I can love him, but can I live with him?

melissadefelice · February 2010

My FI and I have been dating for 2 years, and have been engaged for 2 months. We are getting married in July 2011.

He owns a house, I do not and currently rent. I will be moving into his house. The thing is, he is a slob. His house is very old (structure is sound, though) but it looks like a college apartment. It is not a "home" more than it is a dingy bachelor pad he has been living in for the past 4 years with guy friends as roommates. (They will all be gone when we wed and I move in) He has junk everywhere and does not feel the need to dust, mop, vacuum, or clean the bathroom/toilets. Now, I am well aware that this is how guys live - but he has a dog (who is way to big for the house) that sheds, and he won't vacuum for MONTHS. The toilet, which is white, is black/brown inside and is very hard to get clean. Dishes and trash will collect mold and stink. He treats his house like crap and doesn't make repairs, so little things become larger problems. Plus, his DOG has free run of every corner of the house - and there is much damage to windows/furniture. AND - the dog has a bed in every room - and not a nice bed, a pile of old, dirty, ripped sheets and blankets. He refuses to let me buy "real" dog beds to replace them.
He really doesn't care that he lives in his own filth - when I bring it up, he makes it out that I'm being a bitchy nag. I refuse to spend any nights there because of the horrible smell and allergies I get from all the dog hair and dust.

I know men can't change, and I know I will have to do most of the cleaning in the relationship. But how do I get this house up to speed before I officially move in? He is working with me to re-paint and redo the rooms and make it a "home", but he gets tense when I do things like reorganize and clean the kitchen. BTW - he thinks it would be AWESOME to redo the kitchen in diamond plating. (the material most tool chests are made of on the back of pick up trucks.) I am stressed when I go into his house because I know I can afford a much better, cleaner, more open house than the old dirty one he owns and has failed to maintain for the past 4 years. He owes MUCH MORE on the house than it is worth right now, so selling is not an option. I don't even know where I will put all my stuff because he has so much stuff everywhere.

We are working on getting the house ready for me - but I have a hard time with it because he makes me feel like I'm barging in and dictating his life. But then again, it will be MY house too in a little over a year. I wish we could have had a situation where we bought a house together! Can I make this work!!???!?!?!?

krmabojo · February 2010

"Now, I am well aware that this is how guys live" - Hmmm... I must be lucky, because My FI has always been tidy... even before I moved in.

"I know men can't change, and I know I will have to do most of the cleaning in the relationship. " - Looks like you are making excuses for his laziness... man CAN change, just mabe yours REFUSES to.

"he gets tense when I do things like reorganize and clean the kitchen." - This is simply because he is used to having things in certain places; you would be annoyed to if someone came in and moved everything around. Ask him where he wants things, let him know what you think, especially if something fits better somewhere else. Just do not go in adn change everything on him. Meet his half way.

Basically, you just need to talk to him. If you are a neat freak and he is well, the opposite, there ARE going to be issues. So what if a plate or the coffee pot is out of place, or if you missed a day of vacuuming.

I have a house, Fi and a dog all under one roof and we do fine. I do more indoor work, FI does more outdoor work. There is crossing over though.

I would say if there is something your FI hates doing (cleaning the bathroom) and if you do not mind, just clean it yourself. gatta meet half way.

melissadefelice · February 2010

The dog is a rescued dog, is about 5 years old, and has no house manners. I grew up with two dogs, but they were outside dogs. I do not like animals sleeping in my bed.
This dog is crazy and runs around the house like a nut and is a medium sized dog so this results in damage and sometimes injury to myself (I have a healing cut on my chest right now from the last time he jumped on me.) My FI does not let the dog just go outside for fear that he will "jump the fence and run away". He goes out to pee every few hours on a leash, then he's back inside. The dog never gets to run outdside - ever. I understand that for the past 2 years it has just been my FI and his dog, but the dog is like his spoiled child. It goes everywhere, is allowed to do anything, and runs his life. The dog is not agressive, but is very playful and has never been repremanded to not be crazy in the house - and though my FI has tried to train him since I've stressed my concerns, he's not consistent and roughhouses with the mutt in the house most of the time. I am concerned about having an infant in the same house as that dog. My dad was just at the house to help with some repairs this week and said the same thing to me about the dog. He is conerned about our future kid's safety. So I know it's not just me seeing it. His roomates can't stand the dog either - and these are people who grew up with dogs in their house. It is out of control. Plus, like I said before, I do not believe animals should have free range of the house. They are animals, pets, not children. They do not belong sleeping on my pillow, which is disgusting. As far as the hair - I have a vacuum that cleans animal hair - my concern is that my FI has no problem living in filth and I'm afraid I am going to be his maid for the rest of my life. Plus, the dog comes before me - and I'm afraid it will someday come before our children.

melissadefelice · February 2010

"Basically, you just need to talk to him."

I've been talking to him for the past 2 years. Trust me, I'm not some crazy nut moving in and moving stuff around. I am just trying to clean. I spent the entire weekend cleaning mold off his walls. It's pretty bad. I'm not the neatest either, but even his own parents won't go into his house it is so bad.

duckie1905 · February 2010

Okay, so really the problem is just as much the dog as the mess?

First of all, you don't have children so I'm not sure why, at this point, you are concerned for these non-existent childrens' safety. Your future children really aren't the issue.

As for the dog, it isn't his fault he behaves the way he does. It is your FI's fault that he wasn't trained properly. While I don't agree with you on a lot of your dog-treatment beliefs (I don't mind dogs that have reign of the house and sleep on/near the bed) you need to live with this dog too.

I think it would completely horrible for you to suggest that he get rid of the dog or turn him into an outside dogs (many dogs are not built for strictly outside living) but it would not be a bad idea to discuss his plans for training so that you can live with him as well.

You'll have to give some to get some in this situation. Maybe you each walk him once a day. And, instead of making him and outside dog perhaps he gets access to the whole first floor but not the second. And, if he consents to dog beds you'll help keep them clean.

duckie1905 · February 2010

At this point you both need to talk to each other. If he's not willing to give and you aren't willing to, either, then you need to decide if you can really deal with his mess and un-trained dog for the rest of your life.

redheadfsu · February 2010

I have two rescue dogs.

Seriously just train him. Dogs should be inside dogs. An outside dog is a no no in the rescue world. It is just mean. Sounds like the dog needs exercise. Walk him. He will be your dog too. Do not pull the kid card, dogs are very protective & careful around kids. [Edit: as long as they are not red case aggressive & you said your future dog was only playful.] So TRAIN HIM & WALK HIM. My dogs are my kids. You can help the dog be a happier & healthier dog if you lose your attitude.

Don't be his maid - it is very simple. Have a choreboard & he will step up if he cares about you & you don't nag. Hire a maid if it is that bad.

OP-Please read this link

LesaBear · February 2010

This is how my FI used to live. - minus the dog,

Men CAN change. Hygiene is something that I think is completely acceptable to try and change in a man's life. That said I don't think it's at all realistic to try and get the house up to your standards while his roommates are there. If everyone who lives there does not pitch in, it's not gonna happen. I wouldn't expect drastic change until after you move in.

Talk to him about your concerns and how you will share housework and drop it until it is much closer to the move in date. There's no reason to think you should have to do most of the cleaning.

lisarose7 · February 2010

Moving in together is always a compromise. FI and I have lived together for most of our 7 1/2 year relationship and it was NOT always easy. He always got mad at me for leaving snotty tissues lying around and I would yell at him for leaving dead animals in the freezer (he's a trapper). We both talked about what bothered us about the other's living habits and did our best to be accommodating. I agree with the PP who mentioned each having your own space. That way each of you has a room to do whatever you want and you can compromise on the others.

dsouldiva · February 2010

Toilet - go to the hardware store and invest in some Caustic Soda, leave it over night and it will eat through the stains (wear rubber gloves)

Dog - invest in some training lessons and send dog & Fi (it's more often the owner that needs training than the dog), buy Fi a dog mitt and ask him to brush the dog twice a week, this should minimise shedding.

Make your Fi have a brutal clear out, quarantine items he won't let go of i.e. put them away for 6 months and if he hasn't used them or needed them then they go in the bin or to the charity shop (don't try this with items of sentimental value!)

Talk to your Fi and agree how things will change when you move in, he's probably just clinging on to his bachelor days for as long as he can, he probably knows it's time to be a grown up now!

psichick · February 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_chit-chat_can-love-him-but-can-live-him?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:14Discussion:72c0f41b-5872-41a6-9efa-af482ab2a32bPost:f5647977-3f9e-4afb-a2aa-914d7f4589b1">Re: I can love him, but can I live with him?</a>:
[QUOTE] Plus, the dog comes before me - and I'm afraid it will someday come before our children.
Posted by melissadefelice[/QUOTE]

so you're jealous of the dog? and you seem to just go in and do whatever you want in his house, moving things and making demands. you don't seem like you're willing to compromise about anything and you've already made up your mind that the dog needs to go. so.....are you looking for us to validate your behavior and attitude? i for one won't.

goheels05 · February 2010

Duckie and I seem to be sharing a brain today. No, all men do not live like this. My husband has always maintained a clean household, even when he lived alone with his male roommates. He shouldn't have to get rid of the dog, but it definitely sounds like some training is in order.

Doing all the housework isn't a great idea. You will resent him for it.

You two need to have a frank but calm discussion about how you will manage your household, and come to some terms you can both agree with.

CA2MT4EveR · February 2010

I dated a guy who was super OCD about clean. Pretty much after he rewashed the dishes I washed I knew it was time to go. Not all guys are slobs. Not all girls are super clean

kkrissel · February 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_chit-chat_can-love-him-but-can-live-him?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:14Discussion:72c0f41b-5872-41a6-9efa-af482ab2a32bPost:f5647977-3f9e-4afb-a2aa-914d7f4589b1">Re: I can love him, but can I live with him?</a>:
[QUOTE] Plus, the dog comes before me - and I'm afraid it will someday come before our children.
Posted by melissadefelice[/QUOTE]
<font class="Apple-style-span" color="#800080">
</font><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#800080">Looks to me like you have some other issues to sort out besides cleanliness. Having a dog come before human beings in his life is a MAJOR issue. May I suggest premarital counseling? </font></div>

EMF9903 · February 2010

Im not sure what I would do about the living situation... my mom was in a relationship like this where she would help him with his house to make it more livable then he would just not take care of the work they had done.... Im sure its frustrating but it appears that its something you can work through when youre moved in it is your house too. The idea of sharing household chores is an excellent one but sadly in my experience it didnt work but things get done when they need to by either me or my fiance. You can always try it see what happens but I would recomend leaving things alone until it is actually your shared house, just my opinion.

a PP mentioned walking the dog yourself, from what Ive learned thats an excellent idea because the dog will start to respect you as an owner as well. Something that might be fun is if you actually signed up for dog training classes, Pet Smart offers some, may not be top notch but it would be a bonding time for you and the dog. It sounds silly to bond with a dog but thats how they begin to listen to you and will be better behaved.

Good luck I hope things work out for you!

Ken&Cass · February 2010

Hire a cleaning person.

jenn.daniel · February 2010

I would suggest hiring someone to do a big clean before you move in. He can change, but it's slow going. Work on getting dishes to the kitchen sink before you worry about him washing them.

As far as the dog, you are going to have to accept him because you're going to be his mommy. It sounds like he just needs to be trained. If he jumps a lot, maybe he needs to be walked more. He should be allowed to spend more time in the yard. Once he is well trained, he should be allowed to run in the yard while he is watched. I honestly think if your FI sees you trying to make friends with his dog, he'll be more willing to clean up a little more.

megandjay · February 2010

Move in before you get married, and try it out. My parents are divorced, and all my life my Mom said that I should live with someone before I marry them, because she loved my Dad but they just could not live together. Better to find that out BEFORE the wedding.

All men are not slobs, my FI is usually reminding me on cleaning day.

The dog needs training, don't blame him for lack of manners if he was never taught any.

Men CAN change, anyone can change, but only if they WANT to change.

And as PP said, hire a cleaning service to do a big clean out, then it is just about maintenance.

anne.azano · February 2010

It sounds like he doesn't so much need to change as grow up! Living in filth is immature and there's no reason you should have to compromise on that. Obviously moving in with anyone requires compromise on both parts, but from what you've said, he seems unwilling to do so.

Not walking or training your dog is neglect. He shouldn't own a dog if he's not going to take care of it. And I think you're right to consider how this will play out with future children.

I think you should really seriously think about spending the rest of your life with this man. I'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but the beatles were wrong! You need more than love! The honeymoon period will end and you need to be prepared for living with this man. You're already disgusted and resentful. How will you feel in a few years? in 10 years?

My advice echoes what most of the other girls have said...take the dog to a training class and start walking it so it's tired and not such a maniac. Buy dog beds whether he likes it or not. Stop letting the dog on the beds for humans. It's not a human!

Regarding the house, hire a cleaner to get the worst of it. Organise a chore sheet. Ask him to start by cleaning for 5 minutes a day, whether it's putting a few things away, vacuuming one room, doing a sinkful of dishes, whatever. But, start slow.

Consider selling/renting that house and starting over together. And definitely get some marriage counseling. Good luck!

anne.azano · February 2010

Also, why not have some dog-walking dates? That could kill two birds with one stone... you tire the dog out, and have a chance to talk to your FI about how you feel without distractions. I find that my best talks with my FI about the stuff that matters take place on walks around our neighbourhood after dinner. It's a nice cheap date. Grab the dog, get a coffee somewhere and walk and talk about the issues that are bothering you.

Also, I'm sorry if I sounded harsh in my previous post. How old is he? It's pretty normal for some guys to live like frat boys in the years after university. It doesn't mean he can't/won't change. He may find he likes living in a clean house. I mean, who wouldn't?

Make sure you work on some kind of division of labor so you aren't resentful. If cleanliness is important to you and he doesn't care and doesn't want to do it, inside can be mostly your responsibility. However, that means he should be in charge of the car or the bills or the yard work. Just make sure you don't get stuck with everything. You are not his mother or his maid. You will be his wife and in this day and age, a husband and wife share the housework.

brookelynpaisley · February 2010

I'm picturing a 5-year-old living in the house from Fight Club. Blech.

I agree that if you can move in before the wedding, you should do so. Not all men are slobs. My husband is far tidier than I am, but I'm more of the cleaner when it comes to chores. It's finding a way to compromise and it doesn't sound like he is, or perhaps you're not approaching it the right way. Either way, it sounds like he gets harsh when you try to broach the subject. Premarital counseling and dog training are both good ideas in this case. And I agree that there seems to be a conflict of values here. That may sound extreme because it's "just a dirty house" but we're talking about his living environment and the chaos he's willing to live with. I'd take a serious step back and assess this situation.

anne.azano · February 2010

I think I was picturing the fight club house too!!! Hopefully it's not that bad...

melissadefelice · February 2010

I do plan to move in before we get married. I use to live an hour away for the first part of our relationship and would "live" in the house on the weekends and during extended breaks from work (I'm a teacher).

Basically, we are in the "getting ready for me to move in" stage. He is cleaning out the stuff that has accumulated over the past 4 years to make room for my stuff. I moved from my apartment to a room in my parent's house, so I have already downsized significantly.

I probably won't move in until one of his two roomates moves out, maybe this summer. I basically live between my parent's and his house. I clean on the weekends - basically, if I am going to own the house soon, someone needs to maintain it. He lets me clean, and has made an effort to tidy up when I am not there.

I also have started being the disciplinarian for the dog. The dog actually has a closer relationship with me now. I'm shocked, it's not too far from kids - they crave dicipline!

melissadefelice · February 2010

Actually, the dog-walk dates are an awesome idea. Last summer we use to walk his dog to Rita's Water Ice about two blocks away. That was nice for us and the dog loved to be around all those little kids and to lick the ice cream off their hands! (for being crazy he is GREAT around kids - unless there is another dog or a cat, then he's almost uncontrollable)

He is 27 years old, and really does need to grow up. He bought the house 4 years ago with a friend, so it was two young guys owning a house, and renting it out to their friends - so you can imagine the state it is in! He's having trouble adjusting to the "I'm going to be married" changes that occur.

anne.azano · February 2010

Well, 27 isn't too old! I'm sure he'll grow up and adjust. Just make sure you both know what you're getting into, and that he is aware he will have to make some changes and that you shouldn't be forced to live in filth just because he is willing to. Good luck and have fun walking the dog together!

I can love him, but can I live with him?

Re: I can love him, but can I live with him?

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