FI's daughter situation - sort of long...

hsbstone

Fi has a 13 y.o. who has been in the middle of an endless custody battle since she was five. Her mother is crazy and evil and had tried everything possible to keep her father away from her; I know that is extremely difficult for her to please her mother, but sometimes I am concerned that she is becoming inconsiderate with her father, because on top of trying to please her mother, she knows that her dad is very permissible and any "I love you dad" will calm him down. Right now, she is in her vacation along with her mother (they are at home, this is just a way that her mother legally found to keep her away from him for one month). He has called on the only phone available to contact his daughter-  her mother's cellular never answered - and after half dozen calls, she calls him once and leaves a 30 seconds message and that's it. It has been about three weeks since they had been together and quite frankly, I think that she is old enough to get on a phone and call her dad by herself. It drives me crazy, and I had complained with her many times before and implied that she was not doing right with her dad, and that she should not treat her parents differently because both deserve the same degree of respect and consideration. I never said one word against her mom, and she trust me to advice her whenever she has a problem at home. It breaks my heart seeing FI sad and disappointed because his daughter doesn't care to call him. Just whenever she has an agenda, exactly like her mother...and right now she has one because we are up to going on a cruise with our kids and  she is very excited with her very first international trip. I am almost excluding her from it, but I don't want to hurt FI or act like her "b...." mother! I'd appreciate your input and suggestion on how to better deal with this issue. Thanks ladies!

melissamc2

I think the main thing for you to remember here is that she IS a child.  Children don't think things through the way we do, they don't always consider everyone else's feeligns involved, and they rarely think of longterm consequences of their actions, particuarly emotional ones.

As you've said, she's been in the middle of something traumatic for most of her life.  To YOU this probably seems unstable and terrible.  To her it is normal.  While it is wonderful that you want to be a parental figure in her life and want to help her, while still a child, she is of an age where you may not been seen as such.  What transpires between she and her parents is between them.  It's your fiance's battle and getting TOO involved WILL backfire on you.  I can almost promise it.  I've seen it happen with a lot of people.  Good intentions can only go so far.  Be supportive.  Be kind.  Be loving.  Don't be intrusive, though.

I 'get" your thoughts on it all, but excluding her in ANY way from a family event will reflect badly on YOU and will cause more trouble.  Again, I need to stress that she's a CHILD.  You don't shut out kids.

My advice, as a Mother, is to do your best to include her, make it a fun event, and let her know that she is loved and welcomed in your home - but not at all pressured to be there unless she wants to be.  She's getting to an age where she'll have to make her own choices about her parents.  Just give her some room, and love, to do that based on what she sees and feels, not what she's told.

Good luck!  I think it's great that you care so much about your fiance's feelings.

right1thistime

You are not going to like my answer, because I totally and completely disagree with you. Fi has a 13 y.o. who has been in the middle of an endless custody battle since she was five.  - 13 y.o. girls are absolutely impossible to begin with- never mind the tragedy of being in the middle of battling parents for 8 years.  and after half dozen calls, she calls him once and leaves a 30 seconds message and that's it. This is about how much contact any 13 yr. old wants with her parents.  Honestly- he's lucky she called at all.  I think that she is old enough to get on a phone and call her dad by herself. It drives me crazy, and I had complained with her many times before and implied that she was not doing right with her dad, and that she should not treat her parents differently because both deserve the same degree of respect and consideration.   In my opinion- this is NONE of your concern.  If her father has an issue with his daughter - HE should address it.  You are not her step mom yet, and I would venture that your interference is NOT helping her interest in spending time with her father.  It breaks my heart seeing FI sad and disappointed because his daughter doesn't care to call him. Just whenever she has an agenda, exactly like her mother  Those are the most DANGEROUS words you can apply to this child "just like her mother".  That will do far more to alienate her from her father than any month long vacation.  I am almost excluding her from it, but I don't want to hurt FI or act like her "b...." mother! If your FI would even consider going along with you on this- he deserves to be abandoned by his daughter-- because he will have ceded his parental authority to you, and abandoned her. If the only reason you would consider NOT excluding her is to avoid hurting her father- then, in my opinion, this young lady is absolutely right to avoid you like the plague, you care not a whit about her.  In my opinion, I would guess YOU are at least some of the problem here.  If you are ever going to have a peaceful blended family, you all need some serious family counseling.  ~Donna

nmauser82

I had written out a long post last night but decided not to post it. I agree with right1thistime. If any of my dad's girfriends had had an attitude towards me like you just expressed, then I would have been distancing myself from him too.

I was that 13 year old girl whos parents were fighting over me. I can't begin to describe what it is like for a girl of that age to deal with a situation like this. When both of your parents are constantly bad mouthing each other, and manipulating each other (and you whether they realise it or not). When my dad brought home his first girlfriend I slammed my bedroom door in her face because I didn't know how to deal with the idea of another woman in his life. I was impossible as a 13 year old. moody, rude, and didn't want anything to do with my parents. I eventually grew out of it, mostly. I can't say that it didn't screw me up though, I still have issues to this day with trusting people.

So, my advice is to try and see things from her view and not pass judgment because unless you have been in her shoes you don't know what she is thinking and feeling. She is just as messed up about this as her dad. What she needs is space, love, respect, compassion, and boundaries.

hsbstone

I may not explained myself correctly but I can't do that much without been long once English, out of all the languages that I know, is not my best.
I want to clarify that Fi relationship with his daughter is still there because I stepped in from the beginning when I became the legal  supervisor demanded by her mother for their last custody battle - so far three out of 8 years of divorce. It was over 5 years ago, and ever since FI's daughter and I have a great relationship and she respects me a lot and take my words into consideration much than her own father's because I am not that permissible with her or my own son.
I am demanding and that's the way I was raised and have raised my kids with no problems: my two older sons are great, stable and well balanced young adults and are doing pretty well in their lives. And they will listen to me whenever I talk to them, and usually follow my advice at some point.
When FI's daughter started coming to my house, I set a beautiful decorated bedroom for her, bought her the brand name clothes that she wanted, organized birthday's and get together parties for her and her friends...all these things she doesn't have in her mother's house because her neighbors don't allow their kids going to her house because her mother...and they came to mine multiple times.

She has stated many times that she loves spending time with us, that she feels us like a family, that she knows  she always can count on me. She trusts me and know that if I call her attention is for her own good, because I care for her enough to allow her grow selfish and manipulative or evil. I know it's hard to behave differently when you have a bad behavior exemple right in front of you and it comes from a parent and she knows this as well - her own words by the way.
She has called me and introduced me as her stepmother from the beginning and if someone takes us for mother and daughter, she never corrects them. 

I pay  for her private ballet and soccer classes and for most of our travels - FI pays a very expensive child support and I try to spare him out of these expenses while keeping the things that we like to do in place.
His whole family supports the way I care for her and FI's own mother told me that I am a great influence upon her grand daughter and that she is way more well behaved when I am around without freeking out like she does with her mother.

So, in face of all these facts, I think I have plenty of room to talk to her about this or any other issue.

My question was just if I was being too hard on her, or if there was another way to deal with it because I know that FI is afraid of setting boundaires with his daughter and lose her like he lost his older daughter, completely alienated by her mother - and it started 7 years ago, when the old one was acting exactly like her mother - pshychologist words, not mine because I don't know her at all.
I never had to deal with a situation like that before because I have an excellent relationship with my ex and we both think that parental authority is not negotiable.

Thanks Melissa and Nmauser for getting right on the spot...I will think and probably follow your advices.
Right1thistime, you are completely out of line in some of your comments, but thanks for replying to the post.

AdelphiTN

Then I am quite confused. In light of all of this information, why would you consider excluding her from a family trip? Because she doesn't call? Did I mis-read?

right1thistime

So because a 13 y.o. has declared you to be her step mom- you claim the legal and moral rights of one?  If tomorrow she declares you an ogre and evil witch-- will we all next see you in Grimm's fairy tales?  13 y.o.s-especially girls-are as fickle as the wind. 
Do you think she will continue to respect you if you take "your" children on a "family" trip and exclude her? 

And for the life of me, I don't get what you spending money on her has to do with any of this.  You cannot BUY the right to parent a child.  I told you that you would not like my answers.  I've seen too many "step moms" come and go in my children's lives, each with their own viewpoint on what the children that I parent 99.5% of the time should be doing. ~Donna

hsbstone

My moral rights were well established when her mother requested my supervision legally - I didn't offer it - on her visitations with her father. She could request anyone's but she wanted mine because she knows that her daughter is attached to me.
I didn't have to do this, I could say no, but I accepted in order to help them all...I never had a major problem with my own kids and I was living pretty well without them. I just stepped in for the sake of them, not for my own sake.
I don't try buying a right that I already have with my own kids - it could be a case if I was not a mother already.
 

I believe in grounding a kid to make him learn something else.  Maybe it's a cultural kind of thing, but respect and honor(consideration) for a parent is the first commandment with a promise and I believe that it starts with little things like that.

To Right 1...:
"I've seen too many "step moms" come and go in my children's lives, each with their own viewpoint on what the children that I parent 99.5% of the time should be doing"
As I've stated before, I never had to deal with such situations before and I am trying to do help her not be inconsiderate or selfish. Never had been in any children's life before other than my own, and as I said before, I have no experience with girls as well and that's why I came here asking for advice.

Lisa8888

Why are you a legal supervisor in your FI's visits with his daughter? And is this your bad English or are you really legally appointed by a court to supervise his visits?  Why would the mother want you to supervise?

This whole issue is between your FI and his daughter. You honestly have no right to butt in the way you do. You have no right to tell his daughter anything. And you are wrong for constantly bashing this girl's mother.  Let your FI handle this. She is not your daughter.

AdelphiTN

Hey I believe in grounding too... at this moment, two of my four are grounded. I also demand respect... and get it. But excluding a step-child from a family trip (that she was previously invited to) is not a "little thing" - you would be ripping a hole in the family that would be difficult to repair.

She behaves around you, calls you step-mom, is attached to you - all your words. If I am understanding, you are upset that she doesn't telephone her dad.  I have not heard you tell any stories where she is overtly disrespectful to him or you.  If that's the case, then you are over-reacting.  You would be hard pressed to find 13 yr old girls who call dad just to chat, frankly.  This is fairly normal teenage behavior - probably in any culture.  My son only calls to ask if he can have a soda...lol.  Plus remember that she also may be getting pressure from mom to NOT call... she is certainly seeing that put forth as a behavior example by her mother. 

IMO, the problem here is between Mom and Dad and their communication issues. The child is caught in between and does not need punishment for this. A positive approach would work better. "Dad loved that you called."  And from dad, "Wow honey thank you for calling, I was just wondering what you are doing today."  No guilt for not calling sooner, no punishment for not calling enough. Encourage her to reach out, accept her joyfully when she does, and don't punish her when she finds it difficult to do so.

hsbstone

Great advice Adelphi, I appreciate your suggestion about a positive approach. Thanks!

MikesAngie

Adelphi!  Your advice was spot on.  Girls are tough, and at 13 they are confused about the childhood they're leaving and the adulthood they're facing without parental issues thrown in. Having battling parents creates another layer of drama for the child to work past/through/over/under to resolve who and how she wants to be. 

Positive reinforcement of good or favorable behaviors will win out over a child being shunned every time.