Blue Engagement

Re: Blue Engagement

• CMGragain member

  

  January 2015 edited January 2015

  juch1987 said:

  First time posting, and I'm sad to have it in this forum! But I'm starting to fall apart. 

  
  

  My fiance and I had been together for five years and living together for three when he proposed this past September. The problem is classic: my parents don't like him. And he doesn't like them. They are totally different people. My parents are very pragmatic, clannish, hard-working, and perfectionistic. They rarely offer the benefit of the doubt to anyone, can be very critical, and will never admit they are wrong in any situation. I love them anyway - they are also loyal, giving, and determined. My fiance on the other hand is generous, intellectual, and unfailingly emotionally supportive, which are traits that make him a caring partner but that my parents are hard-wired to never appreciate. They see him as unambitious, lazy, and a little snobbish. They frame their concern as being worried that he won't step up to the plate to provide for me and our new family if anything happens and I can't work (I currently earn more than twice as much as he does, but also work longer hours in a more demanding job). In reality, he is struggling a little with his career - grad school is wacky expensive, his current job is a dead-end, and he isn't in love with any potential career alternatives. I see their concerns, but I wish they could see his good traits!

  
  

  They don't think he is a worthy person, and he doesn't think they are worthy people. All three of them are also proud, and deeply offended by the (known) fact that the other party dislikes them. It's bad enough that I had a small panic attack after he proposed and before we gave them the news, which cast a pall over our engagement (he's partly convinced I don't actually want to get married to him). 

  
  

  To mend fences, I suggested that they be involved in the wedding planning, which I imagined at the time would be a string of fun and pretty activities. Disastrous. They disagreed with everything we liked, and we had several phone conversations that ended with me in tears because my parents said things like, "If that's what you decide to do, don't expect your father to come," or "We feel like we don't even know you any more," or "You are turning into a very selfish person." In response to things like: wanting to use a local decommissioned ferry-boat for the venue (it's beautiful, tons of people I know have been married there), wanting to have the wedding on a Sunday versus Friday, or forgetting to explicitly invite my mom to come with me to go back to the shop and inspect/pick up the wedding dress I had tried on with her previously. All of this has been painful and stressful, and I've struggled to set boundaries with them while trying to keep the groundwork for an on-going healthy relationship with them. Over Christmas, I told them that while I still would keep them in the loop around wedding stuff, I didn't want them to be part of the decision making anymore, because they aren't able to disagree with me without taking the position that it's because I am wrong and they are right. There is no room for compromise with them. It's hard to feel like I have hurt them in the short term, but I do hope that it will help us in the long term.

  
  

  On the other side, I am juggling my fiance's feelings about my parents, which are very, very negative. He doesn't see any of the good in them, just the ways that they have hurt me and insulted him. We are going to a couples therapist, which has helped to articulate some of what we are feeling, but it doesn't feel like there is a solution. When I'm not actively angry at my parents, it's hard for me to hear him say mean or cruel things about them. Not only do I still love them, but a lot of who they are has shaped me as a person. I am also pragmatic, hard-working, perfectionistic, even if it's to a less extreme degree. My personality sometimes conflicts with his for the same reason that his conflicts with my parents. So when he says things about them, it feels like he is saying them about me, too.

  
  

  Three months into our engagement, every element of trying to plan the wedding has ended in tears one way or another.  I'm exhausted. He's depressed. My parents are alternately trying to stay involved and offended by our reluctance to talk about anything related to our lives. We don't want to find an officiant, book a photographer, ask friends to be our attendants, or even choose wedding colors, because it feels wrong to pull more people into this unhappy experience. We did, at least, send save the dates, so that's something. Our friends are on my fiance's side - my parents are hard to sympathize with if you don't already love them. My younger brother wants to stay out of the whole thing.

  
  

  I guess my question is, how do I climb out of this "pit of despair"? I never really elaborately imagined a dream wedding as a little girl, but I did always think that it would be a happy time where I felt supported by the people closest to me. I have no idea how to even try to get back to that dream.
  

  Go see a Disney movie.  That is how realistic you are being.
  
  Life is not always happy.  Weddings are often stressful.  Your expectations are not realistic.  There is no "happily ever after".
  
  Sorry to be so blunt, but there it is.  Your family will not magically change into different people just because it is your wedding.  Your fiance will not change his mind about your parents, either.  YOU have to decide what is most important to you, and draw the line.
  
  If your parents start criticizing, you cut off the conversation and hang up the phone, or leave.  No arguing.  No discussion.  You can say, "It hurts me when you talk that way about John.  Please don't do this."  Same with your fiance.  "I know my parents are not perfect people, but it hurts me when you say mean things about them.  Please don't do this."
  
  You may have to come to a painful decision about your relationship if you can't work this out.  If you think they are ever going to be a loving family, then you are being very unrealistic.
  
  If you do go through with your wedding plans, then stop involving other people in decisions.  Plan your own wedding.  (Are you paying for it?  If you aren't, then you should!  Then you will have complete control.)
  

  

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• AddieCake member

  

  January 2015

  CMGr is right. If neither side is going to budge, you are going to have to make some choices. You didn't say your parents will be dropping out of your life if you marry him, so at least you have that. Hopefully everyone can be civil to each other when they have to be around each other, but you may find that your time with everyone together will be limited. For example, your fiance might choose not to go with you to see them. All of this can put a strain on your relationships, both with your parents and your future husband. Plenty of people manage with these difficult relationships, though. It sounds like you have done all you can, so now you just have to accept that neither side is going to warm up to the other and make it known to both sides that you are not interested in hearing what they think regarding the other side.

  What did you think would happen if you walked up to a group of internet strangers and told them to get shoehorned by their lady doc?~StageManager14

  

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• ohannabelle member

  

  January 2015

  This is sad. Truly. 

  That being said, it's time to set very firm limits with both your parents and fiancé.

  They aren't required to love each other. (In a perfect world, they would. The bad news, of course, is that we exist in an imperfect world.)

  
  

  They are required to behave like respectful adults who love you. I'm assuming they all love you, and are just behaving badly.  I have said a million times that you can't control anybody's behavior, but you can absolutely control how you respond to it.

  
  

  Time to take control. 

  
  

  All persons need to be told that their behavior is hurting you, and that they need to deal with their own issues quietly and politely, like adults. 

  You're more than aware of your Fiancé's feelings. There's no need for him to further criticize your parents to you, knowing it hurts you. 

  The same goes for your parents. 

  The end.

  
  

  Tell everyone very clearly that you're done dealing, unless what they say is something helpful and constructive to a better relationship. You're simply no longer going to listen to complaints and criticisms. It puts you in unhappy and conflicted positions, and it accomplishes nothing. They can learn to accept and deal with their differences as adults, or simply keep it to themselves.

  Say it, mean it, and if anyone starts, you remove yourself from the room. No exceptions. Refuse to have these conversations. 

  
  

  You are perfectly within your rights to ask for this personal respect, and to set these limits. Before adults open their mouths, they are required to consider what their words will accomplish, and what the consequences might be. Nobody's doing this. They need to start, immediately. 

  
  

  Ask your counselor the best way to present this to them. I tend to be very very direct and plain spoken, like a sledgehammer. There is probably a more diplomatic way to tell everyone to grow up and behave. 

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• mlg78 member

  

  January 2015

  Stop trying to make your parents inclusive on everything regarding the wedding and start creating boundaries with your husband and your parents in regards to how they treat one another and how they drag you into it.

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• rcher912 member

  

  January 2015

  I, too, have struggled with a lot of aspects of wedding planning. No one's nearly as excited or happy about it as I am (or want to be, usually) - it's feeling a lot like Christmas to me. It's something that IS HAPPY DAMMIT AND WILL BE GREAT DAMMIT but the expectations in my head are just too high. It's exhausting and, like you, putting a real strain on some relationships.

  
  

  For me, it's definitely been a lesson in calming myself down, setting more realistic expectations, and finding different levels of support (including these forums, various friends I don't usually lean on, etc) to take the stress of off me and my usual support system.

  
  

  Also, a quick vacation over Christmas break didn't hurt. Get out of town and reconnect with FI, even if only for a weekend. No decisions, no calls, just old-fashioned R&R.

  
  

  Good luck, and it'll be OK. Sending hugs!

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• Knottie31257313 member

  

  January 2015

  It's time to make a choice- and I think, from what I see in your post, it should be your fiance.
  
  I understand that parents are family, and that you love them unconditionally, but it doesn't seem like they're repaying the favor (of course, that isn't to say that they don't love you), but threatening not to come to your wedding because of decisions you're making about it is over the line. Do you want them telling you what career to choose, how many kids to have (and how to raise them), what house to buy, etc.? No. It sounds like your parents are trying to live your life for you, and it would break my heart to see you go down that path (and I don't even know you!) See it from your fiance's point of view: he doesn't want to spend his entire life cringing at Christmas after a comment made by your parents or having to raise your kids a certain way to appease them. This is one of the drawbacks to being an adult: you have to at some point choose between you spouse and your family (even if they love each other, you have to make choices on some level) and, at least in my opinion the best choice in your case is your fiance. 
  

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• vulpiepop member

  

  January 2015

  I'm sorry to hear that you're having so much trouble. I struggled with some similar situations but not nearly as bad. My parents also don't like my fiance but after making that known and after I talked to them about how it makes me feel for them to say such bad things about it, they stopped. Now my fiance and my parents communicate through me for the most part and that's just fine. It's getting better as they get used to each other.

  
  

  The main thing, as PPs have said, is to take control. You shouldn't have to choose between your parents and your fiance, but they don't need to like each other either. Your parents and your fiance all love you. Tell your fiance to knock off the crap talk about your parents around you. Let him know it hurts you when you hear him do that. He honestly shouldn't be speaking so badly of your parents around you when he knows full well that they're your parents and you love them. Tell your parents how you feel about their taking control of your wedding. Are they paying for it? If so, they have a say but ultimately, it's your wedding and you should make that fact clear. I mean, don't be disrespectful or anything, just say something along the lines of "Mom, Dad, I love and respect you, but this is my wedding and I really like this."

  
  

  Your fiance and your parents don't have to like each other, but for your sake, they need to stop quibbling and crap talking. They're all adults and should be able to be civil.

  
  

  

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• [Deleted User] member

  

  January 2015

  That's your man, not theirs. You two are getting married. Stop letting 3rd parties in your business & don't let them talk down on one another. Love them all; keep them separate unless necessary.

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• flutteringinfl member

  

  January 2015

  I don't know that you have to make a choice between them, but I do think you need to accept that they will never get along. If one party is making you feel like you need to choose, well, that says something, but they're also not necessarily right. You are allowed to communicate with people who don't get along themselves, and I think the more you try to push this idea of the "happy family," on everyone, the more it will backfire and the more miserable you will be.

  
  

  You don't need to emphasize to your parents why you've decided to stop talking to them about wedding stuff; just stop talking to them about it unless they're paying.

  
  

  It's not a fun lesson a learn, but it's something we all have to face at some point: you have to learn to accept or not accept people as they are; you can't change them. Sure, there's always the chance that something could happen and your parents and FI will change their minds for each other, but you have to accept the possibility that they won't. I know that's a really hard thing to accept, but I think that if you do, you'll feel a lot more peace than you now think you will. That's the key to making things better, not trying to force them together.

  

  
  

  
  

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• juch1987 member

  

  January 2015

  Thank you guys all so much for your thoughtful (and sometimes tough) responses. It's exactly what I needed to hear - that this is just how real life plays out sometimes, that just because the situation is difficult doesn't mean that it's broken, and that while they have a right to dislike each other, I have a right to not hear their badmouthing. 

  
  

  The last few days since I've posted have also had some encouraging developments - our landlord agreed to replace the ancient carpet in our apartment, which sent us on a mission to repaint the walls. My mom actually sent FI a text message directly to ask how it was going, in a chatty and agenda-free way, and they had a mini text-conversation about it. It's a little thing, but gives me a little hope that they may, one day, at least get used to each other. And if it doesn't happen, then I at least have strategies for pushing them to be civil, and can continue to work on building the inner gumption to stick to those strategies. 

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