How do we get a prenup?

Jessw3288

We agreed to a prenup, no issues there. But how do we now go about getting one? (without spending an outrageous amount in attorney fees)
Thank you any information is welcome

breaness

Unfortunately you are going to need to pay legal fees since a lawyer will need to draft it up. 

MyNameIsNot

You'll need a lawyer to do it for you.  There are downloadable ones on the internet, but they aren't very good, and often don't hold up.  

Contact your local bar for a referral.  It shouldn't cost a ton to draw up, and you can usually get a package deal and go ahead and do a will and living will at the same time.  

breaness

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_chit-chat_prenup?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding%20BoardsForum:14Discussion:11f475a8-1dc8-4efd-894f-cbe5fa6e8ac0Post:10dc8d15-a8c2-4cda-a99b-058710b38ed5">Re: How do we get a prenup?</a>:
[QUOTE]You'll need a lawyer to do it for you.  There are downloadable ones on the internet, but they aren't very good, and often don't hold up.   Contact your local bar for a referral.  It shouldn't cost a ton to draw up, and you can usually get a package deal and go ahead and <strong>do a will and living will at the same time.  </strong>
Posted by MyNameIsNot[/QUOTE]
I highly recommend this. My Uncle passed recently and he never had either. We had no idea what he wanted in terms of a funeral service (he avoided any and all conversations regarding his mortality even though he was diagnosed with terminal cancer) and well, let's just say not having a will brings out the worst in a family.

Jessw3288

I know we will need to pay legal fees but is there a way to go prepared with a draft or something to help speed up the process so the hourly doesn't get outrageous? But I guess if there is a package deal an hourly might not matter...

Does anyone know when the best time is to do this? My fiance lives in SC and wont be here until a week before the wedding. Wedding date is Oct 22, 2011 and I am in MI doing most of the planning so this also poses a problem. Bc of this a will and living will may have to be postponed.

Has anybody had bad experiences with lawyers and creating a prenup?

Also, it sucks that the Knot does not have more information on this. It is 2011 and there doesn't need to be anything negative about a prenup (vent )

Thank you all so much for your input!! So helpful already

AudgiePodge

I don't know about writing up a draft yourselves first, but you will need separate lawyers to work with. You can't have the same one represent you both.  We went through about 6 drafts with each lawyer before the final prenup.   It took about 8 hours worth of work for each lawyer with our prenup.

MyNameIsNot

This is typically something a lawyer would do for a flat fee, rather than an hourly rate.  At least, it is in my community.  When I do them, I meet with the client and explain the process, and then send them home with a questionaire.  They fill it out, I draft the document.  Then I give it to them so that they can review it and have the FI's attorney review it.  We make any necessary changes and execute it.  If it turns into a negotiation, I would bill hourly, but so long as it is "uncontested" it doesn't involve a ton of attorney time.  

You are going to need to each get seperate advice from your own lawyers, so that takes time.  Since you've got about 4 months to the wedding, I'd suggest going to see someone now.  You can always have your FI communicate about it from long distance, but this is not something you'll be able to get accomplished in the last week before the wedding.  

FutureJilliannD

Second that you will definately have to each get your own lawyer.

There are probably two reasons why TK doesn't have info on this. One, each state is different in terms of what should be included and the requirements. A community property state is vastly different than a separate property state. Two, a small segment of the population actually needs a prenup. We generally only recommend them in two situations. First, if the parties have significant assets on their own prior to the marriage. Second, if there are prior children or a prior marriage. But if it is something you are worried about, I would talk to a lawyer and determine what is at risk if you don't have one.

LuluP82

Yeah you'll need two lawyers. No reputable lawyer will just draft a prenup representing both of you at the same time.

A way to save time is to discuss things beforehand so you're both on the same page, and to not try to do anything outrageous or that doesn't belong on a prenup (for example, in the state where I passed the bar, you can't make child custody decisions in a prenup) so that the lawyers don't have to spend as much time on it and it wont' turn into a negotiation.

I don't practice family law or trusts and estates so I don't have a ton of advice on how to approach it, but you should get a referral and go from there. My dad and his wife were able to get a prenup done fairly quickly because they agreed to everything. The only "snag" was that they wanted the same lawyer, and my dad spent a day fighting with his lawyer (and then me and my H, also a lawyer) as we tried to explain that it's not ethical to represent two parties

This might be unpopular, but do you need a prenup? I always thought we'd get one, and we didn't, mostly because we both entered the marriage with similar amounts of savings, and no real estate or anything significant. So we didn't have anything that was really worth drafting a pre-nup over.

Also you can have a post-nup in some states, which is just as effective as a pre-nup. SOmething to think about if you're pressed for time (but make sure it's available and enforceable in  your state first).

LuluP82

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_chit-chat_prenup?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:14Discussion:11f475a8-1dc8-4efd-894f-cbe5fa6e8ac0Post:b8199da3-a5f8-4ee2-a0fc-5cfac095b93e">Re: How do we get a prenup?</a>:
[QUOTE]Second that you will definately have to each get your own lawyer. There are probably two reasons why TK doesn't have info on this. One, each state is different in terms of what should be included and the requirements. A community property state is vastly different than a separate property state. Two, a small segment of the population actually needs a prenup. We generally only recommend them in two situations. <strong>First, if the parties have significant assets on their own prior to the marriage. Second, if there are prior children or a prior marriage.</strong> But if it is something you are worried about, I would talk to a lawyer and determine what is at risk if you don't have one.
Posted by FutureJilliannD[/QUOTE]

Exactly why we didn't bother. And we're both lawyers and very practical people. It just doesn't make sense at some point.

marriedfilingjointly

You don't need to spend any money.  You just gotta holla "we want prenup, we want prenup, yeah."

Just kidding.  I agree with MyNameIsNot.  It's a flat-fee service around here, too.  It's not too outrageously expensive, and it's a good idea to go ahead and get a living will anyway. 

marriedfilingjointly

Oh, and this is a long shot, but if you happen to be a member of a credit union, ask if they offer prenup/other legal services at a discounted rate.  Our credit union partners with a law office to offer these types of services to their members. 

FutureJilliannD

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_chit-chat_prenup?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:14Discussion:11f475a8-1dc8-4efd-894f-cbe5fa6e8ac0Post:d1a42dc1-63a8-481c-acaa-2725a5398824">Re: How do we get a prenup?</a>:
[QUOTE]<strong>As an attorney, I'm very surprised that you wouldn't recommend that everyone get a prenup</strong>.  No one wants to think their marriage will fail, of course, but the best time to agree on how to split assets is when you are logical and thinking straight and aren't a big emotional mess.  It really has nothing to do with whether you have assets now or not.  It's about how you will financially split your assets if you do divorce.  Paying an attorney for a pre-nup is potentially a money saver as divorces can be drawn out and expensive. OP - Agree with PPs that you each need to have your own attorney.  And I wouldn't wait until a week before the wedding to sign it.  This is something I would get done asap.
Posted by jcbsjr[/QUOTE]

Yes divorce is expensive, but a prenup is only covering what you have prior to the marriage. Usually most people have significant marital assets, so you are going to fight about those, prenup or no. It is rare in our divorce cases where a prenup would have made any difference in terms of time or money. I have found that most people agree upon who owned what before they were married. And we have had divorce cases where the prenup takes care of premarital stuff, but the rest is still up for grabs.

marriedfilingjointly

Do some states mandate that assets be split equally in the case of divorce or something?  I know that in some states, if a spouse dies, it is very hard to get around spousal rights to survivorship even with a will or prenup, so I was wondering if it's the same way with divorce.  If so, I could see why couples with few assets and no children could forgo the prenup.

ETA:  nevermind, thanks Jillian. 

FutureJilliannD

Speaking very generally, because I am sure that not too many others are interested...Where I am, if you owned it before the marriage it is automatically yours. In general  it is an equal split after that unless there are some special circumstances which you must prove. So I think we are dealing with differences in the laws. That is why I also said that the reason TK doesn't offer info on this is because everywhere is so different.

LuluP82

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_chit-chat_prenup?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:14Discussion:11f475a8-1dc8-4efd-894f-cbe5fa6e8ac0Post:d1a42dc1-63a8-481c-acaa-2725a5398824">Re: How do we get a prenup?</a>:
[QUOTE]<strong>As an attorney, I'm very surprised that you wouldn't recommend that everyone get a prenup.</strong>  No one wants to think their marriage will fail, of course, but the best time to agree on how to split assets is when you are logical and thinking straight and aren't a big emotional mess.  It really has nothing to do with whether you have assets now or not.  It's about how you will financially split your assets if you do divorce.  Paying an attorney for a pre-nup is potentially a money saver as divorces can be drawn out and expensive. OP - Agree with PPs that you each need to have your own attorney.  And I wouldn't wait until a week before the wedding to sign it.  This is something I would get done asap.
Posted by jcbsjr[/QUOTE]

Until I took the bar in my state, I thought this too. Then I realized, it doesn't make sense for everyone. It varies a lot, state by state. No attorney is going to be comfortable recommending that everyone have a pre-nup, because in a lot of cases, it will make no difference in a divorce.

stacie+luciano

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-boards_chit-chat_prenup?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding BoardsForum:14Discussion:11f475a8-1dc8-4efd-894f-cbe5fa6e8ac0Post:dfb78084-ebc2-4235-8a73-02b0ec649aac">Re: How do we get a prenup?</a>:
[QUOTE]Do some states mandate that assets be split equally in the case of divorce or something?  I know that in some states, if a spouse dies, it is very hard to get around spousal rights to survivorship even with a will or prenup, so I was wondering if it's the same way with divorce.  If so, I could see why couples with few assets and no children could forgo the prenup. ETA:  nevermind, thanks Jillian. 
Posted by marriedfilingjointly[/QUOTE]

Texas is a 50/50 state from what I know, unless you agree at time of divorce on what each party gets (speaking from my brother's experience). I have no idea about pre-nups though :\. We aren't getting one because, like you, have equal savings and the house will be in our names (he had it first but my name is going on it soon), etc. etc.

hmcchesney

I didn't do a prenup so I'm not sure if they do this, but you can look it up. I did my wills through this company though, so I'm assuming they can do prenups.

I signed up with something called Prepaid Legal. They charge you a monthly fee, but it includes identity protection, wills, any lawyer fees covered in a trial. And I think for FI and me its $35 a month. And I think kids under a certain age are free. May be worth looking into.

em01092

If you want a prenup, do it sooner rather than later. The closer you wait til the wedding day, the more it will look to a judge like one of you coerced the other into getting it, should you ever need to use it. Also avoid frivolous things.   

I agree with the ladies about checking out your state's laws. If all you are worried about is what you had prior to the marriage, you may be ok without one. For example, if you keep a separate savings account or own property prior to the marriage, then your spouse might have no claim to those things,unless you put the money in a joint account or if you put his name on the deed to the house, stuff like that. But if you want to clarify salaries, property, and such after the marriage, then yeah, get one. I'm not sure how inheritance works. Like if your grandma leaves you a car (as in no mention of the spouse), I presume that car is totally yours, in most states. If you sold the car and put the money in a joint account, I would think your spouse has a claim. 

^All based on advice from one of my professors who is a lawyer and is the pre-law advisor at my college

elizajane519

My only advice is know what your assets and debts are before meeting with the attorney.  In Virginia you have to disclose your assets to the other party so they know what they are giving up.  You should have bank names, account numbers and approximate balances for all accounts, checking, saving, retirement, your pension benefit info, real property, annything of value you are bringing to the marriage and want to keep separate.