Your landlord gave them KEYS?!

mrsconn23

Dear Prudence,

Growing up, I had to be self-reliant—one parent worked evenings, and the other was emotionally abusive and eventually resorted to alcoholism. Fast-forward to today, and my parents and I have had a better relationship since we’ve lived in separate households. Because of a job transfer, I moved closer to my parents last month. There’s still a good 30-45-minute distance between our homes. The problem? I now find myself—at 40+—with a helicopter parent.

I find myself pestered with questions about if I’ve had something or another done yet, being told “you need to get XYZ done by a certain date,” or that my parents are coming over to help me unpack, do chores, etc. While I appreciate the help with moving, I have said at least a dozen times that I need to go through things myself and that I need the time and space to do so. Not only has this not been a deterrent, but it has led to more insistence that I need “help” to get things done. The apartment complex manager gave my parents the keys (I was out of town and they picked them up to “help”), and they made copies for themselves, so there are times when they’ve let themselves in when I am not home. Conversations obviously have not worked, counseling is not an option (as the parents see no problem and think any sort of counseling is a waste of time), and the apartment complex won’t let me change the locks. Moving again also isn’t an option—in addition to expense, I live in an area with very few options (and even fewer affordable ones). Help!

—New Helicopter Parent

banana468

Well, for starters you need to report the complex to the local housing board.  Tell them that in no uncertain terms that they gave the keys to people who are not on the lease and that is not only against your wishes it's a violation of the law.  Go back to the office and tell them that if they don't change the locks you'll be forced to take legal action.

And now be clear to your parents that while you appreciate your help you have this covered and you need them to stay out.  

charlotte989875

So I don’t think this is the apartment’s fault- if LW asked their parents to pick up the keys that’s on them, but parents should NEVER had made copies. 

Look, this is an issue you need to work out with your parents. If a conversation hasn’t worked, you need to have a clearer more specific one where you say “mom and dad you are not to let yourself in my apartment without my consent again”. You also need to stop tel them what you need to do so they can’t comment on how and when it’s getting done. 

Setting boundaries is HARD but seriously moving or changing locks isn’t the answer. You need to work this out with them. 

banana468

@charlotte989875 that's interesting.  My take was that they weren't authorized to get the keys but the complex gave them to the parents under the guise of helping and not realizing that they weren't on the lease. 

At this point if the answer is that the complex won't let them change the locks for free then I think she has to offer to pay for that to be done and cite a safety concern. 

climbingsingle

That's absolutely got to be a violation on the complex's part. They NEED to change your locks. They fucked up and gave people keys that don't live there.

I wonder if talking to the local police would help anything in getting the locks changed faster. 

And absolutely set boundaries with your parents. Limit contact. Don't share with them things that are going on in your life. 

STARMOON44

I think it sounds like the apartment complex was authorized to give the parents keys. Offer to pay to have the locks rekeyed and tell your parents they can either have a relationship with you or your keys but not both. 

VarunaTT

No, I would have a serious conversation with the management company.  That is not supposed to happen.  Even when I locked out K, my management company told me that if K came into the office, they would have to give them keys to get in.  I asked if they could send their mother (b/c I knew that's what K would do) and was told no, b/c mom isn't on the lease; no one can get keys except who is on the lease, to avoid situations exactly like that LW is going through.

Just b/c I'd want fast resolution, I'd pay to replace the keys and give the management company new copies, with strict instructions and probably a copy of the applicable city/state statutes and lease agreement again.

Then limit contact with parents to my schedule and ignore any other attempts.

STARMOON44

I mean my parents picked up my keys on move in day, with my permission, and it was completely not an issue. Obvi it hasn’t worked out well here but I don’t think we can conclude from this letter the complex was clearly wrong. 

banana468

STARMOON44 said:

I mean my parents picked up my keys on move in day, with my permission, and it was completely not an issue. Obvi it hasn’t worked out well here but I don’t think we can conclude from this letter the complex was clearly wrong. 

That may be true.  But if the LW is now demonstrating that this is become a safety issue the complex is going to need to work with them in the same way that they should be open to working with a tenant who is saying that they have an abusive former partner who has access. 

Casadena

This is not a safety issue, it's a parental annoyance issue. I also read as parents were "authorized" to pick up keys, but obviously we don't know for sure. They definitely shouldn't have made copies (isn't this why most keys like this have "do not copy" stamped all over them?) but they were able to. Tell the complex that and offer to pay for  a lock change. If they refuse I think this is a situation where you ask forgiveness, not permission, if you can't get your parents to stop. Just change the lock and door handle and give your place a copy of the new key.  That's what I would do at least. 

banana468

Casadena said:

This is not a safety issue, it's a parental annoyance issue. I also read as parents were "authorized" to pick up keys, but obviously we don't know for sure. They definitely shouldn't have made copies (isn't this why most keys like this have "do not copy" stamped all over them?) but they were able to. Tell the complex that and offer to pay for  a lock change. If they refuse I think this is a situation where you ask forgiveness, not permission, if you can't get your parents to stop. Just change the lock and door handle and give your place a copy of the new key.  That's what I would do at least. 

I don't agree (obviously).   This person is saying that her parents are letting themselves in when they're not at home and won't listen to requests to stop.

They are already engaging in not respecting boundaries and once grown adults tell you that they feel entitled to enter your space, that space ceases being your safe location.  

Casadena

banana468 said:

Casadena said:

This is not a safety issue, it's a parental annoyance issue. I also read as parents were "authorized" to pick up keys, but obviously we don't know for sure. They definitely shouldn't have made copies (isn't this why most keys like this have "do not copy" stamped all over them?) but they were able to. Tell the complex that and offer to pay for  a lock change. If they refuse I think this is a situation where you ask forgiveness, not permission, if you can't get your parents to stop. Just change the lock and door handle and give your place a copy of the new key.  That's what I would do at least. 

I don't agree (obviously).   This person is saying that her parents are letting themselves in when they're not at home and won't listen to requests to stop.

They are already engaging in not respecting boundaries and once grown adults tell you that they feel entitled to enter your space, that space ceases being your safe location.  

And that is not the landlords problem. It is LW's problem. 

banana468

Casadena said:

banana468 said:

Casadena said:

This is not a safety issue, it's a parental annoyance issue. I also read as parents were "authorized" to pick up keys, but obviously we don't know for sure. They definitely shouldn't have made copies (isn't this why most keys like this have "do not copy" stamped all over them?) but they were able to. Tell the complex that and offer to pay for  a lock change. If they refuse I think this is a situation where you ask forgiveness, not permission, if you can't get your parents to stop. Just change the lock and door handle and give your place a copy of the new key.  That's what I would do at least. 

I don't agree (obviously).   This person is saying that her parents are letting themselves in when they're not at home and won't listen to requests to stop.

They are already engaging in not respecting boundaries and once grown adults tell you that they feel entitled to enter your space, that space ceases being your safe location.  

And that is not the landlords problem. It is LW's problem. 

And there are solutions here that the LW and landlord can find.  But the landlord/complex has to be working with the LW rather than tell them no.  

If everyone tells the LW no then the LW is not safe.    And plenty of complex keys don't say "do not duplicate".  The only keys I've ever seen that said that were the keys to my college residence housing. 

Casadena

banana468 said:

Casadena said:

banana468 said:

Casadena said:

This is not a safety issue, it's a parental annoyance issue. I also read as parents were "authorized" to pick up keys, but obviously we don't know for sure. They definitely shouldn't have made copies (isn't this why most keys like this have "do not copy" stamped all over them?) but they were able to. Tell the complex that and offer to pay for  a lock change. If they refuse I think this is a situation where you ask forgiveness, not permission, if you can't get your parents to stop. Just change the lock and door handle and give your place a copy of the new key.  That's what I would do at least. 

I don't agree (obviously).   This person is saying that her parents are letting themselves in when they're not at home and won't listen to requests to stop.

They are already engaging in not respecting boundaries and once grown adults tell you that they feel entitled to enter your space, that space ceases being your safe location.  

And that is not the landlords problem. It is LW's problem. 

And there are solutions here that the LW and landlord can find.  But the landlord/complex has to be working with the LW rather than tell them no.  

If everyone tells the LW no then the LW is not safe.    And plenty of complex keys don't say "do not duplicate".  The only keys I've ever seen that said that were the keys to my college residence housing. 

Nothing in LW's letter suggests their safety is at risk. It suggests a complete lack of boundaries on the parents part, but that is not the same as being unsafe and is not the problem of the apartment complex. 

I do think it's annoying that the company won't change the locks, but if they won't, then LW should just do it, add some sort of lock, or move. Should they have to? of course not, but that still doesn't make it the company's problem (**all of this is assuming that it was arranged that the parents would pick up keys, if they handed them out in error without talking to LW, then sure, legal action of some kind would be appropriate)

banana468

Casadena said:

banana468 said:

Casadena said:

banana468 said:

Casadena said:

This is not a safety issue, it's a parental annoyance issue. I also read as parents were "authorized" to pick up keys, but obviously we don't know for sure. They definitely shouldn't have made copies (isn't this why most keys like this have "do not copy" stamped all over them?) but they were able to. Tell the complex that and offer to pay for  a lock change. If they refuse I think this is a situation where you ask forgiveness, not permission, if you can't get your parents to stop. Just change the lock and door handle and give your place a copy of the new key.  That's what I would do at least. 

I don't agree (obviously).   This person is saying that her parents are letting themselves in when they're not at home and won't listen to requests to stop.

They are already engaging in not respecting boundaries and once grown adults tell you that they feel entitled to enter your space, that space ceases being your safe location.  

And that is not the landlords problem. It is LW's problem. 

And there are solutions here that the LW and landlord can find.  But the landlord/complex has to be working with the LW rather than tell them no.  

If everyone tells the LW no then the LW is not safe.    And plenty of complex keys don't say "do not duplicate".  The only keys I've ever seen that said that were the keys to my college residence housing. 

Nothing in LW's letter suggests their safety is at risk. It suggests a complete lack of boundaries on the parents part, but that is not the same as being unsafe and is not the problem of the apartment complex. 

I do think it's annoying that the company won't change the locks, but if they won't, then LW should just do it, add some sort of lock, or move. Should they have to? of course not, but that still doesn't make it the company's problem (**all of this is assuming that it was arranged that the parents would pick up keys, if they handed them out in error without talking to LW, then sure, legal action of some kind would be appropriate)

I think we may have differing opinions of when safety is at risk.

If you let yourself into my home and into my things, I see that as putting my safety at risk even if it's done with the best of intentions.  It's a sign that you don't trust me to take care of myself and consequently will rearrange my space to suit your desires vs. my needs.  

Not all safety issues need to be life and death.

climbingsingle

If the apartment complex gave them keys without LW's prior approval, it absolutely is on THEM to fix it. That means changing her locks. 

If she gave the complex approval, that's on her. She should offer to pay for having the locks changed. 

And most apartments I've lived in, you cannot change the locks yourself. You can't just install new locks and give them a copy. You also are not allowed to add any additional locks to your door. 

banana468

climbingsingle said:

If the apartment complex gave them keys without LW's prior approval, it absolutely is on THEM to fix it. That means changing her locks. 

If she gave the complex approval, that's on her. She should offer to pay for having the locks changed. 

And most apartments I've lived in, you cannot change the locks yourself. You can't just install new locks and give them a copy. You also are not allowed to add any additional locks to your door. 

Also a good point.  If the LW doesn't have the skill set to manually do that themselves then they're likely not going to find a contractor who will do it due to legal issues. 

Casadena

totally agree if the apartment gave them keys and shouldn't have, it's on them to fix. But if they're saying no, there's not much LW can do other than change the door handle (it's not hard, i've done this at lots of apartments to add a lock to my bedroom door - keep the old one to replace before you leave). 

It's still not a safety issue from anything we read in the letter in my view. 

LW is in a shitty situation obviously - but if the apartment won't do anything then their options are limited to what they can do in the short term to stop it. Changing their own locks or moving seem to be the only options outside of legal action. Which honestly feels way overblown in my opinion, but LW could obviously go that route.

short+sassy

climbingsingle said:

If the apartment complex gave them keys without LW's prior approval, it absolutely is on THEM to fix it. That means changing her locks. 

If she gave the complex approval, that's on her. She should offer to pay for having the locks changed. 

And most apartments I've lived in, you cannot change the locks yourself. You can't just install new locks and give them a copy. You also are not allowed to add any additional locks to your door. 

Pretty much this.  That's a major piece the LW wasn't clear on.

I suspect when the LW says the "apartment complex won't let them change the locks", what the AC really said was "only we can change the locks and, we will, but it will cost you $XXX."  Or the LW is telling them he/she will be changing the locks and won't give them a copy.

Because ACs change locks all the time.  It wouldn't make any sense for them to say it won't be done.

Me personally, I even have a clause in my lease with the cost to change locks or if we have to let a tenant into their home, if they locked themselves out.  For locking themselves out, we will give them one of our extra keys for no charge if they come to our house to get it and then return the key later.

We just had to do this last month.  A tenant had a contentious break-up with her b/f (not a tenant) and he didn't return her key.  She was the one who gave him the key, so she was responsible for the changing lock charge, which she totally understood.

Edited to add: But if that tenant hadn't paid the fee, then her lock would not have been changed.  We also allow people to change the locks themselves, which would be cheaper for them, as long as they give us a copy of the key.  However, I understand an AC wouldn't want to have all kinds of different looking locks and why they wouldn't allow tenants to do it themselves.

mrsconn23

LW clearly needs to figure out their boundary issues with their parents.  If they greenlit the key pickup, then it's on LW, unfortunately.  I understand their landlord not being for changing the locks. 

Maybe LW could ask the landlord if they can set up an alarm system like simplisafe  (since it's not hardwired) and give landlord and maintenance the alarm code, so they can get in just fine if they need to, but advise no one else can have the code. The answer may still be 'no', but it's not as permanent as changing locks.  

I guess as a landlord, I wouldn't want a non-tenant having keys to my unit. Especially a key a non-tenant made on their own.  The unfortunate part of automation is that most keys are made in a machine kiosk and not by a person operating a machine and looking at the key before it's copied.  

Most importantly, LW needs to be more direct in their communication with their parents. If their parents are all, "did you do x, y, z?"  Don't explain why you haven't or that you need 'time' or what the hell ever.  If you know that they're gonna show up to your place if your answer is anything but 'yes' then effing say 'yes' and move on. Don't walk yourself into their trap. 

kerbohl

So .... you USED to have an emotionally abusive parent but they aren't anymore and you have a better relationship.  I don't think it got better, LW.  I smell that the abuse is continuing here, and I would treat it as such.  LW needs to point this out and cut ties with the parents and clearly state that their behaviour is unacceptable and if they want a relationship they need to change.  The next time you are there or they are at your place, take those copies of the keys back (don't warn them or they will make copies of copies) and I'd back off on the relationship until they get that what they are doing is wrong.  

if that doesn't work, options above for keeping the parents out and same thing - back off on the relationship until there is evidence of change.  

short+sassy

kerbohl said:

So .... you USED to have an emotionally abusive parent but they aren't anymore and you have a better relationship.  I don't think it got better, LW.  I smell that the abuse is continuing here, and I would treat it as such.  LW needs to point this out and cut ties with the parents and clearly state that their behaviour is unacceptable and if they want a relationship they need to change.  The next time you are there or they are at your place, take those copies of the keys back (don't warn them or they will make copies of copies) and I'd back off on the relationship until they get that what they are doing is wrong.  

if that doesn't work, options above for keeping the parents out and same thing - back off on the relationship until there is evidence of change.  

So true!  There has been a lot of focus on the keys, because that is the immediate problem.

But the biggest problem is the parents who are ignoring all of the LW's boundaries.

MyNameIsNot

I would lie and tell the apartment manager that the parents are dangerous to get them to change the locks. Or just change them myself and deal with the consequences. 

But I think LW's best next step is counselling. Not with the parents, alone. They need to figure out how to either set and enforce boundaries or cut ties. 

MesmrEwe

There's laws in the LW's area when it comes to rekeying a property even if it means paying for it to be done yourself which will be worth every penny...  Wouldn't be the first, won't be the last to have something like this happen...

ei34

LW you have a parent problem.  What happened can be read either way- if the landlord gave the parents the keys you have a landlord problem, and a parent problem since they made copies...if you authorized the landlord to give them the keys you have a parent problem since they made themselves a copy of the keys.  Either way it's a parent problem and echoing @charlotte989875 that a serious, final, CTJ  boundaries discussion needs to happen.