Red flags?

SBbride67 · January 2014

My fiancé and I have lived in different cities for the past 2 years after college but have made it work and are planning to wed in October 2014.

My fiancé just got a new job that pays very well. At the suggestion of his family (he comes from a lower-income family with bad spending habits and lots of debt), he went out and rewarded himself by buying a new car.

Technically, he can afford the payments, but if we want on purchasing a home in the next year or two which is something we've talked about, our mortgage rate will be higher because of his new car in addition to his student loan debt.

He asked me about buying this car before, and I told him I thought it was a bad idea because it would lower our ability to get the best mortgage rate possible. But he insisted that taking the bus to work was just not going to work for him. He also owns a motorcycle that he makes payments on, and I told him to suck it up, wear his winter riding gear, and use that to get to work.

My parents, who are very money-conscious and are also paying for the entire wedding, are very upset with what they call "a rash, childish, selfish decision" on his part. They have put all wedding planning on hold for the next few months, and as of right now, are questioning if he is the right man for me. Before this, they loved him and welcomed him into the family gladly.

I know that women shouldn't try to change their men, but in our relationship, I'm the ration money-brain and he even admits to that. I was going to do the banking once we were married. I'm very certain that he would not have purchased the car if we lived in the same city.

We will be visiting our premarital counselor in soon to discuss this. I know that he and I can get past this, but I'm worried about my parents' perspective on him now. I also worry that this desire of his for instantaneous gratification will become a problem for him during our marriage, since he had very little growing up. Now that he has a nice job, he wants to make up for it, but needs to realize that paying off debts need to happen first before he takes on more debt.

buttercup1958 · January 2014

nicolesands said:

My fiancé and I have lived in different cities for the past 2 years after college but have made it work and are planning to wed in October 2014. My fiancé just got a new job that pays very well. At the suggestion of his family (he comes from a lower-income family with bad spending habits and lots of debt), he went out and rewarded himself by buying a new car. Technically, he can afford the payments, but if we want on purchasing a home in the next year or two which is something we've talked about, our mortgage rate will be higher because of his new car in addition to his student loan debt. He asked me about buying this car before, and I told him I thought it was a bad idea because it would lower our ability to get the best mortgage rate possible. But he insisted that taking the bus to work was just not going to work for him. He also owns a motorcycle that he makes payments on, and I told him to suck it up, wear his winter riding gear, and use that to get to work. My parents, who are very money-conscious and are also paying for the entire wedding, are very upset with what they call "a rash, childish, selfish decision" on his part. They have put all wedding planning on hold for the next few months, and as of right now, are questioning if he is the right man for me. Before this, they loved him and welcomed him into the family gladly. I know that women shouldn't try to change their men, but in our relationship, I'm the ration money-brain and he even admits to that. I was going to do the banking once we were married. I'm very certain that he would not have purchased the car if we lived in the same city. We will be visiting our premarital counselor in soon to discuss this. I know that he and I can get past this, but I'm worried about my parents' perspective on him now. I also worry that this desire of his for instantaneous gratification will become a problem for him during our marriage, since he had very little growing up. Now that he has a nice job, he wants to make up for it, but needs to realize that paying off debts need to happen first before he takes on more debt.

I can tell you love your parents but I think you need to address some boundaries with them. You say that they are now putting the wedding plans on hold because of this situation. Honestly maybe its because I have a different relationship with my parents but I wouldn't be too happy with them questioning MY relationship. However, I feel like you do need to make it clear to your fiance that his money will be your money and you need to be a team when it comes to big and small decisions. Also the way you put it sounds like he listens to his family opinions more than yours.

Correct me if I'm wrong though. You should definitely put a stop to that and make sure that you and him are a united front. This will be great to bring up in your counseling and I think its a great idea that you are doing the classes before getting married. Here is what I would do if I was in your shoes. I would say thanks but no thanks to my parents money and plan the wedding you can afford. I don't see this ending too well for either sides. Also I think you should get your fiance to say to his family "thank you for your opinions but I will have to think it over" in situations like this from now on. This way it doesn't make YOU look like the bad guy but allows you two to figure out what you want to do. I hope this helps.

mrscaty · January 2014

Honestly, I don't think this is a red flag. He bought a car. This is something that, eventually, he would probably need anyway. Maybe this isn't the perfect time for him to buy a car but it's not like he went behind your back and lied about it. He asked for your opinion and considered it, then made a decision. I don't know what more you could ask for except for him to do what you want.

What I find the most concerning is your parents just pulling out of funding your wedding because of this. Sure, if this is a recurring problem I would get it - but you said he can afford it. I think you are going to have to let this run it's course with your parents. It sucks they are super apprehensive now but there isn't really anything you can do except be on his side about this.

MobKaz · January 2014

@nicolesands said....."My parents, who are very money-conscious and are also paying for the entire wedding, are very upset with what they call "a rash, childish, selfish decision" on his part. They have put all wedding planning on hold for the next few months, and as of right now, are questioning if he is the right man for me. Before this, they loved him and welcomed him into the family gladly. "

I'm sorry, but it sounds like your parents need to practice what they preach. Their knee jerk reaction to something between you and your FI was just as childish and selfish. Do they plan on holding your wedding hostage everytime something displeases them?

I think another issue that may need discussion at your counseling sessions is the hold your parents have on you, and whether they perceive you as an adult. I would strongly urge you to consider whether you want such incredible strings tied to the financing of your wedding. Because at the moment it is clearly their wedding.

manateehugger · January 2014

If he can afford the payments, I don't think this is a huge problem. Especially because, as PP mentioned, successfully paying off a car can help you out come mortgage time. He needed transportation, so he bought transportation he can afford. If he bought a luxury car he could not afford to make payments on, I think it would be a little different.

I'm more concerned that you two don't seem to be on the same page about expenditures and about the fact that you are letting your parents stick their noses where they don't belong. Your finances are not between you and them. They are between you and your future husband. You two need to work out a plan for finances together and upcoming big ticket items, not you and your parents. Your parents pulling funding because your FI bought a car HE CAN AFFORD is ridiculous. Trying to manipulate who you marry and when you marry is ridiculous.

If you are combining finances in the future, start working out a plan to make financial decisions now with your counselor. I don't think this is a red flag about him in particular, but I do think it's a red flag about how you two will make financial decisions in the future together (SANS PARENTS). It sounds like you two are just lacking communication on the issue.

SBbride67 · January 2014

Thanks for the replies everyone. That really gave me some perspective. My fiancé and I are going to sit down with my parents to discuss boundaries, and he and I will also discuss our marital financing more.

artbyallie · January 2014

Why doesn't he sell the motorcycle? If he's got a new car to get to work, the bike is a luxury. He doesn't need to be making payments on two vehicles.

PolarBearFitz · January 2014

I'm with PPs on this one. Your Fiance's spending using his money is none of your parents business. It really doesn't make a difference that they are paying for the wedding in this case.

I think it's crappy your parents are acting this way to begin with and treating wedding funding like a bartering chip. One decision to buy a vehicle after getting a new lucrative job is not a testament to what kind of man your FI is...the only person who should be saying he is or isn't the 'right man' is you.

You should definitely be a part of the discussion on any big purchases as your finances will soon be combined but not your folks. This should not be something you discuss with your parents and if they pull funding like that then I think you two should consider paying for your own wedding.

QueerFemme · January 2014

You might want to consider putting off your wedding until you two can pay for it. Your parent's money comes with strings and judgement.

jneen101 · January 2014

What kind of car is it?

cmiles89 · January 2014

I can totally see where you're coming from OP, I've had a similar situation like this happen with my FI. At the time, the frustrating part was that he could have bought a much cheaper used car with a lower interest rate, but he wanted a sporty car and he can just barely afford payments on it so he isn't saving much. So, even though we had other things to look forward to in the future, he bought something that set him (and therefore, me) back a little bit financially.

The key is communication- talk to your FI and come to an understanding of why this might be an issue, and create a united front. Talk to your parents about boundaries, and talk to your counselor about what to do in the future.

This is *not* an insurmountable problem, as your parents seem to think, it just takes some work and talking it out. GL!

phira · January 2014

You're two years out of college in an economy where, on average, people aren't buying homes until they're in their 30s. I don't really get why there's so much pressure on him not to buy a car because of how it'll affect mortgage rates when you're 24-25 years old.

dharmabunny · January 2014

From someone that has fits and spasms of "instant gratification". Wanting to have a little consumeristic joy in the now is not a character flaw or the mark of a lesser being. There's nothing wrong with curbing the excesses or conscious financial planning. But living like a penitent monk just to game the mortgage system may not be something he wants to live with. Maybe your end goals are not exactly on the same page

Maybe a his, yours and ours account setup could work. X amount goes to each of you as "allowance" to use as each if you sees fit. If he wants to continue payments on his motorcycle and spend the remainder on snickers bars, his money. But he can't whine about not having the money to buy a new toy.

This isn't deal breaker stuff. Draw the parental boundary, for one (like I even tell my parents anything about $$$) I would just make the suggestion that you need to do some reflection about what money means to you and why you treat it like you do, he does the same and that coming to a compromise does not mean "you do what I tell you to do"

erinlin25 · January 2014

what kind of car did he buy? I mean if he went balls to the walls and bought a crazy sports car that cost like thousands of dollars that he clearly could not afford than I would say that was rash and childish, but if he bought an affordable car with his own money so he can get to his job then that to me is a necessity. Your parents need to chill and stay out of it. If they are holding money over your wedding you need to decline their money and host the wedding you and your fiance can afford. He has a job and has control over what he spends his money on-- a car is an item that most people would need. If he were throwing his money on exotic vacations and over spending then that would be a red flag. To me, working hard to graduate college and landing a good job qualifies as I can reward myself with a car. I bought myself a car after I graduated college and got my first real job. And buying a car and making payments on it can actually help his credit, especially when he pays it off. What are your contributions to buying a house? You can always rent an apartment or smaller house to get started. I will tell your parents to chill and cut the cord.

mrsconn23 · January 2014

I see more red flags with you than him.

Yes, buying a car should be an expense that is discussed in detail before making the purchase. But, he had a need for the car. And he bought one he can afford.

It's BS that you told him to 'suck it up and deal'. He's not a petulant teenager that wants something to want something. You essentially closed off the discussion and forced his hand to make a decision for himself.

Furthermore, you can say whatever you want about how it went down, but basically you went and told mommy and daddy on him. WTF? Y'all are grown, college-educated people. With jobs.

While it's uber-generous of your parents to pay for your wedding, they are over-reaching by telling you guys how to spend your money and holding the wedding over your heads. I would be livid if my husband discussed our finances in detail with his parents. It's not.their.business.

Yes, background and how people are raised is important. But you and your parents seem to have a judgmental air about how you view his family and by extension, him.

All of these points are what you should be discussing in counseling. Not the damn car.

kannf1982 · January 2014

Buying a car, especially when somebody needs one and just got a new job, is a perfectly normal decision.

Trust his decisions a little more, and disregard your parents' opinions altogether. You and he are adults. Honestly I am 31 and have been financially independent for ten years and if my parents every tried to control any aspect of my life or marriage or shred with me any judgment about my life or my fiance's, they would stop hearing from me until they learned to be quiet and mind their own business.

Tread lightly when it comes to unabashedly judging the actions of your fiance while taking everything your parents say as solid gold truth. If you're wrong, you may end up single and stuck with parents who will be ready to unwittingly talk you out of the next decent guy as well.

Try being happy for him.....telling him you support his decisions....congratulate him on his new job and his new car and tell him he deserves it....go into the bank and get a 3.8% mortgage instead of the 3.2% you thought you were gonna get, and just be happy youre in a house...ignore your judgy parents who likely dont have the fainted idea about the challenges other people have faced....

You may just find yourself in a happy healthy relationship, despite the few extra bucks on your monthly mortgage payment!!!

PMeg819 · January 2014

There is some missing info here. Buying a car may have been necessary, but OP doesn't mention if he bought something sensible or if splurged. I can afford payments on a BMW but that doesn't mean it makes financial sense for me to do so. I probably should stick with a Toyota. The other thing is that in some instances motorcycles are cheaper to own- they use less gas and depending on her fi's location may be cheaper on parking costs. OP needs to examine everything. And honestly, if he had talked to you about the car payments and such beforehand, but still went out and bought a car that you thought you had both agreed was more than you wanted to spend I'd be concerned about your communication more than your parents.

Chipmunk415 · January 2014

FI talks about getting himself a new car after graduation. He currently drives a 98 corolla. It's in fairly good condition, but not something I'd want to take on long trips with speed limits of 70 mph.

My only comments to him are a) don't take out a loan like he did for the truck he ended up selling- he was sooo happy when he sold that gas guzzler and got out of debt, and b) remember that with us getting married, this will soon become a joint decision/discuss with me, as we've both stated the priority is saving for a house.

baconsmom · January 2014

Chipmunk415 said:

FI talks about getting himself a new car after graduation. He currently drives a 98 corolla. It's in fairly good condition, but not something I'd want to take on long trips with speed limits of 70 mph.

My only comments to him are a) don't take out a loan like he did for the truck he ended up selling- he was sooo happy when he sold that gas guzzler and got out of debt, and b) remember that with us getting married, this will soon become a joint decision/discuss with me, as we've both stated the priority is saving for a house.

A '98 Corolla is *not* in "good" condition if you don't trust it to do 70 mph. He should get something else.

(I have a '00 Corolla. I do 85 on the regular. That's "good" condition.)

Wzz · January 2014

i agree with conn. i get consulting your parents on wedding-related purchases. i do not get why your parents need to know what your fiance has spent his own money on when they aren't responsible for his personal bills.

PrettyGirlLost · January 2014

PMeg819 said:

There is some missing info here. Buying a car may have been necessary, but OP doesn't mention if he bought something sensible or if splurged. I can afford payments on a BMW but that doesn't mean it makes financial sense for me to do so. I probably should stick with a Toyota. The other thing is that in some instances motorcycles are cheaper to own- they use less gas and depending on her fi's location may be cheaper on parking costs. OP needs to examine everything. And honestly, if he had talked to you about the car payments and such beforehand, but still went out and bought a car that you thought you had both agreed was more than you wanted to spend I'd be concerned about your communication more than your parents.

They are also incredibly dangerous to drive in urban areas where motorists might not see them, tail gate them, etc. And you cannot drive them in the winter because it's just fucking freezing and motorcycles do not do well on ice. The windchill is below zero in my city right now, guess how many motorcyclists I see out on the roads?

ReturnOfKuus · January 2014

You two should postpone the wedding until you're old enough not to attribute all behavior to your parents' beliefs.

Pandemonia · January 2014

Your FI taking out a loan on a car is something that you need to deal with together. Your parents have no need or right to know about his finances. So for starters, stop over-sharing.

Jean0715 · January 2014

If he can afford it he can buy it.

I dealt with something similar when we first started saving for our wedding. My fiancé traded in his car for a car with a lower monthly payment and then went out and bought a brand new dirt bike (it was over $7,000).

Did I get mad? no. Why? It's his money that he works hard for and he can spend it the way he wants. Plus we were still able to save for our wedding.

I think the counseling is a good idea for you two. You both need to be on the same page when it comes to finances.

Wzz · January 2014

i don't think his ability to afford or not afford a car is an issue. the problem is that it is none of the parents' business what his finances are unless he is asking her parents for money to pay his bills.

delujm0 · January 2014

The issue here is one of communiction - clealy OP's priority is getting a mortgage in two years. OP, it's going to be hard to get that mortgage if your FI doesn't have a job. And it's going to be hard for him to keep a job if he can't drive there in the winter on his motorcycle.

There's definitley some information missing here...i have to assume that OP's FI didn't buy something ridiculous, since she states that he will have no problem making the payments. OP, you two need to sit down and discuss your financial priorities...honestly i'd be more concerned about FI's ability to save for a down payment now that he has the car payment than i would be about the slight rise in interest rates that you'll be dealing with now. No one can predict what interest rates will be in 2 years. For all you know, they will double and you won't be able to afford to get a house at all. You should be concentrating more on a down payment right now.

Also, loosen up the purse strings a little. If you're going to question every purchase your FI makes, you're going to be miserable in the long run. A car is a necessity in most places. If he had a car and he went out and randomly bought at $20k motorcycle, that would be another story. You can't expect him to use a motorcycle as his only vehicle, especially if you live somewhere that has a winter.

pinkcow13 · January 2014

It is not your parents business what your finances are, let alone his. And the fact that you are letting your parents influence your opinion of him is in my opinion more of the red flag. This is your fiance, he will be your husband, and you will be become a family. Are you going to run to your parents to complain about him every time he does something that you don't agree with? Your parents have absolutely no say in this. And unless he bought some flashy car, I think it was a smart decision. Personally, I would want my FI riding to work in a car than a motorcycle any day.

MollyandD · January 2014

I bought my house last year at age 24 on my own. My credit was at a great place and I got a fantastic interest rate without having anyone else on the loan. My fiance helped pick it out, and we split all the bills evenly. They just happen to be in my name.

He didn't just take away your chance to own a home. You may get a better rate if you wait a little longer than you planned, but all hope isn't suddenly lost.

Blergbot · January 2014

pinkcow13 said:

And the fact that you are letting your parents influence your opinion of him is in my opinion more of the red flag.

This. You are quite young to be getting married, and the fact that you still have this kind of relationship with your parents suggests that they may not think the two of you are mature enough to handle your own finances. Maybe that's just them being overprotective and not being able to let go, but given the fact that you and your fiance aren't on the same page, maybe they have some legitimate concerns here. That's not to say you and your SO shouldn't be together and aren't committed to each other, but maybe waiting a few years to get married would be wise.

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