So heated!!!!!! Vent...really long

volleygurl0306 · February 2012

So have to give some back story. One of my BM, R, has a chronic problem with dating bad guys. Not just guys who aren't right for her but HORRIBLE human beings. At 17 a man who was 32 got her pregnant (to highlight the horrible, he also had another woman pregnant with his 3rd child). My friend decided to keep her daughter but the dad is not involved. So of most recent R had been with this guy for about a yr and a half. Idk if "with" is even the right word. All they have in common is sex. This guy has a serious testosterone imbalance (anyone else know a balanced guy who works out 2x a day, has sex 4 times a day, AND has her go down on him to completion at least once...EVERY DAY) combined with a like for aggressive sex. R actually allows him to choke her during sex! She doesn't enjoy it, she just does it for him. I say to each his own but that's not okay with someone that aggressive. To top it off, he is in the country on a student visa which is about to expire. Until about a month ago he would not call her his girlfriend but all of a sudden started telling her he wants to marry her. Also, he never does just typical stuff...take her to a movie or even buy her dinner! It sex at his place and TV then more sex. I know I can't know everything about their "relationship" but this has bad news written all over it.

The hardest part for me is not her...she's a grown woman and if she wants to screw up her life and won't listen to anyone (everyone of her friends, her parents, and even FI have had heart-to-hearts about how he needs to go) fine screw up your life. But she's solely responsible for her 5 year old daughter! She will stay at this guys house and come home (her mom's house) first thing in the morning. But, because she's so tired she'll be late getting her daughter to school. Not ok in my book. This guy has never been alone with her daughter and they have different view points on child-rearing (he believes in spankings and such, she doesnt). I asked her if he was good with kids and would make a good father. Her response? "That's not something I typically think about when I'm dating a guy." WHAT?! I think of that and I don't have any kids!

Okay so that's how upsetting this whole situation is. I've honestly considered calling immigration on this guy! So after the doing w/e they are for a year and a half, I and my other friend finally met the guy tonight! He's either been afraid to meet us or she's been afraid to bring him around but he's never met any of her friends before tonight (also find this weird). I wanted to immediately threaten him to get the eff away from her but put on a smile and shook the jerk's hand. R explained how she was in my wedding. He just had this blank stare like he had no clue she was going to be a BM. So then he asked when I was getting married. I said September and he said his sister was getting married around them. Without missing a beat, my friend says "Oh I may have to miss your wedding then to go to his sisters." Are you serious?!

What makes it better is after she says this she giggled and looked at him and said "I'm going to be invited right?" and he just shrugged! So joking or not it really crossed her mind to jump ship on my wedding to go to a wedding she doesn't even know she's invited to and for someone she doesn't know (his family is all in his home country).

I managed to not reach out and slap her and I changed the subject. Didn't help because she iced the cake. It wasn't to the gravity of the previous comment but was inconsiderate nonetheless. She has a grad school interview on Friday and said she needed to find something to wear. I work in an office full-time so I said she could look through my stuff but it would probably fall off of her because it is even falling off me a little (shes a 00 and I'm a recent 4, used to be 6). And she said "oh I'm fat right now so that'll be perfect." And I said how they are 4's and 6's. She said "oh nevermind I'm not THAT fat." I get that if you're small a 6 can be big for your frame but those are my clothes that have fit me before. I just walked away from her. I'm furious! More about the wedding thing than the fat thing because I'm happy with my shape and work hard and know I'm not fat but it's like she became as much of an a$$hole as he is because he was around.

MrsReynolds12 · February 2012

I'm so sorry to hear that. Personally I would have told she doesn't have to bother coming to the wedding since she was so quick to jump ship at the idea of possibly getting an invite to another wedding. But I would have done that out of anger I dint suggest you do it. I really don't know what to tell you. Your friend is being a jerk and I hope she gets it together so she can support you on your big day. I hope things get better soon. You seem like a great friend to continue supporting her and even choosing to meet the dope she's dating. I couldn't do it.

kellycatalo · February 2012

wow, this girl seems like a huge bia. i'm guessing it's just this guy because she must have been nice and normal at one point since you guys have been friends for so long. i'd try to have a serious talk to her without her guy around, and just truly lay everything out for her. i can't believe she'd be so willing to miss your wedding to go to one for someone she doesn't even know!

honestly though, i wouldn't feel that bad if she couldn't make it to your wedding, i'd just want to know now. if she is really like this, she doesn't deserve to be your friend or to see you get married. my rule of thumb with inviting people has been only invite people that i plan on being friends with 5 years from now, and she seems like she might not be around then.

morenachica110 · February 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-club-boards_september-2012-weddings_so-heated-ventreally-long?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20Club%20BoardsForum:a464c18c-2e4d-469b-8eae-3865079cb9cfDiscussion:f89cacaf-50f9-4b7b-aa75-b694fb89745dPost:75eba240-cce0-4f6f-86e2-4c7824187b3f">Re: So heated!!!!!! Vent...really long</a>:
[QUOTE]wow, this girl seems like a huge bia. i'm guessing it's just this guy because she must have been nice and normal at one point since you guys have been friends for so long. i'd try to have a serious talk to her without her guy around, and just truly lay everything out for her. i can't believe she'd be so willing to miss your wedding to go to one for someone she doesn't even know! honestly though, i wouldn't feel that bad if she couldn't make it to your wedding, i'd just want to know now. if she is really like this, she doesn't deserve to be your friend or to see you get married. my rule of thumb with inviting people has been only invite people that i plan on being friends with 5 years from now, and she seems like she might not be around then.
Posted by kellycatalo[/QUOTE]

<div>I totally agree with all of this. I would tell her everything and if she doesn't want to take your advice and make a change, then it's on her. I do feel bad for her kid, though. =(</div>

caterpillar85 · February 2012

I'd figure out how to say "you are a huge douche bag and if you don't leave her alone I will cut your precious peepee off" in his home language. Maybe coincidentally have some scissors in your purse.

likeadeadstar · February 2012

I agree that he sounds bad for her, but I am going to step in and say that judging two grown adults for aggressive sex and frequent sex is really not your business. Some people do have sex frequently in a day. Further, there's nothing wrong with choking or other physical aggression if both parties are perfectly willing (your friend agrees to do it to please him, which isn't great or ideal, but she IS agreeing). I don't think any of this is really relevant at all here.

/end sex positive counsellor intervention

I think the big area where you should intervene as a friend is her neglect of her daughter and also, the fact that he's avoided meeting her friends.... almost as if he's isolating her. Her deference over his sister's wedding also seems.... off.... Her comments about weight may be coming from things he's said to her. I'd cool off and calmly express my concerns in terms of being worried for her and her daughter, leaving weddings out of it. Because this is about friendship right now, not whether or not she comes to your wedding etc. If she is being psychologically abused behind the scenes, you can't blame her for acting this way or say "Oh she's not worth having as a friend anyway!" She's not herself.

That said, if she chooses to stay with him.... there's nothing you can do, except be there to support her and encourage her to leave him. You can't make her do it or make threats or ultimatums; you'll just isolate her further. Step back, invite her to the wedding, let what happens happen. I'd only suggest intervening if there is clear physical danger (she's got marks on her she can't explain) or her daughter is in danger of serious neglect (maybe have her mom step in?).

romamor4 · February 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-club-boards_september-2012-weddings_so-heated-ventreally-long?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20Club%20BoardsForum:a464c18c-2e4d-469b-8eae-3865079cb9cfDiscussion:f89cacaf-50f9-4b7b-aa75-b694fb89745dPost:d59e5931-2ec1-4b95-9d21-8651996017a3">Re: So heated!!!!!! Vent...really long</a>:
[QUOTE]I think the big area where you should intervene as a friend is her neglect of her daughter and also, the fact that he's avoided meeting her friends.... almost as if he's isolating her. Her deference over his sister's wedding also seems.... off.... Her comments about weight may be coming from things he's said to her. I'd cool off and calmly express my concerns in terms of being worried for her and her daughter, leaving weddings out of it. Because this is about friendship right now, not whether or not she comes to your wedding etc. If she is being psychologically abused behind the scenes, you can't blame her for acting this way or say "Oh she's not worth having as a friend anyway!" She's not herself. That said, if she chooses to stay with him.... there's nothing you can do, except be there to support her and encourage her to leave him. You can't make her do it or make threats or ultimatums; you'll just isolate her further. Step back, invite her to the wedding, let what happens happen. I'd only suggest intervening if there is clear physical danger (she's got marks on her she can't explain) or her daughter is in danger of serious neglect (maybe have her mom step in?).
Posted by likeadeadstar[/QUOTE]<div>
</div><div>I agree with this. No offense, but she sounds like a huge flake from what you say about her. But at some point she must have been a lot nicer for you to be friends with her, I think. This guy may be having an affect on her and she behaves more-so like a flake around him. I've seen many women do this very thing when around overbearing males. My first husband was also from out of the country and unfortunately had a male dominating attitude. I was different around him than I was around my friends when he wasn't there. So my questin is, how is she when he's not around? If I were you, I would try to meet with her more and be her close, close friend. Hopefully she will open up this way to you and be more vulnerable with you and be able to face her emotions in regard to the situation. Unfortunately, whether or not you like the guy (I don't blame you for not liking him at all! Sounds like a major DB), she is the one that has to come to grips with whether or not she is destroying her life and friendships because of it. Maybe she needs a dose of reality. But unfortunately she has to come to that conclusion. If you can help her in a non-invasive way, then wonderful!! </div><div>
</div><div>As I said before, my ex-husband did the very same thing as far as not meeting or getting to know my friends. He kept me very isolated. This makes you think that your relationship is normal when it's really not. It was emotional abuse but I let myself believe it was "love" because I was just trying to be culturally loving. I thank God I am out of that marriage and with a man who cares about me and doesn't isolate me or criticize me. It took a major event for me to start to see how wrong his behaviour was though. No friend telling me their concerns from the limited amount of time they saw me with him meant much because I figured they didn't understand him culturally. Thankfully I got out of that marriage fast. I unfortunately have to deal with the consequences though because I had a child with the DB and still have to deal with his games and manipulation.</div><div>
</div><div>I understand your worries about the wedding as well. That just sucks. I think she really needs a good friend right now though and that is the best way you can approach the subject with her. Just my two cents. Good luck!! I really hope you can find peace in this situation!

</div>

volleygurl0306 · February 2012

Thanks ladies! I've really tried to be supportive of her and to encourage her to do things that are right for her daughter but she's just a very mixed up person. I'm not going to lash out for her over the comments from last night, I was just so hurt to see this side of my friend. I know it was because of him because when it is just us, she's a sweetheart. As someone suggested, I make plans with her frequently just us or us and FI, but always suggest family-friendly plans so she can bring her daughter because I think this is important. Approaching the issues with him have become totally unaffective. To the point where she'll stop talking to friends for months for giving advice on why this all isn't healthy. Recently I've been thinking of approaching it from ther perspective of her daughter. Sadly, it is obvious to see her young daughter will almost inevitably have "daddy issues" since even my friend's dad is an MIA father and my friend won't even tell her daughter anything about her father when she asks (yes she's 5 but how long does the stork story last). She has no positive male influences on her life. My FI is the closest thing to that and he sees her only every few months.

likeadeadstar--I agree that two consenting adults have a right to have sex when they want, how they want, as frequently as they want. But, I've asked why they have sex so much and her response is "I'm afraid if I say no he'll leave me," which is clearly a form of emotional trauma/abuse/intimidation combined with her horrible self-esteem. Also, of most recent for his valentine's day gift she bought some restraints for her limbs and a gag ball. If that's your thing, I can understand that. But, then she told our friend she was kinda afraid to go thru with it because what if he went too far and she was tied down and couldn't do anything to help herself. This is way too scary to me. I think consenting means that we both feel safe doing it (hence the existence of safe words!) and enjoy doing it...that goes for everything from missionary to the most extreme sexual encounters.

On a lighter note, caterpillar...LOL! I was already out of my house when I found out I was going to get to meet King D-bag and my first thing I said to my friend was "should I turn around and get FI's gun so we can tell him to go back to his home country?" I was kidding. I think.

CowgirlK39 · February 2012

I think romamor has the best insight into this. Bad relationships are like drugs. Even though people tell someone to stop and that they are killing themselves, they don't realize it till they hit rock bottom. Sadly, it kills some people before they realize it. Same can be said about abusive relationships. If you do see physical injuries to her, or she tells you more frequently how she is afraid of the things he may do, you need to tell her family, or even call immigration. Get people involved. If you see that her daughter is looking unhealthy or even says things to you that make you worry about her safety, call the officials. But ultimately if you have no physical proof of abuse of either her or her daughter, you just have to let her hit rock bottom with him. It may take years but someday, the rose colored glasses will fall off.

My BM just recently broke up with her a-hole bf of four years who was emotionally abusive. She told me recently that she had no idea how much people hated him till it was all over and she could see things clearly. What was rock bottom for her was when she was in a friends wedding and saw what real pure love looked like, and realized that that was NOT what she had going on.

So heated!!!!!! Vent...really long

Re: So heated!!!!!! Vent...really long

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