Krist and Nickolis Wedding Venue Question

krisandnick12514

My parents told my fiance and I that they would pay for the wedding if we stayed within the budget they set for us which is more then enough. My fiance's brother got marrid two years ago and there was alot of tension with the familys because his mom wasnt included in the planning. My finance and I really wanted to include his mom and learn from the mistakes his brother had made with his wedding. The only problem is that my fiance thinks of his mom as holier then god and wants her included in every little thing(I think his mom wants this to and doesnt realize that shes not paying for it). I also want to include his mom, BUT I dont want to offend my parents. I set up appointments to start looking at venues and I realized that I know nothing about negotiating and that it would probably be best for someone to come with us so I dont blurt out something stupid when they start talking prices. My finance already assumed that his mother would come help look at venues and last night his mom got mad at him because she thought we went to look at a place and she wasnt invited(this wasnt even the case we went out to dinner). But this shows that she wants to be apart of the venue search process. Today I said to my mom that I think that maybe we could alternate with venues so nicks mom comes to some and my mom comes to some and my mom flipped out!!! My mom doesnt want his mom coming to any of the venues because shes not paying for the wedding. I know this is going to be a fight and I dont want to tell either side that I personally could care a less either way but everyone else is having the issues so I have to blame it on myself. This means that I will be fighting with everyone, look like the bad guy and I am in themiddle of it. I feel like its me against everyone else. Help what is the proper way to do this. 

[Deleted User]

It sounds like both parents want to be involved in planning AND paying- I would say all parties (you, your FI, and both sets of parents) all need to sit down ALL together and work it out before you look at anymore venues. 

Jen4948

I think that all your parents and your FI need to do some chilling out and stop taking it personally if a parent is or isn't invited to some aspect of the planning.  You shouldn't be the bad guy, but everyone is flipping out over this or that.

So I think that before you do any more specific planning, you first need to set some boundaries with your FI, and then with each set of parents.  One boundary is that everyone needs to permanently cease and desist from all this flipping out and making you the bad guy.  Then set and enforce others that will make the planning process tolerable for the two of you individually as well as together.  He and his mom can't expect to be in control of everything with no room for you or your parents, and despite your parents paying, they should allow for some compromise as well.  Either that or you need to pay for everything.

arrippa

He who pays says. You mom should be going on the venue search since she is paying.

Also, you and you FI need to be on the same page. If he is always taking your FMIL side, you don't have a FMIL problem, you have a FI problem. As for your FMIL, is there anything in the wedding that you can give her to plan?

ashleyep

I invited my FMIL with us when we went to look at venues (my parents and sister came too). Ultimately the decision came down to my FI and I and my parents who are paying for the bulk of it, but I thought it was nice to include her.

STARMOON44

Your parents definitely get to come if they want, and I agree with your mother, I wouldn't want someone who isn't paying there while I talk dollars and cents. Your FI should be telling his mom
"oh, no, we're going with sweetie's parents since they are paying. I'm sure there'll be something else for you to join us on".

phira

krisandnick12514 said:

My parents told my fiance and I that they would pay for the wedding if we stayed within the budget they set for us which is more then enough. My fiance's brother got marrid two years ago and there was alot of tension with the familys because his mom wasnt included in the planning. My finance and I really wanted to include his mom and learn from the mistakes his brother had made with his wedding. The only problem is that my fiance thinks of his mom as holier then god and wants her included in every little thing(I think his mom wants this to and doesnt realize that shes not paying for it). I also want to include his mom, BUT I dont want to offend my parents. I set up appointments to start looking at venues and I realized that I know nothing about negotiating and that it would probably be best for someone to come with us so I dont blurt out something stupid when they start talking prices. My finance already assumed that his mother would come help look at venues and last night his mom got mad at him because she thought we went to look at a place and she wasnt invited(this wasnt even the case we went out to dinner). But this shows that she wants to be apart of the venue search process. Today I said to my mom that I think that maybe we could alternate with venues so nicks mom comes to some and my mom comes to some and my mom flipped out!!! My mom doesnt want his mom coming to any of the venues because shes not paying for the wedding. I know this is going to be a fight and I dont want to tell either side that I personally could care a less either way but everyone else is having the issues so I have to blame it on myself. This means that I will be fighting with everyone, look like the bad guy and I am in themiddle of it. I feel like its me against everyone else. Help what is the proper way to do this. 

1) Sit down with your fiance and set boundaries. It sounds like you have a fiance problem: he can't say no to his mother. What does "set boundaries" mean? Discuss how you're going to go about looking at venues and booking vendors, and how you will involve parents. Then, as a team, you enforce those boundaries.

2) Honestly, there is no rule that dictates who MUST look at venues with you, or who may NOT look at venues with you. We're paying for our wedding, and we asked our parents to come with us to look at the two venues we were deciding between. It was FINE. However ...

3) The people who are paying are in charge. Sit down with your parents and let them know that your future mother-in-law is feeling left out. Talk to them about what THEIR expectations are in terms of their involvement in wedding planning. If you're accepting their money to pay for the wedding, it's only fair to you and your parents to know what their expectations are. It's not fair to them if they give you money with strings attached and you ignore their wishes; it's not fair to you to start wedding planning and THEN find out that you've broken a rule you didn't know existed. If you disagree with how they want their money spent, then you need to decline their money.

4) Your future brother- and sister-in-law did not do anything WRONG by not including your future mother-in-law in planning. They were not obligated to involve her if she wasn't paying. I'm not saying that it didn't cause problems, or that they shouldn't have even considered involving her, or (more importantly) that you shouldn't involve her. I'm saying that you need to get away from this mind-set that not involving her is An Unacceptable Insult.

So basically, what should you do? I recommend talking with your parents first. Find out exactly what they expect of you. It sounds like they initially said, "We'll pay, just stay within our budget." Clearly, there's more than that. I'd let them know that if they can't be upfront about their expectations right away, you're going to have to decline their money. Put it to them this way: it's not fair for them to pay for the wedding and not have their wishes respected, but you need to know what those wishes are NOW so you're not neck-deep in deposits before you find out that you can't honor those wishes.

Next, talk with your future mother-in-law. Regardless of what your parents have said, you need to talk to her about expectations, too. Involving her in wedding planning does not mean that she has to help you with every decision; your idea of involvement is more like maybe she comes to a tasting, or you ask her for opinions on flowers. Her involvement appears to be looking at every vendor with you and helping you make the decisions, something that should be left to the couple and the people paying for the wedding. It sounds like you might not be able to win with her: either you involve her in EVERYTHING or she'll be upset that you're doing what her other son did.

Finally, you and your fiance are a team. This is your wedding together; no one gets attacked while the other one comes up smelling like roses. That means that if your parents are mad that you want to invite your future mother-in-law to visit a venue, then they need to be mad at both you and your fiance. If your future mother-in-law is angry that you're not involving her, then she needs to be mad at both of you. And you and your fiance need to stick to your boundaries ("Mom, we have to decline your money. We already talked involving FMIL and you keep changing your mind, and that's not fair to us. So we're going to just pay for everything ourselves," or, "Mom, this is our wedding. The only reason OP's parents are coming to look at venues is because they are paying for the wedding. We are not trying to leave you out of wedding planning, but if you continue to get upset with us for every wedding-related thing we do, then we will have to leave you out").

JaxInBlue

Agree with PPs.  The payers get a lot of say, and I know a lot of people wouldn't feel comfortable or negotiating with an audience.  Is there a way you, FI and your parents could do the initial look at each venue and then maybe include your FMIL when you have it narrowed down to the top two or three, or  everyone goes for an initial look but only you, FI and your parents do back to do the narrowing/negotiating/contract signing?

Also agree with PPs that boundaries and understanding are going to be important, particularly between you and your parents (they don't get the only say on everything) and FI and his (there are some things they might not get to weigh in on).  I like the idea of finding something specific to include FMIL in - maybe something where your parents don't have specific opinions. 

It would be good before you head out to that first venue to take some time to set reasonable expectations for everyone.  You and FI need to know to what extent your parents expect to be decision makers, so you can decide if taking their money is the best decision.  You and FI also need to know if his mom's expectations for inclusion are also too restrictive.  For our wedding, other than the date, I can't think of one thing DH and I decide with the input of all the parents. Some things we decided together, with some things we asked for my parents' help, other things reflected his parents input. 

emmaaa

When my FI and I were looking at venues, we inluded both my mom, his mom, my SIL and FSIL. Even though my parents are paying, I want to include his family. Honestly, before you go to a venue you should talk about pricing anyways. That way you know whether or not you can afford it before you go look and possibly fall in lovewith it. Many times when you go look for the first time, you aren't going to go in to detail about the cost. I think you could do that on the phone after the fact or after everyone leaves. Ultimately, it is important that your parents are there since they are paying and you can include you FMIL if you want.

cowgirl8238

I think your best bet is to sit down with your FI and decide with him what he wants to do.  Once you have unified your front you can better tackle this.  I get the impression that your FMIL is going to be pushy and make everything into a big deal, not just the venue but EVERYTHING.  Again, set the rules, what can she plan, what can't she plan.  Sometimes its best to just cut them out of planning and bean dip them everytime it comes up. 

If you parents are paying they get a say.  If nobody can work togther then you may be best paying for it on your own and planning the wedding by yourselves.  I am very fortunate that my parents are providing me the money "no strings attached" and that my IL's are not pushing to many issues (only minor guest list which FI helped me to nip in the bud).

So, sit down with FI and tell him what you want.  Listen to what he wants.  Make a compromise and a plan and stick to that plan.  If your FMIL can't get along with your plans she gets bean dipped, isn't included anymore and just shows up on the wedding day.

cowgirl8238

why did you DD?????

You were getting some great feedback on here!!!!!!!

BTW you were quoted so that did nothing...and by DDing you will attract more traffic.

HeatherKat

Just came for the DD. Thanks for quoting @phira!

cruffino

@phira with the win

Cookie Pusher

I hate DDing. I mean, if you're going to take all the time to type something out, you should own it. Especially if you've been quoted.

MairePoppy

Unless Nick's mom is offering to split the cost of the venue with your parents, she has no business in the venue search. Your parents will want to discuss money and that could be very awkward in front of your FMIL. And it's none of her business. You shouldn't have invited FMIL without asking your parents. 

Once you and Nick and your parents have looked at the venues and you've narrowed down the decision, you could make an appointment to walk through with Nick's mom. She will be able to get a feel for the style of your wedding, but shouldn't be making any decisions that involve your parent's money.

There will be ways to include FMIL, along the way on 1. Anything she is paying for, 2. Her guest list for the wedding and any wedding related parties 3. Table assignments for her side and 4. You could shop for her dress with her, 5. Keeping her informed on your planning and 6. If all goes well, your mom may feel inclined to get FMILs opinion on things such as the menu, flowers etc....

MairePoppy

Another DD

Inkdancer

She DDed, saw that it didn't take the post away, and then put the post back up with a new title.

P.S. OP don't use your and FI's full name. There are plenty of crazies on the internet and Google can find you here.

krisandnick12514

WOW - People are really mean. I accidentally posted twice and was trying to figure out how to delete my comment. Didn't realize you can't. Thanks for the responses. No thanks to the meanies. 

MairePoppy

scribe95 said:

DD? Huh? The post is there for me.

Really? It was gone and now it's back. Must be magic.

Viczaesar

Why did you change the name of your thread?

NYCMercedes

With all the OP's changes, I feel as though I'm watching TV with my husband. Every tine I start to get into something, click and there he goes with the remote, changing shows. In this case, it's titles, questions, posts...

OliveOilsMom

krisandnick12514 said:

WOW - People are really mean. I accidentally posted twice and was trying to figure out how to delete my comment. Didn't realize you can't. Thanks for the responses. No thanks to the meanies. 

No one was mean!  They offered you constructive critism and advice on how to fix the situation.  You just didn't like what people said even though it is the best way to solve your problem.

Remember this phrase: He/She who pays gets a say! And if that includes your mom not wanting FMIL at the venue tours, then FMIL doesn't get to come!

jneen101

krisandnick12514 said:

 No thanks to the meanies. 

This, combined with your worry that you will blurt out something stupid so you should bring a mom with you to talk in your place, makes me worried that you are 13 years old.

phira

I just had a feeling.

AroundTheBlock

This is where it is nice to have traditional etiquette: The bride's mother has "first dibs" on offering to host a wedding celebration for her daughter. Tradition does NOT actually say that it's her responsibility to bankroll it while someone else does all the planning or while the planning is done by others. It says it's her privilege to host the celebration -- and that if the bride declines that offer in favour of someone else's offer, it is a slap in the face to her mother. Nowadays of course most brides host their own weddings precisely because they want to do all the planning themselves, and also because not every mother has the desire to offer the scale of celebration that is expected, and some mothers do treat it as a co-funded event or else just give funding as a gift; and nowadays brides' mothers are tolerant toward surrendering their privileges to their daughter. But traditionally, she has the right to plan and pay for the celebration.

That means that traditionally, if the groom's mother wants to be involved, she needs to be accomodating to the bride's mother and a little diffident about offering up her own opinions -- which should be phrased as the merest suggestion. In compensation, the groom's mother has the privilege of hosting the rehearsal dinner and using that as the outlet for all of her hospitable creativity.

Kris12514, your conciliatory course of action could be, to specifically ask each mother to focus on separate things: your mother on the actual wedding reception itself, and then get your future mother-in-law involved in planning the rehearsal dinner and checking out those venues; helping you find groomsmen's apparel, choosing your bouquet (traditionally that's a gift from the groom, so it's a reasonable thing to engage hi mother on), helping the two of you decide on your honeymoon destination. And, of course, you'll want to get her list of family and friends to pass on to your mother.  I recommend spending several afternoons with her, getting to know your fiance's family tree and finding out (among other things) the preferred title, surname and address for all of the groom's-side connexions. Even if you draw the circle a little tighter when you determine the actual guest-list, it will be a reference for future Christmas card lists, and for keeping track of who's who during groom's-family reminiscences and reunions.

crunchymamaof2

AroundTheBlock said:

This is where it is nice to have traditional etiquette: The bride's mother has "first dibs" on offering to host a wedding celebration for her daughter. Tradition does NOT actually say that it's her responsibility to bankroll it while someone else does all the planning or while the planning is done by others. It says it's her privilege to host the celebration -- and that if the bride declines that offer in favour of someone else's offer, it is a slap in the face to her mother. Nowadays of course most brides host their own weddings precisely because they want to do all the planning themselves, and also because not every mother has the desire to offer the scale of celebration that is expected, and some mothers do treat it as a co-funded event or else just give funding as a gift; and nowadays brides' mothers are tolerant toward surrendering their privileges to their daughter. But traditionally, she has the right to plan and pay for the celebration.

That means that traditionally, if the groom's mother wants to be involved, she needs to be accomodating to the bride's mother and a little diffident about offering up her own opinions -- which should be phrased as the merest suggestion. In compensation, the groom's mother has the privilege of hosting the rehearsal dinner and using that as the outlet for all of her hospitable creativity.

Kris12514, your conciliatory course of action could be, to specifically ask each mother to focus on separate things: your mother on the actual wedding reception itself, and then get your future mother-in-law involved in planning the rehearsal dinner and checking out those venues; helping you find groomsmen's apparel, choosing your bouquet (traditionally that's a gift from the groom, so it's a reasonable thing to engage hi mother on), helping the two of you decide on your honeymoon destination. And, of course, you'll want to get her list of family and friends to pass on to your mother.  I recommend spending several afternoons with her, getting to know your fiance's family tree and finding out (among other things) the preferred title, surname and address for all of the groom's-side connexions. Even if you draw the circle a little tighter when you determine the actual guest-list, it will be a reference for future Christmas card lists, and for keeping track of who's who during groom's-family reminiscences and reunions.

No. First "dibs" goes to the couple that's getting married. IRT the op- this was one of the nicest, most thoughtful advice containing threads I've read on here. No need to turn 13 and call us meanies because for some reason you don't like the advice. My 4 year old does that. Reminds me of the quote "advice is what you ask for when you know the answer but wish you didn't"

crunchymamaof2

Ok I'm on iPad- can anyone tell me why my paragraphs aren't showing up??

Viczaesar

Is anyone else wondering if it's supposed to be Nickoli's, or if her FI's name is Nickolis?

ETA: Or!  Maybe she's Nickoli(s) and her FI is Krist?  I guess it could go either way.

MairePoppy

I assumed their first names are Kristen and Nickolis because of her SN. I hope she isn't using their last names.