Interested to hear NEYers Opinions

trebmal

So I just got a Facebook message from a friend asking me to help her move this weekend as she's broken up with her boyfriend of 8 months.  Now that alone is sad enough, however, her reason was that he apparently told her that they will be"fine" but they're just not on the same page now as far as marriage and kids go but he feels they will be "eventually".  She's had a bad run of luck, as we all have, I think, and she says if he doesn't know after 8 months he won't "eventually" know and she wants to move on and try to find someone that has "no doubts".
Soooo, I have no clue what to tell her.  I'm not the best person to seek advice from, but, I don't want her to think I'm being rude and ignoring her.
So, my lovely NEYers, what say you?
Thanks ladies. 
PS Everything in quotes are directly from her email...

Wrkn925

If she's dead set on moving out, it's probably for the best.

I've never left a relationship and regretted it.

heyimbren

I really don't get it. It sounds to me like he wanted to let her off easy by saying it "could work out in the future" but not right now, when he really means "never" and he's hoping she'll just move on in the mean time.

I think I'd go and help her move and just let her vent.

trebmal

That's the thing though.  She's told me she "can imagine being with him forever and wants to have kids with him, but she thinks he should KNOW by now and doesn't want to waste her time".  (we are in our 30's and she's afraid of missing out on milestone things in life). 
She says she "can't imagine waking up without him and she'll be a hot mess for a long time, if she ever does get over him, but she just can't keep living with him and loving him more to have him bail on her later". 

Elle1036

I have a friend who just got out of a two-year relationship for very similar reasons.  She was ready to move forward; he wasn't; she was worried that he never would be.

In the weeks since the break up, she's gotten a lot more logical and positive about the whole thing.  Now she can see that their relationship was probably never meant to go all the way and, while she still loves him and misses him, she's happy for what they had and how things turned out.

As far as whether or not your friend made the right decision, I can't say.  That's really only up to her.  My friend definitely did, though.  Just tell her that you're proud of her for knowing what she wants in a relationship and having the spine to stick to it, and that you're always available to talk if she needs it. 

motoLyn

That is a tricky scenario.  8 months isn't that long, and the guy said that he just doesn't know now, but eventually will.  Its one of those situation that is up to the person.  Like the question, "How long do I wait?"  Well that's up to  you right.  I would tell her that 8 months isn't long, and if she doesn't want to wait a few more months to see how it shapes up then she really doesn't want to be with him in the long run.  Waiting 8 years yes that might be going no where.  There are guys out there, my fiance included that it took some time for him to be "there" on the same page.  She could break up with the current guy and find someone out there is ready but not right for her. 

I can see the fear of time passing by with nothing to show for it, but people need to let that go.  Its not a race.  Well at least that's my two cents. 

[Deleted User]

8 months is pretty fast to already want to be engaged IMO. Thinking "this is someone I could see myself ending up with" is reasonable, but already talking engagement?

I would simply comfort her. Break-ups are hard no matter why or how they happen. Tell her she'll meet someone whose life goals match up with hers eventually...and who knows, maybe this guy will eventually come back into the picture; just keep her heart open and maybe be a little more patient.

trebmal

Thanks girls.  I just don't know what to say to her.  He always seemed like such and up and up guy.  He was the one who brough up marriage first, but now it seems to me, via her facebook (yes, she is an over sharer, but that's another post), he was "having doubts" and is telling her he'll deal with them, and he wants to be with her "always" and she needs to "calm down" and they'll be "fine". 
I'm just worried her "fine" and his "fine" aren't the same.  She says she's told her her "fine" is married with kids, not a perma-girlfriend, so I asked her what he said to that and he said, "I know".

heyimbren

Some people know at 8 months, some people don't.

Either way, if that's the scenario and he broke up with her then I think it's good for her to move on. Space can sometimes be a very good thing, kind of like what Elle was saying.

trebmal

Good points, all of you, I'm just having a hard time with this, so I really appreciate all of this.  Kinda came out of nowhere so I don't know what to say. 
Bren, she broke up with him.  He asked her not to.  He asked her to stay, he said they'll be fine, just to "calm down" (not sure what that means, but that's the term he keeps using- according to her).  He's told her to just stop and not to push and that this behavior doesn't help him "get there" at all but she is SO scared of "messing things up again" she doesn't wanna waste time.

NurseyK

I've been there. In my experience, a man who isn't sure about the relationship is a man who isn't committed to moving forward. Staying in the relationship can only make her feel like she is waiting for nothing  and will put unnecessary pressure on the relationship. I think it's best to take some time apart. I might tell this friend to take some time to clear her head and also tell her evaluate how she feels after being without him for a couple of months. If after time she still sees her future with him, than giving him space will give him a chance to figure out if he wants to be with her. 

You're in a tough spot. You might find it easier to offer no advice and just be there as her should to lean on. Either way, be supportive of her decisions, even if you silently disagree. 

[Deleted User]

It sounds to me like your friend is questioning the timeline more than her actual relationship with this guy. If she is willing to give him up because she won't be married and having her first kiddo within a certain timeframe...then maybe she made the right decision here. I think a lot of women can get hung up on the "I want to be married and have kids before 30" thing. If this is where her head is at...she will have to meet someone who is in the exact same place. There's no room for waiting for a guy to "get there" if she needs  those things right now...

It would be sad to me if she gave up a potentially great relationship because she was rushing into the next phase just because she's over 30.

trebmal

I think you're right Nursey K.  I guess I just don't get why he'd tell her those things if he didn't mean it.  I mean he's been married, divorced, has a son with his ex, so why lead her on and tell her he wanted those things with her if he didn't knowing how painful all of that was for him why would he want to hurt someone else?  But then again, I don't get dudes, so I'm out on that one. 

trebmal

Allusive, that's ALL she talks about.  "I'm 32, I'm not a mother, I'm not married, I'm not even engaged, I'm a failure".
 I feel her pain, we are a lot alike in a lot of ways, but I think this was just SO hurtful for her to hear what he said and now she says he's telling her "calm down they'll be fine" but all she can hear is him saying "I don't know" when she asked him if they were on the same page as far as marriage and kids. 
According to her he said he will be and her reply was "I don't have 2 to 3 years to wait on you to love me as much as I love you" and he had no answer. 
Overall, she doesn't think he will "eventually" love her enough to marry her. 
She said she feels stupid because she thought they both wanted the same things, as they'd talked about it rather extensively and to find out he doesn't want that (right now anyway) crushed her dream and she hates the thought of starting all over. 

SassyFlats

Look, if she wants to leave, then let her leave. Be supportive of your friend. No need to lecture her. But like Wrkn said, I have never left a relationship and regretted it. Back in the day, several years ago, DH and I broke up for a while. We weren't on the same page, maturity-wise. He wasn't ready for the kind of commitment I needed. So, I broke up with him.

He realized that maybe he was ready for more than he thought, and if that meant going all or nothing in this relationship he was willing to go for it. He needed to lose me for a while to figure out what he really wanted and when he wanted it. I do not regret breaking up with him. I didn't do it to manipulate him, or to make him change his mind. I did it because as much as I loved him, I wanted more than he was willing to give at that time.

It took him a while to convince me that he figured things out, and that he wasn't just saying what I wanted to hear. I didn't want just a fun time. I wanted forever. I wanted to KNOW it was forever. When faced with forever with or without me... he realized I was it for him, and he needed to act that way.

We got back together after a few months (although it took him a few more years to propose... but at least I knew we were going down the same road together), and we've worked things through and are very happily married now.

I am not saying your friend's (ex) BF will do that. I don't know if he'll figure things out. But if he doesn't, then they weren't meant to be. And if your friend has decided she'd rather be with someone who KNOWS what they want, and isn't just content with hanging around, then that is her priority and good for her for realizing it. There is no point sticking around in a relationship that can't give you what you need. You can love someone and just not be right for each other.

I get the whole "it's not a race" sentiment, but unless this girl habitually leaves great guys after only a few months because they won't commit fast enough... then I don't see the problem in her figuring out her goals and seeking someone who KNOWS they have the same ones.

Blue & White

I think if I were already divorced with kids, I wouldn't jump on the bandwagon to get engaged after 8 months either.  And by "calm down", I imagine the now-ex is telling her to chill out and stop bugging him about engagement.  Girls can be psychotic sometimes.

That being said, your friend needs to realize that a "timeline" isn't going to help anyone in this situation.  If her "timeline" doesn't change, she'll have to get engaged 4 minutes after meeting the next guy.  There's nothing wrong with being an independent woman - heck, you can even have kids on your own these days.

NurseyK

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_interested-hear-neyers-opinions?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:136Discussion:ed7aae3c-efd3-4dc7-8b2f-fdc146cb1a01Post:bb4ba7c9-0123-4aaa-a676-c645cebfe5ec">Re: Interested to hear NEYers Opinions</a>:
[QUOTE] She said she feels stupid because she thought they both wanted the same things, as they'd talked about it rather extensively and to find out he doesn't want that (right now anyway) crushed her dream and <strong>she hates the thought of starting all over.</strong> 
Posted by trebmal[/QUOTE]<div>
</div><div>
</div><div>Well nobody wants to start all over. Break ups suck. For all she knows Mr. Right might be waiting patiently for her when all is said and done. Only time will tell. If it was me, I'd take her out for ice cream.

</div>

[Deleted User]

I think she just needs to realize that she has very specific needs in a relationship. If this guy is not able to be the person she wants...then she shouldn't waste any more time. I personally think he does have feelings for her (from what you've told us), but probably doesn't want to rush into anything given that things didn't work out for him in the past. He's probably nervous to hurt someone else...so rather than rushing into another marriage, he wants to take things slow.

Neither of them are wrong for feeling the way they feel. BUT, if she's unwilling to wait and he's unwilling to "dive in" - they should both split and hopefully meet someone else in the future who's a better fit for them. I think your friend realized this (as much as it hurt) and made the right decision. All you can do now is comfort her...

SassyFlats

Starting all over is hard to do. I thought I'd be married long ago with a couple of kids by now. I thought I'd be done birthing babies by the time I was 30, but it looks more like I'll become a mom for the FIRST time around 29-30. It wasn't how I thought my life would go. But sometimes it takes longer than you planned to find that one person who just fits right into your life and makes everything make sense.

That is tough to realize. It's tough to let go of your timelines in order to be truly happy. Be there for her. But she's not crazy for being upset over this. She wants something and she thought she'd have found it by now. Poor kid. But she'll be so much happier in the long run if she doesn't settle for someone who isn't sure that they want what she does.

trebmal

Thanks Blue and White, and Allusive, I am confused as well as to why she is hung up on what he said about "eventually".  To me, that would mean, if you really want to stay with him, marry him, have his kids, then that would be enough, yes?  I mean, not wait forever (years), but like, at the one year point (since they're already at over 8months), see where they are and what they're thinking. Is it wrong to tell her that?  I mean I am pretty sure they'd be fine if she'd "slow her roll" as I was told on here with my first few posts.  But he just bought a house, and wants her to move in there with him and they've made some major purchases together in the semi-short time they've been together, so I don't see why she can't focus on those things.  One thing I "think" I know about guys is that their financial independence is rather important to him and he's already shared a couple big-ish things with her as far as that goes.  Not to mention he's introduced her to his son and he's the son is already mentioning her being his step mom.  To me those are both really big things as I know his ex-wife (kind of) and I know he doesn't just introduce his kid to any random person.  I want to her to be able to be confident in their relationship but she's known me for a long time and she knows what I've been through and how I've reacted and, well, like I said, I'm not the best person to ask for advice from as much as I want to help her.  

trebmal

Thanks Sassy.  I feel so bad for her because she is hurting sooo badly but I really don't want her to just give up.  I mean, we are over 30 so meeting someone that you feel that strongly for isn't very common, but I am nervous that she'd be willing to walk away from it just because he isn't where she is right now, even though he's told her that he will be...
But, I spent 3.5 years hearing "eventually" and I fell for his nonsense everytime and I know how bad that hurt when I finally did leave and I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy let alone a girl I care about as a friend. 

cu97tiger

As other posters have said, if she doesn't have the patience to wait relationship out for awhile longer, it's totally up to her to leave, as long as she realizes that eight months is a short amount of time to expect someone to be ready to commit to forever.

I know what she's going through. I didn't meet my BF until I was 32, and didn't REALLY know he was the one until a year or so later. I thought I knew, but it wasn't until we'd been through some stuff that I realized I would fight for this relationship, and that we were both in it for the long hall. At this rate, we'll be engaged when I'm 35, married when I'm 36 and babies hopefully at 37 or 38. Being impatient because of her age will only push some good men away and keep her from enjoying the wonderful things she has in her life right now.

All that to say - comfort your friend, don't lecture her, but also don't let her wallow in the 'I'm 32 and not married' drama. It's self-destructive for your friend.

SassyFlats

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_interested-hear-neyers-opinions?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:136Discussion:ed7aae3c-efd3-4dc7-8b2f-fdc146cb1a01Post:4ecb36bb-490a-4b96-9d9d-23c618b6a486">Re: Interested to hear NEYers Opinions</a>:
[QUOTE]Thanks Blue and White, and Allusive, I am confused as well as to why she is hung up on what he said about "eventually".  To me, that would mean, if you really want to stay with him, marry him, have his kids, then that would be enough, yes?  I mean, not wait forever (years), but like, at the one year point (since they're already at over 8months), see where they are and what they're thinking. Is it wrong to tell her that?
Posted by trebmal[/QUOTE]

To me, if he knew he wanted to get married and have kids... he wouldn't say "eventually" they'd be on the same page. He'd say they ARE on the same page... but he's just not ready to pop the question yet and wants to take a little more time to <insert premarital goals here />.

Maybe they're not communicating well, but from what you have said here, I'd have a similar reaction to your friend- "you don't know NOW if you want to get married, but you think you might want to get married eventually... maybe? Okay... well... I'mma go find someone who knows they want marriage and kids because that is incredibly important to me."

peekaboo2011

I think at this point the best you can do is just be there for her.  She may really not want advice, just someone to talk to.  I know when FI and I fight, the best thing my BFF can do is let me scream about him and our fight and I'll eventually work it out, but she tells me when I'm going overboard.

I'm going to agree that taking her out for ice cream is a good idea.  Let her get it out.  I think you'll know when she's going overboard, and you can help her recognize that.  *hugs*

mandi921vh

If she thinks he should be ready after 8 months and he isn't then I think it's good they broke up. That there tells you they are not on the same page. Just be a supportive friend, and help her deal with her breakup. 

heyimbren

I totally misread that she broke up with him. If that's the case, then it doesn't sound to me like he's "putting it off" at all. It sounds like she's just pushing for it because of her age, and that isn't healthy in any relationship. He does want marriage and possibly kids at some point... yes? Generally speaking, with someone? He just isn't sure if she's that woman... Am I right?

If that is the case, then I'd just try to gently talk to her and ask questions about that. Try and prod her in the right direction, but it really is up to her.

calindi

trebmal - the girls all have good points, but what I would most suggest is to be a listening ear and not offer advice.  It can come back and bite you one way or the other.  If you tell her to give it more time and she ends up waiting and he decides he doesn't want to propose, it will be your fault that she wasted more time.  If you tell her that you support her decision to move out and that he probably would never know if he didn't know already, then she'll resent you down the line for being the person to 'convince' her to break up with the 'love of her life'.  Seriously, I may be a skeptic, but there's so many ways this can bite you in the butt!

Offer a sympathetic ear, and a lot of non-committal supportive comments.  That you'll support her no matter what she decides.  Offer no advice or suggestions or comments on what she should or shouldn't do.  She's clearly already made up her mind if she's moving out.

trebmal

Ok sassy. Im going to copy & paste your reply (He'd say they ARE on the same page... but he's just not ready to pop the question yet and wants to take a little more time" ) & ask what he said if she can really remember or if she was too emotional. And from what she's said about the marriage thing is that he's said THEY will be married. That he loves her more than he's ever loved anyone & it's her, always, again this all from her Facebook statuses over the course of their relationship so I could be putting too much clout in all that. We had a talk about them about a month and a half because she found out he was getting emails from match.com & looking at the emails to see the matches they sent him. She confronted him & he said he didn't actually log in to match.com just looked at the email out of curiosity & offered to show her his email & internet history but since then she's been scared he's looking for something better than her. So I think all that is playing a part too. I'm just concerned w/ this house deal. He's (they're?) supposed to move this weekend & as of 10:43 last night when I got the fb message, he wanted her to move w/ him but after his comment last week she's wondering if she should just move on her own since she's already packed up (they currently live together).

peekaboo2011

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_not-engaged-yet_interested-hear-neyers-opinions?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:136Discussion:ed7aae3c-efd3-4dc7-8b2f-fdc146cb1a01Post:1ddd1f5d-38f9-4f2d-9d4a-1988dc5e5a26">Re: Interested to hear NEYers Opinions</a>:
[QUOTE]Ok sassy. Im going to copy & paste your reply (He'd say they ARE on the same page... but he's just not ready to pop the question yet and wants to take a little more time" ) & ask what he said if she can really remember or if she was too emotional. And from what she's said about the marriage thing is that he's said THEY will be married. That he loves her more than he's ever loved anyone & it's her, always, again this all from her Facebook statuses over the course of their relationship so I could be putting too much clout in all that. We had a talk about them about a month and a half because <strong>she found out he was getting emails from match.com & looking at the emails to see the matches they sent him. She confronted him & he said he didn't actually log in to match.com just looked at the email out of curiosity & offered to show her his email & internet history but since then she's been scared he's looking for something better than her.</strong> So I think all that is playing a part too. I'm just concerned w/ this house deal. He's (they're?) supposed to move this weekend & as of 10:43 last night when I got the fb message, he wanted her to move w/ him but after his comment last week she's wondering if she should just move on her own since she's already packed up (they currently live together).
Posted by trebmal[/QUOTE]<div>
</div><div>This is SKETCH.  Match.com doesn't just randomly send you matches.  You have to log on to them to get matches.  And you don't do that just out of curiosity.  If I were her, I'd be out.  But this is a decision she needs to make on her own...I don't know what the terms of his divorce were, but if it were cheating, and he's on match.com now, I'd be seriously concerned.

</div>

SassyFlats

Don't push too hard on this. I know it's difficult, hon... I have two friends who just split up a couple months ago. I just found out the REAL reason they broke up- it wasn't because they're not great together... it's because "now isn't the right time."

I want so badly to talk to both of my friends and prod them and tell them that you don't have to BREAK UP just because now isn't the right time to get married because you're both working on your professional lives and school. Two busy people CAN be happy long-distance. DH and I did it for years! When you really love someone and they're IT, you CAN make it work if you just put in the effort.

But... I'm not in their relationship (even though I love each of them dearly). I don't know if they're REALLY right for each other, or if they love each other but aren't really IT. I can't make that call, and I shouldn't pressure them to get back together just because, in my outside point of view, they're wonderful together.

You can't make that call, either. Listen to your friend, offer your support no matter what her choice is. As Cate said- there are many ways pressing her could go wrong. Just be there for her.

trebmal

Good call calindi. I think I'll take that route because I dont want to be the cause of any more hurt. She's feeling overwhelmed I know. She lost her dream job due to the economy about a year ago so she's working random temp jobs to pay her bills. Her car broke down on new year's eve so she had to buy a different one (which he helped her finance b/c she couldn't do it alone based on her income) so her self esteem is in the crapper right now & has been for several months. I just don't want to see her lose one more thing in her life & make it all worse on herself. especially if there is no reason for her to.