How do you feel about 2 ceremonies within a ceremony?

SB1512 · November 2012

FI and I met with a JOP over the weekend, who was absolutely wonderful, and very thorough. We spent 2.5 hours chatting at him home, and we both agreed he will be our officiant. Now, FI's parents and aunt/uncle are religious and apparently there was a LOT of grumbling to FI's sisters when they learned we are not doing a church wedding. I am not religious.....to the point where I was not even baptized. FI attended church until the day he made his confirmation (15 years ago) and then promptly told his parents he was no longer going to be attending church on sunday's, he'd rather be sleeping lol. Since I am not religious, and he is not a believer, I am not willing to cave and get married in a church just to please his family and FI 100% agrees with this.

When meeting with the JOP he was telling us about ceremonies we could do within our ceremony (candle, sand, rose, wine and box, ring warming, stone blessing, etc). FI and I both really liked the rose ceremony, and he suggested that maybe we do the candle ceremony because it's similar to what happens in a church wedding (but the wording along with the ceremony is not religious) and his parents would appreciate it. Do you think 2 ceremonies within our JOP ceremony is too much? I think overall the whole thing won't go more than 20 minutes even with both, just wanted to get other opinions on whether or not 2 symbolic ceremonies is overboard. Thanks!

Love11506 · November 2012

No I don't think it's too much if you want to do it that way it's your wedding do what you want to do!

JaxInBlue · November 2012

I think two would be fine. Looking at the rose ceremony wording, it seems like this is something you would do toward the end of your ceremony, whereas my understanding of the unity candle ceremony is that its timing can be a little more flexible. I'd just keep flow and brevity (if that's important to you) in mind and involve your officiant in how the events are ordered so that each has its own significance.

Calypso1977 · November 2012

i actually think trying to do something that "appears" religious is probably going to be more insulting to your FI's family than if you did nothing at all.

i assume your FI is catholic as you mention confirmation. the unity candle isnt even a part of the catholic wedding ceremony although some priests allow for its inclusion.

i would have the ceremony that the two you want to have, that fits your beliefs. i would add parts that you think are important to you, but i wouldnt add parts just for filler. i went to one JOP wedding that was about 3 minutes long. i felt it VERY short, but its what the couple wanted.

jessicabessica · November 2012

I agree with PPs. If you want to have both ceremonies, go for it, but don't expect his parents to be grateful that you are doing the candle ceremony.

SB1512 · November 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_how-do-you-feel-about-2-ceremonies-within-a-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:366f0052-5530-4087-ac59-6caaf15826bfPost:15d36e14-f0bd-4239-aec5-0535a27abd29">Re:How do you feel about 2 ceremonies within a ceremony?</a>:
[QUOTE]I don't think it's too much, but the Unity Candle has no inherent Christian properties and actually isn't allowed in many churches. Also, I have found that families being upset by lack of religion in wedding ceremonies tends to be less about not having "familiar" elements in the wedding and <strong>more about worrying their child will suffer eternal damnation for their choices</strong>. So if your only reason for doing a unity candle is to hopefully make his parents happy, I wouldn't bother.
Posted by StageManager14[/QUOTE]

It's definitely this reason, because a lot of their grumbling was "that's not how we raised him." Well, does how I was raised not get taken into account? I'm also guessing that they are thinking ahead to any children we may have (which is a whole other conversation because we are both unsure that we even want kids) and whether or not they could get baptized (again, a whole other can of worms because I do not believe in doing something for show, we'd never take any kids we do have to church so what's the point of a baptism).

SB1512 · November 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_how-do-you-feel-about-2-ceremonies-within-a-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:366f0052-5530-4087-ac59-6caaf15826bfPost:c361055c-c3a4-4615-ba55-cbe6f668a6a9">Re: How do you feel about 2 ceremonies within a ceremony?</a>:
[QUOTE]I agree with PPs. If you want to have both ceremonies, go for it, but don't expect his parents to be grateful that you are doing the candle ceremony.
Posted by jessicabessica[/QUOTE]

I agree and I don't expect anything. I think that if FI thinks having the candle ceremony will make them happy (even though now I know the ceremony is not done in most church weddings) then that's his choice to make and I won't tell him to do otherwise.

joeyryan · November 2012

Awww... that's unfortunate. But, it's YOUR wedding. YOU GUYS are in charge, not the families. If the unity candle or oathing stone speaks to you, then you should include it in the ceremony. Don't do it "for them". They will put on their best faces and their best Christian manners and enjoy themselves. Or they won't. The next time THEY get married, they can get married in a church or sacrifice a cow or wave a chicken over their heads or whatever they want. This is YOUR day, and YOU should do what YOU want. 'Nuff said.

Simply Fated · November 2012

If they are going to grumble, anyway, then I wouldn't do it just for them. Do these things because you want to do them and not for them. You'll enjoy your ceremony more. Try to turn a deaf ear to their grumbling. I know that won't be easy, trust me, but it is your ceremony, not theirs and you need to be happy with it, not them.

KatWAG · November 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_how-do-you-feel-about-2-ceremonies-within-a-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:366f0052-5530-4087-ac59-6caaf15826bfPost:548b0f9f-7bb4-45ff-a17f-8ea790969f03">Re: How do you feel about 2 ceremonies within a ceremony?</a>:
[QUOTE]i actually think trying to do something that "appears" religious is probably going to be more insulting to your FI's family than if you did nothing at all.<strong> i assume your FI is catholic as you mention confirmation</strong>. the unity candle isnt even a part of the catholic wedding ceremony although some priests allow for its inclusion. i would have the ceremony that the two you want to have, that fits your beliefs. i would add parts that you think are important to you, but i wouldnt add parts just for filler. i went to one JOP wedding that was about 3 minutes long. i felt it VERY short, but its what the couple wanted.
Posted by Calypso1977[/QUOTE]

Lutherans also have confirmations.

TheVirginians · November 2012

...and Presbyterians have confirmations. Religion is about worshipping a god, whether that god be a pumpkin or my God. You have a relationship with that deity and pray to that deity and honor that deity. If you don't have a god, so be it. You cannot incorporate a deity into your ceremony if you don't have a deity. There is absolutely no way that unity candles, etc. have anything to do with a deity. It is what you say and feel and whom you revere during the ceremony that brings God into the ceremony. Have the ceremony that you want and don't try to bring in something you do not believe in. There is nothing wrong with a JOP led ceremony. Just thank the parents, if you want to honor them.

StephJean83 · November 2012

My friend got married 2 yrs ago and she had a JOP wedding at a local barn with ceremony in the gazebo outside. They exchanged vows and rings, had a sand ceremony, did the rose ceremony, her Godmother read a poem, a friend read a scripture reading and they released doves. Her whole ceremony was done in about 25/30 mins. It flowed very nicely and the order worked. The ceremony was: Processional, greeting/welcoming, scripture reading, vows, rings, sand ceremony, God mother's poem, rose ceremony, presentation of husband and wife, releasing of the doves and recessional.

If you want to do the candle or rose ceremony, I say go for it. Do it because it is something that will symbolize you and your FI and your relationship and not for his family. If you both give in and have the ceremony in a church for them, they will probably find something else to complain about to your FI's sister. A PP said it best, the ceremony is all about the couple, so as long as everyone invited has a seat, do what makes the 2 of you happy.

Jen4948 · November 2012

Don't do it to make them happy if it's something you and your fiance don't believe in, because it would be disrespectful to that religion, and in the end, they won't be happy anyway because your ceremony isn't in their religious tradition. I think you're in for a married lifetime of grumbling from them. Just don't go along with any suggestions from them that you're not "married" because you didn't do it the way they wanted.

SB1512 · November 2012

Thanks for the responses. As I tried to state in my original post, it is not my wanting to incorporate religious things to make my FIL's comfortable, it is FI's idea to do it for his parents. To be honest, FI has been pretty hands off during wedding planning, other than choosing major vendors, and I've felt bad that I have been making a lot of decisions (even though he insists that he doesn't care about XYZ and whatever I choose is fine) and I feel like if I tell him not to have the candle ceremony it will seem like I am trying to take things over. So, regardless of his reasoning, I'm thinking that if he wants to have the candle ceremony we can have it. I think we'll wait to get the timeline of things from our JOP and see what it looks like. We both agreed we want to keep it at 20 minutes max, so if having 2 ceremonies will make things go longer than we like we'll discuss what can be eliminated, and what will comprise the ceremony we want, not what anyone else wants.

TurtlesAllTheWayDown · November 2012

I'm not really into those types of ceremonies, so we didn't do them... but our entire ceremony was less than 15 minutes long, too. Some people like to have the ceremony drawn out a bit because, well, it's meaningful and while some people appreciate short ceremonies, for some people they can be TOO short... personally, I think doing both of those and having a 25-30 minute ceremony is perfectly acceptable.

SB1512 · November 2012

Again, thank you Retread and CMGr. As I have already stated, this is not me doing this, this is FI doing it for his parents. I have seen many times advice given to brides to let the men deal with their parents, so that is what I plan to do. FI knows his parents best, and if he thinks they would appreciate a candle ceremony and feels strongly about including it (even though I have now learned it has no religious meaning) I do not want to force him out of the idea. Like I said, if we get our timeline and it looks like it will run more than 20 minutes I can nicely bring up "hey the candle ceremony isn't religious at all and not allowed in any churches, do you still want to include it?" Maybe I can suggest we ask his parents how they would feel about it. But, I don't want to bring it up now and have it come across like I am trying to take control over our ceremony. His parents do know that he does not hold their beliefs and has not set foot in church other than for a wedding or funeral since he was 15. To be honest, I do not know if they know I am not religious, or even baptized. To their credit, none of their grumbling has been directed towards FI directly, because they know he would get angry and yell at them about it, and they probably know on some level it's not their place to interfere......their grumbling was voiced to FI's sisters who of course filled him in. But his sisters also reminded his parents when the grumbling ensued that just because something is important to them doesn't mean that their child and his future wife will hold those same views and beliefs and something like religion and it's place (or lack thereof) in a ceremony is definitely a choice that only the bride and groom should be making.

noahark1 · November 2012

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_how-do-you-feel-about-2-ceremonies-within-a-ceremony?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:366f0052-5530-4087-ac59-6caaf15826bfPost:4cc5de43-5010-4188-9cc0-21fd3755ca5f">Re: How do you feel about 2 ceremonies within a ceremony?</a>:
[QUOTE]Again, thank you Retread and CMGr. As I have already stated, this is not me doing this, this is FI doing it for his parents. I have seen many times advice given to brides to let the men deal with their parents, so that is what I plan to do. FI knows his parents best, and if he thinks they would appreciate a candle ceremony and feels strongly about including it (even though I have now learned it has no religious meaning) I do not want to force him out of the idea. Like I said, if we get our timeline and it looks like it will run more than 20 minutes I can nicely bring up "hey the candle ceremony isn't religious at all a<strong>nd not allowed in any churches, do</strong> you still want to include it?" Maybe I can suggest we ask his parents how they would feel about it. But, I don't want to bring it up now and have it come across like I am trying to take control over our ceremony. His parents do know that he does not hold their beliefs and has not set foot in church other than for a wedding or funeral since he was 15. To be honest, I do not know if they know I am not religious, or even baptized. To their credit, none of their grumbling has been directed towards FI directly, because they know he would get angry and yell at them about it, and they probably know on some level it's not their place to interfere......their grumbling was voiced to FI's sisters who of course filled him in. But his sisters also reminded his parents when the grumbling ensued that just because something is important to them doesn't mean that their child and his future wife will hold those same views and beliefs and something like religion and it's place (or lack thereof) in a ceremony is definitely a choice that only the bride and groom should be making.
Posted by SB1512[/QUOTE]

<div>
</div><div>I've been to and assisted at weddings of various Protestant faiths and several do allow the candle ceremony although it does not carry any religious significance. I agree with others who said to incorporate those ceremonies that have meaning to you...and if none of them do, then don't do any</div>

How do you feel about 2 ceremonies within a ceremony?

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