Best time to negotiate maternity leave

kimmiinthemitten · November 2016

I am not pregnant. But FI and have I discussed not preventing about 6 months after the wedding, so June-Julyish.

If I do become pregnant, I'll be the first commissioned employee to do so and our current policy only covers salaried/hourly employees. When I inquired at HR they recommended talking to my boss because he would have a large say in the policy.

So when would you start the conversation? I'd rather discuss this before I become pregnant so I know what I'm dealing with going in. Open enrollment is in January, so part of me thinks now isn't a bad idea. Maybe then it could be in place before OE (we have 4 female commissioned employees now and one other woman who could become pregnant- but I don't know her situation just her age). But then I think end of year is so crazy maybe I should wait until January.

Thoughts?

Edited for grammar

charlotte989875 · November 2016

Said as someone who has never been prettier asked for family leave.

I think you should ask your boss what the leave policies are now. This isn't something you need to wait until your pregnant to know. Get something in writing about what is expected. Then when you do become pregnant go back to your boss and discuss the specifics of when you'll take off, what specific projects you need to complete based on the policies you discussed previously.

STARMOON44 · November 2016

I wouldn't ask yet. I'd use this time to figure out what comparable companies offer commissioned workers. Personally I'd hesitate to give them a heads up on a future pregnancy potentially years in advance since it just gives them an opportunity to sidetrack you for longer. Unless you are planning to quit if the policy isn't good enough I'd talk about it when you are at 12 weeks pregnant and not before.

ei34 · November 2016

If you do talk to your boss, inquire about FMLA, don't actually use the word pregnancy. Even though it's 2016, lots of employers will treat you differently if they know you're even thinking of trying, unfortunately.

And I can only speak about three sets of new parents I know very personally (H and me, sister and BIL, and a cousin and her H), but when all three of us had babies, the OE period didn't apply as far as coverage for the baby. You fax / email / interoffice the hospital paperwork to HR asap, and a copy of the birth certificate when you have it (usually takes 2-3 weeks), but newborn babies are covered right away, not when the next OE period rolls around.

kimmiinthemitten · November 2016

So much to think about and respond to! Thanks!

@charlotte989875I asked HR last year. Our policy is paid for 6 weeks at 60% (Short Term Disability) and then 6 weeks unpaid. However, I am an outside sales rep and work on a draw, and we have never had an employee take more than 3 weeks consecutive who is on a draw. That would be up to the President to write the policy (do I receive STD and my draw, how are my commissions and territory handled etc).

@STARMOON44 In my industry less than 5% of commissioned employees are women. I considered another opportunity earlier in the year and spoke with some other women in the industry whom I trust and my understanding is most companies also haven't updated their policies. In other industries, some companies suspend commission all together, but we have a long sales cycle and this would leave me unpaid for work I completed months prior. Other companies deny STD and continue the draw, others deduct the time off from the draw, some companies base STD pay on your draw alone, others include your salary. There doesn't seem to be an easy consistent answer.

@eileenrob I have quiet a few friends I'd probably make the same recommendation to, but I honestly don't worry about it affecting my job stability. I'm in the top 15 out of over 40 reps, have 9 years with this company, am a product specialist and the same person who will determine how I am paid is the same person who personally promoted me 7 years ago. I feel like having a veiled conversation about FMLA time off could either a. worry the President since I just had surgery 6 weeks ago or b. come across as an obvious veiled conversation with a boss that I'm close enough to invite to the wedding.

ETA: my thoughts for OE were more for me in case I need to change something I'm paying into/not paying into based on the policy in case I do get pregnant.

charlotte989875 · November 2016

kimmiinthemitten said:

So much to think about and respond to! Thanks!

@charlotte989875I asked HR last year. Our policy is paid for 6 weeks at 60% (Short Term Disability) and then 6 weeks unpaid. However, I am an outside sales rep and work on a draw, and we have never had an employee take more than 3 weeks consecutive who is on a draw. That would be up to the President to write the policy (do I receive STD and my draw, how are my commissions and territory handled etc).

@STARMOON44 In my industry less than 5% of commissioned employees are women. I considered another opportunity earlier in the year and spoke with some other women in the industry whom I trust and my understanding is most companies also haven't updated their policies. In other industries, some companies suspend commission all together, but we have a long sales cycle and this would leave me unpaid for work I completed months prior. Other companies deny STD and continue the draw, others deduct the time off from the draw, some companies base STD pay on your draw alone, others include your salary. There doesn't seem to be an easy consistent answer.

@eileenrob I have quiet a few friends I'd probably make the same recommendation to, but I honestly don't worry about it affecting my job stability. I'm in the top 15 out of over 40 reps, have 9 years with this company, am a product specialist and the same person who will determine how I am paid is the same person who personally promoted me 7 years ago. I feel like having a veiled conversation about FMLA time off could either a. worry the President since I just had surgery 6 weeks ago or b. come across as an obvious veiled conversation with a boss that I'm close enough to invite to the wedding.

ETA: my thoughts for OE were more for me in case I need to change something I'm paying into/not paying into based on the policy in case I do get pregnant.

I respect what other PPs are saying about worrying if you'll be treated/paid differently if they know you're TTC, but given that you don't know how the leave policies apply to you as a contracted position I think it's wise to know what you can expect going in, especially if you have a close working relationship with your boss. This way you can make any adjustments during OE, and have time to get other financial plans in place that might be affected by the leave policy.

I also agree with going back to your boss when you are around 12 weeks to discuss specific projects/expectations, but I think it's unreasonable to not discuss leave policies at all as these are benefits you're entitled to, and if they are not clear now you should ask about them.

short+sassy · November 2016

Normally I would just say to wait until January, when it sounds like your all's work slows down a bit. But, since their policy might influence how you fill out your OE paperwork, I'd talk to your boss soon. I'm also basing that on the fact that it sounds like you are not too worried your potential upcoming TTC plans being held against you.

DrillSergeantCat · November 2016

Might I suggest purchasing a short term disability and hospital income plan now. If your company will not offer you maternity leave, this will be a way for you to not lose all of your income.

kimmiinthemitten · November 2016

DrillSergeantCat said:

Might I suggest purchasing a short term disability and hospital income plan now. If your company will not offer you maternity leave, this will be a way for you to not lose all of your income.

I actually popped back in to HR to clarify a few things...I get STD automatically through work, so I don't pay additional for that benefit. The question is if I take advantage of STD what happens to my draw position and my incoming commissions vs if I don't.

A long time ago when we were a much smaller company, we had one rep use STD for FMLA and they discounted his draw by the difference (so if his draw was $40k and he lost 1k/month due to the pay discrepancy, they deducted $1k/month from his total salary payback). However, we're a larger company now so they want to give my boss the opportunity to review the policy/make changes etc before it's implemented.

So for me, the question is how my commissions are processed when I'm off. if a sale is made in an existing account and I'm on STD I can't be compensated for that. Whereas if I continued my draw, I'd receive my weekly paycheck and still owe 52 weeks of pay back to the company vs 40 or whatever.

lyndausvi · November 2016

Maybe approach it from a different angle. Take the pregnancy out of the equation. What happens if you have a heart attack, get into a bad accident or anything that requires you to use STD? Or what happens if your parents get sick and you need to use FMLA?

What would the polices be in regards to your draw?

I also do not like the idea of giving a company a heads up on you getting pregnant. It's sad, but we are still in a time where it can be used against you. I would approach it by using broader situations that would effect both sexes.

kvruns · November 2016

So are you a W-2 employee or you considered an independent contractor? Are there other benefits that salaried/hourly employees receive that you do not (vacation/sick time, disability benefits, life insurance, separate health benefits, etc)? Do you work out of the company central office or are you completely remote - if remote are you within 75 miles of a main office?

the only thing I can think of that would affect OE would be if you had to voluntarily elect STD coverage, otherwise I'm not sure I can think of a benefit that would be affected by pregnancy. Not to mention if you started trying in June/July you wouldn't deliver until the following year barring any early labor so STD wouldn't come into play next year anyway.

kimmiinthemitten · November 2016

kvruns said:

So are you a W-2 employee or you considered an independent contractor? Are there other benefits that salaried/hourly employees receive that you do not (vacation/sick time, disability benefits, life insurance, separate health benefits, etc)? Do you work out of the company central office or are you completely remote - if remote are you within 75 miles of a main office?

the only thing I can think of that would affect OE would be if you had to voluntarily elect STD coverage, otherwise I'm not sure I can think of a benefit that would be affected by pregnancy. Not to mention if you started trying in June/July you wouldn't deliver until the following year barring any early labor so STD wouldn't come into play next year anyway.

1st paragraph: W2 and I do not receive vacation or sick time. I have a cube at our main Corporate HQ, but I am in and out at best and set my own schedule.

2nd paragraph: FI and I were reviewing health insurance options and with holdings options for 2017. I misread my last W2 and thought I paid for STD, but it's a free benefit from my company. After talking with my friend in HR she recommended reviewing my Unum benefits, JIC.

To @lyndausvi's point - we have, fortunately, only encountered FMLA time once with another rep, but that was when we were a much smaller company and almost all of our policies have been updated/changed since then. That rep took STD and reduced his overall draw position by the difference. She doesn't know what happened with his commissions while off.

The person HR says need to review the policy is the man who hired me, promoted me, and was the second person to RSVP yes to my wedding. He knows me and my family well enough that if I asked about FMLA it would probably raise a much larger red flag than inquiring about planning for a potential pregnancy. I have an aging parent, a disabled parent and a recovering drug addict brother. With his permission and blessing, I've negotiated many a deal next to a hospital bed. That's why I think coming to him with questions about generic time off isn't the best way to handle it either.

charlotte989875 · November 2016

kimmiinthemitten said:

The person HR says need to review the policy is the man who hired me, promoted me, and was the second person to RSVP yes to my wedding. He knows me and my family well enough that if I asked about FMLA it would probably raise a much larger red flag than inquiring about planning for a potential pregnancy. I have an aging parent, a disabled parent and a recovering drug addict brother. With his permission and blessing, I've negotiated many a deal next to a hospital bed. That's why I think coming to him with questions about generic time off isn't the best way to handle it either.

I really think this is what matters. You know your work situation better than anyone, and if you think it would be best to approach it directly, before you're pregnant, and aren't worried about potential repercussions then that's probably the best way to handle it.

kimmiinthemitten · November 2016

charlotte989875 said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

The person HR says need to review the policy is the man who hired me, promoted me, and was the second person to RSVP yes to my wedding. He knows me and my family well enough that if I asked about FMLA it would probably raise a much larger red flag than inquiring about planning for a potential pregnancy. I have an aging parent, a disabled parent and a recovering drug addict brother. With his permission and blessing, I've negotiated many a deal next to a hospital bed. That's why I think coming to him with questions about generic time off isn't the best way to handle it either.

I really think this is what matters. You know your work situation better than anyone, and if you think it would be best to approach it directly, before you're pregnant, and aren't worried about potential repercussions then that's probably the best way to handle it.

I totally get the advice as to why to avoid discussing pregnancy, and it would be my go to advice for people too.

But realistically I work for a family owned business, the manager between me and the President is an owner, one year older than me who just had his third child. And I'm 36 pushing 37 and getting married. It's not like if I want to try I can sit around on this decision for years. Now that I know I don't really have to change my OE, I may sit on this longer, but it's still a conversation I have to have at some point.

kvruns · November 2016

based on the relationship you have with the company/management I would definitely ask about it because it is good to know for the future and it might be something they haven't even thought through yet. Perhaps you can help shape the policy for others in this position in the future.

You could request to see the STD certificate/policy to see how benefits are paid. A common provision is that your STD payout is reduced by any commissions/bonuses/profit sharing received or payable but deferred so that would be a concern with your payment structure. There might be a way they could craft payment as a salary continuance instead of commission/bonus payment that would all you to receive both without a reduction (some carriers and policies have more leeway than others).

kimmiinthemitten · November 2016

kvruns said:

based on the relationship you have with the company/management I would definitely ask about it because it is good to know for the future and it might be something they haven't even thought through yet. Perhaps you can help shape the policy for others in this position in the future. - this was my thought too.

You could request to see the STD certificate/policy to see how benefits are paid. A common provision is that your STD payout is reduced by any commissions/bonuses/profit sharing received or payable but deferred so that would be a concern with your payment structure. There might be a way they could craft payment as a salary continuance instead of commission/bonus payment that would all you to receive both without a reduction (some carriers and policies have more leeway than others).

Thanks! This is good information. I'll ask for a copy!

Best time to negotiate maternity leave

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