The Handmaid's Tale (warning: possible spoilers)

levioosa · May 2017

Is anyone else watching it? We got through the first episode last night. It's already chilling because there are components of it that already exist in our culture and legal system. I thought they picked fantastic actresses.

Thoughts? (We can talk about other episodes too. I read the book so it's not like anything is a real spoiler).

charlotte989875 · May 2017

I just read the book, but haven't started the series yet (post semester reward for getting my grading done). Reading it now was definitely chilling.

VarunaTT · May 2017

I've watched the first three. And it is chilling b/c when you see the rights being stripped away in favor of the unborn, well, watching a fictional slippery slope is sickening.

The scene with shooting into the protesters was especially hard. We've seen that happen before and I am very afraid of it happening again.

I had a lot of struggles watching the 3rd episode especially. The queer relationship and the consequences of it were really hard. But I think the worst was the term "gender traitor". I have a few friends that I've warned about watching it, b/c I think it could be pretty triggering. It was hard for me to stomach and I'm pretty strong when it comes to things like that.

levioosa · May 2017

VarunaTT said:

I've watched the first three. And it is chilling b/c when you see the rights being stripped away in favor of the unborn, well, watching a fictional slippery slope is sickening.

The scene with shooting into the protesters was especially hard. We've seen that happen before and I am very afraid of it happening again.

I had a lot of struggles watching the 3rd episode especially. The queer relationship and the consequences of it were really hard. But I think the worst was the term "gender traitor". I have a few friends that I've warned about watching it, b/c I think it could be pretty triggering. It was hard for me to stomach and I'm pretty strong when it comes to things like that.

Yes. I want to tell a friend to watch it, but I think the scene where the women are circled around the SA survivor and are chanting "her fault, her fault" will be a huge trigger for her.

I don't think it's a fictional slippery slope any more. We are having real talks about reversing Roe V Wade. There's bills that prevent you from getting an abortion without ultrasounds, double OB visits, partner (and let's be real here--male) consent. The bill that allows doctor's to lie to you in Texas about fetal abnormalities has passed the Senate, which is disturbing enough. The federal appeals court just ruled that it's legal for women to be paid less then men for the same work. Margaret Atwood gave a fictional picture that is turning into our reality and it scares the hell out of me.

VarunaTT · May 2017

levioosa said:

Yes. I want to tell a friend to watch it, but I think the scene where the women are circled around the SA survivor and are chanting "her fault, her fault" will be a huge trigger for her.

Yeah, I flinched at that scene too. I actually had to turn my head a bit. The interesting thing is how much you, as a viewer, end up enjoying the scene where the Handmaidens beat the hell out of the rapist. And it's obvious that the Handmaidens enjoy it too. The warping of reality is pretty difficult to handle.

I meant the well, somewhat tongue-in-cheek. It's terrifying b/c you think, "That could never happen hear," but then you watch and read about how Atwood specifically made sure that everything in her story had happened before and you can get pretty overwhelmed.

I somewhat binged the first 3 episodes. I'm not sure I'm going to do that again.

I also like how they keep making you pity/hate Mrs. Waterford.

levioosa · May 2017

VarunaTT said:

levioosa said:

Yes. I want to tell a friend to watch it, but I think the scene where the women are circled around the SA survivor and are chanting "her fault, her fault" will be a huge trigger for her.

Yeah, I flinched at that scene too. I actually had to turn my head a bit. The interesting thing is how much you, as a viewer, end up enjoying the scene where the Handmaidens beat the hell out of the rapist. And it's obvious that the Handmaidens enjoy it too. The warping of reality is pretty difficult to handle.

I meant the well, somewhat tongue-in-cheek. It's terrifying b/c you think, "That could never happen hear," but then you watch and read about how Atwood specifically made sure that everything in her story had happened before and you can get pretty overwhelmed.

I somewhat binged the first 3 episodes. I'm not sure I'm going to do that again.

I also like how they keep making you pity/hate Mrs. Waterford.

The manipulation of the Handmaids in that scene was painful for me to watch. It was so calculated by the powers that be. Marginalize a group, then give them an outlet to give the illusion of empowerment.

I definitely pictured some of the cast as being older (The Waterfords, for example), but I think the show is doing a great job of walking that pity/hate line with Mrs. Waterford too. Because even though she is complicit (at best) you can only imagine how hard it must be for her. Oh, and they did a great job at making Jeanine completely crazy.

I wanted to watch the next episode but SO could only handle one at a time. Stretching them out every Wednesday was also probably a good move on Hulu's part.

TrixieJess · May 2017

I read this book when I was a teenager. I'm a huge Margaret Atwood fan. You have to remember that this book was written in the 80s, the fact that it speaks volumes today is chilling.

I'll wait until all the episodes come out, then watch it.

ernursej · May 2017

I have to figure out how to watch it in Canada. Is it on Netflix?

charlotte989875 · May 2017

ernursej said:

I have to figure out how to watch it in Canada. Is it on Netflix?

Hulu only. At least in the US.

TrixieJess · May 2017

ernursej said:

I have to figure out how to watch it in Canada. Is it on Netflix?

Bravo is airing it. They have an app or on their website.

ernursej · May 2017

TrixieJess said:

ernursej said:

I have to figure out how to watch it in Canada. Is it on Netflix?

Bravo is airing it. They have an app or on their website.

Hum. I'll take a look at that. We don't get Bravo with our cable package but perhaps I can get temporary access once all the episodes are available.

TrixieJess · May 2017

ernursej said:

TrixieJess said:

ernursej said:

I have to figure out how to watch it in Canada. Is it on Netflix?

Bravo is airing it. They have an app or on their website.

Hum. I'll take a look at that. We don't get Bravo with our cable package but perhaps I can get temporary access once all the episodes are available.

Do you guys have pick and pay out where you are? The cable companies in Ontario are required to have it but I don't know what it entails, I'll end up either watching it through the Bravo site or our Android box.

ernursej · May 2017

TrixieJess said:

ernursej said:

TrixieJess said:

ernursej said:

I have to figure out how to watch it in Canada. Is it on Netflix?

Bravo is airing it. They have an app or on their website.

Hum. I'll take a look at that. We don't get Bravo with our cable package but perhaps I can get temporary access once all the episodes are available.

Do you guys have pick and pay out where you are? The cable companies in Ontario are required to have it but I don't know what it entails, I'll end up either watching it through the Bravo site or our Android box.

H deals with the cable but I'll ask. I know they offer some customization but you are not yet able to pick single channels so you end up with a bunch of channels just to get one. I'm sure it is coming because of the ruling that they have to offer it.

justsie · May 2017

I started watching it last weekend and blew through the first 3 episodes. I'm a huge bindge watcher so I hope I am able to remember to watch it every week. Holy cow I am really enjoying (??) it so far, I think the actors/actresses are doing well and the costume work is great. I haven't read the books, but I am considering adding them to my listening list for the car rides.

southernbelle0915 · May 2017

I haven't had the time to read the book or watch any of the episodes, but I really want to and plan to.

This is a really interesting article that one of my friends posted to Facebook. It's an interesting perspective on this issue in practice:
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/feminism/2017/02/handmaid-s-tale-has-already-come-true-just-not-white-western-women

VarunaTT · May 2017

southernbelle0915 said:

I haven't had the time to read the book or watch any of the episodes, but I really want to and plan to.

This is a really interesting article that one of my friends posted to Facebook. It's an interesting perspective on this issue in practice:
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/feminism/2017/02/handmaid-s-tale-has-already-come-true-just-not-white-western-women

I had no idea this was a thing. I'm now in a rabbit hole reading all of the articles it's linked to.

Another thing this is bringing up for me (both the show and this article) is the whole issue of expected motherhood. As I'm aging, and continuing with my decision to not be a mother, the reactions are changing from, "You'll change your mind" to "How selfish" and now, "You'll never know what you missed."

short+sassy · May 2017

VarunaTT said:

southernbelle0915 said:

I haven't had the time to read the book or watch any of the episodes, but I really want to and plan to.

This is a really interesting article that one of my friends posted to Facebook. It's an interesting perspective on this issue in practice:
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/feminism/2017/02/handmaid-s-tale-has-already-come-true-just-not-white-western-women

I had no idea this was a thing. I'm now in a rabbit hole reading all of the articles it's linked to.

Another thing this is bringing up for me (both the show and this article) is the whole issue of expected motherhood. As I'm aging, and continuing with my decision to not be a mother, the reactions are changing from, "You'll change your mind" to "How selfish" and now, "You'll never know what you missed."

I've also chosen to not have children. When I was younger, I got a lot of the "you'll change your mind". But, other than that, I haven't had anyone say the other negative statements to me. Though I've heard those kind of things vicariously through others, like yourself.

I have truly never understood the "You're selfish" argument. I'll own it! Sure, part of my reason for not wanting children is I like my time and money better. So what? How does that affect anybody else or society in general? Because we already live in an overpopulated world, including in our own country. The human species is not dying out.

Now, if a plague wipes out 90% of the population and I am one of the few surviving women. I will reconsider my stance. However, my baby producing powers are not needed by society at the present time.

VarunaTT · May 2017

The selfish thing is weird to me. The people who have told me that have presented it as since I (assumed) have the resources to have a child, I should. Which pisses me off to absolutely no end b/c that is so telling me my identity (and other women) is wrapped up in the power (or even in the non-power, hello infertility) of my womb.

levioosa · May 2017

VarunaTT said:

The selfish thing is weird to me. The people who have told me that have presented it as since I (assumed) have the resources to have a child, I should. Which pisses me off to absolutely no end b/c that is so telling me my identity (and other women) is wrapped up in the power (or even in the non-power, hello infertility) of my womb.

The selfish thing to me is a direct representation of the warping of Christianity. To be fruitful, to be successful, you have children. You become a good mother. It's the reason Pence still calls his wife "Mother" even when they are around other non-related adults. Telling people in the conservative Christian community you don't want children is akin to saying you don't believe in your purpose--God's purpose. It's borderline sacrilegious.

I think pregnancy and childbirth can be strong and beautiful things. But it should be a choice, and a woman is not defined by her choice whether or not to have children. I don't think I want kids. I don't think I am any "less" for that. I can still be powerful, beautiful, and a functioning member of society. If more people didn't have kids who didn't want them, the world would be a better place. Because if I truly don't want children, and I have them and resent them, what kind of message am I sending to them? Am I giving them the tools to succeed in life when they feel diminished and in the way? Probably not. I would never wish that on a child. And I think that's probably the most selfless thing I could do for them.

southernbelle0915 · May 2017

levioosa said:

VarunaTT said:

The selfish thing is weird to me. The people who have told me that have presented it as since I (assumed) have the resources to have a child, I should. Which pisses me off to absolutely no end b/c that is so telling me my identity (and other women) is wrapped up in the power (or even in the non-power, hello infertility) of my womb.

The selfish thing to me is a direct representation of the warping of Christianity. To be fruitful, to be successful, you have children. You become a good mother. It's the reason Pence still calls his wife "Mother" even when they are around other non-related adults. Telling people in the conservative Christian community you don't want children is akin to saying you don't believe in your purpose--God's purpose. It's borderline sacrilegious.

I think pregnancy and childbirth can be strong and beautiful things. But it should be a choice, and a woman is not defined by her choice whether or not to have children. I don't think I want kids. I don't think I am any "less" for that. I can still be powerful, beautiful, and a functioning member of society. If more people didn't have kids who didn't want them, the world would be a better place. Because if I truly don't want children, and I have them and resent them, what kind of message am I sending to them? Am I giving them the tools to succeed in life when they feel diminished and in the way? Probably not. I would never wish that on a child. And I think that's probably the most selfless thing I could do for them.

I agree with a lot of what you're saying, but I don't think women being encouraged to have children is just a Christian thing.

For a long time, H and I were on the no-children bandwagon. Folks from other religions (Muslim, Hindu, Sikh) and even lots of non-religious people make these types of comments.

But to the bolded, I could not agree more. I honestly think that exact statement is what's at the root of many issues in society, not just overpopulation.

levioosa · May 2017

southernbelle0915 said:

levioosa said:

VarunaTT said:

The selfish thing is weird to me. The people who have told me that have presented it as since I (assumed) have the resources to have a child, I should. Which pisses me off to absolutely no end b/c that is so telling me my identity (and other women) is wrapped up in the power (or even in the non-power, hello infertility) of my womb.

The selfish thing to me is a direct representation of the warping of Christianity. To be fruitful, to be successful, you have children. You become a good mother. It's the reason Pence still calls his wife "Mother" even when they are around other non-related adults. Telling people in the conservative Christian community you don't want children is akin to saying you don't believe in your purpose--God's purpose. It's borderline sacrilegious.

I think pregnancy and childbirth can be strong and beautiful things. But it should be a choice, and a woman is not defined by her choice whether or not to have children. I don't think I want kids. I don't think I am any "less" for that. I can still be powerful, beautiful, and a functioning member of society. If more people didn't have kids who didn't want them, the world would be a better place. Because if I truly don't want children, and I have them and resent them, what kind of message am I sending to them? Am I giving them the tools to succeed in life when they feel diminished and in the way? Probably not. I would never wish that on a child. And I think that's probably the most selfless thing I could do for them.

I agree with a lot of what you're saying, but I don't think women being encouraged to have children is just a Christian thing.

For a long time, H and I were on the no-children bandwagon. Folks from other religions (Muslim, Hindu, Sikh) and even lots of non-religious people make these types of comments.

But to the bolded, I could not agree more. I honestly think that exact statement is what's at the root of many issues in society, not just overpopulation.

Sorry, I was referencing Western American culture and should have been more clear. The rise of the Christian right and their control in politics alarms me greatly. I do think religion has a shitty track record with women in general. And things that were meant to be empowering, especially in regards to women, have been twisted by all religions.

Kind of off topic, but I remember discussing the origins of misogyny in an anthropology class. The gist of one of the theories was centered around women's menstrual cycle. When men bled, it was because they were injured, and the consequences could be as severe as death, but women bled monthly and were completely fine. So misogyny was born out of this jealousy that women could do what the men could not. I thought it was a really interesting theory.

ernursej · May 2017

In the last 3 months, I've had more and more people come up to me and ask if I was pregnant. I've practically tattooed 'no babies' on my forehead and it still doesn't stop people. I've been told "I'm selfish", "I'll change my mind", "I'll regret my decision" and my favourite "you don't know what you are talking about". H tells me that I'm getting the attention because we recently got married and I work with a bunch of women. The fact that people think it is okay to ask someone if they are pregnant and then when told that they are not and they don't want children they still think they should dig deeper and offload their ideas and thoughts ... argh!

The Handmaid's Tale (warning: possible spoilers)

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