Future In Laws: Religion and Wedding Rant/Help

MeganAngela

Ok, ya'll.  I need some serious, serious help!

My FI and I are having troubles with FI's family, and we don't know what to do or where to draw the line.

1) Religion:  FI's family are born again Christians.  My family, while also Christian, is not of a traditional sect (Moravian for any of you who know about it).  Anywho, his family has always known this and this weekend at Thanksgiving FI's father told me that in the future that if I'm going to be a part of their family that I will have to start saying a blessing before meals on occasion.  I told him that I would be glad to recite the Moravian blessing for him as that is what I am and that is what makes me comfortable.  He told me on no uncertain terms that he'll tolerate none of that mess in his house and that I will have to start doing blessings like a proper Christian.  Needless to say, I am very adamant about respecting his traditions while not changing my own.  FI agrees with me, but we don't know whether I'm supposed to just suck it up and do what I'm uncomfortable with or whether FI should confront his family and tell them that I'm not to be asked to do something I feel uncomfortable with as far as religion is concerned.

Wedding:  I should start by saying that the future in laws have agreed to pay for nothing more than the rehearsal dinner, yet FI's mother is insisting on things being done her way outside of that.  She told me that she is excited to scout out rehearsal dinner venues and I told her not to get anything too big as we won't have many people coming.  She started listing who all should come and afterwards I told her that FI and I had mutually decided that we didn't want a wedding party.  She freaked out and was like, "YOU DON'T WANT (FI'S SISTER) TO BE YOUR BRIDESMAID?!?!".  Of course, she said this in front of FI's sister and I just politely told her that at this time that was our decision and that etiquette dictates that we not pick our party this early out anyway.  She later pulled FI aside and said, "You know that YOU get to make some of these decisions too, right?!".  And she was angered when he told her that he knew and that he agreed with me.  Then she insisted that we include his sister somehow so that we don't hurt her feelings.  I should state that his sister has never asked to be a part of things, and we're not including my own three siblings either.

She is also upset that we've asked to have a small friends and family only wedding.  She said that she had 150 people at her wedding and that she considered that small.  We're thinking more like 50-75 people and she made it very obvious that she doesn't agree with us on it.

Lastly, she insisted on throwing me a shower in the near future.  I told her thank you, but it wasn't necessary.  I feel uncomfortable having a girly shower as I'm not super traditional or girly.  She continued to insist.  However, FI and I had talked in the past that if we could pick, we'd love to have a His and Her shower.  Should I completely decline my FMIL's shower offer or ask her if she'd be willing to throw a His and Her shower instead of a traditional Bridal shower?  I don't know the etiquette on it.  I could broach the etiquette board if need be, but I thought I'd throw it in here.

From FI's point of view, he feels like his mother has always seen him as a "yes-man" and so she thought she could get away with meddling because she thought she could do it through him.  Instead, she's being told no and my FI is putting his foot down on her and she can't stand it.

I will say that FI has been handling things so well so far, but I know he feels like it is worthless because it never gets better and he is at his wit's end.  It's even to the point that he's said that if this type of behavior continues, he's going to not invite his entire family to the wedding because we don't need their stress on our day.

There is so much more, but I feel like this is enough for one post.  Probably too much, but I really needed to get this off my chest to uninvolved parties.  I'm sure ya'll understand that.

Any advice / similar stories?  I could really use, and my FI could really use, some reassurance right now.  Thanks!

redheadedgeek

Wow, that is a lot! You are right to stand your ground on the religion thing. It is unfair and disrespectful for your FIL to order you to do something that violates your own principles. I think there are customs that priorotize the woman's faith over the man's (I'm not religious & could be way wrong on this.) If that is correct and your FIL was unwilling to compromise, you could always try that argument. As for the MIL, you might consider throwing her a bone on something, whatever you find least obnoxious or uncomfortable. In other words, pick your battles. You will have to live with these people for a long time. Would having a shower be that terrible? I would find it much more upsetting to have someone force me to practice unwanted religious ceremonies or demand I put people in my wedding party.
Good luck with whatever you decided to do. It sounds like you are being placed in a very uncomfortable position.

virgincita

Do Moravians have saints? Because you are on the road to becoming one :-) in my opinion. You have handled the situation with grace that most of us on these boards could never hope to have. And thank goodness you have a fiance who is willing to stick up for you and his decisions. I have no doubt that you will have a happy and successful marriage.

I cannot entirely relate on the religion aspect, as me, my FI, and in-laws are all Catholic. But as a third party, I'm glad you stood your ground. Way to "nip it in the bud", so now, in the future when they're being pushy they won't be too surprised to find resistance. I admit I don't know anything about the Moravian faith, but if you're both Christian than I can imagine a generic, " Thank you Lord for this food. Amen" would work? I might be wrong though, so forgive me. I am NOT reccomending that you give in to his demands....just a suggetsion for the future if you feel like extending an olive branch.

I can relate on some of the rest of it....but that's because (as all the girls on this board know) I am as spineless as a worm. I also wanted a small friends and family only wedding. I've never enjoyed being the center of attention and I think the amount of money people spend on weddings these days is sickening. Did I get the small wedding? No. Because in my FI's culture weddings are a HUGE deal....and people come from different continents to go to them. Yea. I decided to not fight that battle. A "small" wedding for them is 500 people. We're having close to 200....and they think I got my way because, to them, that's small. But you go girl on having that small wedding :-) I'm happy that at least some of us get to have that!!

I also am not super girly and, like I said, don't like to be the center of attention. So I wasn't really comfortable with having showers. BUT, my FI and I just graudated from college and we're broke...and we had nothing. Not even a pot to cook on. My mom, who knows me and my shy ways, told me that I could deal with having a shower. "People know that you need stuff and they want to give it to you. Let them." So...I had not one, but TWO traditional showers. One here and one in the state my family lives in. Honestly, it wasn't that bad....a little uncomfortable, yes...but it warmed my heart to see all those ladies who came out (often from far away) to support me. If you already have stuff to live with (cooking, towels, etc.) then I say stand your ground and just don't have one. Or you can decline your MIL and host your own "house warming" party AFTER the wedding?

Once again, I commend your grace and tactfulness. I hope someday your in-laws realize what a gem you are.

MairePoppy

Your FIL was extremely disrespectful to you in regards to your religion. You should not just suck it up. Stand firm. Tell him you would be happy to share a Moravian prayer with the family, if they want you to lead the prayer before meals. They should sit quietly and listen respectfully as you do for their prayers. If he can't act like an open minded adult, he should ask someone else to lead the prayer.

As far as the RD and shower goes. If the FILs are hosting, they get to plan them. I see nothing wrong with suggesting that you would like a coed shower, but it is the host prerogative on whether they honor your suggestions. Just remember no one should be invited to those events unless they are also on the wedding guest list.

You and fi get to decide whether or not you will have a wedding party and who will be in it. If you want to include siblings in some other way, you could get them all corsages and boutonniere and have them lead the processional. Don't let your FMIL bully you.

I'm glad that your Fi is standing by you and that the two of you are presenting a united front. It may take some time for the ILs to catch on, though, because it sounds like they have been running the show for a very long time.

Good luck

sister2groom

OK, I'm protestant Christian but not Moravian. I googled the Moravian blessing, I think this is it.

Come, Lord Jesus, our guest to be
And bless these gifts
Bestowed by Thee.
And bless our loved ones everywhere,
And keep them in Your loving care.

I can understand being uncomfortable if he didn't believe in praying to saints or something and your prayer included something to saints, but what can possibly be controversial about this prayer, if you're a Christian? I mean, this is about as neutral a Christian prayer as they come. Maybe FIL has the wrong impression of the Moravian blessing. I say, invite ILs over and say the Moravian blessing over dinner, without identifying it as such,and see what happens. Or if that's kind of sneaky, recite the blessing to your ILs in a conversation, tell that what it is, and ask respectfully which part of it offends them?

zitiqueen

Vegas.

MeganAngela

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_moms-maids_future-laws-religion-wedding-ranthelp?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:357Discussion:0f828b6e-9b71-41fa-b0e2-73bec9f1d503Post:cdb84d09-abd3-45f6-8836-230ceae57a9e">Re: Future In Laws: Religion and Wedding Rant/Help</a>:
[QUOTE]OK, I'm protestant Christian but not Moravian. I googled the Moravian blessing, I think this is it. Come, Lord Jesus, our guest to be And bless these gifts Bestowed by Thee. And bless our loved ones everywhere, And keep them in Your loving care. I can understand being uncomfortable if he didn't believe in praying to saints or something and your prayer included something to saints, but what can possibly be controversial about this prayer, if you're a Christian? I mean, this is about as neutral a Christian prayer as they come. Maybe FIL has the wrong impression of the Moravian blessing. I say, invite ILs over and say the Moravian blessing over dinner, without identifying it as such,and see what happens. Or if that's kind of sneaky, recite the blessing to your ILs in a conversation, tell that what it is, and ask respectfully which part of it offends them?
Posted by sister2groom[/QUOTE]

<div>Haha, yep!  That's the blessing!  It's just a traditional blessing to be said before mealtimes.  My grandfather, who was also Moravian, did lead a more open-ended prayer where he said what he liked, but with my mother who I was raised with, we always said the Moravian blessing or took a quiet moment of silence.</div><div>
</div><div>I guess I should have wrote for those who don't know, the Moravian sect is really not that much different than most Protestant sects.  We get the same kind of preaching that you would find in any Methodist (which is what they are), Baptist, Presbyterian, etc. church.  The only differences we have are that we have things like Candle Teas and Love Feasts which are just fun little traditions.  We hang up "Moravian" stars at Christmas, which are really just North stars.  We have our own little blessing.  We are also, oddly enough, known for our cookies, which depending on where you are in the country, you would probably find at the supermarket over Christmas.  The religion has three large bases, if you will.  One is in Bethlehem, PA, the other in Winston-Salem, NC, and the last in Jamaica.  It's not a cult or anything.  Just a smaller sect than your traditional, commonly known ones. :)</div><div>
</div><div>I think that is why I was so bothered.  If you do a two second Google search, you will clearly see that it is pretty much the same as every other Protestant Christian sect.  It surprised me more because his parents told me that one time their Methodist church tried to co-op a Moravian Love Feast.  That actually bothered me because the church attempted it and did it wrong, but the point is that they attempted to do something from my sect in their own church and had no problem with it then.</div><div>
</div><div>This just made me think of another question.  At the rehearsal dinner, who should say the prayer?  His family or mine?  What about at the reception?  Should his family say it at the rehearsal dinner and mine at the reception since that is who is paying for what?  His family is the holding hands and saying a prayer kind, while mine is decidedly not.  While my family won't take offense to their way of doing things, when it comes time to do our blessing, I know my family would be offended if his family chose not to play along.  I don't know.  Like I said, this is just all a big mess.  :(</div>

MeganAngela

Ok, so I do know that the FIL's get to plan what they pay for.  When I suggested for my FMIL to not get a large venue it was because I knew there wouldn't be a lot of people there, but also because I know his family doesn't have a lot of money and I'd hate for them to plan something extravagant for a handful of people and then have something to gripe about later.  However, like everyone said, if they want to plan a big rehearsal dinner, that is their prerogative.  I still won't invite people there who don't need to be there from my side, but it is their money and it is up to them.

And as far as the shower goes, I think I'll agree to it and not invite anyone.  She can invite the women from her family and my mother and grandmother and leave it at that.  My mother has expressed interest in maybe throwing a His and Hers shower for us, and we could both invite our friends and my family to that one.  I know that guest list overlaps for showers is a no-no and seems gift grabby, so I won't double invite (except I'd invite my FI's mother and sister to the one my mom throws just because it is the right and nice thing to do).  Although, if I wanted to have a few friends for support at my FMIL's shower, could I let them know that they would be invited to both and while a present isn't expected in either occasion, that if they wanted to bring one they should bring it ONLY to the FMIL's shower?  I feel that my FMIL would be more offended if my friends showed up to her shower sans gifts, but brought them to my mother's.  Then again, FI and I are worried that if my mother throws a separate shower that my FMIL would be offended and throw a fit.  I know the etiquette on showers, but this is such a strange situation that I don't know how to handle it.

In the end, all of this hurts my FI more than me.  He sees my mother be very much like, "This is your day and I'll help accommodate your wishes and dreams because you deserve it." and his mother be very much like, "This is OUR day and we have our own dreams for how it should be and we'll complain about it even if we aren't paying for it!".  And while he stands up to his family spectacularly, there are nights where he gets close to tears (he's a softy!) because of the way his family is acting and how rude they are being.  It hurts me to see him so hurt by his family this way.  I know that, for me, this situation has made me love and appreciate my own family so much more and it has brought my FI closer to them.

Thank you everyone for all your responses.  They have really helped to soothe my heart.  If you have more advice or stories, please, keep them coming!  I've been updating my FI on the responses, and I know they are making him feel better about the situation, as well.  

cmwekwert

Wow, I would definitely stand my ground on the religion thing, but then again, I changed mine. I am not christian and although I do bristle when someone makes a direct slam on my religion, I also recognize that most of the people I come in contact with are, in fact, Christians of some denomination. My FI is was Christian but doesn't practice and has also started participating in my religion. Most of our family is, however, Christian, which could potentially pose a problem if we wanted to honor one faith over the other.

 Thats why we are choosing to go a non-religious route. There are some traditional elements, but thats about it.

Let me tell you though, I really got riled up at the "not in my house" part. He deserves a kick right in his religious... well, you know... Good luck, and please let us know how it goes!

MeganAngela

In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/special-topic-wedding-boards_moms-maids_future-laws-religion-wedding-ranthelp?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Special%20Topic%20Wedding%20BoardsForum:357Discussion:0f828b6e-9b71-41fa-b0e2-73bec9f1d503Post:6ff7f7f7-f4d5-4d5c-b06a-3bd1ebf5dcdd">Re: Future In Laws: Religion and Wedding Rant/Help</a>:
[QUOTE]MeganAngela....to follow up on what ziti suggested....Gatlinburg is closer than Vegas....and you can elope to a beautiful mountain sunrise wedding if it comes to that..... Are you near W/S? I'm in Johnston County but spend a lot of time in Greensboro.
Posted by RetreadBride[/QUOTE]
I grew up in Johnston County!  But, no.  I'm not near W/S.  That is where all of my family minus my mother lives, though!  She's in Wake.  I'm in Lee County right now.<div>
</div><div>And, oh, man.  I love Gatlinburg!  It is so beautiful!  I was there a few years ago in March and it snowed while I was there.  I want to go back so bad!  Thanks for stirring up all those great memories!  Haha!</div><div>
</div><div>Do they have the kind of quickie chapels that Vegas has or is it more like a destination wedding/honeymoon?  I don't know if we'd ever elope....but, I like having the info all the same!  You know, just in case! ;)</div>

SSaltzman87

First, I'm glad your FI isn't giving into your FMIL's demands and standing his ground. Good for him!

You should NOT have to meet the religious expectations that your FFIL is setting, that's just disrespectful and really quite ignorant since it's not a secret what your family's religious affiliation is. You might just have to REALLY limit your time with them if this is how they're going to handle it. I wouldn't expect them to 'come around' with the attitude they're having.

FWIW, my mother is Catholic and my father is Jewish. They've been married for 30+ years.

The FMIL is digging her own grave with her attitude as well. She's committing every faux pas that these boards strongly say you don't do. I guess the solution with her is to limit your wedding talk with her since it's clear she doesn't see eye to eye and won't compromise.

I really wish you the best of luck!

graysquirrel

That sounds like an absolute nightmare! I hate it when supposed Christians act like that. It makes the rest of us look like closed minded jerks. 

Does your FI's family understand your faith at all? Has anyone ever explained the basics of it to them? As someone who grew up in a very christian household, that sounds like a perfectly acceptable prayer. And isn't God supposed to judge what a good prayer is? Good grief.

I say good for you for sticking to your guns. They're just going to have to get used to your beliefs, end of story. My parents were not originally happy with my choice of FI because of his beliefs, but they've grown to accept him over time. I hope that they can do the same for you.

As for the shower thing, I agree with pp and would say pick your battles. You're dealing with a family that is a little hostile sounding. If it were me, I'd just accept the offer and grit my teeth. At least this way FMIL feels good about it all and wont have any more fodder against you. Just make sure that she only invites people who are on your guest list. I'd let them host an RD if they want, as well. If you don't have to pay for it, then it is one way to ingratiate yourself with the family. 

ravensbride49

Jumping off what Graysquirrel said, have you ever sat down with them to discuss the differences in beliefs? I may be a total hypocrite by saying this, since I don't have the balls to do it myself (FMIL is culturally Catholic, i.e doesn't necessarily practice her religion-- notice I said, religion, not faith, yet she has major issues that I am a practicing Protestant, apparently dragging her son to the depths of hell with me, since he and I mutually decided to marry in my home church, which is a UMC, and find a Protestant home church... but I digress...) but you seem to have the fortitude to broach the subject.

"FFIL-- it seems there is some apprehension about the specific denomination of Christianity to which I adhere, so I wanted to clear the air.... Here is what I believe...." Or, even better, put the ball in HIS court "What are your concerns with the way I commune with God? I'd love to ease them for you, or at least understand them."

As someone who takes her personal relationship with God/spiritual identity to heart, I feel for you. Perhaps I'll take my own advice (which was actually given to me by my mom), but in the meantime, I feel like it could go a long way in bridging the gap between you and your FILs if you have an open discussion about ways you differ in your walks with God and, more importantly, ways in which you are similar.