Catholic rules... 2nd marriage-

johnsonia · October 2010

So, my SO has been married once before. however, his previous marriage was done by a JOP.

my SO and i are catholic. i would definitely want to be married in a church, by a priest.

is this allowed?

my thinking is that although the catholic church does not believe in divorce, his first marriage was not done in a church, by a priest , so would they even acknowledge his 1st marriage to begin with?

EDIT: thx for replies! he is already divorced. does he still need annulment? i dont understand? we have not picked a date, TK made me pick an estimate...

Lisa50 · October 2010

Is this allowed? Yes, it is permitted, however you really need to go to your parish priest, let him know your status and learn how to proceed.

Would they even acknowledge his 1st marriage to begin with? Tricky question ... yes, his first marriage would be acknowledged (it happened), however, it was not as a sacrament. And from there, I wouldn't dare go further ... again, your parish priest knows this stuff.

I notice, in your bio, that you've aleady chosen a date. If you haven't already spoken with the pastor in your parish -- it's time to do so.

right1thistime · October 2010

Lisa's advice is quite sound. And every diocese operates their annulment process a little differently - although the basic rules are the same. He will require an annulment, and it is not unusual for the Church to refuse to book a date until the annulment is granted. I believe - but am not certain- that his marriage will be easier to annul than one performed sacramentally (in a church). But even that will take months.

Your parish priest will give you all the details, the estimated timeline, the cost and the rules you will have to follow. ~Donna

topcatiom · October 2010

definately get advice from your priest, unfortunately we are not allowed, my second, FI first, i wasnt married in catholic church but the parish priest would not allow it, i was devasted but understood ,expected and respectd his decision.

johnsonia · October 2010

we have not picked a date. (TK made me chose something, i think) we plan to get married in a year or so. im waiting for ring.

he is divorced. does he still need an annulment?

2dBride · October 2010

Yes, he still needs an annulment issued by the church. However, it tends to be easiest to get if both partners are Catholic and the first marriage was outside of a church without the special permission required in the event of such marriages.

sosterhout · October 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_second-weddings_catholic-rules-2nd-marriage?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special Topic Wedding BoardsForum:35Discussion:c760e3f7-e916-49ce-a406-eacac47929a9Post:069e8e42-f307-46be-b7c4-a0f6e7b3c2fd">Catholic rules... 2nd marriage-</a>:
[QUOTE]So, my SO has been married once before. however, his previous marriage was done by a JOP. my SO and i are catholic. i would definitely want to be married in a church, by a priest. is this allowed? my thinking is that although the catholic church does not believe in divorce, his first marriage was not done in a church, by a priest , so would they even acknowledge his 1st marriage to begin with? EDIT: thx for replies! he is already divorced. does he still need annulment? i dont understand? we have not picked a date, TK made me pick an estimate...
Posted by johnsonia[/QUOTE]

I had a very similar situation.
1) our priest is allowing it and he has 2 kids.
2) we had to get a certificate of baptismal(from the original chruch, proving he wasnt married) and then the priest contacts the state for a certificate of nulity.(6 weeks in comparison to the 2+years an annulment can take.
3) I was always told that because he is a man the catholic church looks at the children as being the womans

Hope it helps!

johnsonia · October 2010

i wonder if making a "donation" would help ;-)

Lisa50 · October 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_second-weddings_catholic-rules-2nd-marriage?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special Topic Wedding BoardsForum:35Discussion:c760e3f7-e916-49ce-a406-eacac47929a9Post:b85a7408-0e81-4210-8a4b-dd4734d81183">Re: Catholic rules... 2nd marriage-</a>:
[QUOTE]i wonder if making a "donation" would help ;-)
Posted by johnsonia[/QUOTE]

Doubtful. Have you had a conversation with your parish priest about your questions? That might be a better approach.

kittylabrok · October 2010

I agree with the PP's who say to speak to your parish priest before moving ahead with anything. Different rules for different situations/diocese so go straight to your parish priest and ask these questions. My annulment was just granted in September and I started the process in March of this year. There are many different factors that are considered when requesting an annulment. Before I went through the process, I heard sooooooo many different stories/rumors/timelines/$$$ factors that it was hard to tell fact from fiction. And for the most part, they were all wrong. I'll say it again, go to your parish priest, he will guide you so that you can be married in the Catholic Church as you wish. Good luck!

lindsaynewbride10 · October 2010

Yep, he's gonna need an annulment regardless of whether he was married in a Catholic Church or at a landfill.

Sorry girl, just be honest with the priest and see what he'll allow you guys to do- you might just be surprised.

jedsden · October 2010

After reading the PP I gues it must be diffrent at each church.

I was married in Vegas 2003 and then I divorced. When I recently got engaged I went to the church and provided them with my divorce papers and we filled out a piece of paper and my annulment took one month. I was told by the pastoral associate that since I wasn't married in the church an annulment was needed but it was much easier than if I had been married in the church.

I guess it could be diffrent in each church though so I would suggest your FI make an appointment to speak with the church.

MerryNMath · April 2011

Talk to the parish priest. Period. Before you even think about a date or anything else.

My FI would not even propose until we were both 'cleared' by the church. Technically if either of you are Catholic (he is, I am not) and have been married previously in a ceremony the church would accept as sacramental (most Christian church ceremonies) - you are still married. Period. It's a religious sacrament, a divorce doesn't remove the bond from God. (Honestly my FI shouldn't have even been dating without already having his annulment.)

If, after listening to your story, the priest/deacon says here are the papers - you need an annulment - get it moving. His took 18 months, mine (I needed 1+) took 10 months. If you are honest and detailed with their questions and your answers it can be very heart wrenching to dredge it all up again, but it's also very therapeutic to 'get it all out' and get that stamp of approval.

In our Archdiocese (Baltimore) there are 2 'types' of annulments that we dealt with. The full blown annulment and something called a Ligamen (which I called the mini-annulment. Think of them like Church-Court cases - because that's pretty much what they are.

Full blown - the person requesting the annulment has to prove that the bond was never sacramental. That one or both of the parties never really intended 'til death do us part' for one reason or another.

Our process went kinda like this. The petitioner (person requesting the annulment) fills out the paperwork - about 50 short answer/essay questions surrounding their parents, dating, theology, courtship, marriage... that's the painful part.  That gets submitted with the names/addresses of 3 witnesses and the name/address of the former spouse.

The former spouse is contacted and has the option to participate (generally if they DON'T want the annulment) or not. If you prep them ahead of time and tell them it's coming it's much better. Just check the box, tell them you don't want to participate and mail it back.

The witnesses are contacted and given a list of about 35 short answer/essay questions on the same topics about the couple. This was kinda hard on my Dad. He didn't like nor did he feel it was anyone's business the questions about his parenting and his relationship with my mom.

Both of those things have to be done within a certain amount of time or the whole thing tanks. If the former spouse doesn't answer, they give 2 weeks and send again, 2 weeks and send again. Then after sending 3 times they presume they don't care and move on.   HOWEVER, if one of your witnesses doesn't get it done and mailed back (my dad) they will send you a letter and say, if we dont' have this by... then this case will be put on hold or closed. UGH!   So choose your witnesses wisely, let them know it's coming, and prepare them anyway you can.

After all the paperwork is in it has to go through several stages, goes to the defender of the bond who is kinda like the grand jury - he decides if you have a case or not - kinda sorta - and he writes up a brief based on the Canon Law and sends it to the 1st court (kinda like the lower courts) they pass judgement and send you a letter telling you it's moving on to the 2nd court (kinda like the appellate courts). They review the lower court's decision and either confirm it or deny it. If they deny you have one appeal (kinda like the supreme court) to Rome. Fortunately, we didn't have to go to Rome!

Yes, they can be pricey (mine was $750) but if you think of the time and the work involved in the process and realize that it really is a court/tribunal system and relate it to what you probably paid your divorce attorney.... well then you see why they charge something.

The other one I needed was called a Ligamen or Prior Bond.  So I have been married twice previously. The Ligamen was for the 2nd marriage because HE had been married prior. Knowing that my 1st was pretty much a slam dunk I knew I had to prove that HE had a prior bond (even though legally we both did). Much shorter paperwork, only the ex involved. Had to pull all previous marriage/divorce records from the courthouse and send them in with short explanations. In the process (when I thought I was wife 2 for him) I found out I was wife number FOUR!!!   Yes, his 4th wife. Once that was all written down and I showed where our marriage license/certificate stated that it was both of our 2nd marriages - another slam dunk and fast.

Probably more information than anyone needed - but that's how it works in Baltimore, I wish I'd known it before - maybe we wouldn't have had to wait 28 months for both of our annulments to come through and I'd have prepared my 'witnesses' a little better for what was coming their way. The good thing is that it's all done via mail - and you never actually have to go to "court."

Feel free to PM me with any other questions - I am by NO means an expert - but I can try to point you in the right direction or tell you how my experiences were.

God Bless and Good Luck!

Catholic rules... 2nd marriage-

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