October 2012 Weddings

Kick MOH out?? HELP!

Alright, I am going to break down and get some outside opinions on this, and it is also pretty personal and embarrassing, so it’s hard. My sister and I have NEVER gotten along. We are 4 years apart, me being the oldest, and we just were in different phases of life all the time. Since she was 12 or 13 she has been in and out of trouble with drugs. This has gone on for over 9 years now. When I say trouble I mean juvey, drug/alcohol abuse places, rehab, and real jail recently. She moved away for a year and came back about 6 months ago. She was doing really well and I know it would mean everything to my mom that she is my MOH…so I made her my MOH, which was huge for me, but with the contingency that she not do drugs again or I would kick her out. I didn’t want her in my wedding at all, but wanted to try and not regret it later in life if we ever became close. So, she was clean for about 2.5 months, and then got back into the hardcore drugs again. I told her she was no longer my MOH when she was arrested for drugs. She got back on them again, went to jail again, and continued staying on them until just recently when I started looking at BM dresses and told her that she is not invited. She is now in a rehab place, which is a voluntary place…but she was told by my parents she would be kicked out if she didn’t go. So, she is there willingly…but unwillingly really. My mom basically told me if she is not my MOH she will not come to my wedding. My fiancé wants nothing to do with her, my friends can’t stand her. My best friend, and BM, asked her about the bachelorette party and it was things that my sister wanted to do nothing I would like to do. She can’t afford to even help pay for her dress, the bridal shower, or the bachelorette party…anything, she has no job.  I feel this is all about her having the “glory” of saying she was my MOH, not that she really cares or wants to support me. What do I do? Do I have her in the wedding with another contingency she stays clean or kick her out? I figured this would be my last attempt, but I have said this over 5 times now..this is the last time, no this is the last time, okay...one more time. So I know she isnt going to take me seriously, b/c she know I will cave again to please my mom. I talked to her counselor and he isnt very hopeful for her. Sad, huh? I was going to tell her that she had to get a job and pay for her dress herself and the next time she gets high..ON ANYTHING...she is out. I know etiquette says you can’t do that…but I am not having her high at any of my parties and especially not at my wedding embarrassing me. Yes, this is something she would do. HELP!
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Re: Kick MOH out?? HELP!

  • Addiction is a disease and you need to try your hardest to remember that. Although you have not always gotten along, most likely because of the substance abuse she is your sister. When she is clean do you have fun - and love her. I think that it shouldn't be viewed as punishment, she probably beats herself up enough about the situation she has put her in. I would say that you have open communication tell her you love her and you are happy that she is getting help and you want her to be included in your day - However if you are using on my wedding day I can't have you invoved.

  • edited April 2012
    It is definitely a disease..and I am supporting her. I have gone to see her and talked to her counselor and group counselor. I cant tell her I love her, just not me or what I do...but by me supporting, I think that is showing that I care and want her to get better. I just dont know when enough is enough. She is my sister, but like I said...we NEVER got along. Even when we were younger, weird I know. When she was off for the 2 months she was nice to be around and I was really trying. I just dont know how she is going to help with these functions when she is trying to help herself. She cant afford them either, and I only have 2 BM's, not including her, and I dont expect them to pay for everything. I want to chip in...but they keep telling me no. Its just hard...its to the point where it is affecting FI and I, and our relationship. 
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  • As much as you can support her, a disorganized MOH that can't afford to participate and isn't reliable at all is not a good combination. I say to continue to support her sobriety and not feed into her addiction. But you also don't have to have her be in your wedding, especially not as MOH. It's too risky and you don't want her to have a situation on your big day or any other day leading up to it.
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  • edited April 2012
    I understand what you're going through is very hard and it sucks. With that being said, I wouldn't kick your sister out. It can be a relationship ending move and it seems you guys are already struggling. All that is required of a MoH/BM is to buy a dress and be there the day of the adding to stand by you. So, she ultimately makes the decision. If she can buy the dress, good.if she doesn't get it, then she's not in the WP. Also, bridal showers and bachelorette parties are not required. Is there anyway you could forego them because it seems like money is a struggle for you BP? I understand you want a MOH who helps, but she isn't responsible for paying for these parties if she can't. That's just my 2 cents!
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  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-club-boards_october-2012-weddings_kick-moh-out-help?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding Club BoardsForum:56b9bcef-1e34-456e-81f5-cfaa107456b2Discussion:e80a8277-9224-4ccc-9d0f-f90c5b0c11e7Post:13eedcdb-7a48-4316-880a-cca6420eea03">Re: Kick MOH out?? HELP!</a>:
    [QUOTE]It is definitely a disease..and I am supporting her. I have gone to see her and talked to her counselor and group counselor. I cant tell her I love her, just not me or what I do...but by me supporting, I think that is showing that I care and want her to get better. I just dont know when enough is enough. She is my sister, but like I said...we NEVER got along. Even when we were younger, weird I know. When she was off for the 2 months she was nice to be around and I was really trying. I just dont know how she is going to help with these functions when she is trying to help herself. She cant afford them either, and I only have 2 BM's, not including her, and I dont expect them to pay for everything. I want to chip in...but they keep telling me no. Its just hard...its to the point where it is affecting FI and I, and our relationship. 
    Posted by
    fishinflagrl[/QUOTE]



    I don't think, though, that the biggest issue here is whether her not she would make a good MOH. Her addiction is a bigger issue than the wedding, so only focusing on how she'll be on the wedding day shouldn't be an issue. Because in the end, she's Fishin's sister, not just a MOH.

    Bring in the adding might be something for her to look forward to.
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  • The shower I could care less about...but I would like to go out with my girls. Its just hard to put so much on them while my sister gets out of it like she has her entire life. Yet she will be the first to buy the most expensive drink on my tab. So really base it off if she is going to pay for the dress or not. I figured it would be a great goal for her.
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  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-club-boards_october-2012-weddings_kick-moh-out-help?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding Club BoardsForum:56b9bcef-1e34-456e-81f5-cfaa107456b2Discussion:e80a8277-9224-4ccc-9d0f-f90c5b0c11e7Post:7b11d928-da47-4080-b8f7-a9a518aeeed6">Re: Kick MOH out?? HELP!</a>:
    [QUOTE]The shower I could care less about...but I would like to go out with my girls. Its just hard to put so much on them while my sister gets out of it like she has her entire life. Yet she will be the first to buy the most expensive drink on my tab. So really base it off if she is going to pay for the dress or not. I figured it would be a great goal for her.
    Posted by fishinflagrl[/QUOTE]




    Maybe you could just plan a night out with you and your girls and not call it a bachelorette party? Or if they are planning one, I assume they're only paying for you, so if she can't afford it, she can't go.

    But, yes, if she doesn't get the dress, she automatically excludes herself from the wedding. Or, if she can't, you could buy it for her, but I know you probably don't want to do that.

    I feel your frustration, and it sounds like you're being a good sister.
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  • I know that drug addiction is a disease,I study it in the lab (I'm a scientist) and I I have a family friend who's daughter struggles with addiction.  I think the major thing to remember when dealing with an addict is that they have to understand that there are consequences to their actions.  Yes, sometimes they can't help falling back into drug seeking behavior but at the same time they need to use the potential consequences as motivation not to go back there.  Our family friend's daughter has nearly killed herself, has stolen money, etc  and for the longest time the family kept giving her money and allowing her to live in their home.  Unfortunately, insurance companies don't pay for a long enough rehab (her insurance only pays for 30 days, and she really needs like 6 months of intensive rehab).  The family has met with many counselors and therapists, and they all say the same thing.  When she is using drugs, do not give her money and do not let her live in your home.  Let her be homeless and understand what happens when she is using drugs and has no money. Let her know that her family supports her but cannot support or enable this behavior. It's been very difficult to for my friend to see her daughter living in a homeless shelter, but it's what needed to be done while she is using drugs.  When she gets clean and commits to rehab, she will be welcomed home with love and support. 

    I would never say to kick a bridesmaid out, but you have given her many chances to get herself together.  You can't keep giving her more chances and not follow through with the consequences.  I would give her 1 more try and really explain to her (and your mother) that if she doesn't get clean, she will not be in your wedding and you mean it this time. 

    I also agree with Brittney that all a BM has to do is to buy a dress and show up.  I don't expect my BMs to pay for my shower, etc b/c they are all students and cannot afford it.  My family and FI's family are getting together to throw me a shower.
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  • If it were me I would talk to her about focusing on herself and not worry about the wedding.  See if she's ok with not being MOH but a BM instead.  Tell her you'd love for her to be part of it, but that your understanding of her situation.  Maybe try to have a talk with her and get her to bow out herself? 

    I'm not really one to agree with kicking someone out of your wedding party, but I get this.  I'm sorry you have to deal with this.  I hope for yours and your families sake that she gets better!

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  • edited April 2012
    It is very hard to be a good sister right now, especially after 9 years of dealing with this on and off. She is my sister, but I feel like there is no relationship. When she moved away we had no communication, nor did she make an effort...but neither did I. My mom was calm, my mom and I finally got along, and it was just a great feeling knowing she isnt going to steal anything from our houses. I do feel like the worst person in the world for not "loving" her the way most sisters do and trying harder...but I am just not that kind of person.

    I was actually going to pay for her dress and have her pay my the money, and in the end I was even going to give it back to her. I just dont know how many chances I want to give her. I know she mentally isnt there, but its hard to deal with an addict who constantly wants attention when you are planning your wedding. I almost feel she does it when my mom pays more attention to me about the wedding. I know...I am creating so many excuses to hate her and kick her out.

    Ultimately, I will never know now if I will later regret having her in the wedding or if I will regret not having her in the wedding.
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  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-club-boards_october-2012-weddings_kick-moh-out-help?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding Club BoardsForum:56b9bcef-1e34-456e-81f5-cfaa107456b2Discussion:e80a8277-9224-4ccc-9d0f-f90c5b0c11e7Post:5a1c28cd-3416-4daa-aa61-fb791f4a28b3">Re: Kick MOH out?? HELP!</a>:
    [QUOTE]If it were me I would talk to her about focusing on herself and not worry about the wedding.  See if she's ok with not being MOH but a BM instead.  Tell her you'd love for her to be part of it, but that your understanding of her situation.  Maybe try to have a talk with her and get her to bow out herself?  I'm not really one to agree with kicking someone out of your wedding party, but I get this.  I'm sorry you have to deal with this.  I hope for yours and your families sake that she gets better!
    Posted by Seipel12[/QUOTE]



    The thing with demoting though, is that it can also end relationships. Your MOH should be someone you care about, not the person who helps the most, so why demote her?
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  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-club-boards_october-2012-weddings_kick-moh-out-help?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding Club BoardsForum:56b9bcef-1e34-456e-81f5-cfaa107456b2Discussion:e80a8277-9224-4ccc-9d0f-f90c5b0c11e7Post:b28c83e7-148b-4317-8791-d4927732c035">Re: Kick MOH out?? HELP!</a>:
    [QUOTE]It is very hard to be a good sister right now, especially after 9 years of dealing with this on and off. She is my sister, but I feel like there is no relationship. When she moved away we had no communication, nor did she make an effort...but neither did I. My mom was calm, my mom and I finally got along, and it was just a great feeling knowing she isnt going to steal anything from our houses. I do feel like the worst person in the world for not "loving" her the way most sisters do and trying harder...but I am just not that kind of person. I was actually going to pay for her dress and have her pay my the money, and in the end I was even going to give it back to her. I just dont know how many chances I want to give her. I know she mentally isnt there, but its hard to deal with an addict who constantly wants attention when you are planning your
    wedding. I almost feel she does it when my mom pays more attention to me about the wedding. I know...I am creating so many excuses to hate her and kick her out. Ultimately,
    I will never know now if I will later regret having her in the wedding or if I will regret not having her in the wedding.
    Posted by fishinflagrl[/QUOTE]



    I think either way, it will not ruin your wedding. In the end, you'll be married to your FI and that's all that matters. I think kicking her out will strain the relationship even more, and possibly create more tension with your mom, who you say you're finally get along with. Had you asked this before you asked her, I would have advised you to not have her be a MOH, but what's done is done. I suggest keeping her in the wedding, and I think, no matter what, you'll remember your wedding as a great day.
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  • I care more about my friends who are there for me. My sister went to a friends house b/c she was in a bad mood the day I asked her to come up to see "The Dress". I asked her once more and she said she was coming but then didnt have gas to make it to the place. My mom gave her money and she went and bought drugs instead. The nights I have asked her to come help me with things for the wedding she said she had to work later I found out she was with her friends and lost her job.

    Nic - my mom has a huge problem with enabling. I have begged her to stop giving her money and stop letting her stay at their house b/c she stole over $2,000 in 2 weeks from them...and pawned my dad's (a mechanic) tools to get more money. My parents told me that they can no longer help pay for the wedding b/c of how much she has stolen...they will try but probably like the cake where as they were paying for the reception before. You are definitely right about insurance not giving them enough time. Her counselor said she needs to be in something for at least for a year...and small steps to recovery. She will be there for 35 days and gets out the day before her 21st birthday! Which I am terrified about!!! 

     

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  • In Response to <a href="http://forums.theknot.com/Sites/theknot/Pages/Main.aspx/wedding-club-boards_october-2012-weddings_kick-moh-out-help?plckFindPostKey=Cat:Wedding Club BoardsForum:56b9bcef-1e34-456e-81f5-cfaa107456b2Discussion:e80a8277-9224-4ccc-9d0f-f90c5b0c11e7Post:eae9fad2-3120-4b3f-ab6f-cf5acc5f8e99">Re: Kick MOH out?? HELP!</a>:
    [QUOTE]I care more about my friends who are there for me. My sister went to a friends house b/c she was in a bad mood the day I asked her to come up to see "The Dress". I asked her once more and she said she was coming but then didnt have gas to make it to the place. My mom gave her money and she went and bought drugs instead. The nights I have asked her to come help me with things for the wedding she said she had to work later I found out she was with her friends and lost her job. Nic - my mom has a huge problem with enabling. I have begged her to stop giving her money and stop letting her stay at their house b/c she stole over $2,000 in 2 weeks from them...and pawned my dad's (a mechanic) tools to get more money. My parents told me that they can no longer
    help pay for the wedding b/c of how much she has stolen...they will try but probably like the cake where as they were paying for the reception before. You are definitely right about insurance not giving them enough time. Her counselor said she needs to be in something
    for at least for a year...and small steps to recovery. She will be there for 35 days and gets out the day before her 21st birthday! Which I am terrified about!!! 
     
    Posted by fishinflagrl[/QUOTE]



    Do you feel like you really want a relationship with your sister at this point? I mean this whole situation is really beyond whether she should be in your wedding or not. I would do tough love like Nic suggested. She gave really good advice. In the end, if she makes you this unhappy, don't have her in it. But I would tell her it's because she's a bad MOH or can't fulfill her "duties" and I definitely wouldn't replace her.
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  • I'm so sorry that your family is dealing with this.  It sounds very familiar...family friend's daughter stole all of her brother's high school graduation money last year in addition to other things.  I'm sure it's hard for your mother to even think of her daughter living on the streets so that's why she keeps letting her come back home.  Is your mother (parents) talking to a therapist about how to deal with your sister, I know that doing so has really helped my friend.

    Addiction is nothing to be embarrassed of, I wish there wasn't such a social stigma surrounding it and that people would talk about it more.  So many people stuggle with addiction/mental illness, but very few feel comfortable talking about it.  I wish nothing but the best for your family <3


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  • I don't think there's an easy answer to this one.  My sister is also an addict, although she is currently in recovery.  I did ask her to be my MOH but when I asked her, she had been clean for several months.  I told her when she was in the stage of homeless on the streets that she needed to get her sh*t together so she could be my MOH.  Not that I think that was her motivation, but if she hadn't been clean, I don't think I would have asked her to be in my wedding party.  I really think that only you can make the decision on this one--taking into account the effect your decision will have on your relationships with your sister, your mom, and even your FI.  I think it's past taking etiquette into account.  Honestly at this point, if it were me, it wouldn't be worth keeping her in if it was causing problems with my FI.  I'm so sorry that you're going through this...feel free to private message me if you ever need to!

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  • I agree with the sentiment that kicking her out probably isnt the best idea.

    HOWEVER, the idea is that if she doesnt get her dress, she's out, but it sounds like even though times are tough for your parents, they will probably get the dress for her anyway, since she has no job.

    Another option, and its not for everyone but...since it seems that you have a friend who is stepping up and filling in as your MOH (just without the title) where your sister isn't, maybe have her be one of your two MOH.  It sounds like if you kick her out, even though she causes your parents a lot of grief, it will create a huge wedge between you and your mom, which I feel you would probably regret more later than having your sister there even though you don't really want to.  I can't say for sure obviously, but that's just the way I feel it could go. I'm not really into "promoting" a BM to MOH after you've already asked her to be a BM and not the MOH, but you speak of wanting her to have 'glory' or being your MOH.  It might be a way to appease your mom and also have someone standing up with you that YOU really want there.  There's also the notion that if you sister keeps going down the same path that she's on, she may be in another rehab facility or sadly, even jail again.  Then you won't have to even worry about her being there to mess up your day. 

    My FI is having two best men, not for any other reason he couldn't pick one over the other and it was either have no best man or two.  The way we are handling the "un-even" MOH/Best man thing is we are either having my sister my MOH walk up with both of his best men OR  (which we prob go with this option) having one walk up with my sister and actually hand him the ring and have the other sign the certificate.  They are both goign to be listed as best man ( i know, i know). 

    Just an idea, again, i know its not for everyone but it sounds like theres a few ways your situation could go.  Like I say, she might not be able to come to your wedding then you won't have a MOH standing with  you at all, your friend who is doing all this work will probably be the one to stand with you. If it was me, I'd rather ask her now when it seems like its more of a choice (because it really is) instead of a few weeks or days before when it seems like you have no other choice.  If that makes sense to you, it makes sense in my head.


    good luck and I'm very sorry for you being in this situation.
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  • Fish-

    That is a really suck situation that you are going through.  Im sorry that it is causing problems between you and your FI and you and your mom.   Do you think your mom would buy the dress for her if you told her she had to buy the dress or it actually wouldn't be possible for her to stand up with you?    Is it too late for her to actually make some money to pay for it?  It really sucks that your mom told you she wouldn't go to your wedding if your sister wasn't in it, especially in light of your sister's behavior toward them.   She should want to be there regardless.  I don't know if you answered this or not but do all go to counseling together?
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  • I just want to thank each one of you, BrittneyRN, Nic, Kimm, cbear, and irish for making me feel okay with talking about this on here. This is the best board just for that reason! You all are awesome!

    Irish - I called my aunt who knows the situation and how my mom is, and she suggested the same exact thing. I think that is what I might do. My friend has been there so much already, which I need right now getting closer to the big day while my sister takes care of herself. She has already helped so much.

    Nic/Irish - my parents have gone to the counseling held by the rehab she is in, and they have told them, specifically my mom that she needs to "love and detach". My mom just cant seem to do it, and will always pick her up rather than letting her hit rock bottom, which I believe she needs. I recently went to counseling separate from her place to get another outside opinion. It is just a confusing road.

    I really appreciate you girls. Thank you!
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  • Happy to help!

    I'm glad it seems like you're at least on the road to figuring out what to do.  I wish you and your fam and your sister the best! 
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  • What an awful situation.  :(  I don't really have any advice to add.  Dealing with someone else's addiction is .. well, it's terrible.  I've been down that road, but it was a guy, not a sibling.  That was much easier to walk away from when it became apparent that for my own well being, it was my only option.  I don't think I could walk away from a sibling though.

    I just wanted to say I'm sorry you're all going through this and I think you're a wonderful sister for being so conflicted.  *hugs*
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  • NMINMI member
    Sixth Anniversary 100 Comments
    Does she want to be in the wedding, or is she just trying to please your mother?

     Perhaps by her behavior, she is trying to tell you. (and hoping you will make the decision for her)
    Maybe, it is as simple as that.

    Ask her if she wants to be in the wedding, if not the MOH, then as a bridesmaid (less stress)
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  • Thanks Caitlin, it is definitely a tough decision and hard to deal with. I know things could be worse...but this is very difficult for me.

    NMI - she wants to be in the wedding... but I think it is for the "glory" of saying she is my MOH. I dont think she is in it other than the attention and glory, she definitely has not helped or supported me yet. I am considering making her a BM or a co-MOH.
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