Is it really no-wife's-first-name?

32daisies · June 2013

I'm struggling with invitation etiquette. If I'm reading everything correctly, we should address the outer envelope of our invitations to:

Mr. & Mrs. Elmer Snodgrass

Really? Is that still true? I don't generally consider myself a feminist, but it just seems strange that in 2013 we're still not letting women have their own first name anymore. Is it a terrible faux pas to write:

Mr. Elmer & Mrs. Gertrude Snodgrass

HisGirlFriday13 · June 2013

That's what I did, too. I also had variations for unmarried people, people who hadn't taken their spouse's name, etc.

daria24 · June 2013

Yes, it is still true that Mr. And Mrs. John Smith is the "proper" form of address. However Mrs. Jane and Mr. John Smith or Mrs. Jane Smith and Mr. John Smith are also acceptable.

Mr. John and Mrs. Jane Smith however is not correct, because the man is never separated from his last name, as he was born with that last name, whereas Jane acquired it upon her marriage. Of course, that presumes that John didn't take Jane's last name, or that they didn't both change their names to a new name.

We did Mrs Jane and Mr John, as I don't like not including the woman's first name. However, there are women who prefer to be addressed as Mrs. John Smith, I know CMGr is one of them.

32daisies · June 2013

CMGr said:

This is not your decision to make. You only get to decide what YOU want to be addressed as, not your guests. It is proper to address people the way they prefer to be addressed.

Well sure, but to be frank most of the women I know would not prefer their first name to be left off the invitation. In other words, going with exactly what you're saying, what if they would prefer Ms. Jane Smith? Or frankly, what if they prefer Mrs. Jane Smith? If the guest's preference is what matters, how can etiquette override that?

AddieCake · June 2013

We addressed ours to Jonathan and Jane Smith. We used people's full names (Jonathan instead of John), but other than that, we were more informal. We didn't have anyone coming to our wedding who would give a damn about the formality of their names on the invitation.

krispi921 · June 2013

I addressed mine the traditional way for the sake of etiquette, but I don't like it. For Christmas cards or any other correspondance, I would do it the way Addie did.

Jen4948 · June 2013

I don't like the traditional Mr. and Mrs. John Smith either, but I respect that it is traditional and some people still use it (my late great-aunt did and my parents still do, although they wouldn't care about being Mary and John Smith instead).

I'd find out what people's own preferences are (where practical) and use that, although I'd fall back on the traditional by way of default if I can't directly find out from them what their preferences are before sending the invitations.

HobokensFury · June 2013

Am I the only one that smiles when I get mail as Mrs. DH

lyndausvi · June 2013

I have 2 last names and I have zero problem with Mr and Mrs John Smith on a joint invitation. Honestly, it's just something I do not care about. (not like I see it often anyway.) I also think it just looks cleaner on the envelope.

That said, I loathe Mrs John Smith if it's not a joint invite. Doesn't make sense logically, but it's the way I feel.

Ms/Mrs Jane Jones Smith

Ms/Mrs Jane Smith

are my preferred way on an invite going only to me. I don't care about Ms or Mrs either.

Now when I got married I addressed an 86 year old widow Mrs Jane Smith. It came back to me as Mrs John Smith. You better believe on her table card I wrote Mrs John Smith. Not my thing, but it's her name.

wabanzi · June 2013

There are guidelines for how to write formal correspondence, such as wedding invitations. However, the ultimate rule of etiquette is the consideration of others. Wedding invitations are not mass mailings (although it can feel like that when you are addressing hundreds). They are personal. Approach the formal address in this personal manner, rather than the application of a universal "rule."

If you do not know the woman's preference you have two options: 1) inquire, 2) make your best assumption based on what you think the person would prefer.

Most of my friends would cringe at being addressed as "Mrs. (no first name) Anything," while my aunt treasures it. I address each appropriately, according to their preference for formal/family appellation.

32daisies · June 2013

StageManager14 said:

32daisies said:

CMGr said:

This is not your decision to make. You only get to decide what YOU want to be addressed as, not your guests. It is proper to address people the way they prefer to be addressed.

Well sure, but to be frank most of the women I know would not prefer their first name to be left off the invitation. In other words, going with exactly what you're saying, what if they would prefer Ms. Jane Smith? Or frankly, what if they prefer Mrs. Jane Smith? If the guest's preference is what matters, how can etiquette override that?

I don't see anything in CMGr's post telling you to "override" your guests wishes. If you know what they are, then address them as such. If you don't know, call or email them to ASK.

For the record, I'm under 30, very MUCH a femenist and I am absolutely Mr. and Mrs. Husband's Name on joint mail. It irritates the crap out of me when people address it differently, because taking away my right to CHOOSE to be traditional is absolutely just as oppressive as repressing any other woman rom choosing to keep their own last name, be addressed using their first and last, etc.

I haven't explained my concern, then -- what I was saying to CMGr is that it's not a question of me trying to impose *my* preferences, per se, though I freely admit I'm surprised the custom hasn't adapted to circumstance over time. My preferences and my surprise are neither here nor there, you are right.

It's more that, as much as it might irritate the crap out of you to see your traditional choice taken away, what if my particular friends are more likely to have the crap irritated out of them by my imposing that tradition on them, when I know they do not care for it personally or professionally? That's what I was getting at asking, which is, I assume if I KNOW that their wishes are contrary to etiquette, than etiquette be damned, correct?

32daisies · June 2013

wabanzi said:

There are guidelines for how to write formal correspondence, such as wedding invitations. However, the ultimate rule of etiquette is the consideration of others. Wedding invitations are not mass mailings (although it can feel like that when you are addressing hundreds). They are personal. Approach the formal address in this personal manner, rather than the application of a universal "rule."
If you do not know the woman's preference you have two options: 1) inquire, 2) make your best assumption based on what you think the person would prefer.

Most of my friends would cringe at being addressed as "Mrs. (no first name) Anything," while my aunt treasures it. I address each appropriately, according to their preference for formal/family appellation.

Good point. It does start to feel like a "mass mailing" project, so you start looking for universal rules to apply to the entire group. But you're right, it's important not to think of that way. Thanks, I'm going to take your advice.

AddieCake · June 2013

Sleeper2013 said:

I addressed like Addie, only with the woman's first name first.

Whoops. Derrr. We had the woman's name first,too, actually. I think. Hell, I'm not sure I even remember now! I'm a barbarian.

32daisies · June 2013

StageManager14 said:

Etiquette has options for all three and you should address each invitation in the manner that couple prefers. Which is what CMGr told you as well.

And yet I didn't instantly understand!

I get that now, Stage, but I've been saying from the very get-go of this post that I've been confused by this whole issue of invitation wording, that's why I came on here, and I appreciate the explanations. Bear with me -- this initial post was prefaced by hours of Google searching, which brings up a huge amount of conflicting information on the topic. Then again I am finding that true of lost of questions regarding weddings -- the magazine, Pinterest, Googling, you get all kinds of answers.

smalfrie19 · June 2013

StageManager14 said:

HobokenBride2012 said:

Am I the only one that smiles when I get mail as Mrs. DH

Nope. I love it.

I love when we go into safeway and i use his club card and they hand the receipt back to me and tell me to "have a good day mrs fi last name"

makes me excited

Nightingalejules · June 2013

I mainly played it by ear... mostly threw etiquette to the wind and addressed things without Mr or Mrs and just Mary Smith Jones and John Jones, or Robert and Ann Smith. That only varied when I knew I was addressing it to a Dr, or the party in question was older (and presumably more traditional), when I went by the old Mr and Mrs John Doe.

Is it really no-wife's-first-name?

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