NWR - Should I pay this fee?

quotequeen · June 2010

I am currently renting a unit in a condo building from the unit owner, and I am planning to move tomorrow. When I contacted the building manager to schedule elevator time, he told me that there is a $750 fee for moving out, because each unit owner gets one free move-in and one free move-out. This apparently was put in place after the owner moved in, so his move-out was the free one, and my move-in was the free one, which is why we were not charged this when we moved in.

This fee is not mentioned anywhere in my lease, and I have no recollection of being told about it, though my landlord now claims he did tell me about it. (He also claimed that he didn't know about it and IMO is being altogether weaselly about the whole thing.) The lease does specifically mention the elevator deposit, which is refundable if the elevator is not damaged during the move, and is separate from this fee. Landlord has said that he will split the fee with me. Would you agree to split it? Or refuse to pay and risk that he will take it out of the security deposit in which case we would have to go to court over it?

danieliza1127 · June 2010

What the hell is the fee for?

pumpkinpumpkin · June 2010

That sounds ridiculous. Why/HOW can they charge you to move out?

ExpatPumpkin · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwr-should-pay-this-fee?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:828032e4-a0ce-4dd4-816d-45f95102034fPost:b95d2d8a-4162-41b9-88ba-653f5558b7c8">NWR - Should I pay this fee?</a>:
[QUOTE]I am currently renting a unit in a condo building from the unit owner, and I am planning to move tomorrow. When I contacted the building manager to schedule elevator time, he told me that there is a $750 fee for moving out, because each unit owner gets one free move-in and one free move-out. This apparently was put in place after the owner moved in, so his move-out was the free one, and my move-in was the free one, which is why we were not charged this when we moved in. This fee is not mentioned anywhere in my lease, and I have no recollection of being told about it, though my landlord now claims he did tell me about it. <strong>(He also claimed that he didn't know about it and IMO is being altogether weaselly about the whole thing.)</strong> The lease does specifically mention the elevator deposit, which is refundable if the elevator is not damaged during the move, and is separate from this fee. Landlord has said that he will split the fee with me. Would you agree to split it? <strong>Or refuse to pay and risk that he will take it out of the security deposit in which case we would have to go to court over it?
</strong>Posted by quotequeen[/QUOTE]

I don't think you should have to pay it. But, I think your best bet is probably agreeing to split it with him. Otherwise, he's probably going to deduct the entire $700 from your deposit. I'd rather be out $350 than $700.

I'd be really upset too, but he has your money hostage! And even if you get a favorable ruling in court, there's no guarantee that he'll pay in a timely manner, or ever :(

quotequeen · June 2010

I believe the intent of the fee is to discourage owners in this condo building from renting out their units. They can certainly charge the owner this since it's in the condo by-laws or whatever. Apparently this is fairly common in Chicago, though I had never heard of it before. I've only lived in regular apartment buildings before this, which don't have this type of thing.

georgia_bride09 · June 2010

I have never heard of a move-in/move-out fee. I would refuse to pay it, and if it isn't in your lease, he can't do anything about it.

PetraStonegirl · June 2010

I'm not a lawyer, but my understanding is that if it's not in the lease, it's not enforceable. I'd refuse and take my chances that he takes it out of the deposit. If he does, file in small claims court and back up your case with the lease. I've never heard of a move out/in fee, and smacks of a scam. Utterly ridiculous!

Calypso1977 · June 2010

i think it also has something to do with the elevator being tied up for residents while the person is moving.

a friend of mine actually had to hire a certain company when he moved stuff out of his deceased relatives place. AND, he was forbidden from doing a self move. somethign abotu liabilty, since movers are known to whack furniture into walls and such, particularly when its an apartment/condo. my movers were DEFINITELY not as gentle abotu the walls when tehy moved my stuff out of my apartment, but wehn tehy brought it to our house, they were extra gentle because htey knew it was ours.

apnk2005 · June 2010

If it's not in your lease, you don't have to pay. If it's something the unit owner knew about, but failed to put in your lease, it's his problem. If it's not in the condo owners' association by-laws or anything, then it's BS. If it is, then the unit owner should have put it in your lease, or he should pay it himself. It's not your fault he failed to read the by-laws. Even $350 is a lot of money. I wouldn't let your landlord get away with it, if I were you.

danieliza1127 · June 2010

If it's not in your lease, I don't see how he could possibly enforce you paying it or take it out of your security deposit.

polichik · June 2010

No way. I get so mad when people try to take advantage of others like this. No way in hell would I be paying! If it's not in the lease, it's not your issue.

J&K10910 · June 2010

If it's not in your lease, and you don't have written notice, then he can't charge you. I'd inform him you're not paying because of these reasons, and let him know that if they try to take it out of your deposit, you'll take him to court. Some landlords are crappy and will try to take advantage of people, but in my experience, if you let them know that you're aware of your rights, they won't try shiit like that.

quotequeen · June 2010

The other risk is that he will be more inclined to come up with other stupid stuff to withhold from my security deposit, or charge me for things that he would otherwise let go, because I took a hard line on this.

J&K10910 · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwr-should-pay-this-fee?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:828032e4-a0ce-4dd4-816d-45f95102034fPost:fc6b9644-1d9e-4ea6-b29c-8efe7e691b05">Re: NWR - Should I pay this fee?</a>:
[QUOTE]The other risk is that he will be more inclined to come up with other stupid stuff to withhold from my security deposit, or charge me for things that he would otherwise let go, because I took a hard line on this.
Posted by quotequeen[/QUOTE]

But will that stuff add up to $750?? Doubtful. Also, find a site with your rights as a renter in your state. I know in MN we have to have an itemized list of everything they take out of the deposit and you're able to dispute.

ExpatPumpkin · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwr-should-pay-this-fee?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:9Discussion:828032e4-a0ce-4dd4-816d-45f95102034fPost:fc6b9644-1d9e-4ea6-b29c-8efe7e691b05">Re: NWR - Should I pay this fee?</a>:
[QUOTE]The other risk is that he will be more inclined to come up with other stupid stuff to withhold from my security deposit, or charge me for things that he would otherwise let go, because I took a hard line on this.
Posted by quotequeen[/QUOTE]

That's what I'm thinking too. He'll find enough "damage" in the apartment to cover the $700. And you'll probably lose that battle in court as the unit obviously isn't pristine... Even if the "damages" are just normal wear and tear, there's good chance you'd lose in court. Then you'd be out your $700 plus filing fees!

I really hate this situation for you... By splitting it, you're giving in and it's not fair. But if you fight it, you may very well lose much more :(

J&K10910 · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwr-should-pay-this-fee?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:828032e4-a0ce-4dd4-816d-45f95102034fPost:fc7dc524-5035-444c-b133-6ed1a3e93673">Re: NWR - Should I pay this fee?</a>:
[QUOTE]In Response to Re: NWR - Should I pay this fee? : That's what I'm thinking too. He'll find enough "damage" in the apartment to cover the $700. And you'll probably lose that battle in court as the unit obviously isn't pristine... Even if the "damages" are just normal wear and tear, there's good chance you'd lose in court. Then you'd be out your $700 plus filing fees! I really hate this situation for you... By splitting it, you're giving in and it's not fair. But if you fight it, you may very well lose much more :(
Posted by ExpatPumpkin[/QUOTE]

In MN, they can't charge you for normal wear and tear. This is why I strongly advise you to read up on your rights, quotequeen. When you move out, take pictures. Also, I hope you documented everything that wasn't quite right when you moved in.

weddingbells2010 · June 2010

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_etiquette_nwr-should-pay-this-fee?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:9Discussion:828032e4-a0ce-4dd4-816d-45f95102034fPost:6076b1cf-4da3-49ff-a2f2-cd7028800c6f">Re: NWR - Should I pay this fee?</a>:
[QUOTE]I'm not a lawyer, but my understanding is that if it's not in the lease, it's not enforceable. I'd refuse and take my chances that he takes it out of the deposit. If he does, file in small claims court and back up your case with the lease. I've never heard of a move out/in fee, and smacks of a scam. Utterly ridiculous!
Posted by PetraStonegirl[/QUOTE]

<div>
</div><div>This.</div>

ecsmiles · June 2010

I would definitely not pay this. Here's how I see it. On top of the other good points that the previous posts brought up.....The owner was aware of the policy BEFORE moving out. So the owner chose to lease the condo to you knowing that the fee was going to be an issue for you to move out. He also chose not to include it in the lease. I don't think he can make you pay it.

taraz579 · June 2010

the consensus is correct: If it's not in writing, it's BS. I agree, I'd take pictures & compare them against the move-in list of flaws (hopefully that's around). Tell him the truth: it's not in your lease or conco rules it's not valid. And if he tries to nickel n dime ya for punitive, normal wear & tear stuff, I'd challenge that too.

I suppose you could be worse off financially for challenging him, but it's a matter of principle now: he's being an extremely crappy, dishonest landlord attempting to take advantage of you & probably others whenever he can.

Just my two cents. good luck & don't back down. It's not in writing & he can't prove it, if it's not written with your signature.

apnk2005 · June 2010

Definitely take pictures of everything before you move. And when you move out, be patient...in some states, if landlords don't give you a written itemized list of why they're keeping your deposit within a certain amount of time, they have to give the whole thing back, no matter how trashed the place was. I had a shitty landlord try to keep my deposit for something stupid, but she didn't know about that particular law, so after two weeks, I sent a her a polite letter via certified mail telling her to give it back. She did, because if I had to take it to court, they most likely would have made her pay twice what my deposit was.

Oh, also, if you've had any email exchanges with him about this issue, or anything in writing for that matter, you should hang on to it...you probably won't need it, but it might be useful to have if you have to take him to court.

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