Politics and the Lesser of Two Evils

themosthappy91 · October 2015

So reading some of the responses on the debate thread and other political discussions we've had on here makes me wonder- how do you feel about the lesser of two evils argument? From a poll I made previously it seems like posters on here are pretty overwhelming liberal and pretty evenly split between Bernie and Hillary- will you vote for whichever one gets the nomination in the general election?

I love both Bernie and Hillary so I'll be happy to vote for either honestly- but even if I didn't like the Democratic candidate I would vote for him/her over the Republican or a third party because I care a lot about seeing liberal justices appointed to the Supreme Court. I get the appeal of making a statement by going with a third party candidate, but I'm more concerned about another Thomas or Scalia on the court than I am about making that point. What are y'alls thoughts?

monkeysip · October 2015

It depends. Up until now, I've usually voted independent because I have very serious issues with both sides, and I honestly felt like neither side really lived up to its ideals. All just politics. I am hoping we can either get a third party out there one day, or the parties will seriously shift.

BUT this year, I might actually favor Sanders. He might be enough for me to overlook my problems with the democrats because I feel like he's so principled and outside of the establishment.

Ultimately, I do want to vote for someone who can win, but I'm not going to vote for someone whom I find disgusting only because I find them slightly less disgusting than the other guy, you know?

STARMOON44 · October 2015

I am a huge Hillary supporter and will absolutely vote for whichever candidate gets the nomination, just like I did right years ago. If we're comparing Sanders and Rubio, Sanders is an easy call for me even though he's not my first choice. I've never really felt like I'm choosing between two evils in the presidential election.

kimmiinthemitten · October 2015

For me, my mom is Deaf/Blind and lives on SSDI and Medicare. Dad is a retired, union postal worker. FI is a union public school teacher. Brother is a recovering addict. Sister is a mental health social worker for the VA. My job is in industrial sales so I'm surrounded by anti Union republicans and would personally benefit from their tax cuts, but I've seen too many manufacturers that wouldn't care about worker safety, proper product disposal and that already institute 60 hour mandatory workweeks to have faith in deregulation. I vote for the Democrat because there has yet to be a Republican candidate that supports my family or aligns with my belief system.

Currently, that is Bernie but I'd gladly vote for Clinton if she won the nomination.

ETA: if somehow Webb or Chaffee made it out on top I couldn't support them. They may claim to be Dems but that's only because of how far right the Republican Party has shifted. They're the new Reagen Democrat, since even he wasn't conservative enough for today's standards.

MairePoppy · October 2015

I'm a Democrat, the type that Republicans derisively refer to as 'liberal.'

I will be voting for Hillary. I love Hillary's ideas and I think she knows how to work the system. But let's say that something unforseen happens and Bernie is our man - I would vote for him. I love Bernie's ideas, too, but I don't think he has a solid plan to implement them. I would like to hear more about O'Malley. The other two, Webb and Chafee would not get my vote. Their chances of running for president are so slim that I'm not worried about chosing between them and a Republican.

I wouldn't rule out voting for a Republican - ever- but I definitely wouldn't vote for any that are campaiging right now. As it stands now, I would vote for any of the Democratic candidates over any of the present Republican candidates. It's scary that Trump is their favorite right now.

Not sure if I'd ever vote for a third party candidate. He/she would have have some great ideals and a huge following with some chance of winning. Otherwise, I'd feel like I was throwing my vote away.

LD1970 · October 2015

Eight years ago, I liked both Hillary and Obama, but voted for Obama in the primaries because I thought he had a better chance of winning the general election than she did, and I was right.

Today, Hillary has made me dislike her immensely. Bernie's my guy, and if the polls I've seen are right, he's going to take it. If he loses the primary, though, I'm writing him in as my choice for the general election. Hillary's a liar who's too easily bought, and the Republican candidates are all looney tunes. So no matter what, I'm voting Bernie twice.

themosthappy91 · October 2015

LD1970 said:

Eight years ago, I liked both Hillary and Obama, but voted for Obama in the primaries because I thought he had a better chance of winning the general election than she did, and I was right.

Today, Hillary has made me dislike her immensely. Bernie's my guy, and if the polls I've seen are right, he's going to take it. If he loses the primary, though, I'm writing him in as my choice for the general election. Hillary's a liar who's too easily bought, and the Republican candidates are all looney tunes. So no matter what, I'm voting Bernie twice.

I'm curious what polls you are looking at- the vast majority of national polls that I've seen have Hillary handily ahead.

kimmiinthemitten · October 2015

themosthappy91 said:

LD1970 said:

Eight years ago, I liked both Hillary and Obama, but voted for Obama in the primaries because I thought he had a better chance of winning the general election than she did, and I was right.

Today, Hillary has made me dislike her immensely. Bernie's my guy, and if the polls I've seen are right, he's going to take it. If he loses the primary, though, I'm writing him in as my choice for the general election. Hillary's a liar who's too easily bought, and the Republican candidates are all looney tunes. So no matter what, I'm voting Bernie twice.

I'm curious what polls you are looking at- the vast majority of national polls that I've seen have Hillary handily ahead.

National polls ran or published by Time Warner or Cablevision companies/channels per chance? Time Warner owns all of CNN and is her 7th largest contributor. Cablevision is the largest cable provider on the east coast and is her 10th largest contributor. Comcast owns NBC and has donated over $400,000. Hell, even Century Fox 21 is a huge contributor of hers.

themosthappy91 · October 2015

I usually check this site:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/president/

...because it has a variety of polls from all kinds of sources- news outlets, universities, PPP, think tanks etc. The only ones I ever see Bernie ahead of Hillary in are ones that just look at the early primary states, which aren't really reflective of the nation due to their lack of minorities, a group that Hillary absolutely crushes him with consistently. And even in those he's barely up, versus a slew of polls that have her 20+ points ahead.

Don't get me wrong- I love Bernie and I wish he had more of a shot. I just see a lot of his fanbase- who tend to be young and heavy social media users- getting swept up in click-bait-y, misleading articles pumping up his numbers that tend to go viral due to the nature of his base.

ETA: I usually just skim stuff about polls this early out so it's totally possible I'm missing some big ones in favor of Bernie- I didn't mean from my comment to sound like I'm an authority on this when I really am not the closest follower. I really am curious if y'all have other polls with him on top to share!

STARMOON44 · October 2015

kimmiinthemitten said:

themosthappy91 said:

LD1970 said:

Eight years ago, I liked both Hillary and Obama, but voted for Obama in the primaries because I thought he had a better chance of winning the general election than she did, and I was right.

Today, Hillary has made me dislike her immensely. Bernie's my guy, and if the polls I've seen are right, he's going to take it. If he loses the primary, though, I'm writing him in as my choice for the general election. Hillary's a liar who's too easily bought, and the Republican candidates are all looney tunes. So no matter what, I'm voting Bernie twice.

I'm curious what polls you are looking at- the vast majority of national polls that I've seen have Hillary handily ahead.

National polls ran or published by Time Warner or Cablevision companies/channels per chance? Time Warner owns all of CNN and is her 7th largest contributor. Cablevision is the largest cable provider on the east coast and is her 10th largest contributor. Comcast owns NBC and has donated over $400,000. Hell, even Century Fox 21 is a huge contributor of hers.

I like fivethirtyeight for election stats. And they are very much selling Bernie stock.

STARMOON44 · October 2015

kimmiinthemitten said:

themosthappy91 said:

LD1970 said:

Eight years ago, I liked both Hillary and Obama, but voted for Obama in the primaries because I thought he had a better chance of winning the general election than she did, and I was right.

Today, Hillary has made me dislike her immensely. Bernie's my guy, and if the polls I've seen are right, he's going to take it. If he loses the primary, though, I'm writing him in as my choice for the general election. Hillary's a liar who's too easily bought, and the Republican candidates are all looney tunes. So no matter what, I'm voting Bernie twice.

I'm curious what polls you are looking at- the vast majority of national polls that I've seen have Hillary handily ahead.

National polls ran or published by Time Warner or Cablevision companies/channels per chance? Time Warner owns all of CNN and is her 7th largest contributor. Cablevision is the largest cable provider on the east coast and is her 10th largest contributor. Comcast owns NBC and has donated over $400,000. Hell, even Century Fox 21 is a huge contributor of hers.

This is also just not true. Those contributor statistics are doctored, in part, by combining individual personal donations and attributing them to that person's employer. If you're really into the polling data I encourage you to do some more research.

kimmiinthemitten · October 2015

STARMOON44 said:

themosthappy91 said:

LD1970 said:

Eight years ago, I liked both Hillary and Obama, but voted for Obama in the primaries because I thought he had a better chance of winning the general election than she did, and I was right.

Today, Hillary has made me dislike her immensely. Bernie's my guy, and if the polls I've seen are right, he's going to take it. If he loses the primary, though, I'm writing him in as my choice for the general election. Hillary's a liar who's too easily bought, and the Republican candidates are all looney tunes. So no matter what, I'm voting Bernie twice.

I'm curious what polls you are looking at- the vast majority of national polls that I've seen have Hillary handily ahead.

National polls ran or published by Time Warner or Cablevision companies/channels per chance? Time Warner owns all of CNN and is her 7th largest contributor. Cablevision is the largest cable provider on the east coast and is her 10th largest contributor. Comcast owns NBC and has donated over $400,000. Hell, even Century Fox 21 is a huge contributor of hers.

This is also just not true. Those contributor statistics are doctored, in part, by combining individual personal donations and attributing them to that person's employer. If you're really into the polling data I encourage you to do some more research.

And the Super PAC's for each of those companies. Most people vote with their pocketbook, so it only makes sense that employees of huge monopolies in both banks as well as communications (mass media and tele-comm) would support the candidate that supports their employer best. And if your work/professional organization happens to be bundling donations under one lobbyist - even better!

Here are other media/telecomm donors who contributed to her Super PAC as well: Haiam Sayab, Herb Sandler, Jeffrey Katzenberg, Donald Sussman, Fred Eychaner, Irwin Jacobs, and James Simons.

aurianna · October 2015

Now unlike many here, I'm very fiscally conservative and socially moderate, and often align closer to 3rd party candidates than the GOP establishment, but in general I tend to prescribe to the "lesser of two evils" camp. I really did not like McCain that much but I voted for him. Didn't like Romney much better but I voted for him.
Jeb Bush and Chris Christie aren't my favorites but if one of them won the nomination I'd probably vote for them. Because third party just is so rarely viable.

The exception would be if Trump won the nomination. While I really enjoy watching him for the entertainment value, I would need to see a lot more from him before I thought he was prepared to lead the country. A lot more.
Even still, the Supreme Court issue brought up by a PP gives me pause. As it stands, scotus is pretty well balanced. I think most can agree that there haven't been many cases lately that "ZOMG! They're all conservatives and that's why this decision happened." I'd like to see the balance continue. Depending on how long the more conservative justices seemed like they'd be able to hold on, would potentially sway my vote, even in the Trump case. It's really too early for me to make that call though.

Politics and the Lesser of Two Evils

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