Needing help with a friend

[Deleted User]

 This is really long sorry! 

Summary

vvvv

I have been married 2 months and am having a hard time adjusting my relationship with my best girlfriend who texts me 24/7 (even on the honeymoon!) and is upset I can't constantly talk to her or hang out every day. Need help setting boundaries without coming across like a jerk. 

Long post

vvvv

I had been lurking for a while here while I planned my wedding but had to create a new account because I can't remember my info. This website def helped me plan a proper wedding. Thank you! But My post isn't about my wedding, but about a close friendship with my best female friend. 

The background of the story is we have been friends since grade school. We did everything together.  We lived together up until I met DH and moved back in with my parents to save up for a house. 

My friend (and me I guess!) have been having a hard time adjusting. During wedding planning, we were still getting together several times a week  (wether it was wedding planning or just that DH wasn't around because he worked long hours that have since changed. Now he's home from work when I am instead of working the late shift and we live together)

The problem is that I feel like my friend thinks we've just added an extra person to our circle (me her AND DH) it even was to the point that up until we left the wedding reception, she literally thought she was spending the night with us (she lives about an hour away but works in the city 20 minutes from me). I never really Explained to her why she couldn't stay with us (I mean, shouldnt that have been obvious?!) just told her she could stay with my parents instead (she didn't and was upset with me for a little after that she had to drive all the way home) 

DH and I  feel I need to set boundaries with her as he is tired of her constantly calling and texting me when it's our time together and asking to hang out multiple days in a row. It's been a week since the honeymoon where she was texting daily even when I did not respond. That was when I realized maybe we need to have a talk (On the same hand tho, if roles were switched, I can't say I wouldn't be doing the same as her. But also I think I wouldn't bother a newly wed even if they had gone away two months after their wedding). The problem is that things have been rocky since I told her last week I wasn't able to continue texting her because I was spending time with my husband on our honeymoon (obviously if it was an emergency I would be there for her. But it was just that she was "bored"<<her words. She said she's upset because I was spending all my time with DH instead of giving her time too. But it was our honeymoon..neither of our parents even bothered us and we're like "stop calling us!" when we reached out to them a couple times)

How do I set boundaries with my friend and tell her it's not how it was before? How do we both make that change? 

I don't want to be condescending and come across like "yah I'm married now and don't have time for you" 

I love hanging with her and DH believes she's important for me and a great friend but we are both becoming frustrated with how my friend seems to not understand we are married and my priorities have shifted to my husband and will continue to change as we start having children. (Example, I enjoy coming home from work and cooking for him or coming home and him cooking for me. I don't really go out on week days anymore cause dinner is the time we really get to spend together before bed)  I don't want to lose my friendship with my friend (when I first started getting serious with DH, my friendship ended with another friend because she was upset I couldn't go on our girls nights 3 times a week anymore) , but I need her to know we can't text 24/7 and I can't drop all my plans to do things last minute anymore (I mean, sometimes that's fine. But not when I have plans with DH or family things. That was another thing she was mad about a few months back. I didn't want to go away on a week vacation with her and a couple friends because then FI had taken a couple days off for us to be together) or that sometimes hanging out may mean with my husband at times too. (I love a girls night but not every weekend anymore especially when that's the most time I am able to spend with DH) 

I believe I am partially at fault for how she still feels things are the same as pre marriage as I haven't really spoken to her about this. (I'm the first of our friends to get married if that helps. When I asked my coworkers about this, most of them said their friendships did not last with their single friends. I don't want that! And I don't see a reason for why that should happen) 

Please give me advice. Thanks! 

LondonLisa

I think there are several factors here.  It isn't really pertinent what your H thinks, this is between you and your friend

When you first get married it is exciting and I get wanting to be with H all the time. However, this is not sustainable. You do need to regularly see your friends to maintain a healthy relationship. I was with you until you said you have lost friends in the past because of boyfriends. That isn't normal. Have a long, deep, self-reflective look at if you are 'that girl' that habitually ditches her friends for a guy. Also, your coworkers are grade-A jerks if they ditched their single friends after getting married because they didn't want to maintain a friendship with a new dynamic. They sound like the kind of sad, sad women that look at marriage as an accomplishment and part of their identity. 

Have you communicated with her at all outside of saying that you can't text as much? 

She is probably mourining the loss of your friendship. Because no matter how you slice it, you ARE saying 'I'm married now and don't have time for you.' 

So what do you do from here? I would think how you want this relationship to move forward practically. Is it only seeing each other on the weekends? Maybe inviting her over for dinner one night? 

Then start initiating these plans with her on your terms the way you want. Mute your phone when you don't want texts and respond when you are free. She says 'Margaritas on Tuesday?' You respond ' it's so hard for me to go out during the week but how about the farmers market and coffee on Sunday?'. 

You don't need a long chat, just start to participate in the friendship the way you want. Because it sounds like you are retreating and she is clinging to keeping the friendship. 

[Deleted User]

LondonLisa said:

I think there are several factors here.  It isn't really pertinent what your H thinks, this is between you and your friend

When you first get married it is exciting and I get wanting to be with H all the time. However, this is not sustainable. You do need to regularly see your friends to maintain a healthy relationship. I was with you until you said you have lost friends in the past because of boyfriends. That isn't normal. Have a long, deep, self-reflective look at if you are 'that girl' that habitually ditches her friends for a guy. Also, your coworkers are grade-A jerks if they ditched their single friends after getting married because they didn't want to maintain a friendship with a new dynamic. They sound like the kind of sad, sad women that look at marriage as an accomplishment and part of their identity. 

Have you communicated with her at all outside of saying that you can't text as much? 

She is probably mourining the loss of your friendship. Because no matter how you slice it, you ARE saying 'I'm married now and don't have time for you.' 

So what do you do from here? I would think how you want this relationship to move forward practically. Is it only seeing each other on the weekends? Maybe inviting her over for dinner one night? 

Then start initiating these plans with her on your terms the way you want. Mute your phone when you don't want texts and respond when you are free. She says 'Margaritas on Tuesday?' You respond ' it's so hard for me to go out during the week but how about the farmers market and coffee on Sunday?'. 

You don't need a long chat, just start to participate in the friendship the way you want. Because it sounds like you are retreating and she is clinging to keeping the friendship. 

Thank you. 

I do want to iterate tho that I do spend time with friends outside of spending time with DH. (I think that keeps a relationship healthy) I only lost that one friend because our friendship was already rocky due to other circumstances and my relationship didn't help. 

What do I do though when I've been telling my friend I can't hang out on weekdays? I do still text her quite regularly (multiple times daily) and we talk on the phone often and have girl dates often.  But she still wants more. 

I dont want to feel like the bad friend when im turning her down multiple times a week despite still seeing her quite often. 

The only time I told her I couldn't text as much was on the honeymoon because I didn't want to be in hour long conversations while we were out at meals or exploring. I apologized when I came home but still kinda feel like I shouldn't of had to apologize. (I just feel like a honeymoon should be time with just you and H to disconnect from the world and be with each other...aside from the occasional "hope you're having fun!" Or "hey friends and family, just wanted to let you know we're safe" ) 

I  always respond to her texts throughout the day and initiate conversations a lot. It's just frustrating responding to texts when I'm not able to answer for an hour and her texts turn into "omg why can't you answer me?" 
(It Had gotten to a point where I realized I was on my phone texting her continuously  rather than talking to DH who would be sitting right next to me. And that's not fair either. I think I'm still trying to find that balance with the two of them?) 

(also I don't know if it's fair to say that none of my other friends are like this. We text weekly and hang out monthly, sometimes more. Always been like that especially after college.  But I never lived with any of them ether). 

Subwayloves

I'm a little confused why your relationship with this friend is just now changing. Presumably, your DH has been an important part of your life for quite a while, so why did your relationship dynamic change so dramatically after you got married? Didn't you want to spend time with him, and start making him a priority, before you were married? If you have been with him for a while, and things hadn't changed when you were together with him, I can see why your friend may be confused why things are now dramatically different just because you are married.

Maybe it's because I was with DH for 5 years before getting married, but he was a priority long before we got married. Of course I still saw and talked to my friends (and DH and I also got lucky that our friend groups meshed really well and are now one huge friend group that loves hanging out), but our relationship dynamic shifted not long after DH and I started dating, as he was important to me and they understood that. We still talked/talk most days, but they know if I have something specific planned with DH I won't be answering right away. We would/do have occasional girls nights, but most of the time we see each other is with DH (and other SOs/friends) as well. It wasn't like when we got married something changed dramatically just because we were married; by that point, they obviously knew he was a part of my life, and my friendships didn't change at all after I got married. 

You do to figure out a balance between your friendships and your marriage. Just because you and your husband have time off together doesn't mean he's the only person you can see and spend time with! Why not make some times for just you and girlfriend, but also some times when the 3 of you (or a larger group) hang out as well? You can make your DH a priority while still maintaining close friendships.

ETA: If she is just not understanding that DH is a priority too, maybe you do need to have a sit down conversation with her. "Friend, I love you and want to maintain our close friendship. But DH is a large part of my life too, and I want you to know sometimes I will be doing things with him, and may not always be able to answer or hang out with you. I will make time for you, but it may not be exactly the same as it was before DH."

kimmiinthemitten

I don't understand why being married changes your relationship with your BFF? I lived with my BFF for five years before I moved in with FI.  I have at least one, sometimes 2 date nights a week with her and we text all of the time too. Hell, I just realized the only day I get to see him next week is the day I scheduled a venue walk thru with my BFF and a couple vendors. 

If this is being pushed from your husband that's a huge red flag. I mean, by now shouldn't you both be confident enough in your relationship to share time with other people who you have an a important relationship with?  I get wanting to see him when he's slower at work and home more, but if you're only hanging out with friends as a back up for when he's not available, you're going to find yourself friendless when you need them the most. 

Your post reads as really young to me though, so maybe it's a growing pain thing. 

[Deleted User]

Subwayloves said:

I'm a little confused why your relationship with this friend is just now changing. Presumably, your DH has been an important part of your life for quite a while, so why did your relationship dynamic change so dramatically after you got married? Didn't you want to spend time with him, and start making him a priority, before you were married? If you have been with him for a while, and things hadn't changed when you were together with him, I can see why your friend may be confused why things are now dramatically different just because you are married.

Maybe it's because I was with DH for 5 years before getting married, but he was a priority long before we got married. Of course I still saw and talked to my friends (and DH and I also got lucky that our friend groups meshed really well and are now one huge friend group that loves hanging out), but our relationship dynamic shifted not long after DH and I started dating, as he was important to me and they understood that. We still talked/talk most days, but they know if I have something specific planned with DH I won't be answering right away. We would/do have occasional girls nights, but most of the time we see each other is with DH (and other SOs/friends) as well. It wasn't like when we got married something changed dramatically just because we were married; by that point, they obviously knew he was a part of my life, and my friendships didn't change at all after I got married. 

You do to figure out a balance between your friendships and your marriage. Just because you and your husband have time off together doesn't mean he's the only person you can see and spend time with! Why not make some times for just you and girlfriend, but also some times when the 3 of you (or a larger group) hang out as well? You can make your DH a priority while still maintaining close friendships.

ETA: If she is just not understanding that DH is a priority too, maybe you do need to have a sit down conversation with her. "Friend, I love you and want to maintain our close friendship. But DH is a large part of my life too, and I want you to know sometimes I will be doing things with him, and may not always be able to answer or hang out with you. I will make time for you, but it may not be exactly the same as it was before DH."

DH was working the over night shift most of the time we have been together. His promotion finally went through right before we got married and now he's a regular 8-4. that left my evenings wide open 5 nights of the week. 

I have tried incorporating my friend into our plans. Any time I've invited her Over the house or out with us it's "I thought it could be just us" (this was even before I was married). Usually I just give in and we  go out another day or  I'll cancel things with DH. 

Most of the time it's not too too bad with her. I just don't know how to deal with her increasingly more often comments of "well why didn't you answer me right away" and her not understanding things like expecting to sleep over after the wedding or me not wanting to always rearrange my plans. 

and to reiterate again, I do spend time with her and my other friends apart from DH. Just not multiple times weekly like we did before. kimmiinthemitten said:

I don't understand why being married changes your relationship with your BFF? I lived with my BFF for five years before I moved in with FI.  I have at least one, sometimes 2 date nights a week with her and we text all of the time too. Hell, I just realized the only day I get to see him next week is the day I scheduled a venue walk thru with my BFF and a couple vendors. 

If this is being pushed from your husband that's a huge red flag. I mean, by now shouldn't you both be confident enough in your relationship to share time with other people who you have an a important relationship with?  I get wanting to see him when he's slower at work and home more, but if you're only hanging out with friends as a back up for when he's not available, you're going to find yourself friendless when you need them the most. 

Your post reads as really young to me though, so maybe it's a growing pain thing. 

It's not being pushed by him. It's just that me and him had been talking about it and I decided To post here cause I wasn't sure if I was overreacting or not and I didn't want to go to people that know my friend. 

I don't think I hang out with people just as a backup. I just had more free time before his work schedule changed. so far I've been getting together with friends pretty regularly on Fridays and Sunday's. 

Im 24 and my friend is 22 if that adds perspective. 

charlotte989875

I do think you're overreacting a bit. You're unilaterally changing your relationship with this woman without explaining why, and I think that's pretty unfair to her. You went from hanging out with her multiple times a week to not seeing her at all or much during the week, that's got to sting. 

What about having a standing weekly evening with just the two of you? 

Additionally, if you've been texting with her throughout the day and just now you don't want to do it? That seems odd to me. 

Marriage changes things, but it seems like you're ditching a good friend just because you're married. 

kimmiinthemitten

charlotte989875 said:

I do think you're overreacting a bit. You're unilaterally changing your relationship with this woman without explaining why, and I think that's pretty unfair to her. You went from hanging out with her multiple times a week to not seeing her at all or much during the week, that's got to sting. 

What about having a standing weekly evening with just the two of you? 

Additionally, if you've been texting with her throughout the day and just now you don't want to do it? That seems odd to me. 

Marriage changes things, but it seems like you're ditching a good friend just because you're married. 

And I get the feeling she's here to rally the married women around her. 

SP29

I had 2 friendships similar to this, but this is when I was 11-12 and a teenager in high school. I can't say I've had this problem as an adult, nor have I lost my single friends because I got married.

My two previous childhood friends were much like your friend. No cell phones back then, but we'd talk on the phone everyday. The first friend would ask me to do something, I'd say I'd be busy (usually family stuff) and she'd make me feel guilty for it. Initially I'd give in, but then I started saying well what about tomorrow night, or the next night... and she'd make up an excuse about why she couldn't get together then, so it HAD to be tonight. Of course she'd then contact me all those days she "couldn't" get together to hang out. My family moved and that helped give some space, and then her family moved out of province, so we lost touch, but we later became friends on FB as adults. Second friend and I were VERY close, and we would often have sleepovers, but then she'd want me to stay for lunch, then dinner, then just sleep over again the next night. When I started dating my boyfriend (who is now my husband), there was definitely much jealousy, as I started to make more time for him. She and I remained close, but we didn't hang out as often as she wanted (she wanted to have sleep overs every weekend). The same thing happened with this friend when I started to make some new friends in high school, just people I had more in common with and was more like personality-wise, we definitely drifted apart- nothing bad happened, we were both just different. I noticed she behaved similarly with other friends she became close with (being together all the time). We are still distant friends, and I am sure with both of these people, as adults our relationships would be much different and positive. But again, this all happened prior to adulthood.

I see both sides of this argument. I get your feelings- you can't always respond to a text right away, why would you be in constant contact with much of anyone during your HM, now that you have your husband at home, you want to create new traditions of having dinner at home together. I also get your friend- why is this just changing now because you got married, not back when you first started dating? I can see how it would be hurtful for behaviours that you created to suddenly change (you previously texted her all the time, you would be agreeable to go out for dinner multiple times per week, etc). Does your friend have a large friend group outside of you? I found with my two previously mentioned friends that when we were "best friends" it was mostly just the two of us, all other friendships on each others parts were more distant. That could be hard for her if she doesn't hang out with a lot of other people, and thus feels like she's losing a friend.

I think at the end of the day, you need to have a conversation with your friend. Acknowledge her feelings. Acknowledge your own wants and needs. Include her in group events, include her in activities with your husband, and make sure you've got some time for her alone.

Keisha84

My friend I and have a similar relationship you have/had with your friend. For years it was just the two of us. We did everything together and spent a lot of time together. When I started dating my now FI she backed off and stopped wanting to hang out cause she though it was the right thing to do. I felt horrible cause she one thought I wouldn't make time for her and two cause I felt like I lost a huge part of my life. We talked it out and we both realized we were wrong and our friendship is better for it. Things have changed yes but we can both see each other's side. That's why we've been friends for so long. 

I can understand where your friend is coming from. She's trying to reconfirm her role in your life. She went from being the most important person to second fiddle. It doesn't matter how you look at it, she sees herself as losing her friend. You are married yes but that shouldn't change your friendship. Take some time and spend a day doing something you both like and assure her she's still your number one friend. 

And stop having inviting your husband out with you guys. He doesn't have to come everywhere you go. Friend time should be friend time and that's it. 

TheMostHappy15

I guess I'm in the minority here but I really don't see where OP is doing anything wrong and I don't think she needs to baby her friend through a transition that should be completely understandable and natural from friend's point of view. 

The key point to me here is the fact OP's H's work schedule changed drastically literally exactly when they got married. It's not as if they got married and overnight OP was like "Well I'm wifed up now so no more time for friends!" - she just suddenly didn't have every single night free to hang out with friends anymore, which she previous had because of H's work schedule. 

OP, your friend sounds crazy needy. It's understandable that she might be a bit sad and need some time to adjust, but any rational human being should be able to understand you aren't going to be able to hang out with them three times a week and text them constantly every day through every phase of your life (geez, I couldn't maintain that even if I had all the free time in the world... but that's just me). As long as you aren't completely ghosting on her (which it doesn't sound like you are at all!), I think the impetus is on her to put on her big girl pants and adjust. FFS, it's not "losing a friend" if you still text her daily, initiate conversations as well as respond, and see her frequently both with and without your H (all things you said you are doing).

It sounds like you've tried to be direct (you said you've already told her you can't hang out on weekdays, text back instantly etc.) and she's just not taking no for an answer. I'd have one last big conversation with her- be very explicit that you love her and are always going to make time for her, but it's not going to go back to being the way it used to be- and if that doesn't work I'd just ignore her complaints in the future (or give a form-letter type response along the lines of "We've already discussed why I can't go out most weekdays anymore, I don't want to go through that convo again.") Put your phone on silent when you and H are having dedicated time together, and when you and friend do get together try to make it just the two of you whenever possible and make sure you're completely present with her just like you want to be when you're with H.

short+sassy

TheMostHappy15 said:

I guess I'm in the minority here but I really don't see where OP is doing anything wrong and I don't think she needs to baby her friend through a transition that should be completely understandable and natural from friend's point of view. 

The key point to me here is the fact OP's H's work schedule changed drastically literally exactly when they got married. It's not as if they got married and overnight OP was like "Well I'm wifed up now so no more time for friends!" - she just suddenly didn't have every single night free to hang out with friends anymore, which she previous had because of H's work schedule. 

OP, your friend sounds crazy needy. It's understandable that she might be a bit sad and need some time to adjust, but any rational human being should be able to understand you aren't going to be able to hang out with them three times a week and text them constantly every day through every phase of your life (geez, I couldn't maintain that even if I had all the free time in the world... but that's just me). As long as you aren't completely ghosting on her (which it doesn't sound like you are at all!), I think the impetus is on her to put on her big girl pants and adjust. FFS, it's not "losing a friend" if you still text her daily, initiate conversations as well as respond, and see her frequently both with and without your H (all things you said you are doing).

It sounds like you've tried to be direct (you said you've already told her you can't hang out on weekdays, text back instantly etc.) and she's just not taking no for an answer. I'd have one last big conversation with her- be very explicit that you love her and are always going to make time for her, but it's not going to go back to being the way it used to be- and if that doesn't work I'd just ignore her complaints in the future (or give a form-letter type response along the lines of "We've already discussed why I can't go out most weekdays anymore, I don't want to go through that convo again.") Put your phone on silent when you and H are having dedicated time together, and when you and friend do get together try to make it just the two of you whenever possible and make sure you're completely present with her just like you want to be when you're with H.

This is more a general statement, but I've never understood the constant texting that some people do or the attitude of "I need my text/phone call answered NOW".  If I'm busy, and definitely if I'm driving, I don't answer texts or phone calls.  The first "complaint" I get about that from someone and boundaries are immediately and politely set.  And they work.

Just let her know something like "Sometimes I can't text/call you back right away.  I'm not ignoring you.  When that happens, you know I'll get back to you later."  Or, if she is texting at a bad time, just let her know, "Hey, H and I are eating dinner/watching a movie/whatever and I can't really talk/text right now, but I'll get back to you in a couple hours/tomorrow."  Retrain her expectations.

I think both of you have done some "bads".  She does sound maddeningly needy, but then it sounds like that is how it has always been and it was fine before.  Your H's promotion sounds great!  But it sounds like it was bad timing for the friendship because it happened literally right before you all got married.  You do have less time for her now, primarily because of his schedule change.  And that's fine.  But you haven't TOLD her that.  At least that is the impression I have.

You expected her to figure it out.  I agree, I think she should have.  But, since she didn't, explain it to her now.  Focus on how much you value her friendship.  Then how your schedule has changed since your H's promotion.  Explain what you can/can't do nowadays, ie no going out on the weekdays most of the time, more limited texting, etc.  Be sympathetic that it is a change from your all's past history.  She might just need reassurance that she is still a major part of your life.   

kimmiinthemitten

short+sassy said:

TheMostHappy15 said:

I guess I'm in the minority here but I really don't see where OP is doing anything wrong and I don't think she needs to baby her friend through a transition that should be completely understandable and natural from friend's point of view. 

The key point to me here is the fact OP's H's work schedule changed drastically literally exactly when they got married. It's not as if they got married and overnight OP was like "Well I'm wifed up now so no more time for friends!" - she just suddenly didn't have every single night free to hang out with friends anymore, which she previous had because of H's work schedule. 

OP, your friend sounds crazy needy. It's understandable that she might be a bit sad and need some time to adjust, but any rational human being should be able to understand you aren't going to be able to hang out with them three times a week and text them constantly every day through every phase of your life (geez, I couldn't maintain that even if I had all the free time in the world... but that's just me). As long as you aren't completely ghosting on her (which it doesn't sound like you are at all!), I think the impetus is on her to put on her big girl pants and adjust. FFS, it's not "losing a friend" if you still text her daily, initiate conversations as well as respond, and see her frequently both with and without your H (all things you said you are doing).

It sounds like you've tried to be direct (you said you've already told her you can't hang out on weekdays, text back instantly etc.) and she's just not taking no for an answer. I'd have one last big conversation with her- be very explicit that you love her and are always going to make time for her, but it's not going to go back to being the way it used to be- and if that doesn't work I'd just ignore her complaints in the future (or give a form-letter type response along the lines of "We've already discussed why I can't go out most weekdays anymore, I don't want to go through that convo again.") Put your phone on silent when you and H are having dedicated time together, and when you and friend do get together try to make it just the two of you whenever possible and make sure you're completely present with her just like you want to be when you're with H.

This is more a general statement, but I've never understood the constant texting that some people do or the attitude of "I need my text/phone call answered NOW".  If I'm busy, and definitely if I'm driving, I don't answer texts or phone calls.  The first "complaint" I get about that from someone and boundaries are immediately and politely set.  And they work.

Just let her know something like "Sometimes I can't text/call you back right away.  I'm not ignoring you.  When that happens, you know I'll get back to you later."  Or, if she is texting at a bad time, just let her know, "Hey, H and I are eating dinner/watching a movie/whatever and I can't really talk/text right now, but I'll get back to you in a couple hours/tomorrow."  Retrain her expectations.

I think both of you have done some "bads".  She does sound maddeningly needy, but then it sounds like that is how it has always been and it was fine before.  Your H's promotion sounds great!  But it sounds like it was bad timing for the friendship because it happened literally right before you all got married.  You do have less time for her now, primarily because of his schedule change.  And that's fine.  But you haven't TOLD her that.  At least that is the impression I have.

You expected her to figure it out.  I agree, I think she should have.  But, since she didn't, explain it to her now.  Focus on how much you value her friendship.  Then how your schedule has changed since your H's promotion.  Explain what you can/can't do nowadays, ie no going out on the weekdays most of the time, more limited texting, etc.  Be sympathetic that it is a change from your all's past history.  She might just need reassurance that she is still a major part of your life.   

I do agree the friend sounds needy, but at risk of being ageist, they're really young and sounds like they spent all of their free time together before she got married.  

To the bolded, this is what I don't understand.  Why can't you do a weekday friend date/respond to texts when you're home with your H?  Why does husband home = wife can't do anything on her own?

TheMostHappy15

kimmiinthemitten said:

short+sassy said:

TheMostHappy15 said:

I guess I'm in the minority here but I really don't see where OP is doing anything wrong and I don't think she needs to baby her friend through a transition that should be completely understandable and natural from friend's point of view. 

The key point to me here is the fact OP's H's work schedule changed drastically literally exactly when they got married. It's not as if they got married and overnight OP was like "Well I'm wifed up now so no more time for friends!" - she just suddenly didn't have every single night free to hang out with friends anymore, which she previous had because of H's work schedule. 

OP, your friend sounds crazy needy. It's understandable that she might be a bit sad and need some time to adjust, but any rational human being should be able to understand you aren't going to be able to hang out with them three times a week and text them constantly every day through every phase of your life (geez, I couldn't maintain that even if I had all the free time in the world... but that's just me). As long as you aren't completely ghosting on her (which it doesn't sound like you are at all!), I think the impetus is on her to put on her big girl pants and adjust. FFS, it's not "losing a friend" if you still text her daily, initiate conversations as well as respond, and see her frequently both with and without your H (all things you said you are doing).

It sounds like you've tried to be direct (you said you've already told her you can't hang out on weekdays, text back instantly etc.) and she's just not taking no for an answer. I'd have one last big conversation with her- be very explicit that you love her and are always going to make time for her, but it's not going to go back to being the way it used to be- and if that doesn't work I'd just ignore her complaints in the future (or give a form-letter type response along the lines of "We've already discussed why I can't go out most weekdays anymore, I don't want to go through that convo again.") Put your phone on silent when you and H are having dedicated time together, and when you and friend do get together try to make it just the two of you whenever possible and make sure you're completely present with her just like you want to be when you're with H.

This is more a general statement, but I've never understood the constant texting that some people do or the attitude of "I need my text/phone call answered NOW".  If I'm busy, and definitely if I'm driving, I don't answer texts or phone calls.  The first "complaint" I get about that from someone and boundaries are immediately and politely set.  And they work.

Just let her know something like "Sometimes I can't text/call you back right away.  I'm not ignoring you.  When that happens, you know I'll get back to you later."  Or, if she is texting at a bad time, just let her know, "Hey, H and I are eating dinner/watching a movie/whatever and I can't really talk/text right now, but I'll get back to you in a couple hours/tomorrow."  Retrain her expectations.

I think both of you have done some "bads".  She does sound maddeningly needy, but then it sounds like that is how it has always been and it was fine before.  Your H's promotion sounds great!  But it sounds like it was bad timing for the friendship because it happened literally right before you all got married.  You do have less time for her now, primarily because of his schedule change.  And that's fine.  But you haven't TOLD her that.  At least that is the impression I have.

You expected her to figure it out.  I agree, I think she should have.  But, since she didn't, explain it to her now.  Focus on how much you value her friendship.  Then how your schedule has changed since your H's promotion.  Explain what you can/can't do nowadays, ie no going out on the weekdays most of the time, more limited texting, etc.  Be sympathetic that it is a change from your all's past history.  She might just need reassurance that she is still a major part of your life.   

I do agree the friend sounds needy, but at risk of being ageist, they're really young and sounds like they spent all of their free time together before she got married.  

To the bolded, this is what I don't understand.  Why can't you do a weekday friend date/respond to texts when you're home with your H?  Why does husband home = wife can't do anything on her own?

I guess I was reading it more like, it's this new thing that her husband is actually home in the evenings after presumably years of him not being around at that time, so she's excited about that new window of time together and to build traditions and rituals like cooking for each other, watching whatever TV show they're into before bed etc.

I think it's perfectly normal for that to be her priority right now, and I also get why she doesn't want to spend all night with her H texting her friend, but I agree she shouldn't NEVER text or go out on weeknights- that would be extreme. The real problem is her friend doesn't seem like she's going to be satisfied with anything less than the constant level of attention she was used to before OP got married, so I doubt OP saying "It's less convenient for me to socialize on weeknights now but there will definitely still be times I'll be up for a girls night on a random Wednesday!" is going to go over well. That's just my reading of the situation though. 

missfrodo

Yeah, I'm with @themosthappy15.  I've never had a friend that needed this much attention, so that may be swaying my feelings on the subject.  It does sound like, for years, you've been attached at the hip to this friend (which, by the way, kudos for managing that on top of school/work/life) but now you need to dial it back in order to have a family of your own.  As adults, I think it's unreasonable for her to expect you both to keep up that kind of contact indefinitely.  People have families, jobs, and other responsibilities that stack up as we grow older.  Lay out exactly what you can give her: Answering her texts the same day, instead of within five minutes, for example, or scheduling girls' night with her one night a week.  I do get the feeling she's not going to be happy if you change her relationship at all, but that's part of growing up.  

charlotte989875

TheMostHappy15 said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

short+sassy said:

TheMostHappy15 said:

I guess I'm in the minority here but I really don't see where OP is doing anything wrong and I don't think she needs to baby her friend through a transition that should be completely understandable and natural from friend's point of view. 

The key point to me here is the fact OP's H's work schedule changed drastically literally exactly when they got married. It's not as if they got married and overnight OP was like "Well I'm wifed up now so no more time for friends!" - she just suddenly didn't have every single night free to hang out with friends anymore, which she previous had because of H's work schedule. 

OP, your friend sounds crazy needy. It's understandable that she might be a bit sad and need some time to adjust, but any rational human being should be able to understand you aren't going to be able to hang out with them three times a week and text them constantly every day through every phase of your life (geez, I couldn't maintain that even if I had all the free time in the world... but that's just me). As long as you aren't completely ghosting on her (which it doesn't sound like you are at all!), I think the impetus is on her to put on her big girl pants and adjust. FFS, it's not "losing a friend" if you still text her daily, initiate conversations as well as respond, and see her frequently both with and without your H (all things you said you are doing).

It sounds like you've tried to be direct (you said you've already told her you can't hang out on weekdays, text back instantly etc.) and she's just not taking no for an answer. I'd have one last big conversation with her- be very explicit that you love her and are always going to make time for her, but it's not going to go back to being the way it used to be- and if that doesn't work I'd just ignore her complaints in the future (or give a form-letter type response along the lines of "We've already discussed why I can't go out most weekdays anymore, I don't want to go through that convo again.") Put your phone on silent when you and H are having dedicated time together, and when you and friend do get together try to make it just the two of you whenever possible and make sure you're completely present with her just like you want to be when you're with H.

This is more a general statement, but I've never understood the constant texting that some people do or the attitude of "I need my text/phone call answered NOW".  If I'm busy, and definitely if I'm driving, I don't answer texts or phone calls.  The first "complaint" I get about that from someone and boundaries are immediately and politely set.  And they work.

Just let her know something like "Sometimes I can't text/call you back right away.  I'm not ignoring you.  When that happens, you know I'll get back to you later."  Or, if she is texting at a bad time, just let her know, "Hey, H and I are eating dinner/watching a movie/whatever and I can't really talk/text right now, but I'll get back to you in a couple hours/tomorrow."  Retrain her expectations.

I think both of you have done some "bads".  She does sound maddeningly needy, but then it sounds like that is how it has always been and it was fine before.  Your H's promotion sounds great!  But it sounds like it was bad timing for the friendship because it happened literally right before you all got married.  You do have less time for her now, primarily because of his schedule change.  And that's fine.  But you haven't TOLD her that.  At least that is the impression I have.

You expected her to figure it out.  I agree, I think she should have.  But, since she didn't, explain it to her now.  Focus on how much you value her friendship.  Then how your schedule has changed since your H's promotion.  Explain what you can/can't do nowadays, ie no going out on the weekdays most of the time, more limited texting, etc.  Be sympathetic that it is a change from your all's past history.  She might just need reassurance that she is still a major part of your life.   

I do agree the friend sounds needy, but at risk of being ageist, they're really young and sounds like they spent all of their free time together before she got married.  

To the bolded, this is what I don't understand.  Why can't you do a weekday friend date/respond to texts when you're home with your H?  Why does husband home = wife can't do anything on her own?

I guess I was reading it more like, it's this new thing that her husband is actually home in the evenings after presumably years of him not being around at that time, so she's excited about that new window of time together and to build traditions and rituals like cooking for each other, watching whatever TV show they're into before bed etc.

I think it's perfectly normal for that to be her priority right now, and I also get why she doesn't want to spend all night with her H texting her friend, but I agree she shouldn't NEVER text or go out on weeknights- that would be extreme. The real problem is her friend doesn't seem like she's going to be satisfied with anything less than the constant level of attention she was used to before OP got married, so I doubt OP saying "It's less convenient for me to socialize on weeknights now but there will definitely still be times I'll be up for a girls night on a random Wednesday!" is going to go over well. That's just my reading of the situation though. 

So much of this could be managed with an adult conversation though.

Rereading the post the OP it still sounds like friend and OP were texting/hanging out all the time leading up to the wedding. Over the honeymoon friend texted way too much, and now that they're home friend is continuing on in the relationship like they both did before, but now OP is not responding to texts and her and the husband want to set boundaries. That's fine, but to just change things up on her without a conversation seems a little unfair to me. 

Sure it's the circumstances that have changed (husband is now home in the evenings), but how is the friend supposed to know those changes will affect both the time they spend hanging out in person, and the online friendship they have, if the OP doesn't explain. OP even says if the situation were reversed, she'd be doing the same thing (texting/expecting to hang out). Sounds like they both had this dynamic (I don't know if I'd call it needy if it worked for them) and now the OP wants/needs to change. That's fine, but she does owe her close friend an explanation since it doesn't seem like the friend did anything wrong. 

I still agree that a weekly friend date, and setting times when they can text during the day/week is a good starting point. 

cowgirl8238

From what I am reading I understand both sides of this situation but I tend to be falling in line with @TheMostHappy15 on that this friend is being too over the top IMO. 

I think both sides need to communicate better.  OP should sit down and have a chat with her friend.  I would set aside a long standing "Girls Night" and try my hardest to make it every week. Then add in another evening/day for "group" activities or as a second "girl's night".  Maybe this rotates one week everyone, the next week just the two of them.  However I also feel like accommodating this person multiple times a week, every week, and not being allowed to bring along DH (on occasion) is a bit much!  Add in the constant need to text/call and the whole "you took too long to respond to me" thing and well... Ehh I guess its just not the type of person I would want to be friends with.

OP, if you find yourself in this situation multiple times I would be concerned that you are doing this (subconsciously at least)...but this all seems like a high maintenance friend who is being a bit immature.  Definitely have a chat and set some boundaries about all this.  Explain the new job and the change in schedules that it has created.  I think your friend feels like you are cutting her out of her life.

TheMostHappy15

Okay now I'm starting to wonder if I'm just a really horrible friend, because all this talk of "schedule weekly girls' nights" etc. just sounds crazy to me! I mean it'd be one thing if she wants to have a dedicated night for her friend- if that's the case, great solution- but she shouldn't feel obligated to lock down one evening (or more) out of every seven into perpetuity just to pacify her. This is the reality of adult life- people get busy, you learn how to strike the right balance of keeping in touch with people, and you shouldn't need to have a standing weekly appointment for a person to feel like they are a part of your life (especially if you a texting and talking to them on a daily basis anyway). 

I have been with my husband for eight years, so we are long past the "can't be apart/blind to the rest of the world" phase... but I still wouldn't be up to going out with friends one night every week, because some weeks I'm just tired from work, want to spend more time with my H, or actually just want time to myself. It's totally fair if OP finds herself growing more into that kind of person (and around 24 is probably when that happens for most people actually... you finish your school/party phase and actually start settling into a career, an adult relationship etc.).

That being said, there is something to be said for letting things fade gradually if she really wants drastically less time with the friend. Like at first maybe you really make it a point to get together at least weekly so she doesn't go into absolute shock over the decrease in contact. I just don't think she should feel beholden to pledging a set night a week to her friend for as long as her friend wants that level of attention.

kimmiinthemitten

TheMostHappy15 said:

Okay now I'm starting to wonder if I'm just a really horrible friend, because all this talk of "schedule weekly girls' nights" etc. just sounds crazy to me! I mean it'd be one thing if she wants to have a dedicated night for her friend- if that's the case, great solution- but she shouldn't feel obligated to lock down one evening (or more) out of every seven into perpetuity just to pacify her. This is the reality of adult life- people get busy, you learn how to strike the right balance of keeping in touch with people, and you shouldn't need to have a standing weekly appointment for a person to feel like they are a part of your life (especially if you a texting and talking to them on a daily basis anyway). 

I have been with my husband for eight years, so we are long past the "can't be apart/blind to the rest of the world" phase... but I still wouldn't be up to going out with friends one night every week, because some weeks I'm just tired from work, want to spend more time with my H, or actually just want time to myself. It's totally fair if OP finds herself growing more into that kind of person (and around 24 is probably when that happens for most people actually... you finish your school/party phase and actually start settling into a career, an adult relationship etc.).

That being said, there is something to be said for letting things fade gradually if she really wants drastically less time with the friend. Like at first maybe you really make it a point to get together at least weekly so she doesn't go into absolute shock over the decrease in contact. I just don't think she should feel beholden to pledging a set night a week to her friend for as long as her friend wants that level of attention.

I think it depends on the friendship.  Prior to living with FI, I lived with my BFF so we saw each other every day. Since I've moved, we still meet up 1-2 times a week and talk off and on all day.  

My sister moved to another state with her now H and made friends there.  She has close girlfriends, and they get together at random, but normally with their SO's in a large group so she would never have standing, weekly dates either.

I think it's really really odd to go from hanging out almost every day to not even communicating.  It's a drastic change in their friendship and while I think the friend is being immature, she also went from spending time with OP on the reg, to being told "I don't have time for you now that I'm married."  If they didn't hang out so often prior to her marriage, I'd agree with you.

charlotte989875

kimmiinthemitten said:

TheMostHappy15 said:

Okay now I'm starting to wonder if I'm just a really horrible friend, because all this talk of "schedule weekly girls' nights" etc. just sounds crazy to me! I mean it'd be one thing if she wants to have a dedicated night for her friend- if that's the case, great solution- but she shouldn't feel obligated to lock down one evening (or more) out of every seven into perpetuity just to pacify her. This is the reality of adult life- people get busy, you learn how to strike the right balance of keeping in touch with people, and you shouldn't need to have a standing weekly appointment for a person to feel like they are a part of your life (especially if you a texting and talking to them on a daily basis anyway). 

I have been with my husband for eight years, so we are long past the "can't be apart/blind to the rest of the world" phase... but I still wouldn't be up to going out with friends one night every week, because some weeks I'm just tired from work, want to spend more time with my H, or actually just want time to myself. It's totally fair if OP finds herself growing more into that kind of person (and around 24 is probably when that happens for most people actually... you finish your school/party phase and actually start settling into a career, an adult relationship etc.).

That being said, there is something to be said for letting things fade gradually if she really wants drastically less time with the friend. Like at first maybe you really make it a point to get together at least weekly so she doesn't go into absolute shock over the decrease in contact. I just don't think she should feel beholden to pledging a set night a week to her friend for as long as her friend wants that level of attention.

I think it depends on the friendship.  Prior to living with FI, I lived with my BFF so we saw each other every day. Since I've moved, we still meet up 1-2 times a week and talk off and on all day.  

My sister moved to another state with her now H and made friends there.  She has close girlfriends, and they get together at random, but normally with their SO's in a large group so she would never have standing, weekly dates either.

I think it's really really odd to go from hanging out almost every day to not even communicating.  It's a drastic change in their friendship and while I think the friend is being immature, she also went from spending time with OP on the reg, to being told "I don't have time for you now that I'm married."  If they didn't hang out so often prior to her marriage, I'd agree with you.

I agree so much with this.

I get that people and friendships change/evolve/mature, but the hanging out multiple times per week/texting all day everyday, even in the week leading up to the wedding, to now ignoring her texts/not having anytime doesn't seem like a gradual progression of a friendship, it seems like "I'm married now, I don't have time for you" and I can see why the friend would be hurt. 

TheMostHappy15

kimmiinthemitten said:

TheMostHappy15 said:

Okay now I'm starting to wonder if I'm just a really horrible friend, because all this talk of "schedule weekly girls' nights" etc. just sounds crazy to me! I mean it'd be one thing if she wants to have a dedicated night for her friend- if that's the case, great solution- but she shouldn't feel obligated to lock down one evening (or more) out of every seven into perpetuity just to pacify her. This is the reality of adult life- people get busy, you learn how to strike the right balance of keeping in touch with people, and you shouldn't need to have a standing weekly appointment for a person to feel like they are a part of your life (especially if you a texting and talking to them on a daily basis anyway). 

I have been with my husband for eight years, so we are long past the "can't be apart/blind to the rest of the world" phase... but I still wouldn't be up to going out with friends one night every week, because some weeks I'm just tired from work, want to spend more time with my H, or actually just want time to myself. It's totally fair if OP finds herself growing more into that kind of person (and around 24 is probably when that happens for most people actually... you finish your school/party phase and actually start settling into a career, an adult relationship etc.).

That being said, there is something to be said for letting things fade gradually if she really wants drastically less time with the friend. Like at first maybe you really make it a point to get together at least weekly so she doesn't go into absolute shock over the decrease in contact. I just don't think she should feel beholden to pledging a set night a week to her friend for as long as her friend wants that level of attention.

I think it depends on the friendship.  Prior to living with FI, I lived with my BFF so we saw each other every day. Since I've moved, we still meet up 1-2 times a week and talk off and on all day.  

My sister moved to another state with her now H and made friends there.  She has close girlfriends, and they get together at random, but normally with their SO's in a large group so she would never have standing, weekly dates either.

I think it's really really odd to go from hanging out almost every day to not even communicating.  It's a drastic change in their friendship and while I think the friend is being immature, she also went from spending time with OP on the reg, to being told "I don't have time for you now that I'm married."  If they didn't hang out so often prior to her marriage, I'd agree with you.

Yeah I can totally see that. And I don't think the OP wants to not communicate with her, since she did make this whole post about how to best talk to her friend about the changes in their relationship... I think she really does want to preserve the friendship overall. But I agree with you it's really the level of contact pre-marriage that makes the difference here... cutting back on anything is going to feel like majorly pumping the breaks when the bar was previously talking all day every day and hanging out every night of the week!

I also agree with you (I think it was you?) in a PP about how age is a factor here. They both are really young (in the grand scheme of adulthood) and just figuring out how to navigate from college-style relationships (which tend to be defined by living together, having cohesive social circles through clubs/majors/Greek organizations, having lots of free time, low levels of outside responsibility) to friendships in the "real" world of having jobs, getting married, taking on home ownership, starting families. It's totally understandable that that's going to be a bumpy road at times... and chances are OP's friend is going to catch up and start having more responsibilities and other obligations of her own before too long, so maybe this will all even out in the end.

cowgirl8238

TheMostHappy15 said:

Okay now I'm starting to wonder if I'm just a really horrible friend, because all this talk of "schedule weekly girls' nights" etc. just sounds crazy to me! I mean it'd be one thing if she wants to have a dedicated night for her friend- if that's the case, great solution- but she shouldn't feel obligated to lock down one evening (or more) out of every seven into perpetuity just to pacify her. This is the reality of adult life- people get busy, you learn how to strike the right balance of keeping in touch with people, and you shouldn't need to have a standing weekly appointment for a person to feel like they are a part of your life (especially if you a texting and talking to them on a daily basis anyway). 

I have been with my husband for eight years, so we are long past the "can't be apart/blind to the rest of the world" phase... but I still wouldn't be up to going out with friends one night every week, because some weeks I'm just tired from work, want to spend more time with my H, or actually just want time to myself. It's totally fair if OP finds herself growing more into that kind of person (and around 24 is probably when that happens for most people actually... you finish your school/party phase and actually start settling into a career, an adult relationship etc.).

That being said, there is something to be said for letting things fade gradually if she really wants drastically less time with the friend. Like at first maybe you really make it a point to get together at least weekly so she doesn't go into absolute shock over the decrease in contact. I just don't think she should feel beholden to pledging a set night a week to her friend for as long as her friend wants that level of attention.

I think my first post came off a little too "You must do this." (and I know others said similar too but I just wanted to clarify my thoughts) I think that if she wants to remain friends she should try to make a long standing "girls night" as a way to show her friend that she is not ditching her indefinitely.  I'm sure I read too much into this all, but it also seemed like that may be the only way to get her friend to understand.  I didn't mean that she has to or she is a bad person.  I think that she has every right to set limits that she is comfortable with.

FTR I don't hang with my friends on a schedule or anything.  We see each other a few times a month for various things...sometimes "the girls" get together but usually everyone is included for games/drinks/fun with their SO.  When I was younger and in college (like their ages), I did have a long standing every Thrusday from 7PM to about 11PM was girl time...and the BF's/Guys all did the same.  Now, I see my friends when we feel like it.  I don't text my friends daily either...I guess I am the type that doesn't need constant contact to be close to someone and I find friends that feel the same way.  Sometimes I can go a month without seeing a friend but when we get together it was as if we were hanging out yesterday!

TheMostHappy15

charlotte989875 said:

kimmiinthemitten said:

TheMostHappy15 said:

Okay now I'm starting to wonder if I'm just a really horrible friend, because all this talk of "schedule weekly girls' nights" etc. just sounds crazy to me! I mean it'd be one thing if she wants to have a dedicated night for her friend- if that's the case, great solution- but she shouldn't feel obligated to lock down one evening (or more) out of every seven into perpetuity just to pacify her. This is the reality of adult life- people get busy, you learn how to strike the right balance of keeping in touch with people, and you shouldn't need to have a standing weekly appointment for a person to feel like they are a part of your life (especially if you a texting and talking to them on a daily basis anyway). 

I have been with my husband for eight years, so we are long past the "can't be apart/blind to the rest of the world" phase... but I still wouldn't be up to going out with friends one night every week, because some weeks I'm just tired from work, want to spend more time with my H, or actually just want time to myself. It's totally fair if OP finds herself growing more into that kind of person (and around 24 is probably when that happens for most people actually... you finish your school/party phase and actually start settling into a career, an adult relationship etc.).

That being said, there is something to be said for letting things fade gradually if she really wants drastically less time with the friend. Like at first maybe you really make it a point to get together at least weekly so she doesn't go into absolute shock over the decrease in contact. I just don't think she should feel beholden to pledging a set night a week to her friend for as long as her friend wants that level of attention.

I think it depends on the friendship.  Prior to living with FI, I lived with my BFF so we saw each other every day. Since I've moved, we still meet up 1-2 times a week and talk off and on all day.  

My sister moved to another state with her now H and made friends there.  She has close girlfriends, and they get together at random, but normally with their SO's in a large group so she would never have standing, weekly dates either.

I think it's really really odd to go from hanging out almost every day to not even communicating.  It's a drastic change in their friendship and while I think the friend is being immature, she also went from spending time with OP on the reg, to being told "I don't have time for you now that I'm married."  If they didn't hang out so often prior to her marriage, I'd agree with you.

I agree so much with this.

I get that people and friendships change/evolve/mature, but the hanging out multiple times per week/texting all day everyday, even in the week leading up to the wedding, to now ignoring her texts/not having anytime doesn't seem like a gradual progression of a friendship, it seems like "I'm married now, I don't have time for you" and I can see why the friend would be hurt. 

Wait, where are we getting the impression she's ignoring her texts/not having any time for her?

OP literally said:  "I do still text her quite regularly (multiple times daily) and we talk on the phone often and have girl dates often.  But she still wants more." She also said not only responds to her texts but initiates conversation. She literally came on here to ask for advice about how to sensitively let her friend know she couldn't keep up with their old hangout schedule (she said she had tried to have versions of that convo before but it hadn't taken) and specifically said the last thing she wants is for it to seem like she's ditching her because she's married now- sounds to me like she's actually being really sensitive to this friend's crazy (IMO) expectations.

Also @cowgirl8238 definitely wasn't directing the girl's night thing at you or anyone in particular, just more using that as an example of how I really don't think it benefits the friendship to force hanging out way more than OP really wants to just to pacify this friend.

kimmiinthemitten

I think the problem is she went from one extreme to the next.  They went from hanging out every weekend and multiple times during the week to: "What do I do though when I've been telling my friend I can't hang out on weekdays?" and "I love a girls night but not every weekend anymore especially when that's the most time I am able to spend with DH."  Combine that with a lack of communication and it's a friendship problem.