Please have patience with her, teach her

Casadena · October 30

Dear Prudence,

I am stuck in a mess where I have a 12-year-old girl, “Nancy,” living with my family. Nancy is the daughter of my sister’s boyfriend. Between the mother and him, there is a mess of unemployment, eviction, and upcoming court cases. There is no family support, and everyone is desperate not to get CPS involved. But I think the situation might warrant it.

Nancy is nearly 13 and has zero independent skills. She frequently has to be reminded to brush her teeth, actually wash up, and brush her hair. She can’t even manage to put her hair in a ponytail or braid, which my 8-year-old can do. If I try to encourage Nancy to do something like make her own sandwich for lunch, she says she “can’t” and shuts down until I do it for her.

It is to the point that I have to watch Nancy like my toddler and clean up after her every day, and take her dirty clothes out of the room. Nancy seems to be doing OK academically, but at home, she can’t function. Talking to her parents gets me screamed at. Her father is in denial about Nancy and says my expectations are too high and I am too hard on her. Her mother accuses me of not doing “enough” because I am not cleaning up after a tween like I do a toddler. My sister is more concerned about not rocking the boat than this little girl. It has been nearly two months with no end in sight.

My husband thinks that if we get the authorities involved, the worst that will happen is that we can get some government benefits and hold the parents accountable for this mess. I know it will nuke my relationship with my sister, but I am more worried about Nancy getting lost in the system. She is a sweet girl who has been failed. I don’t want us to be another name on the long list of adults who have failed her, but we need help here. So what next?

—Nervous About Nancy

banana468 · October 30

How about a psychologist??

flantastic · October 30

Oh my goodness. This is a sign that she is holding it together at school with all the energy she has, what with all the stressors she has. You thinking about turning her over to the state because you don't want to pick up clothes off the floor while you help her develop these skills is, well, callous.

I know the frustration of "I wish we were past this stage of them wanting or needing us to do everything for them," constant reminders, etc., but what the hell.

levioosa · October 30

Poor kid needs a psychologist and someone stable in her life. This is so sad. The fact that her grades aren't suffering means she is doing all she can to hold it together at school and she has nothing left to give when she gets home.

charlotte989875 · October 30

Yah this is clearly a sign that she’s barely keeping it together. What kind of therapy or support is she getting? She’s living with people she doesn’t know, likely doesn’t know when she’ll live with her parents again, and is probably worried about being giving away if she doesn’t clean her room right.

Sure she should be able to do these things, but she can’t and if you have taken her in and agreed to care for her you need to focus on patiently finding a way to help her learn.

banana468 · October 30

levioosa said:

Poor kid needs a psychologist and someone stable in her life. This is so sad. The fact that her grades aren't suffering means she is doing all she can to hold it together at school and she has nothing left to give when she gets home.

Right! I get so frustrated with my kids but have to know that with all on their plates, especially Chiquita, I'll take the mess.

ei34 · October 30

This is so sad. Nancy needs stability and more support than she's getting. If I was LW, I'd be frustrated by the other adults, but the actions they're suggesting would only hurt Nancy.

VarunaTT · October 30

I think I have a different viewpoint. One that I hate. I have very close friends who have adopted their children through foster care. If LW were to get the authorities involved, with the full knowledge that Nancy is with stable family, they will get access to resources that the state can bring to bear, that they probably can't without a formal adoption process. Therapy, money for her care/education, a legal advocate in this mess her bio parents have created, etc. This would be treated a bit differently b/c of her already being with stable family relatives. It wouldn't be perfect and there are some other things that would be difficult (they'd need to get a license maybe?). It's definitely not perfect and just switching one scary thing for another, but they should definitely at least look into it for real and balance the scary vs. resources.

ETA: LW and husband, and sister, will be constrained in getting resources for Nancy on their own b/c they're not her legal parents. I don't think they could make any school decisions or get help from the school or get medical help for her, without the consent of her parents. This very much reminds me of a pair of little boys who didn't know how to wipe their own butts and 10 and 12. When it reaches that point, you really can use professional intervention for a lot of things (PT that's more like OT for a small child) that most people just don't have the knowledge to do. Again, Nancy having people already interested in helping her stabilize puts her in a different category that wards of the state would face in foster care.

MyNameIsNot · October 30

VarunaTT said:

I think I have a different viewpoint. One that I hate. I have very close friends who have adopted their children through foster care. If LW were to get the authorities involved, with the full knowledge that Nancy is with stable family, they will get access to resources that the state can bring to bear, that they probably can't without a formal adoption process. Therapy, money for her care/education, a legal advocate in this mess her bio parents have created, etc. This would be treated a bit differently b/c of her already being with stable family relatives. It wouldn't be perfect and there are some other things that would be difficult (they'd need to get a license maybe?). It's definitely not perfect and just switching one scary thing for another, but they should definitely at least look into it for real and balance the scary vs. resources.

ETA: LW and husband, and sister, will be constrained in getting resources for Nancy on their own b/c they're not her legal parents. I don't think they could make any school decisions or get help from the school or get medical help for her, without the consent of her parents. This very much reminds me of a pair of little boys who didn't know how to wipe their own butts and 10 and 12. When it reaches that point, you really can use professional intervention for a lot of things (PT that's more like OT for a small child) that most people just don't have the knowledge to do. Again, Nancy having people already interested in helping her stabilize puts her in a different category that wards of the state would face in foster care.

This is what I'm thinking too. People think getting child protective services involved automatically means turning a kid over to the state, but there is so much more there. Sure, they're underfunded, overworked and far from perfect, but there are resources! Nancy needs some therapy and probably some other support. LW would probably do well to talk to some professionals about Nancy's development and learn some strategies for helping her through these shutdowns. Obviously Nancy is most in need of help here, but I'm not going to fault LW either. Most people, not even experienced parents, are automatically equipped to deal with a child coming through trauma.

VarunaTT · October 31

IDK why this started me thinking so much last night, but the other thing, in getting the state involved, is that there's suddenly accountability in place for the bio parents. They will often have to take classes, pass home inspections, visits can be required to be monitored, etc. Yes, the state will push a vested interest in placing Nancy back with her bio parents, but there will be conditions attached to it and Nancy will be checked on by the state. Of course it's all problematic, hard to go through, and inperfect, but it's a lot better than where they're all at now with Nancy.

flantastic · October 31

@VarunaTT My problem wasn't so much that she's considering contacting CPS, but that my initial read on her tone here is that she can't be bothered to do the work of teaching her - i.e., she's put in her time on the toddler stage. But looking at it again, it does seem like she's looking for help, and her H is then probably correct.

VarunaTT · October 31

I watched my friends have to go through the home study classes. Some of the things they shared with me, that the state prepares foster parents for, is really horrific. Not just sexual behaviors, although those are a really big thing, but that the kids might not know how to bathe properly, sit at a table and use utensils properly, use the restroom properly, can have speech impediments if they weren't around people speaking to them, etc. Some of the kids that came through their home were absolutely heart breaking.

One of the kids was such an absolute sweetheart, until he became a terror, attacking the other kids in the house after almost 2 years being there. The psychologist he had explained that b/c he finally had a stable homelife, his survival "fawning" was finally able to stop and now problems were rearing their head. His needs outpaced what my friends were able to provide, even with as hard as they worked, and he had to be placed in a group home. All of their adoptive children are all in therapy and some of them have had to go through physical/occupation/speech therapy because they were "delayed" even though it was really "no one paid any attention to you so you never learned how to be a functioning human". It opened my eyes to a lot.

Please have patience with her, teach her

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