Talk to your wife

short+sassy

Dear Prudence,
My wife has a serious medical condition that will eventually take her life. In addition to the stress of being a caregiver for her and our child and working full time, I also find myself increasingly lonely. She may live for years with this condition, though not fully as herself. Already I am more a caregiver than a husband. Sex ended a year and a half ago. I find myself wanting to be with someone but fearing it may never happen. I didn’t date that much before we married, and even if I could give myself permission to be with someone while she is still alive, it would get complicated with family and friends who would see it as not honoring our vows. I’m currently middle-aged, but I may be old by the time my wife dies. Am I doomed to years essentially alone with no prospects of sex or companionship?
—Lonely Caregiver

Ro041

You sound super selfish.  "My wife is dying and even though I took vows to love her in sickness and health, how will I get my rocks off?"  Poor wife.

ShesSoCold

Um, did you marry her purely for sex? What happened to "in sickness and in health"? 

Reacclimate yourself with your hand and be a good person.

VarunaTT

*snort*  Y'all try being married and lonely for years.  It's pretty damn hard to go from having a partner in life, to having a patient.

I do think he needs to talk with his wife.  People have emotional and physical needs and I suspect she's thinking about this as well.  And then, hopefully, they decide what to do together. Marriage vows are just words; the relationship is what needs to find the path forward.

Ro041

@VarunaTT - Your first paragraph came across very condescending and I am not sure if that's how you meant it.  I am sure you can admit that you don't know what kind of marriages PPs have or have had/been a part of at any time in their lives.

VarunaTT

 I absolutely meant what I said.  If we pretend everything was perfect, he's gone from having an equal partner, lover, companion, mother to his child, partner in life to having none of that, being a single parent, and a caregiver to someone in need of specialized care.

Being lonely in a marriage is hard AF.  Hard doesn't even begin to touch on the feelings, desperation, depression, and pain you go through.  I can remember crying and telling myself, "This is what you signed up for, this is just how your life is going to be now."  And no.one.should.HAVE.to.go.through.that. for any reason, ever.  If you chose to, that's absolutely 100% your choice and should be supported...the same goes true for if you don't choose that path.  This man seems to be trying to find a path forward, and being told to masturbate and remember your vows is extraordinarily belittling and terrible and does nothing to address his humanity and pain.

Ro041

So you meant it to be condescending?  That's unfortunate.  

ETA - I don't disagree with the sentiment of your second comment, but I still take issue with your first post because of its tone.

VarunaTT

Okay?  I'm not sure what you're really seeking here.  Your concern is noted, I suppose.

Ro041

VarunaTT said:

Okay?  I'm not sure what you're really seeking here.  Your concern is noted, I suppose.

An acknowledgment that you didn't mean to be condescending when explaining why you viewed things differently?   *snort* I guess that was too tall of an order...

Edited - since you don't know what kind of shitty trapped-in-a-situation-I-can't-get-out-relationship I was in long ago, I didn't really need to be told "try" it sometime.

VarunaTT

I find it fascinating your hackles seem to be raised over my mild callout over your pretty gross statement, because "reacquaint yourself with your hand and be a good person" is not what I would consider perfectly polite.

short+sassy

I don't think he should have an affair, in secret.  But I do think he should have a discussion with his wife about the challenges that he is facing also.  If I were the wife, I think it would bring me some sadness.  But perhaps also mixed with some relief.  I wouldn't want my H to spend years of drudgery as just my caregiver.  I'd want him to stay with me, but not feel lonely and chained to me.

I didn't read this letter like some of you all did that it's just about sex.  It sounds like he is also missing the other physical and emotional components that typically make up a relationship.  And if he can occasionally have time with either a pro and/or a casual relationship to just be himself and feel cared for also, I don't see anything wrong with that if his wife understands it also.

VarunaTT

Hm.  I was being sarcastic, not actually suggesting anyone try it.  I would think that was obvious but since it was not, i will make it clear:

I think it's gross that comments about being selfish and masturbation were made about someone in obvious pain and anguish over an supremely unplanned for situation in life.

The rest of my first comment should still be good.

ETA:  I don't argue with people over tone vs. intent in writing, b/c it's impossible to control people's perceptions vs. my intent.  Which is why I didn't immediately say I wasn't attempting condescension.  B/c it will always seem like a kneejerk nu-unh, with no real way to prove it.

Ro041

VarunaTT said:

I find it fascinating your hackles seem to be raised over my mild callout over your pretty gross statement, because "reacquaint yourself with your hand and be a good person" is not what I would consider perfectly polite.

MY pretty gross statement? I said nothing of the sort. I said he sounded selfish and expressed sympathy for his wife. But ok....

ShesSoCold

I don't necessarily think that a loneliness in a failing marriage is the same as loneliness in a previously healthy (assuming) marriage where one partner now has a terminal illness. 

Yes, a lot has changed for LW and I do feel for him. My original comment didn't express that and it should have. I'm not trying to say he doesn't or shouldn't have feelings of loneliness.

But, IMHO, you don't get a pass on your vows and commitment because things aren't wonderful anymore. I don't think he gets to have his cake and eat it too, here. If he loves his wife and wants to be with her and care for her, he needs to do that. If that means therapy or hiring a caregiver or anything like that, fine.
If he doesn't, then he needs to divorce, find a facility for her, etc. Having a girlfriend and a dying wife just seems insensitive and disrespectful to his wife.

My childhood best friend's dad died when we were 18 after a long battle with lung cancer. He was in a hospital bed in the living room for months while his wife was in the bedroom with her boyfriend. So not only did he have to deal with the extremely painful thoughts of knowing he's not going to be at his kids' weddings or meet future grandchildren and that he's going to die, but he had to watch his wife of 30 years moving on before he was even gone. And I'd like to think that no matter what happens to my husband, I won't make him feel like that.

ETA - I also know someone who left an ailing spouse, but didn't divorce her so she could stay on his insurance until she passed. I'm struggling to word this correctly but I really applaud his honesty with her and with himself. 

VarunaTT

Ro041 said:

VarunaTT said:

I find it fascinating your hackles seem to be raised over my mild callout over your pretty gross statement, because "reacquaint yourself with your hand and be a good person" is not what I would consider perfectly polite.

MY pretty gross statement? I said nothing of the sort. I said he sounded selfish and expressed sympathy for his wife. But ok....

Apologies, yours was about getting his rocks off. 

ShesSoCold

Ro041 said:

VarunaTT said:

I find it fascinating your hackles seem to be raised over my mild callout over your pretty gross statement, because "reacquaint yourself with your hand and be a good person" is not what I would consider perfectly polite.

MY pretty gross statement? I said nothing of the sort. I said he sounded selfish and expressed sympathy for his wife. But ok....

Oh that was me, my comment. I admit it was insensitive. 

levioosa

I think this is an impossibly painful situation. There is no winning here. Either LW will feel lonely and trapped, or he will feel guilty and unable to truly enjoy a relationship. If his wife is no longer mentally able to communicate or critically think, that further complicates things since he can no longer have an honest discussion with her about their future. How incredibly lonely. It doesn't mean cheating is the answer, or that sacrificing his life to care for her is the answer. Taking care of a loved one is one of the most difficult things to do. It's not like any other patient. I do think trying to connect with a support group of spousal caregivers is a good first step, and talking about it with his wife is important if she is mentally able to process the issue. 

Jen4948

levioosa said:

I think this is an impossibly painful situation. There is no winning here. Either LW will feel lonely and trapped, or he will feel guilty and unable to truly enjoy a relationship. If his wife is no longer mentally able to communicate or critically think, that further complicates things since he can no longer have an honest discussion with her about their future. How incredibly lonely. It doesn't mean cheating is the answer, or that sacrificing his life to care for her is the answer. Taking care of a loved one is one of the most difficult things to do. It's not like any other patient. I do think trying to connect with a support group of spousal caregivers is a good first step, and talking about it with his wife is important if she is mentally able to process the issue. 

All of this. It should be totally reasonable and okay to feel sad and lonely when a loving relationship with a life partner becomes one of perpetual one-sided caregiving.

While it would not be appropriate for him to start a new relationship while his wife is still alive, he's entitled to feel a sense of loss of the old relationship with her and frustration that his own needs aren't being met. If he actually cheated on her during what's left of her lifetime in order to fulfill those needs, then yes, that would be selfish. But to call him "selfish" solely for admitting to having those feelings, while he does nothing else about them, would come off as cold and dismissive.

STARMOON44

I think he should talk to a social worker and eventually his wife. I don’t think his only reasonable options are stay in the marriage care for his wife never have sex or companionship or divorce. One of my friends mothers has Alzheimer’s. Got it at 60, was fully gone at 62. She’s 75 now and still in excellent physical health. Her father provides for her care, visits her, loves her, and lives with his girlfriend. Life is sad and hard and complicated and care givers deserve better than being told they are selfish for having needs. 

charlotte989875

STARMOON44 said:

I think he should talk to a social worker and eventually his wife. I don’t think his only reasonable options are stay in the marriage care for his wife never have sex or companionship or divorce. One of my friends mothers has Alzheimer’s. Got it at 60, was fully gone at 62. She’s 75 now and still in excellent physical health. Her father provides for her care, visits her, loves her, and lives with his girlfriend. Life is sad and hard and complicated and care givers deserve better than being told they are selfish for having needs. 

I agree with all of this. 

Also, we haven’t had a Prudie pop-off in a while. 

Casadena

charlotte989875 said:

STARMOON44 said:

I think he should talk to a social worker and eventually his wife. I don’t think his only reasonable options are stay in the marriage care for his wife never have sex or companionship or divorce. One of my friends mothers has Alzheimer’s. Got it at 60, was fully gone at 62. She’s 75 now and still in excellent physical health. Her father provides for her care, visits her, loves her, and lives with his girlfriend. Life is sad and hard and complicated and care givers deserve better than being told they are selfish for having needs. 

I agree with all of this. 

Also, we haven’t had a Prudie pop-off in a while. 

I second (or third?) all of this.  It's a heartbreaking situation and definitely not simple and we can only speculate about how hard it is unless we've been in pretty much the exact situation (which as far as I know, we have not but I could be wrong).  I think it's totally reasonable that LW is missing the sex and physical intimacy - that's a huge part of relationships IMO.  From the letter too, it sounds to me like he is or will be really missing the partnership and intellectual stimulation that comes with a marriage.  He's already acting as a caretaker and single parent - that's a huge adjustment from an equal partnership.  Also, I did not at all get the sense that he is thinking of leaving his wife or "outsourcing" her care in any way - he's just looking for advice on how to handle his feelings.  I think the social worker route or even a therapist would not be a bad idea for LW and their child.  This is a huge adjustment for everyone in the family and I don't think it's selfish or a betrayal of vows to be thinking about the parts of his relationship that have been turned upside down.

ShesSoCold

levioosa said:

I think this is an impossibly painful situation. There is no winning here. Either LW will feel lonely and trapped, or he will feel guilty and unable to truly enjoy a relationship. If his wife is no longer mentally able to communicate or critically think, that further complicates things since he can no longer have an honest discussion with her about their future. How incredibly lonely. It doesn't mean cheating is the answer, or that sacrificing his life to care for her is the answer. Taking care of a loved one is one of the most difficult things to do. It's not like any other patient. I do think trying to connect with a support group of spousal caregivers is a good first step, and talking about it with his wife is important if she is mentally able to process the issue. 

This is very well put, thank you. 

I was too harsh in my initial reaction and judgement of LW. I don't deny that he's in a terrible spot and that his feelings are valid. I'm learning that I'm prone to knee-jerk "get over it" reactions. 

MyNameIsNot

STARMOON44 said:

I think he should talk to a social worker and eventually his wife. I don’t think his only reasonable options are stay in the marriage care for his wife never have sex or companionship or divorce. One of my friends mothers has Alzheimer’s. Got it at 60, was fully gone at 62. She’s 75 now and still in excellent physical health. Her father provides for her care, visits her, loves her, and lives with his girlfriend. Life is sad and hard and complicated and care givers deserve better than being told they are selfish for having needs. 

Late to the party, but agree with this. I have a co-worker who was in a similar situation. His wife was diagnosed with early on-set Alzheimer's in her late 50's. Before she became incapacitated, they had some conversations about what that would mean in the long term, as she expected to be around physically for much longer than she would be mentally. 

When I met him, she was in her late 60's, living in a facility, while he was dating a long term girlfriend. At first blush, it seemed so selfish and callous. But as I got to know him and learned more about the situation I understood that it really was the best option. He visited her every day, and really loved his wife. But together they decided that it wasn't doing anyone any good for him to be lonely and sad. 

It's a sad, hard situation. He should talk to his wife, and they should together decide what this situation should look like from here. He doesn't deserve to be lonely for the rest of his wife, and it doesn't mean he has to leave her.