

I do kind of see why his experience would be different. Women are conditioned not to bring up the long term topics like marriage and kids too soon, especially if we want them, because we were taught to play hard to get and not to look desperate to force a man into a relationship. He may be dating a lot of women who know where they stand but are hesitant to bring it up for fear of looking desperate. 

Men are more likely to have been taught to be direct and assertive about what they want. 

short+sassy

@MyNameIsNot, Interesting!  Now that you mention it, the gender thing does make a lot of sense.

I wasn't worried about playing hard to get.  But I didn't want to bring up heavy conversations right away because I was worried about scaring a guy off for being "too serious, too soon".  Because that is the stereotype about women and relationships, even though it's silly.

STARMOON44

Absolutely put it on your app profile and disclose it early on!