For those following Prop 8

ricksang · August 2010

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=news/state&id=7613247

PetraStonegirl · August 2010

I hate that they put the infinite stay in place. However, I also understand that not doing so sets up a push/pull which would be very very hard on people who want to get married. Imaging being told, 'you can't get married. Oh! never mind, yes you can. Oh, damnit, no you can't" over and over again. Personally, I'd either wish to wait until it's final, or move someplace that respects me and wants me to be part of the community. Either way, I hope the Supreme Court makes up their freaking minds soon, now that it looks to be heading their direction.

TurtlesAllTheWayDown · August 2010

the LA County court was actualyl going to stay open later to allow more people to get marriage licenses. Since they anticipated issuing a huge amount. And they were going to let people request a marriage ceremony without an appointment (so basically immediately).

TurtlesAllTheWayDown · August 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_those-following-prop-8?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:1f12420c-1e7d-4c63-b5b5-03c5812c81c3Post:6b532bfc-ffae-405c-bf92-8503820e3ecb">Re: For those following Prop 8</a>:
[QUOTE]I hate that they put the infinite stay in place. However, I also understand that not doing so sets up a push/pull which would be very very hard on people who want to get married. Imaging being told, 'you can't get married. Oh! never mind, yes you can. Oh, damnit, no you can't" over and over again. Personally, I'd either wish to wait until it's final, or move someplace that respects me and wants me to be part of the community. Either way, I hope the Supreme Court makes up their freaking minds soon, now that it looks to be heading their direction.
Posted by PetraStonegirl[/QUOTE]

Well... I mean, there are gay people who are legally married in California. They married between the time the Supreme Court's decision went into effect and when voters passed prop 8. So I assume that anyone who married now would, indeed, be legally married ALWAYS, even if prop 8 is upheld. But I'm not sure.

M&R7111 · August 2010

I'm pretty sure those already married would be "grandfathered" , right?

This whole issue makes my head hurt. I can't wrap my head around why this, in this day, is such a problem.

katiewhompus · August 2010

Because they are corrupting the youth of America and ugh I can't even say that without wanting to smack myself.

ricksang · August 2010

Smacks Katie :P J/K.

katiewhompus · August 2010

I tried remembering all the anti gay parents stuff from that one thread and couldn't do it.

It is a shame that they have to be so damn pretty though. I went to a gay club with Scott once and it was kind of heartbreaking.

PetraStonegirl · August 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_those-following-prop-8?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:1f12420c-1e7d-4c63-b5b5-03c5812c81c3Post:0db224e7-1e76-474e-a2ac-b3ff44c953db">Re: For those following Prop 8</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: For those following Prop 8 : Well... I mean, there are gay people who are legally married in California. They married between the time the Supreme Court's decision went into effect and when voters passed prop 8. So I assume that anyone who married now would, indeed, be legally married ALWAYS, even if prop 8 is upheld. But I'm not sure.
Posted by msmerymac[/QUOTE]

<div>True, but I am not sure that couples who are legally married (either by the State of California, or outside) are afforded the same protection of law, in terms of spousal medical and financial protection assumed by heterosexual couples since Prop 8 passed. But, damn. I'm not sure.</div>

npasquale16 · August 2010

Besides the obvious, I think that the ambiguity surrounding Prop 8 is the worst part. No one seems to know for sure what exactly it will entail for existing marriages, etc.

TurtlesAllTheWayDown · August 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_those-following-prop-8?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:1f12420c-1e7d-4c63-b5b5-03c5812c81c3Post:4a214a36-bbb4-4e00-b3cb-03a2d56e1c2d">Re: For those following Prop 8</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: For those following Prop 8 : True, but I am not sure that couples who are legally married (either by the State of California, or outside) are afforded the same protection of law, in terms of spousal medical and financial protection assumed by heterosexual couples since Prop 8 passed. But, damn. I'm not sure.
Posted by PetraStonegirl[/QUOTE]

I'm pretty sure they are in California, but no gay couple can get federal spousal benefits as the federal government doesn't recognize gay marriage. But in CA, there is/was a "domestic partner registry" which was basically set up to allow homosexual couples (and other couples who couldn't marry) to register for domestic partner status and get things like survivor's benefits and shared insurance.

npasquale16 · August 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_those-following-prop-8?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:1f12420c-1e7d-4c63-b5b5-03c5812c81c3Post:be13175d-0c06-4956-9e02-82c1ccbae811">Re: For those following Prop 8</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: For those following Prop 8 : I'm pretty sure they are in California, but no gay couple can get federal spousal benefits as the federal government doesn't recognize gay marriage. But in CA, there is/was a "domestic partner registry" which was basically set up to allow homosexual couples (and other couples who couldn't marry) to register for domestic partner status and get things like survivor's benefits and shared insurance.
Posted by msmerymac[/QUOTE]
We have this, as well.

I find this to be the height of irony. If lifetime partnership isn't marriage, wtf is? Why allow partner support, etc without taking the extra step and allowing marriage? It's clearly ridiculous.

TurtlesAllTheWayDown · August 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_those-following-prop-8?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:1f12420c-1e7d-4c63-b5b5-03c5812c81c3Post:c087416a-30ad-4923-869f-6bdc2b2423a1">Re: For those following Prop 8</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: For those following Prop 8 : We have this, as well. I find this to be the height of irony. If lifetime partnership isn't marriage, wtf is? Why allow partner support, etc without taking the extra step and allowing marriage? It's clearly ridiculous.
Posted by npasquale16[/QUOTE]

I agree. I don't know how a person can say, "well, I don't support gay marriage, but they can have civil unions." it's the same damn thing. Don't call it something different just because gay people are involved.

Becky&Chris · August 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_those-following-prop-8?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:17Discussion:1f12420c-1e7d-4c63-b5b5-03c5812c81c3Post:c087416a-30ad-4923-869f-6bdc2b2423a1">Re: For those following Prop 8</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: For those following Prop 8 : We have this, as well. I find this to be the height of irony. If lifetime partnership isn't marriage, wtf is? Why allow partner support, etc without taking the extra step and allowing marriage? It's clearly ridiculous.
Posted by npasquale16[/QUOTE]

It's bigotry. Separate but equal all over again.

There are a couple comments at the end of that article that turn my stomach.

flyjawn · August 2010

everyone should just come to canada and get married here where it's legal and celebrated.

i've actually been to more same sex weddings than opposite sex weddings...lol.

2dBride · August 2010

This is depressing. I can only hope that the Court of Appeals affirms the District Court decision, and that the Supreme Court doesn't undo it all.

M&R7111 · August 2010

From what I keep hearing, people against gay marriage don't think they shouldn't be together, they just can't call it "marriage". Apparently, having them call it "marriage" destroys the sanctity of marriage.

This is what pisses me off.

You know what I'm afraid will affect the sanctity of MY future marriage? It won't be the social acceptance of gay marriage, but the social acceptance of divorce. I don't need my marriage to fall under a "man and women only" club. If two men marry, it won't affect my marriage at all. But what about when times get tough? What about when my husband goes to his friends for advice when we are fighting? Or what about when i go to my friends? Will they hand us a card recommending a good marriage counselor, or a good divorce lawyer?

I understand there are reasons for divorce, and I don't want to offend anyone who did get a divorce - I'm not saying you didn't have a legit reason. It happens. I know that when it wasn't as socially acceptable, women were forced by society to stay in marriages that were abusive - physically and mentally.

But I feel that it is the general conclusion that if it doesn't work out - they can always just leave, walk away, and not try to live up to the vows they took.

If people want to fight to save the sanctity of marriage, they should work to make it harder to divorce, and not harder for two people who love each other to have the same basic right as everyone else. Why can't they hold everyone to "till death do us part"?

ebachelder · August 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_those-following-prop-8?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:1f12420c-1e7d-4c63-b5b5-03c5812c81c3Post:4a214a36-bbb4-4e00-b3cb-03a2d56e1c2d">Re: For those following Prop 8</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: For those following Prop 8 : True, but I am not sure that couples who are legally married (either by the State of California, or outside) are afforded the same protection of law, in terms of spousal medical and financial protection assumed by heterosexual couples since Prop 8 passed. But, damn. I'm not sure.
Posted by PetraStonegirl[/QUOTE]

I think they are even subject to local judges - I remember reading one thing that seemed to say an anti-gay marriage judge annulled all gay marriages performed in her jurisdiction at one point. She should be disbarred. Or whatever they say for judges.

2dBride · August 2010

M&R7111, I would agree with you. My divorce (after 20 years of marriage, when he left for no clearly articulated reason) was emotionally devastating, and made me question whether I could ever trust a marriage to be "forever" again. By contrast, marrying another woman seems to me to be an endorsement of marriage--if it weren't important, why would we be so anxious to be able to marry?

As for the legal issues, married gay couples in the U.S. still don't have anything like the rights that straight couples have. First off, if you are a straight couple and get married anywhere in the US, your marriage will be recognized throughout the US. By contrast, even if you go to one of the few states that will let you have a same-sex marriage, your marriage will not be recognized by most states in the US.

Second, even if your same-sex marriage is recognized in your home state, it will not be recognized by the federal government. For example, if NotFroofy had just remembered to be male, I could have gotten a fiancee visa for her nine years ago. As it was, we had to go through nine years of struggling with one form of visa after another, getting her an entire graduate degree she didn't otherwise need just so she could stay in the US. She got the permanent right to stay in the US ("green card") only about a week before our wedding. Whenever you think about the stress you are going through trying to plan a wedding, imagine not knowing until a week before the wedding whether your partner might be taken from you forever.

Ahem! Ok, better get off my soapbox now.

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