Ugh - mom guilt or my happiness??? WWYD???

jennylee813 · January 2013

Hey everyone,

Here's the short version: I do not want my sister and her abusive husband at my wedding, but I know that if I extend the invite (to keep my parents happy) she will jump at the chance to attend and 'try' to mend fences.

When I tried to get her out of the abusive situation, he chased her down the highway until she pulled over and they 'talked it out' for two hours on the side of the road. Their two kids were in the backseat the whole time. When I finally tracked her down (she went back with him and took the kids to a party, like nothing had happened), she told me that she (get ready for it, direct quote)

"Didn't want to end up like me."

That's divorced. She'd rather stay with a man who is emotionally abusive, who has thrown gallons of paint at her, destroyed their property and put her and the kids in danger than to be like me.

I know that inviting her would make my mom happy, so I have to decide whether or not to put her feelings above mine.

WWYD, fave internet peeps???

MrsGandthebeag · January 2013

Ohhh, that's tough. Do you still want to maintain a relationship with your sister? If so, I would invite her. I don't think you have to invite her husband in this case since he is abusive towards her. I say etiquette be damned in this situation.

jennylee813 · January 2013

MrsG, we have had no relationship since that happened (coming up on three years this March). I see her at family functions only, but she continues to send me messages/cards about wishing we were closer.

He moved her and the kids seven hours away from our family, to an isolated part of the province, but only a half an hour away from his family (who also treat her like garbage). He has full control of her finances, and if she wants to go see our parents, she usually has to bum a ride from someone making the trip - she isn't allowed to take either of their vehicles.

I just don't know if it's worth the headache NOT to invite her, from a dealing with my parents perspective, kwim?

jennylee813 · January 2013

No, we've never really gotten along.

When we were young, my dad worked away and my mom got really sick. She almost died the year I was 9. Dad was away, which left me to come home from school, take care of sick mom and 5 yr old sister. She played mom like a violin: blamed everything that went wrong in her life on mom's being sick, and mom bought it. Super guilt. I was running the house, doing all the chores etc, and didn't think a whole lot about it - it was just what needed to be done, and it was logical to me that I would do it.

I have seen my neice and nephew maybe ten times in their lives. They're 8 and 6 now.

I always send the kids cards on their birthdays and Christmas, but not to her and him. She sent a photo card this Christmas with a handwritten note about wanting to be 'closer in every way'

No, my parents are not contributing to the wedding, and neither has said anything about whether or not she will be invited. They mention her in conversation to me, but have given up 'wishing we would get along'. I just know the storm is coming ...

jenajjthr · January 2013

As much as I would love to say don't invite the abusive husband, etiquette says you have to if you choose to invite her. It doesn't mean that you have to talk to her or her husband, seat them far away from you if you want. She can "try" to mend fences with you, but you have control in that too. Say "Sis, I love you and your kids and it hurts me so much that you stay in a marriage that is damaging to you and to your children. I will always love you and will always be there for you when you decide that a marriage that is abusive is no longer tolerable." You support her, but not her choices. If she continues on how she doesn't want to be like you (divorced) than give her a hug and remind her that you will be ready when she is and walk away and greet other guests.

Even though we think that it is easy to walk away from an abusive relationship and there is no way we would ever be in one, it is harder to leave than you think. Most of the time the victim has other issues going on that preclude rational thinking. When she is ready to leave, she will.

jennylee813 · January 2013

Jen, I've had that conversation with her. And I don't think I can do it again at our wedding.

And I know how hard it is to leave an abusive realtionship, because I've done that too. I ended up in one after my marriage ended. When I walked away I was left with ruined credit, a run down home and no way to pay for it. I went back to school, got another degree, met my FI and moved away. I know, better than most, how hard it is to leave and start over.

Simply Fated · January 2013

It sounds like she's in a seriously abusive relationship. There is a really good chance he has played a part at brainwashing her to think that your situation is a worst case scenerio.

Have you spoken to anyone about this? Maybe a family member, a counselor or clergy member?

Anyway, that wasn't your question. Okay.. what she said was horrible, but is that the only reason you haven't spoken to her in 3 years?

You need to not worry so much about what your mom wants and worry more about what will happen between you and your sister down the line.

ConKFA319 · January 2013

Yeech. That is definitely rough. I think it's up to you at this point.

I will say this: the whole "I don't want to end up like you" thing may have been an exuse on her part to justify going back to him. If he's as abusive as you say he is (and I believe you), then it's natural for her to be scared of him. But as she probably feels completely out of control of her life, she may feel the need to make her getting back with him look like it's "her choice," even though really, at the end of the day, it isn't. She's probably terrified that if she leaves, she'll come after her anyway, or worse, do something to the kids. I know that what she said to you was awful. I do. But think of what her alternative might have been. Just being the devil's advocate.

Do your parents know how abusive he is?

ETA: I posted late. I see PPs have already said something similar. Oh, well.

jennylee813 · January 2013

I have spoken to several people about it, and everyone is on the same page. Even my parents say 'we know what he's like, but we have to keep trying.' She's totally textbook.

Not speaking was more the culmination of the whole situation. I told her that when she was ready to get help I would move heaven and earth to get it for her (when he kicked her out and then chased how down the road, I was on the phone with her all night, then made arrangements for her and the kids when they got to the city, told the family what was happening ...), but until then I couldn't be a part of it anymore.

In her mind that conversation never happened. He is her best friend and greatest blessing. She's cut herself off from all of our family, has minimal conversations with our parents, but sends me the occasional card about wanting to be closer ...

It is about what my parents (more specifically mom) want at this point because I can't be a part of the life she's chosen. I have come a long way to get to this point in my life, am willing to help her if the time comes, but I can't listen to it day after day.

ConKFA319 · January 2013

No, I hear you. I can't help but think, though, that the cards are her way of apologizing for what went down between you two. They may also be something of a call for help, in that they're her saying that she wishes that there wasn't such a rift between you both.

I do think that you have to do what's best for YOU, but I also think that you still need to be there for her in some form, whichever way you feel you can. Does that mean that you should invite her and her douchecanoe husband (understatement) to the wedding? I don't know. That's your call.

Also, I'm so glad that you were able to get out of your previous abusive relationship. I've been there, too. It's SO hard. And I think it's great that you were able to turn your life around in such a wonderful way

jennylee813 · January 2013

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_ugh-mom-guilt-or-my-happiness-wwyd?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:ae0bdb93-843d-49af-bf8e-68afeef7ce3bPost:3ffaf588-2b47-4923-9b45-77c38a59ef3a">Re: Ugh - mom guilt or my happiness??? WWYD???</a>:
[QUOTE]Yeech. That is definitely rough. I think it's up to you at this point. I will say this: the whole "I don't want to end up like you" thing may have been an exuse on her part to justify going back to him. If he's as abusive as you say he is (and I believe you), then it's natural for her to be scared of him. But as she probably feels completely out of control of her life, she may feel the need to make her getting back with him look like it's "her choice," even though really, at the end of the day, it isn't. She's probably terrified that if she leaves, she'll come after her anyway, or worse, do something to the kids. I know that what she said to you was awful. I do. But think of what her alternative might have been. Just being the devil's advocate.<strong> Do your parents know how abusive he is?</strong> ETA: I posted late. I see PPs have already said something similar. Oh, well.
Posted by ConKFA319[/QUOTE]

<div>
</div><div>Yup, Con, they do.</div><div>
</div><div>Dad was th one who drove four hours to collect their dog when her husband wanted to shoot it for jumping into the bed of his truck and scratching the finish with her nails...</div><div>
</div><div>It was their house that she and (then) newborn neice walked to (they used to live about 20 minutes away from them) during a toxic fire that shut down the community. He locked her our of the house and she had to take the baby to our parents place. The entire town was shut down because of a fire at a plumbing factory. Toxic smoke was everywhere, all businesses were closed and people were told to stay inside and turn off air exchangers etc.</div><div>
</div><div>Dad helped her clean up the paint and flooring when he threw the gallon of paint at her for 'making her buy the house' close to mom, and not 7 hours away (where they eventually ended up anyway).</div><div>
</div><div>And I agree. She's totally terrified of him. And should be.</div>

ConKFA319 · January 2013

Ugh. I don't know, then.

I would say invite them. It's more than likely that they won't come anyway - I'm sure that her husband wouldn't want to travel the 7 hours, especially if it puts her closer to her support network. But then I worry that if they DO come, it may cause problems. So...I still don't know.

jennylee813 · January 2013

Thanks Con. I'm pleased with where I am, and firmly believe that the hard (HARD, OMG was it hard) road that took me here has made me who I am.

But I honestly don't know how I can be there for her any more until she's ready to get out. This isn't the first time we've gone through a bout of not speaking. I've 'taken her back' before, and it's all or nothing. Within a day, she'll be back to complaining about him and her whole life. I can't take the negativity when she's unwilling to do anything about it.

I didn't like the way my life was going, so I fixed it. She has a wonderful support system if she chooses to do the same thing. But no one can make that choice for her.

jennylee813 · January 2013

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_ugh-mom-guilt-or-my-happiness-wwyd?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:ae0bdb93-843d-49af-bf8e-68afeef7ce3bPost:d2e62e2a-5f5d-467d-b189-c96f3a94c19f">Re: Ugh - mom guilt or my happiness??? WWYD???</a>:
[QUOTE]Ugh. I don't know, then. I would say invite them. It's more than likely that they won't come anyway - I'm sure that her husband wouldn't want to travel the 7 hours, especially if it puts her closer to her support network. But then I worry that if they DO come, it may cause problems. So...I still don't know.
Posted by ConKFA319[/QUOTE]

<div>That's kind of the crux: I KNOW they would come. If I thought that they wouldn't, I could extend the invite and tell my parents that I made the gesture. For a long time, she wasn't allowed to attend family events, but they made the drive last summer to a cousin's wedding.</div><div>
</div><div>I've been wrestling with this since we got engaged, so I don't know either.</div>

mcda04 · January 2013

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_ugh-mom-guilt-or-my-happiness-wwyd?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:ae0bdb93-843d-49af-bf8e-68afeef7ce3bPost:3dc8721d-94e0-4499-ba90-eb2f45363a1d">Ugh - mom guilt or my happiness??? WWYD???</a>:
[QUOTE]Hey everyone, Here's the short version: I do not want my sister and her abusive husband at my wedding, but I know that if I extend the invite (to keep my parents happy) she will jump at the chance to attend and 'try' to mend fences. When I tried to get her out of the abusive situation, he chased her down the highway until she pulled over and they 'talked it out' for two hours on the side of the road. Their two kids were in the backseat the whole time. When I finally tracked her down (she went back with him and took the kids to a party, like nothing had happened), she told me that she (get ready for it, direct quote) "Didn't want to end up like me. " That's divorced. She'd rather stay with a man who is emotionally abusive, who has thrown gallons of paint at her, destroyed their property and put her and the kids in danger than to be like me. I know that inviting her would make my mom happy, so I have to decide whether or not to put her feelings above mine. WWYD, fave internet peeps???
Posted by jennylee813[/QUOTE]

Wow. Are you me? This just sounds like you described my sister and I. Well a little different because I'm not divorced but she still thinks her life is better than mine because my H and I are not all mushy with each other. Yeah, whatever.

To answer your question though; I didn't invite my sister to my wedding and my mom tried to talk to me about it the day before the wedding. I know my mom was a little hurt seeing me and my other siblings together and two excluded. (One other sister decided to exclude herself because the troubled sister is her "role model" and *I* was disrespectful. <img src="http://cdn.cl9.vanillaforums.com/downloaded/ver1.0/content/scripts/tinymce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-surprised.gif" border="0" alt="Surprised" title="Surprised" /> Excuse Me??????

ConKFA319 · January 2013

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_ugh-mom-guilt-or-my-happiness-wwyd?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:ae0bdb93-843d-49af-bf8e-68afeef7ce3bPost:960b7303-1f37-40b5-9603-257a2a484193">Re: Ugh - mom guilt or my happiness??? WWYD???</a>:
[QUOTE]Thanks Con. I'm pleased with where I am, and firmly believe that the hard (HARD, OMG was it hard) road that took me here has made me who I am. But I honestly don't know how I can be there for her any more until she's ready to get out. This isn't the first time we've gone through a bout of not speaking. I've 'taken her back' before, and it's all or nothing. Within a day, she'll be back to complaining about him and her whole life. I can't take the negativity when she's unwilling to do anything about it. I didn't like the way my life was going, so I fixed it. She has a wonderful support system if she chooses to do the same thing. <strong>But no one can make that choice for her.</strong>
Posted by jennylee813[/QUOTE]

<div>This is very, very, OMG so incredibly true.

<div style="background-color:#ffffff;border:0px;font-size:12px;margin:0px;outline:0px;padding:0px;vertical-align:baseline;font-family:Arial;">[QUOTE]That's kind of the crux: I KNOW they would come. If I thought that they wouldn't, I could extend the invite and tell my parents that I made the gesture. For a long time, she wasn't allowed to attend family events, but they made the drive last summer to a cousin's wedding.</div><div style="background-color:#ffffff;border:0px;font-size:12px;margin:0px;outline:0px;padding:0px;vertical-align:baseline;font-family:Arial;">
</div><div style="background-color:#ffffff;border:0px;font-size:12px;margin:0px;outline:0px;padding:0px;vertical-align:baseline;font-family:Arial;">I've been wrestling with this since we got engaged, so I don't know either. [/QUOTE]</div></div><div style="background-color:#ffffff;border:0px;font-size:12px;margin:0px;outline:0px;padding:0px;vertical-align:baseline;font-family:Arial;">
</div><div style="background-color:#ffffff;border:0px;font-size:12px;margin:0px;outline:0px;padding:0px;vertical-align:baseline;font-family:Arial;">Ech. There goes that, then. Well, whatever happens, and whatever you decide to do, I wish you luck. It seriously sounds like you're stuck in the mother of all catch-22s here. However, if she and her husband have been excluded before from family events, then I think you should be fine not inviting them, particularly since you haven't really spoken for years.

Either way, your wedding is going to be wonderful and perfect and amazing. :)</div>

Wife Kitty · January 2013

I first saw your post at a quarter to five this afternoon, and in the time it took me to read it, re-read it, think long and hard, and finally post a response, I saw that several other posters had already added very similar thoughts to mine, so I deleted. It looks as though my first post was at least up long enough for you to see it, as you answered my questions.

At this stage of the game, I can really only convey my sympathies to you in what is truly a heartbreaking situation. Only you know where your personal boundaries lie, and it sounds like so far you've done exactly what you've needed to do to take care of things as best you can. It won't be easy no matter which choice you make this time around, but just know that in either case you have all of our thoughts and best wishes.

jennylee813 · January 2013

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_ugh-mom-guilt-or-my-happiness-wwyd?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:ae0bdb93-843d-49af-bf8e-68afeef7ce3bPost:06f354c3-2364-4766-a5c2-8d3e87ce8f80">Re: Ugh - mom guilt or my happiness??? WWYD???</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Ugh - mom guilt or my happiness??? WWYD??? : Wow. Are you me? This just sounds like you described my sister and I. Well a little different because I'm not divorced but she still thinks her life is better than mine because my H and I are not all mushy with each other. Yeah, whatever. To answer your question though; I didn't invite my sister to my wedding and my mom tried to talk to me about it the day before the wedding. I know my mom was a little hurt seeing me and my other siblings together and two excluded. (One other sister decided to exclude herself because the troubled sister is her "role model" and *I* was disrespectful. Excuse Me??????
Posted by mcda04[/QUOTE]

<div>Oh, I'm sorry that you have to go through this. It sounds like you did the right thing for you, though. Good for you.</div>

jennylee813 · January 2013

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_ugh-mom-guilt-or-my-happiness-wwyd?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:ae0bdb93-843d-49af-bf8e-68afeef7ce3bPost:90a064af-aa93-4dce-afb0-13f61363ad18">Re: Ugh - mom guilt or my happiness??? WWYD???</a>:
[QUOTE]. Either way, your wedding is going to be wonderful and perfect and amazing. :)
Posted by ConKFA319[/QUOTE]

<div>Thanks, Con!</div>

jennylee813 · January 2013

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_ugh-mom-guilt-or-my-happiness-wwyd?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:ae0bdb93-843d-49af-bf8e-68afeef7ce3bPost:fb3b6da6-383c-4a2b-99d1-6d49753f0b6a">Re: Ugh - mom guilt or my happiness??? WWYD???</a>:
[QUOTE]I first saw your post at a quarter to five this afternoon, and in the time it took me to read it, re-read it, think long and hard, and finally post a response, I saw that several other posters had already added very similar thoughts to mine, so I deleted. It looks as though my first post was at least up long enough for you to see it, as you answered my questions. At this stage of the game, I can really only convey my sympathies to you in what is truly a heartbreaking situation. Only you know where your personal boundaries lie, and it sounds like so far you've done exactly what you've needed to do to take care of things as best you can. It won't be easy no matter which choice you make this time around, but just know that in either case you have all of our thoughts and best wishes.
Posted by Wife Kitty[/QUOTE]

<div>Thanks, Kitty. I guess the choice between being the bad guy (in my parents eyes) vs being uncomfortable at our own wedding is what I have to decide. <img src="http://cdn.cl9.vanillaforums.com/downloaded/ver1.0/content/scripts/tinymce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-frown.gif" border="0" alt="Frown" title="Frown" /></div>

melicifant · January 2013

I have a suggestion. If you are having a larger wedding it might be possible to invite her but limit her interaction with you. I had a similar situation in my first wedding. I invited my sister because my mom had a fit. I got a friend to "babysit" her. She was kept far away from me by someone who knew the situation.

Would this be possible?
If not just explain to your mom that you do not want to risk an episode with the sister and her husband. It wouldn't be fair to you or your guests and she is just going to have to respect your decision.

jennylee813 · January 2013

I've thought about that too, Melicifant. The guest list is around 160 right now, but it's a destination wedding for a lot of the guests, so we're unsure how many will make the trip. That said, she did not initiate contact with me at my cousin's wedding last summer, but did go out of her way to introduce herself to FI.

My mom would likely have a fit, and I strongly suspect that my dad would refuse to come. Although if that was the case, I'd likely get my back up and let that make my decision - and tell my folks that they'd be missed.

'Cause I can be spitey like that sometimes.

Dreamergirl8812 · January 2013

I would not invite her. He wouldn't let her come without him; he would either come despite not being invited or prevent her from coming (that could get ugly). You can't have a dangerous man at your wedding. And a wedding is not the time to "mend fences." A bar? Maybe. A therapist's office? Yes. But not your wedding. Your wedding also isn't about avoiding people by seating them as far away from you as possible.

And I understand that your family has sympathy for this guy (WTF?), but even then there is nothing that you could do in this situation that will make you the bad guy.

awolkenhauer · January 2013

I know what it's like to "save" people over and over only to be hated and unappreciated for it; I did it for years for my younger sister. I finally realized the toll it was taking on my life and cut her out. I, of course, told her I still love her and when she was ready to make changes to her life, I'd be there. For a long time, my family tried to make me feel guilty; they wanted me to put her before my relationship with FI, school, and eventually my career. It's calmed down a bit now but, to this day, she still hates me, puts me down, and refuses to apologize to anyone for any of the hurt she caused (and it was a lot).

We will be getting married in a state park, so because we will have park rangers to call if anyone gets out of hand, I'm comfortable with inviting the dramatic players in my life. We've also been talking about hiring security; would that be an option if you do decide to invite her?

Ultimately, I think your comfort trumps your parents' feelings in this case. It sounds like you've already made a lot of sacrifices for your sister and I don't think you should have to make more for your wedding if it will make you uncomfortable in any way.

knottie1f599089cc8c591f · January 2013

If having them there would upset you or your fiance on your wedding day, don't invite her. I have a friend I love like mad, but he is disabled and would need a family member to chaperone him. None of them know how to properly behave themselves, so unfortunately, he will be left off the guest list, though I will make a point of doing something special with him after the fact.

jennylee813 · January 2013

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_snarky-brides_ugh-mom-guilt-or-my-happiness-wwyd?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:17Discussion:ae0bdb93-843d-49af-bf8e-68afeef7ce3bPost:3a38fb45-1543-4406-9bc5-6c81b8782c7c">Re: Ugh - mom guilt or my happiness??? WWYD???</a>:
[QUOTE]I know what it's like to "save" people over and over only to be hated and unappreciated for it; I did it for years for my younger sister. I finally realized the toll it was taking on my life and cut her out. I, of course, told her I still love her and when she was ready to make changes to her life, I'd be there. For a long time, my family tried to make me feel guilty; they wanted me to put her before my relationship with FI, school, and eventually my career. It's calmed down a bit now but, to this day, she still hates me, puts me down, and refuses to apologize to anyone for any of the hurt she caused (and it was a lot). We will be getting married in a state park, so because we will have park rangers to call if anyone gets out of hand, I'm comfortable with inviting the dramatic players in my life. We've also been talking about hiring security; would that be an option if you do decide to invite her? Ultimately, I think your comfort trumps your parents' feelings in this case. It sounds like you've already made a lot of sacrifices for your sister and I don't think you should have to make more for your wedding if it will make you uncomfortable in any way.
Posted by awolkenhauer[/QUOTE]

<div>Thanks. Having someone run interference has also been in the back of my mind, whether it's security or a trusted friend (but then again, I wouldn't want to ruin a friend's evening by asking them to be constantly vigilant either.) Something to think about.</div><div>
</div><div>I'm sorry that you've gone through this as well. It sounds like we're both in similar situations.</div>

MsYeck · January 2013

Etiqiuette be damned, if he causes the problems I would invite her by herself and if he or she called me on it I would list of the prior offenses as the reasons why I wouldn't be inviting him. Sure he will make promises to be good, but I just would say I don't want to run the risk of drama at the wedding and the easiest way to guarantee that based off of your previous behavior is for you not to be there.

Ugh - mom guilt or my happiness??? WWYD???

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